The (Quintessential) Trade Thread, 2017 (Part 5.0)

[Fidel Sarcasmo]

I can't remember the last time BFB posted. Miss his insight.

I'm still bitter about that. I was in the minority on banners only. He just kept on going with that hyper masculine tough guy BS and got tossed cause of it and Bill took off as a result of the BS.

Idk, I don't have the thread in front of me but BFB doesn't strike me as the type to leave over that. If anything, it was probably the people that insisted on pointing out that Smitty and BFB may not have 100% correct info at all times (stating this as criticism like we don't already know that) over and over that probably got to him. Banners may have jumped in but there were others pushing that agenda very strongly before he joined that thread iirc.

I know, they got harassed a lot. Smitty was getting crushed unfairly from where I was sitting too.After a while, we knew where people stood and they just kept going and going. I felt like the old addage should've been practiced, if you dont have anything nice to say don't say it at all. I literally barely ever quoted or engaged Banners cause I never had anything nice to retort. I just kept it to myself and moved on even though I felt tempted a ton. N I know he was a forum favorite here by a lot. He just reminded me of Sea Bass from Dumb n Dumber. I could literally imagine him wearing a vest and a trucker hat and drinking beer every night referring to his girl friend as his old lady and driving a Chevy. He loved and adored that persona he had. It was too much for me.

[Froob]

Bulls fans haven't learned a thing, can't wait for Butler to be traded for far less than they thought. Both Brook picks, Brown, AND Crowder lol.

[Andrew McCeltic]

Idea now, or at the draft: Bradley (& Amir?) to Minnesota, unprotected 2017 1st to Boston, something small to PHI, Okafor or Noel to Boston. We know Thibodeau would love Bradley, probably Amir, that he'd fit well there - that pick is Tatum or Williams or Giles.

[OFWGKTA]

Bulls fans haven't learned a thing, can't wait for Butler to be traded for far less than they thought. Both Brook picks, Brown, AND Crowder lol.

If he's traded for just the 17BRK pick and expirings Bulls fans will just say there's 5 franchise players in this draft

[Andrew McCeltic]

We're not trading either BKN pick - maybe at the draft, when trade options come into focus. Maybe you deal Bradley to get Tatum 5 and trade the 1 or 3 for Butler.

Best play IMO is to get Gallo, Okafor, Jamychal Green and PJ Tucker. Scoring, vet depth/defense, a little rebounding. Don't know what it would take.

[campybatman]

Has anyone mentioned Terrence Jones...? How about Jones in exchange for one of the three second round picks this year? Or, Jones in exchange for James Young. A lefty for a lefty. Otherwise I think the best available rebounding specialist who's still available is Kenneth Faried. Faried in exchange for Amir Johnson and one of the three second round picks this year.

Chris Haynes
‏@ChrisBHaynes

New Orleans now seeking trade partner for forward Terrence Jones, league sources tell ESPN. Mutual decision on behalf of team, Jones' camp.

Read on Twitter

[Crossy2008]

We're not trading either BKN pick - maybe at the draft, when trade options come into focus. Maybe you deal Bradley to get Tatum 5 and trade the 1 or 3 for Butler.

Best play IMO is to get Gallo, Okafor, Jamychal Green and PJ Tucker. Scoring, vet depth/defense, a little rebounding. Don't know what it would take.

The way I see it is the Brooklyn pick is available for Butler or George, but that's pretty much all that is offered for them. Brooklyn pick and filler, and the deal is done.

Thing is, the Celtics can make a lot of quality offers without touching the Brooklyn picks, but they are so shiny that it's all people can look at. It's like getting a girlfriend who is incredible in so many ways, but she also has a great rack. Sure, you want to appreciate her across the board, but holy crap look at those.

[TheOGJabroni]

Has anyone mentioned Terrence Jones...? How about Jones in exchange for one of the three second round picks this year? Or, Jones in exchange for James Young. A lefty for a lefty. Otherwise I think the best available rebounding specialist who's still available is Kenneth Faried. Faried in exchange for Amir Johnson and one of the three second round picks this year.

Chris Haynes
‏@ChrisBHaynes

New Orleans now seeking trade partner for forward Terrence Jones, league sources tell ESPN. Mutual decision on behalf of team, Jones' camp.

Read on Twitter

I'm all for either of those ideas. Decent bench player to have.

[jfs1000d]

Can't wait to hear all the excuses from the Ainge apologists.

I didn't want the guy. He is a head case.

Here is a saying belichick has...

--- The talent you have determines your floor as a player. Character determines your ceiling. --

Boogie has character issues. I don't know how he is outside of hoops, but locker room and in the court he is a trainwreck.

I am not interested in a guy who is selfish, hard to deal with and has a bad attitude. You can't coach cancer.


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Players are a cancer to their team until they aren't. We've all watched Cousins. Yes he gets T'ed up a lot. But is that enough to call the guy an actual cancer? Two awful coaches were fired in Sacramento then Mike Malone was hired and Cousins actually got a long with him. The owner fired Malone because he didn't want to play 4 on 5 ball. George Karl was hired and that was a disaster for the most part unrelated to Cousins. I mean I get the comments if the Pelicans gave up a ton in this deal. But when this deal assures them of probably the 8th seed in reality it's Hield and a mid 1st.

That's the type of gamble Red would have taken all day. DJ was a "headcase" too ya know.

Guy is a troubled man. He was a handful at UK, uncontrollable as a high schooler, and the reason he went 5th in that draft was because of personality concerns. He was a top 2 talent wise.

This man is what is called an energy sucker. He doesn't make people better, his negativity makes people worse. He is miserable to watch play and generally, if all reports are correct, a miserable person to be around.


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[jfs1000d]

Nm

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[chrisab123]

Has anyone mentioned Terrence Jones...? How about Jones in exchange for one of the three second round picks this year? Or, Jones in exchange for James Young. A lefty for a lefty. Otherwise I think the best available rebounding specialist who's still available is Kenneth Faried. Faried in exchange for Amir Johnson and one of the three second round picks this year.

Chris Haynes
‏@ChrisBHaynes

New Orleans now seeking trade partner for forward Terrence Jones, league sources tell ESPN. Mutual decision on behalf of team, Jones' camp.

Read on Twitter

I'm all for either of those ideas. Decent bench player to have.

For Zeller? All day

[canman1971]

I understand the whole "always trade the picks for an established guy" argument. But the Celtics are in such a unique situation where they are really good right now and they have these picks to make them good for a long time. So, unless they get a player that makes them a contender right now or next year, what is the point of trading the BKN picks? They have other assets to bridge them to free agency and continue to build. The Nets went for the "now" and look where they are at currently.

[Crossy2008]

Really slow day for being so close to the deadline. Seems like everyone is just letting the Cousins deal sink in. How is there no decent rumors out there?

[Bill Lumbergh]

Guy is a troubled man. He was a handful at UK, uncontrollable as a high schooler, and the reason he went 5th in that draft was because of personality concerns. He was a top 2 talent wise.

This man is what is called an energy sucker. He doesn't make people better, his negativity makes people worse. He is miserable to watch play and generally, if all reports are correct, a miserable person to be around.

Kings play by play guy definitely agrees with you. Check out this series of tweets:

Grant Napear ✔ @GrantNapearshow
Trading DMC was an absolute no brainer! There has been a dark cloud over this franchise for years! That cloud is now gone!
10:04 PM - 19 Feb 2017


The Kings were never going to win with Cousins. NEVER! This was a no brainer! I wish him well! I really do but it was time!

The Sacramento Kings just became a team again! Its time to move into the future! It's time to start winning! This gives them the best chance

And here's maybe the most important thing. Most of Cousin's teammates the past 7 years hated playing with him! That is a fact!

[Bohemian]

Really slow day for being so close to the deadline. Seems like everyone is just letting the Cousins deal sink in. How is there no decent rumors out there?

It's normal. Usually there is a strong rumor or trade right after the All Star (Cousins this time) then a couple days in which teams study the talks during the weekend with their offices and then madness unleashes itself the last 24 hrs

[canman1971]

Really slow day for being so close to the deadline. Seems like everyone is just letting the Cousins deal sink in. How is there no decent rumors out there?

Par for the course. Too many GMs play for their jobs rather than take chances and try to better their team and win a title. I mean, that's why Ainge is great. He wants a title again and won't settle for less. So many GMs of teams who have never won anything, and maybe never will, hold on to players because they fill the seats to appease the owners, but won't get them any closer to a title. I mean, I like Butler, but Chicago isn't winning a title with him in his prime. And realistically neither is NO even with Cousins. Ainge will be patient, take his time and build. GS did it and it worked for them.

[bucknersrevenge]

I understand the whole "always trade the picks for an established guy" argument. But the Celtics are in such a unique situation where they are really good right now and they have these picks to make them good for a long time. So, unless they get a player that makes them a contender right now or next year, what is the point of trading the BKN picks? They have other assets to bridge them to free agency and continue to build. The Nets went for the "now" and look where they are at currently.

I posted earlier in the draft thread there's no way I give up the BKN 17 for anyone. I'd certainly think about it for George but it would be hard. Our best asset really is Brad Stevens and the culture of accountability that he has built here. And this draft, depending on who you ask, has anywhere from 3-5 impact draftees in it. To have the opportunity to drop another of those impact kids into our already winning culture as opposed to the losing one they would otherwise be going to at a cost controlled number IMO is WAY too difficult to pass up. Talk about hastening the learning curve for an already talented kid. There is no way to overstate the value of that. Look at free agency, look at trades, but the youth of this team is going to be doing BIG things for this franchise really soon if we just have the nerve to be patient.

[Green89]

I understand the whole "always trade the picks for an established guy" argument. But the Celtics are in such a unique situation where they are really good right now and they have these picks to make them good for a long time. So, unless they get a player that makes them a contender right now or next year, what is the point of trading the BKN picks? They have other assets to bridge them to free agency and continue to build. The Nets went for the "now" and look where they are at currently.

Thomas is 28 and is absolutely in his prime. Horford is a bit past it and not getting any younger. These players were key acquisitions and are here, right now, playing at a high level. The problem in waiting is if you wait too long, these two will no longer be a factor, and then if your picks end up being all star level or in IT's case, and MVP contending level, who is going to compliment them?? You'd be right back where you started with IT and Horford, trying to get more people to pair with them to contend.

We have an incredible starting point right now to build a superb team, with IT the MVP candidate, and Horford the all star level big. You have to use the picks to get the pieces to combine with them to form a championship team. You need 3-4 great pieces to get a ring these days, and we don't even have 3. So even if both the BKN 17 and the BKN 18 turn into two key pieces toward a championship run, you then are no longer having the IT and Horford pieces, and the cycle starts over again. We are assuredly in possession of key pieces right now. You need to then turn your "possibilities" (aka the draft picks) into sure things to pair with them. That's the other thing, there is a chance that one or both picks don't turn out, then you've waiting things out, lost IT as he's past his prime, and Horford retires, and then you don't even have 1 of these 3-4 pieces that can get you a title. You're then in an even worse a position than you are now.

We have partial pieces now and turning the picks into the other pieces is a GUARANTEE that you would then end up with the 4 pieces you need to win it all. Whether you can then take those pieces and turn them into a ring is still up in the air and up to the players and coaches to get it done, but you then know exactly what your pieces are, and what they can do to your winning chances. You have no idea what the picks will ever do for your championship chances.

The bottom line is, if you trade the picks for key players/pieces to help aid a title run, you 100% have obtained the pieces needed for that. If you hold onto them and don't cash them in, you will have to try and pick the best potential, hope they develop, and even then it is a very low percentage that these will turn out to be the absolute pieces we need. We have all pieces now between who is on our roster and who the picks could turn into. We need to use them now. These pieces may never assemble like this again if you play the waiting and hoping game. THIS is why you trade the BKN picks.

[Valid]

Really slow day for being so close to the deadline. Seems like everyone is just letting the Cousins deal sink in. How is there no decent rumors out there?

Par for the course. Too many GMs play for their jobs rather than take chances and try to better their team and win a title. I mean, that's why Ainge is great. He wants a title again and won't settle for less. So many GMs of teams who have never won anything, and maybe never will, hold on to players because they fill the seats to appease the owners, but won't get them any closer to a title. I mean, I like Butler, but Chicago isn't winning a title with him in his prime. And realistically neither is NO even with Cousins. Ainge will be patient, take his time and build. GS did it and it worked for them.

To be fair, the Warriors didn't really take their time. They just sucked for 20+ years, got a plethora of good draft picks and finally hit on a couple of them.

We are in a bit of a different situation.

[canman1971]

I understand the whole "always trade the picks for an established guy" argument. But the Celtics are in such a unique situation where they are really good right now and they have these picks to make them good for a long time. So, unless they get a player that makes them a contender right now or next year, what is the point of trading the BKN picks? They have other assets to bridge them to free agency and continue to build. The Nets went for the "now" and look where they are at currently.

Thomas is 28 and is absolutely in his prime. Horford is a bit past it and not getting any younger. These players were key acquisitions and are here, right now, playing at a high level. The problem in waiting is if you wait too long, these two will no longer be a factor, and then if your picks end up being all star level or in IT's case, and MVP contending level, who is going to compliment them?? You'd be right back where you started with IT and Horford, trying to get more people to pair with them to contend.

We have an incredible starting point right now to build a superb team, with IT the MVP candidate, and Horford the all star level big. You have to use the picks to get the pieces to combine with them to form a championship team. You need 3-4 great pieces to get a ring these days, and we don't even have 3. So even if both the BKN 17 and the BKN 18 turn into two key pieces toward a championship run, you then are no longer having the IT and Horford pieces, and the cycle starts over again. We are assuredly in possession of key pieces right now. You need to then turn your "possibilities" (aka the draft picks) into sure things to pair with them. That's the other thing, there is a chance that one or both picks don't turn out, then you've waiting things out, lost IT as he's past his prime, and Horford retires, and then you don't even have 1 of these 3-4 pieces that can get you a title. You're then in an even worse a position than you are now.

We have partial pieces now and turning the picks into the other pieces is a GUARANTEE that you would then end up with the 4 pieces you need to win it all. Whether you can then take those pieces and turn them into a ring is still up in the air and up to the players and coaches to get it done, but you then know exactly what your pieces are, and what they can do to your winning chances. You have no idea what the picks will ever do for your championship chances.

The bottom line is, if you trade the picks for key players/pieces to help aid a title run, you 100% have obtained the pieces needed for that. If you hold onto them and don't cash them in, you will have to try and pick the best potential, hope they develop, and even then it is a very low percentage that these will turn out to be the absolute pieces we need. We have all pieces now between who is on our roster and who the picks could turn into. We need to use them now. These pieces may never assemble like this again if you play the waiting and hoping game. THIS is why you trade the BKN picks.

You are correct mostly, but the Celtics aren't quite that "Butler, Cousins" piece away. PG, maybe with a follow up but the picture is much bigger than many would like to look at.