Trade Thread Tread pt.2 2023-24 - (Off-season)

[Cricket23]

Grant Williams at 4/52 lmao. He's our 9th man. What team in the NBA can afford to pay their 9th man $13 mil a year?

If you're going to look at it in such a narrow way, he is ahead of Hauser so he is our eighth man. If Brogdon gets traded, he is our seventh man. Good chance he plays more games and minutes than Robert Williams next year. There's also a good chance he plays more games and minutes than Al Horford next year. But you think he has no value, or very little value. 13 mill is not a lot for a guy who's going to play 25 to 30 minutes a night. 13 mill also won't look the same in two or three years. Also take into account that this contract will cover his prime years.

Who cares about "prime years" when talking about fungible end of the bench types? You get them on a year to year basis on minimum contracts.
It doesn't matter if he plays 25 - 30 minutes a night because everybody's injured. We can get another bum off the scrap heap to fill those minutes. Bobby Portis is paid $11 mil. a season. Looney gets 7. Bruce Brown signed for 6.5 a year. Just give him a minimum and if he doesn't want it, good luck finding a roster spot. The Celtics are not a charity for untalented fat men.

He's not an end of the bench type if he's playing those minutes. I get it, you don't like him, but your opinion is irrelevant, as is mine. He could very well start for Boston next season. But if you're right, he won't get that kind of contract because obviously NBA GM's know what you know.

[Cricket23]

Orlando gets D. Russell S & T 3/51

Lakers get Malcolm Brogdon

Celtics get J. Vanderbilt and a 2nd from Orlando

[Bar Fight]

If you're going to look at it in such a narrow way, he is ahead of Hauser so he is our eighth man. If Brogdon gets traded, he is our seventh man. Good chance he plays more games and minutes than Robert Williams next year. There's also a good chance he plays more games and minutes than Al Horford next year. But you think he has no value, or very little value. 13 mill is not a lot for a guy who's going to play 25 to 30 minutes a night. 13 mill also won't look the same in two or three years. Also take into account that this contract will cover his prime years.

Who cares about "prime years" when talking about fungible end of the bench types? You get them on a year to year basis on minimum contracts.
It doesn't matter if he plays 25 - 30 minutes a night because everybody's injured. We can get another bum off the scrap heap to fill those minutes. Bobby Portis is paid $11 mil. a season. Looney gets 7. Bruce Brown signed for 6.5 a year. Just give him a minimum and if he doesn't want it, good luck finding a roster spot. The Celtics are not a charity for untalented fat men.

He's not an end of the bench type if he's playing those minutes. I get it, you don't like him, but your opinion is irrelevant, as is mine. He could very well start for Boston next season. But if you're right, he won't get that kind of contract because obviously NBA GM's know what you know.

If Grant Williams starts for the Celtics next year....our title window is closed.

[Cricket23]

Who cares about "prime years" when talking about fungible end of the bench types? You get them on a year to year basis on minimum contracts.
It doesn't matter if he plays 25 - 30 minutes a night because everybody's injured. We can get another bum off the scrap heap to fill those minutes. Bobby Portis is paid $11 mil. a season. Looney gets 7. Bruce Brown signed for 6.5 a year. Just give him a minimum and if he doesn't want it, good luck finding a roster spot. The Celtics are not a charity for untalented fat men.

He's not an end of the bench type if he's playing those minutes. I get it, you don't like him, but your opinion is irrelevant, as is mine. He could very well start for Boston next season. But if you're right, he won't get that kind of contract because obviously NBA GM's know what you know.

If Grant Williams starts for the Celtics next year....our title window is closed.

He played 26 minutes a night off the bench this past year. If he plays 26 minutes a night as a starter, is there a difference? Brogdon looks to be gone, so White is probable going to be the 6th man. Are they going to start Rob and Al together again?

[djFan71]

Late night whiskey trade of the d… night.

ATL: Brown, Cole Anthony for Dejounte, Kong, Jalen Johnson, 15, 2029 top 4 protected first
ORL: Murray for Anthony, Gary Harris, 6 and 11
BOS: Harris, Kong, Johnson, 6, 11, 15, 29 ATL first for Brown

No blue chips there, but a lot of value and flexibility. We make follow up trades with salary and some / all of those picks.

ATL gets Brown, assumes they can resign him
ORL gets a tall PG to pair with their young front court and Fultz and Suggs.

I had ORL taking Kong and sending us WCJ but changed it. I’m not sure they’d do that for Murray. Maybe. Not positive they’d do both 6 and 11, tbh.

[djFan71]

Follow up possibilities with 11, 15, Brogdon. Get SloMo and Caruso and lesser pick back. 4 way with LAC. Exact picks where, tbd. Something like Brogdon to LAC , Batum & 15 for SloMo. RoCo & 11 to CHI. Caruso, SloMo, 30, plus x to BOS.


Smart, White, Caruso, Harris
Tatum, SloMo, Hauser
Rob, Kong, Al, JJ

6, 30, 35, Gallo, Pritchard, JD, Muscala, Kornet, Grant S&T left to work with.

[Larry_Russell]

Most of this trades do not fix any of BOS problems. What are Simons, OG or Johnson fixing?

The main problems:

- Inconsistent 3pt thread
- Floor general + playmaker
- Ability to penetrate + collapse defenses
- Thin big-man rotation

This are the guys that would fix problems if the value was fair (not a refined list):

Myles Turner
Gafford
Okongwu
WCJ
Siakam
Chris Paul
Lillard
Bogdanovic (both)
Jalen Smith
John Collins
Gordon Hayward
Capela
Westbrook
Steven Adams
Conley
Huerter
Claxton
Jerami Grant
FVV
Beal
Ingram
Delon Wright
McConnell
Larry Nance
Tre Jones
Tyus Jones
Poeltl
Monte Morris
Olynyk
Naz Reid

Simons solves penetration, 3pt shooting (1 and 3)
Scoot solves penetration and playmaking ( 2 and 3)
Eason solves 4
Trading simons in a 3 way deal for og solves 1
Trading simons for siakam solves 3 and 4.

Trading brown for #3 and simons then flipping simons for siakam solves 1,2 and 3.

Grabing better shooting, imo, is not as hard as the other things as not starting horford and smart together will have a great impact on that.

[chrisab123]

Late night whiskey trade of the d… night.

ATL: Brown, Cole Anthony for Dejounte, Kong, Jalen Johnson, 15, 2029 top 4 protected first
ORL: Murray for Anthony, Gary Harris, 6 and 11
BOS: Harris, Kong, Johnson, 6, 11, 15, 29 ATL first for Brown

No blue chips there, but a lot of value and flexibility. We make follow up trades with salary and some / all of those picks.

ATL gets Brown, assumes they can resign him
ORL gets a tall PG to pair with their young front court and Fultz and Suggs.

I had ORL taking Kong and sending us WCJ but changed it. I’m not sure they’d do that for Murray. Maybe. Not positive they’d do both 6 and 11, tbh.

Problem with this is that you're essentially guaranteeing that Tatum is going to ask out. The 2nd best player on the roster would then become Marcus Smart, who is a role player. Who takes the heat off Tatum when he's triple teamed? On the flip side you're hedging your bets that when Tatum leaves you have some young players that can pick up where Tatum and Brown left off. But if they don't then your number 1 option does become Marcus Smart. That would lead to some very lean years and then make that pick they traded to SAS have some kind of value.

[chrisab123]

Who cares about "prime years" when talking about fungible end of the bench types? You get them on a year to year basis on minimum contracts.
It doesn't matter if he plays 25 - 30 minutes a night because everybody's injured. We can get another bum off the scrap heap to fill those minutes. Bobby Portis is paid $11 mil. a season. Looney gets 7. Bruce Brown signed for 6.5 a year. Just give him a minimum and if he doesn't want it, good luck finding a roster spot. The Celtics are not a charity for untalented fat men.

He's not an end of the bench type if he's playing those minutes. I get it, you don't like him, but your opinion is irrelevant, as is mine. He could very well start for Boston next season. But if you're right, he won't get that kind of contract because obviously NBA GM's know what you know.

If Grant Williams starts for the Celtics next year....our title window is closed.

Joe didn't even want to play him. Something tells me that he's gone. Maybe S&T, maybe outright. But he's gone.

[Curmudgeon]

I don't think people here fully understand the implications of the new second apron. It's a de facto hard cap, designed to force highly paid players away from teams whose owners don't care about the tax to other teams with cap space. It is expressly designed to even out the NBA team salary structure.

Expensive teams can bite the bullet now or bite it later, but the longer you delay the more painful it will be. People here think that it's going to be business as usual until the second apron kicks in a year from now. It won't be.

The Celtics either get ahead of the curve or hamstring themselves. Brown is a turnover-prone luxury they can't afford. The days of spending 70% of the cap on two players are over.

I will point out that Miami is already ahead of the curve. That's the team that will be winning multiple championships, even if Denver beats them this year. Adebayo, Butler and a bunch of role players are good enough to make the finals. Tatum and Brown are not.

The Celtics with both Brown and Tatum maxed out will be Clippers East for the next 5 years, and if Stevens can't figure that out he ought to be fired.

[JR Hawks]

Make sure you trade the right guard: Smart.

[big-shot-ROB]

I don't think people here fully understand the implications of the new second apron. It's a de facto hard cap, designed to force highly paid players away from teams whose owners don't care about the tax to other teams with cap space. It is expressly designed to even out the NBA team salary structure.

Teams can bite the bullet now or bite it later, but the longer you delay the more painful it will be. People here think that it's going to be business as usual until the second apron kicks in a year from now. It won't be.

The Celtics either get ahead of the curve or hamstring themselves for the next 5 years. Brown is a turnover-prone luxury they can't afford. The days of spending 70% of the cap on two players are over.

I will point out that Miami is already ahead of the curve. That's the team that will be willing multiple championships, even if Denver beats them this year. Meanwhile the Celtics with both Brown and Tatum maxed out will be Clippers East.

What are you even talking about? This is basically their last chance at all.

How are they ahead of the curve? Their salary structure looks horrible already and they need to either pay or loose Strus and Vincent this offseason:

Miami 2023-2024 salary: $173M (losing Strus and Vincent and Love)
Miami 2024-2025 salary: $144M (On Butler, Adebayo, Caleb, Robinson and Herro!! 5 guys!!)

Celtics 2023-2024 salary: $163M (losing Grant)
Celtics 2024-2025 salary: $120M (On Tatum, Horford, Brogdon, Smart, White, Williams, Hauser)

[Andrew McCeltic]

Late night whiskey trade of the d… night.

ATL: Brown, Cole Anthony for Dejounte, Kong, Jalen Johnson, 15, 2029 top 4 protected first
ORL: Murray for Anthony, Gary Harris, 6 and 11
BOS: Harris, Kong, Johnson, 6, 11, 15, 29 ATL first for Brown

No blue chips there, but a lot of value and flexibility. We make follow up trades with salary and some / all of those picks.

ATL gets Brown, assumes they can resign him
ORL gets a tall PG to pair with their young front court and Fultz and Suggs.

I had ORL taking Kong and sending us WCJ but changed it. I’m not sure they’d do that for Murray. Maybe. Not positive they’d do both 6 and 11, tbh.

Atlanta gets the best player in the deal. You know who gets the second-best player? Not us. Pass.

Six quarters aren’t worth more than a dollar in the NBA- they’re worth less.

[Curmudgeon]

n if Denver beats them this year. Meanwhile the Celtics with both Brown and Tatum maxed out will be Clippers East.

What are you even talking about? This is basically their last chance at all.
[/quote]

Don't kid yourself. Brown isn't good enough.

[Hal14]

Who cares about "prime years" when talking about fungible end of the bench types? You get them on a year to year basis on minimum contracts.
It doesn't matter if he plays 25 - 30 minutes a night because everybody's injured. We can get another bum off the scrap heap to fill those minutes. Bobby Portis is paid $11 mil. a season. Looney gets 7. Bruce Brown signed for 6.5 a year. Just give him a minimum and if he doesn't want it, good luck finding a roster spot. The Celtics are not a charity for untalented fat men.

He's not an end of the bench type if he's playing those minutes. I get it, you don't like him, but your opinion is irrelevant, as is mine. He could very well start for Boston next season. But if you're right, he won't get that kind of contract because obviously NBA GM's know what you know.

If Grant Williams starts for the Celtics next year....our title window is closed.

He started 23 games this past season (when we had #1 net rating in the league and were within 1 game of the NBA finals) and he started 21 games the year before, & he started 5 playoff games too (when we came within 2 games of the NBA championship).

I've already stated that I think he's better suited to a role coming off the bench than starting, but your post seems like hyperbole.

[Larry_Russell]

I want scoot or Simons....flip the other for a power forward

I want Eason and Mark Williams too.

[Hal14]

Late night whiskey trade of the d… night.

ATL: Brown, Cole Anthony for Dejounte, Kong, Jalen Johnson, 15, 2029 top 4 protected first
ORL: Murray for Anthony, Gary Harris, 6 and 11
BOS: Harris, Kong, Johnson, 6, 11, 15, 29 ATL first for Brown

No blue chips there, but a lot of value and flexibility. We make follow up trades with salary and some / all of those picks.

ATL gets Brown, assumes they can resign him
ORL gets a tall PG to pair with their young front court and Fultz and Suggs.

I had ORL taking Kong and sending us WCJ but changed it. I’m not sure they’d do that for Murray. Maybe. Not positive they’d do both 6 and 11, tbh.

Wait, who's Kong?

[165bows]

I don't think people here fully understand the implications of the new second apron. It's a de facto hard cap, designed to force highly paid players away from teams whose owners don't care about the tax to other teams with cap space. It is expressly designed to even out the NBA team salary structure.

Expensive teams can bite the bullet now or bite it later, but the longer you delay the more painful it will be. People here think that it's going to be business as usual until the second apron kicks in a year from now. It won't be.

The Celtics either get ahead of the curve or hamstring themselves. Brown is a turnover-prone luxury they can't afford. The days of spending 70% of the cap on two players are over.

I will point out that Miami is already ahead of the curve. That's the team that will be winning multiple championships, even if Denver beats them this year. Adebayo, Butler and a bunch of role players are good enough to make the finals. Tatum and Brown are not.

The Celtics with both Brown and Tatum maxed out will be Clippers East for the next 5 years, and if Stevens can't figure that out he ought to be fired.

Miami doesn't even spend enough to have second apron problems and they still won't be able to retain their current guys unless they can find a way to dump Lowry. They've got a window as long as Butler does which realistically is maybe two years.

Their biggest advantage is just south beach.

[Celticsfan100]

I don't think people here fully understand the implications of the new second apron. It's a de facto hard cap, designed to force highly paid players away from teams whose owners don't care about the tax to other teams with cap space. It is expressly designed to even out the NBA team salary structure.

Expensive teams can bite the bullet now or bite it later, but the longer you delay the more painful it will be. People here think that it's going to be business as usual until the second apron kicks in a year from now. It won't be.

The Celtics either get ahead of the curve or hamstring themselves. Brown is a turnover-prone luxury they can't afford. The days of spending 70% of the cap on two players are over.

I will point out that Miami is already ahead of the curve. That's the team that will be winning multiple championships, even if Denver beats them this year. Adebayo, Butler and a bunch of role players are good enough to make the finals. Tatum and Brown are not.

The Celtics with both Brown and Tatum maxed out will be Clippers East for the next 5 years, and if Stevens can't figure that out he ought to be fired.

Miami doesn't even spend enough to have second apron problems and they still won't be able to retain their current guys unless they can find a way to dump Lowry. They've got a window as long as Butler does which realistically is maybe two years.

Their biggest advantage is just south beach.

Lol Miami will be winning multiple championships. They won’t even get close again. Yes well coached. But with their string of great luck wouldn’t be surprised if Jokic and Murray went down tonight. First Giannis then Tatum. One of the luckiest teams ever

[Curmudgeon]

Their biggest advantage is just south beach.

No, their biggest advantage is their ability to build a team that plays the right way, not a random collection of stars. This was San Antonio's formula as well.