Official Celtics 2022 Off-Season Thread

[Bad-Thoma]

Good thing that he’s taking the least amount of shots per 36 of his career, then.

The people saying Marcus shoots the ball like he’s a great shooter are just making things up. Him taking wide open shots isn’t a problem, and eventually they’ll start falling more. He doesn’t turn the ball over much, he’s been a monster defender, and he’s gotten much better at playing like a real PG over the last 5ish games. Of course there was going to be an adjustment period with that, expecting otherwise isn’t being realistic.

But if they keep saying it loud enough and often enough doesn't that eventually make it true? It seems to for them at least.

Also, for those keeping track Marcus Smart ranks 303rd in the NBA in usage this season. You can't be a chucker and be turnover prone and rank 303rd in the NBA in usage.

[Fierce1]

you're a casual fan who only looks at 3 point %.

Advanced stats like on/off rating factor in the player's value to the team and measure how well the team performs with him on the court compared to how well the team performs with him off the court.

in other words - it factors the shooting in, but there's A LOT more to basketball than just shooting 3's. If there's 100 possessions in a game and Smart takes 5 three-point attempts. That's 95 other possessions. On/off rating is looking at all 100 possessions. You're only looking at the 5 possessions where he took a 3, lol.

"Smart can play great for 46 minutes then cost the Celts the game in the last 2 minutes and the stats will not show that." is another statement of a casual fan. Let's break it down, shall we?

Player A = only shoots 1/5 from 3, and makes a really dumb foul at the end of the game which costs us a chance to MAYBE get a last second shot that may or may not go in, but that's only 6 possessions in a game. over the course of ALL 100 possessions that game, his play overall had a on/off rating of +15

Player B = shoots 2/5 from 3, doesn't make any dumb fouls but over the course of ALL 100 possessions that game, his play overall had a on/off rating of -1

Guessing you would pick Player B as the better player, but a more informed fan would pick Player A (Smart) every time..

Casual fan?

I've been a Celtic fan for more than 30 years and what's important in the game of basketball is winning, not stats.

You can manipulate the stats all you want, but Smart and the Celts have not won a championship yet.

The Lakers already got Banner 17.

It's been 11 years and the Celts still have not made it back to the finals.

Right now the Celts are a team below .500.

If according to the stats Marcus Smart is so good, why is the Celts just a play-in team right now?

The guy is shooting 34.6% from the field and 26% from 3pt land.

When you play a lot of minutes, 35.8 minutes per game, and you shoot that horribly, your team isn't going to win many games.

Proof of this is the Celtic record!

[Fierce1]

The refs released a statement saying that Smart was actually fouled by Porzingis on that play - nice try.
https://www.boston.com/sports/boston-celtics/2021/11/07/marcus-smart-fouled-celtics-mavericks/#:~:text=Smart%20made%20a%20bad%20decision%20to%20foul%20as%20well%20down%20the%20stretch.&text=Celtics%20guard%20Marcus%20Smart%20was,of%20the%20107%2D104%20loss.

And will that statement change the outcome of that game?

The point is Smart wanted the refs to bail him out.

If you have league pass then watch it again.

There was not even an attempt to play through contact.

What Smart did was when he got hit, he immediately threw the ball up.

Refs ain't calling that!

[Fierce1]

Manipulating the stats still won't change the fact that the Celts are not winning games.

It's just not consistent with what is actually happening.

What's actually happening is even when Tatum had more than 30 points in the game against Dallas and Atlanta, the Celts still lost.

You don't have to be a genius to figure it out.

When was the last time a team went to the finals with a starting PG playing more than 30 minutes per game and shooting below 40% from the field and below 30% from the 3pt line?

Marcus Smart fans will feel good about whatever stats you want to manipulate.

But it still won't change the fact that the Celts are not winning games even when Tatum and Brown are averaging more than 20 points per game.

Horford and Rob are also playing well.

So why are the Celts just the #10 seed?

[Larry_Russell]

My god man, we get it, you hate smart, cannit all just stop?

We know what you willnpost on the matter.

Smart makes an error you will scream about it someone says something positive about him you will scream about it.

We get it mate.

Talk about tatum or schroder or someone for a while.

[Fierce1]

My god man, we get it, you hate smart, cannit all just stop?

We know what you willnpost on the matter.

Smart makes an error you will scream about it someone says something positive about him you will scream about it.

We get it mate.

Talk about tatum or schroder or someone for a while.

I'm just replying to someone who called me "a casual fan".

It's not that I hate Marcus Smart, it's about I just want the Celts to win.

[CelticFaninLBC]

Tatum, Big Al and Smart shooting around their career averages from 3 would be a big help..

Tatum this year is 32.5. His career average is 39%.
Big Al this year is 27.8%. His career average is 36%.
Smart this year is 26%. His career average is 31.8%.

It's not like their career averages are small sample sizes either...

[Fierce1]

Tatum, Big Al and Smart shooting around their career averages from 3 would be a big help..

Tatum this year is 32.5. His career average is 39%.
Big Al this year is 27.8%. His career average is 36%.
Smart this year is 26%. His career average is 31.8%.

It's not like their career averages are small sample sizes either...

It will help, but a better question would be will the Celts be better if they had a different starting PG?

Phoenix went from Rubio to CP3 and the Suns went from non-playoff team to finals berth in 2021.

Milwaukee went from Bledsoe to Jrue Holiday and the Bucks won a championship.

Will the Celts be better if the Celts had Malcolm Brogdon or SGA instead of Smart?

[Bad-Thoma]

Manipulating the stats still won't change the fact that the Celts are not winning games.

It's just not consistent with what is actually happening.

What's actually happening is even when Tatum had more than 30 points in the game against Dallas and Atlanta, the Celts still lost.

You don't have to be a genius to figure it out.

When was the last time a team went to the finals with a starting PG playing more than 30 minutes per game and shooting below 40% from the field and below 30% from the 3pt line?

Marcus Smart fans will feel good about whatever stats you want to manipulate.

But it still won't change the fact that the Celts are not winning games even when Tatum and Brown are averaging more than 20 points per game.

Horford and Rob are also playing well.

So why are the Celts just the #10 seed?

So you use shooting percentage to tell us how bad Marcus is and when we respond with statistics defending his contributions it's "manipulating statistics"? Logical.

[Fierce1]

So you use shooting percentage to tell us how bad Marcus is and when we respond with statistics defending his contributions it's "manipulating statistics"? Logical.

I'm not denying Smart's contributions.

Marcus Smart gives the Celts the intangibles.
There are a lot of things that Smart does that helped the Celts win in the past.

So what's the problem?

Right now Smart is being forced to do too much.

This season and last season Smart became a starter.
It's also this season and last season that the Celts had their worst record since 2015.

Marcus Smart and the Celts are at their best when Smart is on a bench role.

Making him a starter and getting 36 minutes per game does not work because of his poor shooting.

Marcus Smart is a very good player overall.

But he's not a starter.

[Bad-Thoma]

So you use shooting percentage to tell us how bad Marcus is and when we respond with statistics defending his contributions it's "manipulating statistics"? Logical.

I'm not denying Smart's contributions.

Marcus Smart gives the Celts the intangibles.
There are a lot of things that Smart does that helped the Celts win in the past.

So what's the problem?

Right now Smart is being forced to do too much.

This season and last season Smart became a starter.
It's also this season and last season that the Celts had their worst record since 2015.

Marcus Smart and the Celts are at their best when Smart is on a bench role.

Making him a starter and getting 36 minutes per game does not work because of his poor shooting.

Marcus Smart is a very good player overall.

But he's not a starter.

He's not being forced to do too much as is evidenced by the teams better ratings with him on the floor and also by his ridiculously low usage this season. The starter thing is weird as well, he's always been in the games when it matters which is at the end of the game and he's been playing 28-32 minutes a game his whole career. The Celtic's troubles aren't because Marcus is suddenly playing about 3 more minutes a game, the C's troubles are because the team as a whole has been shooting poorly and because we're missing an all-star in JB and a starter in RW. Water finds level and more of the team's shots will start to fall as players move towards their career percentages and hopefully that coincides with the team being healthy and the defense continuing to gel.

I don't even know why I am bothering to argue about it, it's like talking to a wall with any of the people that try to scapegoat one guy on this team anyways.

[Feed Your Head]

Celtics net rating is 19.1 better when Smart is on the court, as opposed to off.

[Larry_Russell]

Celtics net rating is 19.1 better when Smart is on the court, as opposed to off.

Stats and eye test prove this over and over.

[MaxwellSmart]

Its the BALL man....get rid of the Wilson

[zoyathedestroya]

Stats don't matter. These numbers don't mean anything. For the love of God, why won't we just get rid of stat-tracking. No more counting of... i think they're called "points". Just play the game, man. Have fun.

[Fierce1]

Stats only tell part of the story.

Like I said, it's not like the Celts are winning games, Smart is playing well, and I still complain about Marcus Smart.

The Celts are below .500.

Smart is only shooting 34.6% from the field and 26% from 3pt land.
Yet Smart is getting 35.8 minutes per game.
That's very inefficient!

If the goal is just to be a play-in team then mission accomplished!

[Fierce1]

The stats will not show that the opposing coach will tell the opposing player guarding Smart to intentionally leave Smart open so that Smart will shoot and miss.

What that does is make life difficult for other Celtic players because driving lanes will not be open and Tatum and Brown will most likely have an extra defender on them because the one guarding Smart is playing more of a safety role.

It's like playing 4 vs. 5.

[CelticFaninLBC]

Tatum, Big Al and Smart shooting around their career averages from 3 would be a big help..

Tatum this year is 32.5. His career average is 39%.
Big Al this year is 27.8%. His career average is 36%.
Smart this year is 26%. His career average is 31.8%.

It's not like their career averages are small sample sizes either...

It will help, but a better question would be will the Celts be better if they had a different starting PG?

Phoenix went from Rubio to CP3 and the Suns went from non-playoff team to finals berth in 2021.

Milwaukee went from Bledsoe to Jrue Holiday and the Bucks won a championship.

Will the Celts be better if the Celts had Malcolm Brogdon or SGA instead of Smart?

It's not like prior pg's were good distributors.

Unfortunately, the Celtics missed their chance on CP3 and Holiday.

[Triple7]

The refs released a statement saying that Smart was actually fouled by Porzingis on that play - nice try.
https://www.boston.com/sports/boston-celtics/2021/11/07/marcus-smart-fouled-celtics-mavericks/#:~:text=Smart%20made%20a%20bad%20decision%20to%20foul%20as%20well%20down%20the%20stretch.&text=Celtics%20guard%20Marcus%20Smart%20was,of%20the%20107%2D104%20loss.

And will that statement change the outcome of that game?

The point is Smart wanted the refs to bail him out.

If you have league pass then watch it again.

There was not even an attempt to play through contact.

What Smart did was when he got hit, he immediately threw the ball up.

Refs ain't calling that!

I agree with this. If you drive trying to fish for a foul, most of the time, the refs won’t bail you out. The mentality should be to try to score, and worry about the call later. Plus Smart taking those crucial free throws would be a nightmare as well. As if he could calmly sink them both lol.

[Fierce1]

It's not like prior pg's were good distributors.

Unfortunately, the Celtics missed their chance on CP3 and Holiday.

Yeah, Celts won 50 games or more with Kyrie and Isaiah.

Celts were also on pace to win 50 games, with Kemba, before the pandemic.