Omer Asik Trade - Updated link pg.109

[humblebum]

If a late 1st is all a team offer, he probably won't get dealt.. If Asik is offered, he's gone.

I think you're clearly overrating Asik. Not that valuable.

I think you're clearly overrating Crawford. Not that valuable.

I don't understand this fascination with Asik, obviously Ainge doesn't think too highly of him either if all he was willing to give up is the awful Lee contract, a solid piece in Bass and our lowest value first rounder.

Crawford is the only perimeter player on this roster who can create a shot consistently for himself off the dribble. There's also a very good chance Ainge can get him on his qualifying offer or get him on a market rate deal.

We'll see what happens with Asik but there is basically no incentive to trading Crawford right now and I highly doubt Ainge has any intentions of including him in a deal for a no offense C.

[ryaningf]

Come on, Humble. Aik isn't coming here but don't use that fact to spin yarns about Crawford's ability. Big trumps little all day long, especially when the big in question is a top 5 rim protector and the little in question has had like 2 good months on the reservation.

[CelticFaninLBC]

I think you're clearly overrating Asik. Not that valuable.

I think you're clearly overrating Crawford. Not that valuable.

I don't understand this fascination with Asik, obviously Ainge doesn't think too highly of him either if all he was willing to give up is the awful Lee contract, a solid piece in Bass and our lowest value first rounder.

Crawford is the only perimeter player on this roster who can create a shot consistently for himself off the dribble. There's also a very good chance Ainge can get him on his qualifying offer or get him on a market rate deal.

We'll see what happens with Asik but there is basically no incentive to trading Crawford right now and I highly doubt Ainge has any intentions of including him in a deal for a no offense C.

So you're keeping bench players over a much need rim protector. smh

Crawford's played about 10 good games. Don't go overboard.

[humblebum]

Come on, Humble. Aik isn't coming here but don't use that fact to spin yarns about Crawford's ability. Big trumps little all day long, especially when the big in question is a top 5 rim protector and the little in question has had like 2 good months on the reservation.

I don't think people are getting it. The Celtics need MORE guys to score the basketball. Getting rid of Crawford just doesn't make sense.

My point isn't that Crawford is untradeable. It's that Ainge is building a TEAM. It makes no sense to upgrade at C and while simultaneously taking away your best shot creator/scorer. The Celtics have about 5 players who can play, and Craw is one of them.

Asik is a rim protector and that's it. That is a limited value skill set because his presence on the offensive end, plus his atrocious FT shooting limit his value severely. My guess is that the reason Ainge didn't make a bigger offer for Asik is the same reason he chose Green/1st over Perkins.

The rim protector role is overrated unless that player is also a factor on the offensive end. I'm a defense first guy but that's just the way it goes in this new NBA landscape.

Let's not forget that Crawford has played this entire season out of position. He could benefit substantially from Rondo's return as well.

[GreenMachine]

Come on, Humble. Aik isn't coming here but don't use that fact to spin yarns about Crawford's ability. Big trumps little all day long, especially when the big in question is a top 5 rim protector and the little in question has had like 2 good months on the reservation.

I don't think people are getting it. The Celtics need MORE guys to score the basketball. Getting rid of Crawford just doesn't make sense.

My point isn't that Crawford is untradeable. It's that Ainge is building a TEAM. It makes no sense to upgrade at C and while simultaneously taking away your best shot creator/scorer. The Celtics have about 5 players who can play, and Craw is one of them.

Asik is a rim protector and that's it. That is a limited value skill set because his presence on the offensive end, plus his atrocious FT shooting limit his value severely. My guess is that the reason Ainge didn't make a bigger offer for Asik is the same reason he chose Green/1st over Perkins.

The rim protector role is overrated unless that player is also a factor on the offensive end. I'm a defense first guy but that's just the way it goes in this new NBA landscape.

Let's not forget that Crawford has played this entire season out of position. He could benefit substantially from Rondo's return as well.

There is a better chance that Asik is part of our next championship then that Crawford is. THAT is why you do the trade. Sure, we need more scorers... right this minute... but guys like Crawford are easier to come by then guys like Asik... and that is indisputable. Over the next few seasons, I would rather have Asik on the team then Crawford, regardless of the current needs.

[humblebum]

Come on, Humble. Aik isn't coming here but don't use that fact to spin yarns about Crawford's ability. Big trumps little all day long, especially when the big in question is a top 5 rim protector and the little in question has had like 2 good months on the reservation.

I don't think people are getting it. The Celtics need MORE guys to score the basketball. Getting rid of Crawford just doesn't make sense.

My point isn't that Crawford is untradeable. It's that Ainge is building a TEAM. It makes no sense to upgrade at C and while simultaneously taking away your best shot creator/scorer. The Celtics have about 5 players who can play, and Craw is one of them.

Asik is a rim protector and that's it. That is a limited value skill set because his presence on the offensive end, plus his atrocious FT shooting limit his value severely. My guess is that the reason Ainge didn't make a bigger offer for Asik is the same reason he chose Green/1st over Perkins.

The rim protector role is overrated unless that player is also a factor on the offensive end. I'm a defense first guy but that's just the way it goes in this new NBA landscape.

Let's not forget that Crawford has played this entire season out of position. He could benefit substantially from Rondo's return as well.

There is a better chance that Asik is part of our next championship then that Crawford is. THAT is why you do the trade. Sure, we need more scorers... right this minute... but guys like Crawford are easier to come by then guys like Asik... and that is indisputable. Over the next few seasons, I would rather have Asik on the team then Crawford, regardless of the current needs.

You are thinking like a fan not a GM.

The reality is that Ainge wants to get a clear win in any trade and adding Crawford to Bass and a first is too sweet for Asik. You are overpricing the role and value of a rim protector like Asik. He can't play fourth quarters and he can't defend the perimeter against stretch bigs (which is the direction the NBA is going).

He should still be targeted but I'd 100% hold firm at Bass/Lee and the Clips pick. That's his value when money is factored in. He's not anywhere near worth that $15m price tag. Ridding yourself of Lee (a clear goal in the Asik trade) means that Ainge is probably looking to get out ahead of the Bradley and Crawford RFA. That shows Ainge is likely thinking along similar lines to what I'm laying out here.

There is a salary and value slot for Asik on a contender. I don't think he's worth a 6th man type in Craw, a solid 3rd big (with a proven track record of defending high profile wings), a first rounder, AND losing salary flexibility.

[humblebum]

I'd also add that I think Ainge wants a quick turnaround so he can convince Rondo to stay on a more reasonable contract. That's a heck of a lot more likely if you can keep Rondo-AB-Craw-Sullinger in tact.

Personally I could see Green being more trade bait than Craw due to role and likely price points moving forward.

[GregB]

I wouldn't give up Crawford. But I would add brooks as filler over lee. Houston doesn't want to pay lee for another 2.5 years. I wonder if that gets a deal done. But I'm not sure that's enough value for Morey and we don't need to over pay when we aren't contenders.

[brackdan70]

I don't think people are getting it. The Celtics need MORE guys to score the basketball. Getting rid of Crawford just doesn't make sense.

My point isn't that Crawford is untradeable. It's that Ainge is building a TEAM. It makes no sense to upgrade at C and while simultaneously taking away your best shot creator/scorer. The Celtics have about 5 players who can play, and Craw is one of them.

Asik is a rim protector and that's it. That is a limited value skill set because his presence on the offensive end, plus his atrocious FT shooting limit his value severely. My guess is that the reason Ainge didn't make a bigger offer for Asik is the same reason he chose Green/1st over Perkins.

The rim protector role is overrated unless that player is also a factor on the offensive end. I'm a defense first guy but that's just the way it goes in this new NBA landscape.

Let's not forget that Crawford has played this entire season out of position. He could benefit substantially from Rondo's return as well.

There is a better chance that Asik is part of our next championship then that Crawford is. THAT is why you do the trade. Sure, we need more scorers... right this minute... but guys like Crawford are easier to come by then guys like Asik... and that is indisputable. Over the next few seasons, I would rather have Asik on the team then Crawford, regardless of the current needs.

You are thinking like a fan not a GM.

The reality is that Ainge wants to get a clear win in any trade and adding Crawford to Bass and a first is too sweet for Asik. You are overpricing the role and value of a rim protector like Asik. He can't play fourth quarters and he can't defend the perimeter against stretch bigs (which is the direction the NBA is going).

He should still be targeted but I'd 100% hold firm at Bass/Lee and the Clips pick. That's his value when money is factored in. He's not anywhere near worth that $15m price tag. Ridding yourself of Lee (a clear goal in the Asik trade) means that Ainge is probably looking to get out ahead of the Bradley and Crawford RFA. That shows Ainge is likely thinking along similar lines to what I'm laying out here.

There is a salary and value slot for Asik on a contender. I don't think he's worth a 6th man type in Craw, a solid 3rd big (with a proven track record of defending high profile wings), a first rounder, AND losing salary flexibility.

If Houston would do Bass, Crawford and a first I am sure Ainge would do it. Crawford is not an asset. Not a liability either but certainly not an asset. He would be pretty deep on the bench of a contender.

[CelticFaninLBC]

As has been mentioned, guys like Crawford are easier to find. Hence why he won't grab a big contract in free agency. Ainge can find someone like Crawford in the draft, whereas, guys like Asik are more difficult to find, and cost a lot more.

[GreenMachine]

I don't think people are getting it. The Celtics need MORE guys to score the basketball. Getting rid of Crawford just doesn't make sense.

My point isn't that Crawford is untradeable. It's that Ainge is building a TEAM. It makes no sense to upgrade at C and while simultaneously taking away your best shot creator/scorer. The Celtics have about 5 players who can play, and Craw is one of them.

Asik is a rim protector and that's it. That is a limited value skill set because his presence on the offensive end, plus his atrocious FT shooting limit his value severely. My guess is that the reason Ainge didn't make a bigger offer for Asik is the same reason he chose Green/1st over Perkins.

The rim protector role is overrated unless that player is also a factor on the offensive end. I'm a defense first guy but that's just the way it goes in this new NBA landscape.

Let's not forget that Crawford has played this entire season out of position. He could benefit substantially from Rondo's return as well.

There is a better chance that Asik is part of our next championship then that Crawford is. THAT is why you do the trade. Sure, we need more scorers... right this minute... but guys like Crawford are easier to come by then guys like Asik... and that is indisputable. Over the next few seasons, I would rather have Asik on the team then Crawford, regardless of the current needs.

You are thinking like a fan not a GM.

The reality is that Ainge wants to get a clear win in any trade and adding Crawford to Bass and a first is too sweet for Asik. You are overpricing the role and value of a rim protector like Asik. He can't play fourth quarters and he can't defend the perimeter against stretch bigs (which is the direction the NBA is going).

He should still be targeted but I'd 100% hold firm at Bass/Lee and the Clips pick. That's his value when money is factored in. He's not anywhere near worth that $15m price tag. Ridding yourself of Lee (a clear goal in the Asik trade) means that Ainge is probably looking to get out ahead of the Bradley and Crawford RFA. That shows Ainge is likely thinking along similar lines to what I'm laying out here.

There is a salary and value slot for Asik on a contender. I don't think he's worth a 6th man type in Craw, a solid 3rd big (with a proven track record of defending high profile wings), a first rounder, AND losing salary flexibility.

Um... reread the thread. I offered Craw and Hump. No Bass. No pick. I am thinking like a GM. Celtics WIN that trade... but Houston is in need of a PG right now... so they might just do it...

Bass/Lee/Clips Pick is >>>>> Craw/Hump so you are actually offering more value then I am. REREAD THE THREAD.

[Captain_Caveman]

I'd also add that I think Ainge wants a quick turnaround so he can convince Rondo to stay on a more reasonable contract. That's a heck of a lot more likely if you can keep Rondo-AB-Craw-Sullinger in tact.

Personally I could see Green being more trade bait than Craw due to role and likely price points moving forward.

I don't see that at all, especially not with Crawford. Highly doubt Rondo making any major life decisions based on Jordan Crawford.

[CelticFaninLBC]

Humble curious what kind of contract you think Crawford will get this summer, and why you don't think Ainge can sign a similar player??? It's highly doubtful Crawford gets more than a mid-level exception...

[Red2]

Is there anyway NJ can swing a deal for asik or are they prevented cap wise ? they need a center and they've shown a willingness to overpay. Does blatche plus something else get you there?

[CelticFaninLBC]

Is there anyway NJ can swing a deal for asik or are they prevented cap wise ? they need a center and they've shown a willingness to overpay. Does blatche plus something else get you there?

BKN inquired about Asik & Lin and Morey asked for Deron Williams. Doubtful BKN has the pieces...

[humblebum]

Humble curious what kind of contract you think Crawford will get this summer, and why you don't think Ainge can sign a similar player??? It's highly doubtful Crawford gets more than a mid-level exception...

I just find strong value in Crawford the player and also as an asset to a team looking to maintain flexibility while fielding a competitive team. I always felt this was a one year dip into the lottery and a quick resurrection. I think Ainge legit believes in Rondo-Sullinger as a nice one-two punch. The only other guys likely to be keepers IMO are Craw and Bradley.

Why Crawford and not Green? I think it comes down to fit with the two core pieces in the backcourt. Rondo needs a scorer/shooter backing him up but ideally someone who can also complement Bradley by allowing him to move off the ball. Crawford just has the right mix of shooting, height, and ball handling/shot creation.

I think he can be worth 6-7 million but with his RFA status I could see the Celtics getting him back on his qualifying offer or a two year, player option second year for 7-9 million. He also gives you some Rondo injury insurance too.

The BIGGEST aspect of any Asik trade is dumping Lee. That alone has more value than getting Asik, because it opens the door for keeping the backcourt in tact. Getting Asik has AS MUCH or more to do with balancing the roster and the cap as it does in getting Asik the player. That's why it's sweeter to dump Lee/Bass than make the move to fill Humps salary slot.

[brackdan70]

Humble curious what kind of contract you think Crawford will get this summer, and why you don't think Ainge can sign a similar player??? It's highly doubtful Crawford gets more than a mid-level exception...

I just find strong value in Crawford the player and also as an asset to a team looking to maintain flexibility while fielding a competitive team. I always felt this was a one year dip into the lottery and a quick resurrection. I think Ainge legit believes in Rondo-Sullinger as a nice one-two punch. The only other guys likely to be keepers IMO are Craw and Bradley.

Why Crawford and not Green? I think it comes down to fit with the two core pieces in the backcourt. Rondo needs a scorer/shooter backing him up but ideally someone who can also complement Bradley by allowing him to move off the ball. Crawford just has the right mix of shooting, height, and ball handling/shot creation.

I think he can be worth 6-7 million but with his RFA status I could see the Celtics getting him back on his qualifying offer or a two year, player option second year for 7-9 million. He also gives you some Rondo injury insurance too.

The BIGGEST aspect of any Asik trade is dumping Lee. That alone has more value than getting Asik, because it opens the door for keeping the backcourt in tact. Getting Asik has AS MUCH or more to do with balancing the roster and the cap as it does in getting Asik the player. That's why it's sweeter to dump Lee/Bass than make the move to fill Humps salary slot.

If Crawford is a contributor on any team, that team is not a contender. He might get a mid level deal but I would hope not from the Cs. We can do better with that Salary slot. 7-9 million would be extremely foolish.

[Shamrock]

Not sure if this was posted yet but.....

20. Boston Celtics (12-17; last week's ranking: 17): The Rockets let their self-imposed deadline to trade center Omer Asik pass, but Boston is still having trade discussions in hopes of landing him, a source said.

Per Marc Spears Power Rankings Update

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nba-power-rankings--trail-blazers-move-into-top-spot-053707788.html

[ddb]

Just want to break it to you guys that Jordan Crawford most likely is not in Ainges long term plans. He has been good, i think he could be a solid 6th man if he embraces that role, bit paying him 6-7 million per year is career suicide for Danny. Theres no way. None. I think he is playing up his value then included in a deal. Or if Rondo misses the entire season then Craw will be kept then leave as a free agent.

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[bbd24]

Just want to break it to you guys that Jordan Crawford most likely is not in Ainges long term plans. He has been good, i think he could be a solid 6th man if he embraces that role, bit paying him 6-7 million per year is career suicide for Danny. Theres no way. None. I think he is playing up his value then included in a deal. Or if Rondo misses the entire season then Craw will be kept then leave as a free agent.

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"The NBA is loaded with quality players. Big guys are much harder to find than small guys." -- Danny Ainge

With 9 first round picks in the next 5 years, Danny can find us a quality small who can take the place of Crawford. Danny doesn't have to pay Bradley or Crawford if he doesn't feel the value of the contract(s) will be worth what they bring on the court. He's got plenty of ammo going forward to land us better 2 guards or backup PG's.