The Trade Thread, 2016-17 (2.0)

[Edug27]

I'm not mocking your team. I like your team. Great energy, great defense, great coach. I just say you're not realistic about getting the biggest Free Agents until you look like a contender. You think Hayward would choose Celtics over GS / Cavs / Spurs / Rockets / Clippers ?

For starters, half the teams you've mentioned can't afford Hayward.

[krakdol]

I'm not mocking your team. I like your team. Great energy, great defense, great coach. I just say you're not realistic about getting the biggest Free Agents until you look like a contender. You think Hayward would choose Celtics over GS / Cavs / Spurs / Rockets / Clippers ?

For starters, half the teams you've mentioned can't afford Hayward.

You don't know that. A lot of transactions will happen before Hayward becomes a Free Agent.

[chrisab123]

I'm not mocking your team. I like your team. Great energy, great defense, great coach. I just say you're not realistic about getting the biggest Free Agents until you look like a contender. You think Hayward would choose Celtics over GS / Cavs / Spurs / Rockets / Clippers ?

In a perfect world no. He would probably go to GS or Cavs. But the Cavs GS Spurs cannot afford him. Rockets can't since they signed Anderson to that ridiculous contract. Clippers could afford him but only if Blake or CP3 leaves. If they did then that team would not be as good as Toronto or Boston anyways. I think if they go into FA with max space the team will be able to lock up Blake or Hayward. But you can still do this and be competitive this year by making trades and then dealing said players at say the NBA Draft for room or even into the offseason.

[krakdol]

I'm not mocking your team. I like your team. Great energy, great defense, great coach. I just say you're not realistic about getting the biggest Free Agents until you look like a contender. You think Hayward would choose Celtics over GS / Cavs / Spurs / Rockets / Clippers ?

http://www.butlersports.com

Sure, sure, of course I know about Butler and the connection between Brad Stevens and Gordon Hayward.

But like I said, Hayward is a competitor, all he cares about is winning so if he leaves he will go to one of the best teams he can, which in my opinion is unlikely to be Boston because he'll get a lot of offers from top teams.

[DarkAzcura]

I'm not mocking your team. I like your team. Great energy, great defense, great coach. I just say you're not realistic about getting the biggest Free Agents until you look like a contender. You think Hayward would choose Celtics over GS / Cavs / Spurs / Rockets / Clippers ?

You know you are talking about a team that just signed Horford and was in the final meetings with Durant right? Horford also chose Boston over Houston. I can understand where you are coming from to an extent, but you should be far more worried than you are.

[chrisab123]

I'm not mocking your team. I like your team. Great energy, great defense, great coach. I just say you're not realistic about getting the biggest Free Agents until you look like a contender. You think Hayward would choose Celtics over GS / Cavs / Spurs / Rockets / Clippers ?

For starters, half the teams you've mentioned can't afford Hayward.

You don't know that. A lot of transactions will happen before Hayward becomes a Free Agent.

So you're saying that the Spurs would trade LMA Tony Parker or Leonard? The Rockets would find a taker for Anderson? Clippers will break up the big 3 they have or that GSW/Cavs would trade one of their big 3? Cavs are so screwed with the cap anyways that even if they traded Love they would still need to move JR or TT to be able to afford anything of consequence

[DarkAzcura]

The Celtics and Jazz have basically the same record. Add in Hayward, and the Celtics are an ECF team with the assets to acquire another player to put them into the finals. The Jazz don't project to make it to the WCF with Hayward.

If he's all about titles, I wouldn't think that bodes well for your future. Especially given that he won't qualify for DVE status and the difference in money will be minimal.

The difference is Jazz starters were injured all season (Hill / Favors / Hayward / Hood missed tons of games) and they still got this record.

Until last night, Jazz starters (Hill / Hood / Hayward / Favors / Gobert) had played only 12 minutes together.

And Jazz have far better young players in Rudy Gobert or Rodney Hood because they drafted better.

The difference? Talk about not really paying attention to any team but your own. You know the Celtics had their share of injury issues to begin the year also right? The Celtics would probably be tied with Toronto and right behind Cleveland in the standings if they had reasonable health. The Celtics only just recently became completely healthy.

[krakdol]

I'm not mocking your team. I like your team. Great energy, great defense, great coach. I just say you're not realistic about getting the biggest Free Agents until you look like a contender. You think Hayward would choose Celtics over GS / Cavs / Spurs / Rockets / Clippers ?

You know you are talking about a team that just signed Horford and was in the final meetings with Durant right? Horford also chose Boston over Houston. I can understand where you are coming from to an extent, but you should be far more worried than you are.

Oh I AM worried. I'm sure Hayward COULD leave, especially if Jazz don't show they can succeed in playoffs as soon as this year.

I just don't think he'll go to Celtics UNLESS you get another big name first.

I also think he still likes Utah chances for the future so I'd say it's like 70 / 30 he stays right now.

[Ericb5]

I actually kinda liked Hinkie's strategy to just go full tank. I feel like Presti did the same thing, and gets a lot of credit for doing so. In a league where contending, elite players and high draft position are all highly correlated, why not?

With that said, doesn't look to me like you got as fortunate as Presti did. Embiid a nice prospect whose injury red flags are only bigger now that he missed his first two seasons. 300lb 7-footers with feet problems are never a good thing, but I'm not his doctor, so who knows?

The rest of your prospects leave me underwhelmed. Way too early to judge them completely, but I'm not of the mind that Simmons is going to be all that, and I certainly don't take him over Wiggins. Noel is probably gone in a couple of months, and Okafor an is oafish stat-padder, IMO. Wouldn't surprise me if Saric ended up with the 2nd best career after Embiid, tbh.

As of right now, I don't see a future contender or even a path to one, with the major caveat that you should be adding another top 3 pick this summer. I like your future a lot more if you add Ball or Fultz.

I don't think you will be catching Boston any time soon, though. We will also be adding top picks via the Nets, and have a better ownership/front office/coaching situation.

Embiid isn't 300 pounds. He is 275. Plus he is beyond a nice prospect. He is a true franchise player.

Presti got 3 superstars in consecutive years I think in Durant, Westbrook, and Harden. That is obviously the gold standard, and the ultimate hope.

We got Embiid, and Simmons with Okafor in between, who obviously isn't a superstar, but we have two more bites at the Apple this year in a terrific draft that happens to be heavy with the types of players that we need.

I don't have close to the confidence in Collangelo as I had in Hinkie, but Hinkie set him up so well that I think it will be hard for him to screw it up.


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Philly, you already screwed your window. You will get Noel and Okafor for pennies on the dollar. You drafted Okafor instead of Kristaps Porzingis. Why tank if you can't get the draft right? Who knows on Simmons and get ready to max Embiid after next season and no playoff berths. By this time in the OKC tank, they were a playoff team.

You wing 25 games this year. It's over. Time for another rebuild and strategy.

Drafting Okafor was a mistake, but I will happily max Embiid and Simmons when the time comes, unless Embiid breaks the same bone between now and then.

They are both good enough to not have to chase stars in other ways from now on. We can organically grow with them, and add pieces for the right fit. This year we will have two top 10 picks. We don't need to preserve salary space for other stars is what I mean.

Okafor and Noel are rounding errors on the upside of the team.


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[DarkAzcura]

I'm not mocking your team. I like your team. Great energy, great defense, great coach. I just say you're not realistic about getting the biggest Free Agents until you look like a contender. You think Hayward would choose Celtics over GS / Cavs / Spurs / Rockets / Clippers ?

For starters, half the teams you've mentioned can't afford Hayward.

You don't know that. A lot of transactions will happen before Hayward becomes a Free Agent.

The transactions that need to happen to those teams to clear space for Hayward would likely dip them down to the Celtics/Jazz level. That's not a realistic scenario at all. None of those teams except maybe the Rockets are going to go that far out of their way to sign Hayward.

[165bows]

In the off-season, for Boston to create enough cap space to sign BOTH Blake Griffin AND Gordon Hayward to their MAX salaries, they would need to dump Avery Bradley, Jaylen Brown, Jae Crowder and Marcus Smart in addition to renouncing all of their 2017 free agents/non-guaranteed contracts.

As a Jazz fan, I really doubt Hayward leaves for Boston this summer. Sure, you've got Brad Stevens, but why would he leave the Jazz for a team which doesn't look better than the Jazz ?

All he cares about is winning titles if you read what he said, so the only way I see him go to Celtics is
1) if Jazz isn't successful this year (unlikely unless injuries strike again, even with tons of injuries they're already 5th in the West)
AND 2) your team gets a lot better with free agency or trades first.

If Hayward left, he would leave for one of the contenders (GS, Cavs, Spurs and maybe Clippers or Rockets, but Jazz may already be better than those two). I doubt he will because he thinks Jazz may be a future contender, especially with Gobert's emergence.

Right now, Celtics aren't that attractive for a guy like Hayward. You have IT and Horford (near allstars but not superstars) and not much else... I mean, I like the effort, coaching is great, but there's a serious lack of talent in Celtics roster right now.

Draft didn't go that well for Celtics recently. Boston first needs to draft better if they want the biggest FA... That just hasn't happened until now.

I don't know about Blake Griffin, but I suspect he will feel the same...Now maybe the first domino is what matters. Getting one big FA could be enough to make a second one come.

The Celtics and Jazz have basically the same record. Add in Hayward, and the Celtics are an ECF team with the assets to acquire another player to put them into the finals. The Jazz don't project to make it to the WCF with Hayward.

If he's all about titles, I wouldn't think that bodes well for your future. Especially given that he won't qualify for DVE status and the difference in money will be minimal.

Agree, Jazz posters aren't being fully realistic in their views on this. The tale of the tape style comps between players really doesn't mean anything. Both teams are first round through conference finals type teams, the details beyond that are really irrelevant.

I'd be real nervous as a Jazz fan if they don't make at least a real run at the conference finals.

Not mentioned is there has been a huge pace discrepancy between the two teams. Do players generally want higher stats or lower stats? Especially for a guy like Hayward who actually is lined up for two more long term deals in his future.

[Celts17Pride]

Trade with Atlanta:

Amir, Zeller, Rozier, rights to Yabusele, Memphis 1st rounder for Dwight Howard and Ryan Kelly.

Just throwing it out there for discussion. Would solve a lot of issues. Again not sure how I feel about this.

[2Mas]

Trade with Atlanta:

Amir, Zeller, Rozier, rights to Yabusele, Memphis 1st rounder for Dwight Howard and Ryan Kelly.

Just throwing it out there for discussion. Would solve a lot of issues. Again not sure how I feel about this.

This would be really funny if we ended up with both Al & Dwight.

I'd do it for us, but I don't see why Atlanta does it. They got Schroeder who people love (not me), & it seems more of a rebuilding move.


However, if i'm Atlanta, i'm shipping Millsap for the best young talent I can get. That team is done. Solid coach & system that will win them some games, prob snag a 7th seed or so, but that team is delaying the inevitable.

[claycarver]

I've got to think that there could be a deal there with Denver, but the problem is that if Nurkic is on the block I think the price will end up getting raise by the other players in the market to the point where Danny saves his ammo for a blockbuster level deal.

I think Rozier plus a non BKN first or Rozier/Olynyk and 2nds or something along those lines would be where my initial offer lies, but Nurkic has actually shown enough in the league that I wouldn't be surprised if a handful of teams drove that price up and I think that's where I leave it. I like Nurkic, but I'm a little hesitant on his fit. He fills holes the team has, but I don't think he fits into the schemes, particularly on offense, very well.

Jusuf is perfect. If he could be had for Rozier and a non-Brooklyn 1st, that's a no brainer. Trading his contract out for Rozier's keeps us in just the right position to make a run at Hayward in the off season.

You add Jusuf, Hayward, Zizic, a top draft pick and a second year Brown to this years team, we are GOLDEN moving forward.

[CelticFaninLBC]

Trade with Atlanta:

Amir, Zeller, Rozier, rights to Yabusele, Memphis 1st rounder for Dwight Howard and Ryan Kelly.

Just throwing it out there for discussion. Would solve a lot of issues. Again not sure how I feel about this.

Howard is having a good season and would definitely help, but seems if Ainge wanted Howard, he would have signed him last offseason.

If Ainge does decide to blow cap space, Milsap is the more likely trade option. He seems to fit more of what Boston likes to do, since he can stretch the floor, unlike Howard.

[Celts17Pride]

Marc Stein
@ESPNSteinLine
Trade rumble: Houston has made no secret of its desire to add a big man and the Kings' Kosta Koufos, I'm told, has emerged as a prime target

Talks are heating up in the NBA

[Celts17Pride]

Trade with Atlanta:

Amir, Zeller, Rozier, rights to Yabusele, Memphis 1st rounder for Dwight Howard and Ryan Kelly.

Just throwing it out there for discussion. Would solve a lot of issues. Again not sure how I feel about this.

Howard is having a good season and would definitely help, but seems if Ainge wanted Howard, he would have signed him last offseason.

If Ainge does decide to blow cap space, Milsap is the more likely trade option. He seems to fit more of what Boston likes to do, since he can stretch the floor, unlike Howard.

Celtics need a center. Millsap who I like just makes the Celtics the Hawks 2.0. The Celtics would have the same front court issues the Hawks had. Not an endorsement for Howard just pointing out I don't think Millsap would work.

[CelticFaninLBC]

I'm not mocking your team. I like your team. Great energy, great defense, great coach. I just say you're not realistic about getting the biggest Free Agents until you look like a contender. You think Hayward would choose Celtics over GS / Cavs / Spurs / Rockets / Clippers ?

Only team that can plausibly make cap space to sign Hayward is the Spurs. I can see them dealing Danny Green and opening up a max space. As others have mentioned LAC and GSW need to keep their own guys so won't have space.

IT, Horford, Bradley, Crowder, Smart, Brown and BKN's top 5 pick in a loaded 2017 draft is a better group than Gobert, Hood, Hill, Favors, Lyles and Exum. Yes, you have 3 nice young players in Gobert, Hood and Favors, but they're only a couple of years younger than Bradley, Crowder and IT. Also, Stevens is a much better coach than Quinn.

[CelticFaninLBC]

Trade with Atlanta:

Amir, Zeller, Rozier, rights to Yabusele, Memphis 1st rounder for Dwight Howard and Ryan Kelly.

Just throwing it out there for discussion. Would solve a lot of issues. Again not sure how I feel about this.

Howard is having a good season and would definitely help, but seems if Ainge wanted Howard, he would have signed him last offseason.

If Ainge does decide to blow cap space, Milsap is the more likely trade option. He seems to fit more of what Boston likes to do, since he can stretch the floor, unlike Howard.

Celtics need a center. Millsap who I like just makes the Celtics the Hawks 2.0. The Celtics would have the same front court issues the Hawks had. Not an endorsement for Howard just pointing out I don't think Millsap would work.

Why do you think Ainge passed on Howard last summer?

[Celts17Pride]

Howard is having a good season and would definitely help, but seems if Ainge wanted Howard, he would have signed him last offseason.

If Ainge does decide to blow cap space, Milsap is the more likely trade option. He seems to fit more of what Boston likes to do, since he can stretch the floor, unlike Howard.

Celtics need a center. Millsap who I like just makes the Celtics the Hawks 2.0. The Celtics would have the same front court issues the Hawks had. Not an endorsement for Howard just pointing out I don't think Millsap would work.

Why do you think Ainge passed on Howard last summer?

Because he signed Horford and was going after Durant