Kawhi update thread 2.0

[Celts17Pride]

My prediction is the trade that is going to be discussed is:

Irving, Morris, Yabusele, #27 and Memphis pick
for
Leonard and Mills

Rozier, Mills and possibly Smart will handle the point.

Flame away!

[Froob]

It has to be said and it has to be said every now and then...

**** the Lakers.

Who?

[williambh3]

My main interest is making sure he doesn’t go to Philly before FA. Kawhi and Lebron or George in Philly would be a nightmare scenario

[Shak_Celts]

KL was/is one of my absolute non-Celts favorites but I would not trade for him now because I think JB is not too far behind him now (still growing at only 21yo) at a much cheaper rate for years beyond now. Even JB's next max will be a lot less. I think people are underrating JB but also what it could be with our duo of the Jays! I just dont think we should pay near 30m to 4 guys (I think al makes 27) and in a couple years give Tatum 20m if he is who we expect... I know Al will be up but no way we don't give him around 15m if he is still good. That's crazy money when I think we could win a chip with the core 5 and JB can't up and leave us next season. I understand that if JB is who I think he will be then he is going to get paid too but it's gonna be about 10m less than KL but IMO, we could get the same result (a chip) with a much young player all while keeping the other assets (gonna need a lot to match money alone).

I would EASILY love and cheer for KL unlike I would for LBJ if that is what DA decides, I just don't think he will. I think he will run with what we have all while picking up another gem with Sacto19 (small moves and low picks that we can't fully account for yet).

I know that I always think our guys are too good to let go but I am reasonable at times, for instance, I would have traded IT4 for KI, my only problem was thinking the pick was too good to add on (of course I believed IT would recover fully at the time).

THIS IS WHY I HATE THIS TIME OF THE SEASON, I just want to know who I will be cheering for all season so I can enjoy videos and get hyped up. I can't wait for this to be over!!

[CelticsPride18]

I would love Leonard on the C’s but having 3 stars coming from serious injuries is a huge risk and 2 with expiring contracts.

[Smitty731]

In what is now a position-less NBA, Gordon Hayward can absolutely run point (I actually wouldn't even be opposed to this even if we keep Kyrie). As far as there being no big? You can say that about a whole lot of teams in the league nowadays. "Bigs" are dying out. You have guys like P.J. Tucker playing the 4.

Regardless, Kyrie isn't getting traded for Kawhi, so this is a moot discussion.

NBA position is about who you guard. I love those four guys, but none of them are chasing around PGs.

Beyond that, Tucker plays the 4. You can get away with 4 smalls. You can't get away with 5. No team plays 5 smalls for any reasonable stretch. The Celtics without Horford or Baynes in the game were destroyed at the rim. That team would get killed on defense, simply because they would have no big back there. It's also not a good rebounding group either.

There is no reason Boston would need all four of Tatum, Hayward, Brown and Kawhi. None at all. Someone would end up pissed off about minutes. Stevens is good, but he's not that good.

Kyrie 32-36/Rozier 12-16
Hayward 32-36/Brown 12-16
Leonard 32-36/Brown 12-16
Tatum 32-36/Horford 12-16
Horford~20/Baynes & Theis whatever's left

The guy it makes no sense to keep in a Kawhi deal is Smart. KL is better both defensively and offensively. Smart becomes totally superfluous.

Here are the problems:

Brown isn't going to be ok playing anything less than 30 MPG after logging that as a rookie. And he's going to come off the bench?

Rozier just started for an entire playoff run, now he's a 12-16 MPG guy and never closing games? Not happening.

Speaking of closing games, someone gets left out and that guy isn't going to be happy at all.

Oh...and how in the world are the Celtics getting Kawhi without giving up anyone out of Kyrie, Hayward, Brown and Tatum? Are the Spurs taking Smart in a S&T for a bunch of money? Boston can't get Kawhi without trading one of the above four guys. Multiple teams will beat that offer if none of those guys are in there.

[Marvel]

I dunno about y'all but a Kawhi, Bron, PG Laker team would be a threat to beat GS in the West. The thought makes me sick.

It depends on how they flesh out the rest of that roster. They still need more offense to keep up with the Warriors.

True but that team would instantly get potential FAs (ring chasers) lining up to sign there on bargain deals.

[reload141]

NBA position is about who you guard. I love those four guys, but none of them are chasing around PGs.

Beyond that, Tucker plays the 4. You can get away with 4 smalls. You can't get away with 5. No team plays 5 smalls for any reasonable stretch. The Celtics without Horford or Baynes in the game were destroyed at the rim. That team would get killed on defense, simply because they would have no big back there. It's also not a good rebounding group either.

There is no reason Boston would need all four of Tatum, Hayward, Brown and Kawhi. None at all. Someone would end up pissed off about minutes. Stevens is good, but he's not that good.

Kyrie 32-36/Rozier 12-16
Hayward 32-36/Brown 12-16
Leonard 32-36/Brown 12-16
Tatum 32-36/Horford 12-16
Horford~20/Baynes & Theis whatever's left

The guy it makes no sense to keep in a Kawhi deal is Smart. KL is better both defensively and offensively. Smart becomes totally superfluous.

Here are the problems:

Brown isn't going to be ok playing anything less than 30 MPG after logging that as a rookie. And he's going to come off the bench?

Rozier just started for an entire playoff run, now he's a 12-16 MPG guy and never closing games? Not happening.

Speaking of closing games, someone gets left out and that guy isn't going to be happy at all.

Oh...and how in the world are the Celtics getting Kawhi without giving up anyone out of Kyrie, Hayward, Brown and Tatum? Are the Spurs taking Smart in a S&T for a bunch of money? Boston can't get Kawhi without trading one of the above four guys. Multiple teams will beat that offer if none of those guys are in there.

Agreed.

This might be a good time to package up Brown/Rozier as they both will want big minutes and large contracts into the one player, Leonard.

[rickrolled]

Kawhi makes 20.099.189$ in 2018-19.

We need to take back no more than 125% incoming salary vs outgoing salary IIRC.

Does our draft pick at 27 counts toward outgoing salary? If that's the case that's 1.367.000$ without adding 20% from what I understand the New CBA doesn't allow the loopholes from past years that you can wait to sign the player until you use your capspace then go over it by signing your draft pick. Is it only the teams with caproom that this effect or any team?

Jaylen Brown - 5.169.969$
Marcus Morris - 5.375.000$
G.Yabusele - 2.667.600$ (last year guaranteed is 18-19)
A.Nader - 1.378.242$ (cut date August 1st)

=14.590.811$ x 1.25 = 18.238.514$ which is ~ 1.9 million short.

Where are we going to find that 1.9 million, while keeping Rozier and Smart, repeat, in a scenario where we keep Rozier and Smart. Even if we add number 27 it's going to be short assuming it's 100% of the cap hold.

Also idk if Kawhi has a trade kicker? but he probably needs to waive it for a trade to go through.

[Smitty731]

I dunno about y'all but a Kawhi, Bron, PG Laker team would be a threat to beat GS in the West. The thought makes me sick.

It depends on how they flesh out the rest of that roster. They still need more offense to keep up with the Warriors.

True but that team would instantly get potential FAs (ring chasers) lining up to sign there on bargain deals.

Go through guys who have signed on for the minimum over the past 10 years and tell me how many have actually made an impact as a rotation player. The list is much smaller than you think.

[Froob]

Where do you guys have Kawhi ranked? I have LeBron, KD, AD, then probably Steph. I’m done with Harden, he sucks in the playoffs. Probably put Kawhi 5th.

[Smitty731]

Kawhi makes 20.099.189$ in 2018-19.

We need to take back no more than 125% incoming salary vs outgoing salary IIRC.

Does our draft pick at 27 counts toward outgoing salary? If that's the case that's 1.367.000$ without adding 20% from what I understand the New CBA doesn't allow the loopholes from past years that you can wait to sign the player until you use your capspace then go over it by signing your draft pick. Is it only the teams with caproom that this effect or any team?

Jaylen Brown - 5.169.969$
Marcus Morris - 5.375.000$
G.Yabusele - 2.667.600$ (last year guaranteed is 18-19)
A.Nader - 1.378.242$ (cut date August 1st)

=14.590.811$ x 1.25 = 18.238.514$ which is ~ 1.9 million short.

Where are we going to find that 1.9 million, while keeping Rozier and Smart, repeat, in a scenario where we keep Rozier and Smart. Even if we add number 27 it's going to be short assuming it's 100% of the cap hold.

Also idk if Kawhi has a trade kicker? but he probably needs to waive it for a trade to go through.

The 1st round draft pick counts as $0 until the player is signed. When the player is signed, he then counts for whatever amount he signed for (between 80% and 120% of the rookie scale slot). The challenge then is you can't trade him for 30 days. That is what held up the Love/Wiggins deal.

What changed in the current CBA is that the cap hold for first round picks is now 120% of the rookie scale slot vs 100%. Teams used to wait to sign those players until they finished using all the rest of their cap space. Now, there is no reason to wait. A big reason this change was made is that teams wanted players available for summer league without signing insurance waivers.

[Smitty731]

Kawhi makes 20.099.189$ in 2018-19.

We need to take back no more than 125% incoming salary vs outgoing salary IIRC.

Does our draft pick at 27 counts toward outgoing salary? If that's the case that's 1.367.000$ without adding 20% from what I understand the New CBA doesn't allow the loopholes from past years that you can wait to sign the player until you use your capspace then go over it by signing your draft pick. Is it only the teams with caproom that this effect or any team?

Jaylen Brown - 5.169.969$
Marcus Morris - 5.375.000$
G.Yabusele - 2.667.600$ (last year guaranteed is 18-19)
A.Nader - 1.378.242$ (cut date August 1st)

=14.590.811$ x 1.25 = 18.238.514$ which is ~ 1.9 million short.

Where are we going to find that 1.9 million, while keeping Rozier and Smart, repeat, in a scenario where we keep Rozier and Smart. Even if we add number 27 it's going to be short assuming it's 100% of the cap hold.

Also idk if Kawhi has a trade kicker? but he probably needs to waive it for a trade to go through.

Oh and 15% trade bonus for Kawhi, but he can waive it as you said.

[reload141]

Where do you guys have Kawhi ranked? I have LeBron, KD, AD, then probably Steph. I’m done with Harden, he sucks in the playoffs. Probably put Kawhi 5th.

When healthy he’s a top 5 player, MVP candidate.

[DK-All Day]

Where do you guys have Kawhi ranked? I have LeBron, KD, AD, then probably Steph. I’m done with Harden, he sucks in the playoffs. Probably put Kawhi 5th.

Durant and Kawhi are essentially neck and neck as the second best player in the NBA.

[CelticsPride18]

Can we agree to a sign and trade with Smart before July 1??? Smart on a 14m contract /Brown and 3 picks for Kawhi.

[KGboss]

Where do you guys have Kawhi ranked? I have LeBron, KD, AD, then probably Steph. I’m done with Harden, he sucks in the playoffs. Probably put Kawhi 5th.

Durant and Kawhi are essentially neck and neck as the second best player in the NBA.

Davis has an argument. Curry is also a 2 time mvp and 3 time champ now

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

[Froob]

Where do you guys have Kawhi ranked? I have LeBron, KD, AD, then probably Steph. I’m done with Harden, he sucks in the playoffs. Probably put Kawhi 5th.

Durant and Kawhi are essentially neck and neck as the second best player in the NBA.

Eh, I think Durant is clearly better than Kawhi. Who knows how they’d do if they switch spots though, Durant clearly is in a much better situation.

[Homerclease]

Where do you guys have Kawhi ranked? I have LeBron, KD, AD, then probably Steph. I’m done with Harden, he sucks in the playoffs. Probably put Kawhi 5th.

Same. Interchangeable with Curry at 4 or 5.

[rickrolled]

Kawhi makes 20.099.189$ in 2018-19.

We need to take back no more than 125% incoming salary vs outgoing salary IIRC.

Does our draft pick at 27 counts toward outgoing salary? If that's the case that's 1.367.000$ without adding 20% from what I understand the New CBA doesn't allow the loopholes from past years that you can wait to sign the player until you use your capspace then go over it by signing your draft pick. Is it only the teams with caproom that this effect or any team?

Jaylen Brown - 5.169.969$
Marcus Morris - 5.375.000$
G.Yabusele - 2.667.600$ (last year guaranteed is 18-19)
A.Nader - 1.378.242$ (cut date August 1st)

=14.590.811$ x 1.25 = 18.238.514$ which is ~ 1.9 million short.

Where are we going to find that 1.9 million, while keeping Rozier and Smart, repeat, in a scenario where we keep Rozier and Smart. Even if we add number 27 it's going to be short assuming it's 100% of the cap hold.

Also idk if Kawhi has a trade kicker? but he probably needs to waive it for a trade to go through.

The 1st round draft pick counts as $0 until the player is signed. When the player is signed, he then counts for whatever amount he signed for (between 80% and 120% of the rookie scale slot. The challenge then is you can't trade him for 30 days. That is what held up the Love/Wiggins deal.

What changed in the current CBA is that the cap hold for first round picks is now 120% of the rookie scale slot vs 100%. Teams used to wait to sign those players until they finished using all the rest of their cap space. Now, there is no reason to wait. A big reason this change was made is that teams wanted players available for summer league without signing insurance waivers.

thanks, I added 20% to the cap hold and we're still short of 225k but what about players like Larkin, can the C's s&t him if they only have early bird rights? He isn't likely to get more than the vet minimum anyway so only obstacle would be him agreeing to go to SA.