Trade Thread, 2023-24 – (Offseason)

[celtics543]

Am I crazy or didn't the Celtics say Horford was retiring at the end of this playoff run? I keep seeing him in peoples line ups for next year but isn't he done?

[zoyathedestroya]

Am I crazy or didn't the Celtics say Horford was retiring at the end of this playoff run? I keep seeing him in peoples line ups for next year but isn't he done?

He signed a two-year extension. Somewhere around MLE money.

[Hal14]

Could be right, but I expect Smart to be dealt...

Read on Twitter

At this point, I would think there's a good chance that 1 of our 3 PG's (Smart, white, brogdon) could be traded.

There's 3 factors at play here which makes me think it could happen:

1) Egos. We know D-White has no ego. He's a quiet, humble, aw shucks kind of guy. But Smart and Brogdon definitely have egos - especially Smart. Brogdon for the most part has said all the right things this season about being cool with taking a lesser role, cool with coming off the bench. BUT his play on the court is a little concerning. In the preseason, I was so excited at the way Brogdon was playing - zipping passes all over the place, finding open shooters (especially making great passes to Hauser spotting up). He really seemed like the smooth ball handling, floor general, pass-first type of PG we have lacked since Rondo. But as the season went on, he did less and less of that, and he became more focused on getting his own. Just became a shooter, looked for his own shot. Sometimes forced drives and forced shots near the rim. Missed lots of layups. This stuff became harder to accept from Brogdon, since the defensive errors he made seemed to be happening more and more as well. And then in the playoffs, we've seen him make some comments in the media that have raised some eyebrows, that make you think he's not so happy here, some comments hinting that it's been hard for him to accept a lesser role on the team.

2) Money and roster construction. Does it really make sense to pay THREE different guys on the same team $18 mil or more each, who are all 6'4" or under and have potentially too much overlap with their skill sets, strengths/weaknesses ?

3) Reports coming out that certain players are still not over Udoka's dismissal. Well, guess what? Which players have publicly said the nicest things about Udoka? Which players (based on their comments in the media) seem to be Udoka's biggest fans. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know it's Tatum and Smart. Tatum said at all-star weekend that Udoka is his favorite coach ever (above the legend, Coach K). And Smart has made some comments in the media earlier in the season that indicate he was really upset about Udoka's dismissal, comments that indicate the 2 of them had a close bond. Well, guess what? Tatum isn't going anywhere. Entering his prime, 25 yrs old, a top 5 player on the planet. Can shoot, pass, rebound, defend. Good athleticism, good size. I don't think I need to explain to ya'll how good he is lol. But Smart? Good player, arguably our 3rd best player. But a very inconsistent shooter, often times slows the game down too much, dribbles the ball too much sometimes, walks the ball up the floor. Is only 6'3". Gets injured a lot. Sometimes makes dumb mistakes that result in him getting technical fouls, ejected from games, or makes dumb mistakes like the 2 plays at the end of game 5 last year vs milwaukee that lost us the game, the unnecessary half court shot he took 2 yrs ago, etc.

Wouldn't surprise me if Smart and/or Brogdon gets traded this offseason. And obviously, Pritchard could get traded too.

I'd be surprised if White gets traded. He's on a pretty reasonably priced contract. Between him, Smart and Brogdon, White is the quickest ball mover, doesn't hold onto the ball, doesn't over dribble, doesn't force drives, doesn't force shots near the rim. Makes the right basketball play. More of a pass-first guy. Nice combination of both defense and shooting (smart can defend but very inconsistent shooter, Malcolm can shoot but very inconsistent on D). Plus, White has no ego.

[Celts17Pride]

Wouldn't surprise me if Smart and/or Brogdon gets traded this offseason. And obviously, Pritchard could get traded too.

I would guess that one of Smart/White/Brogdon is gone for a big man and Pritchard stays. Just makes way too much sense on many different levels.

[zoyathedestroya]

Paul George (always wanted him on the Cs) or going on a different direction, an opted-in Draymond Green. Lol.

Gordon Hayward for the minimum.

[Cricket23]

Could be right, but I expect Smart to be dealt...

Read on Twitter

At this point, I would think there's a good chance that 1 of our 3 PG's (Smart, white, brogdon) could be traded.

There's 3 factors at play here which makes me think it could happen:

1) Egos. We know D-White has no ego. He's a quiet, humble, aw shucks kind of guy. But Smart and Brogdon definitely have egos - especially Smart. Brogdon for the most part has said all the right things this season about being cool with taking a lesser role, cool with coming off the bench. BUT his play on the court is a little concerning. In the preseason, I was so excited at the way Brogdon was playing - zipping passes all over the place, finding open shooters (especially making great passes to Hauser spotting up). He really seemed like the smooth ball handling, floor general, pass-first type of PG we have lacked since Rondo. But as the season went on, he did less and less of that, and he became more focused on getting his own. Just became a shooter, looked for his own shot. Sometimes forced drives and forced shots near the rim. Missed lots of layups. This stuff became harder to accept from Brogdon, since the defensive errors he made seemed to be happening more and more as well. And then in the playoffs, we've seen him make some comments in the media that have raised some eyebrows, that make you think he's not so happy here, some comments hinting that it's been hard for him to accept a lesser role on the team.

2) Money and roster construction. Does it really make sense to pay THREE different guys on the same team $18 mil or more each, who are all 6'4" or under and have potentially too much overlap with their skill sets, strengths/weaknesses ?

3) Reports coming out that certain players are still not over Udoka's dismissal. Well, guess what? Which players have publicly said the nicest things about Udoka? Which players (based on their comments in the media) seem to be Udoka's biggest fans. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know it's Tatum and Smart. Tatum said at all-star weekend that Udoka is his favorite coach ever (above the legend, Coach K). And Smart has made some comments in the media earlier in the season that indicate he was really upset about Udoka's dismissal, comments that indicate the 2 of them had a close bond. Well, guess what? Tatum isn't going anywhere. Entering his prime, 25 yrs old, a top 5 player on the planet. Can shoot, pass, rebound, defend. Good athleticism, good size. I don't think I need to explain to ya'll how good he is lol. But Smart? Good player, arguably our 3rd best player. But a very inconsistent shooter, often times slows the game down too much, dribbles the ball too much sometimes, walks the ball up the floor. Is only 6'3". Gets injured a lot. Sometimes makes dumb mistakes that result in him getting technical fouls, ejected from games, or makes dumb mistakes like the 2 plays at the end of game 5 last year vs milwaukee that lost us the game, the unnecessary half court shot he took 2 yrs ago, etc.

Wouldn't surprise me if Smart and/or Brogdon gets traded this offseason. And obviously, Pritchard could get traded too.

I agree it's one of our guards on the move. We either go double big or we go small, and it's because we're missing a starting caliber forward. We end up using awkward lineups. It's unlikely to be Smart on the move because he's by far our best distributor. White is more of a connector and Brogdon a black hole scorer. I favor moving Brogdon because we were fortunate that he was mostly healthy for the 1st time since his rookie season. If we trade for a defensive forward we should move White. If we trade for a better offensive forward, it should be Brogdon.

[djFan71]

4 teamer just to put it all together, but could easily be broken up.

BOS: 3, SloMo, Burks, Stewart, Prince, McLaughlin for Brown, Brogdon, Hauser
DET: Simons for Burks, Stewart
POR: Brown for 3, Simons
MIN: Prince, SloMo, McLaughlin for Brogdon, Hauser

MIN is the iffy part, imo. But they're back to the Jazz thing with scoring but no D everywhere and Gobert. McLaughlin is just salary ballast. (Not needed if you do White instead of Brogdon, but we'd want a pick or something).

Scoot/White
Smart/Burks
Tatum/Prince
SloMo/Grant
Rob/Stewart/Al

We also cut $21M in salary, so could take any salary dumps the other teams want or get a TPE.

[AKFO]

What do we think about keeping the core and mortgaging our future firsts for a guy like Anunoby? One of our guards or sign and trade Grant (though that might hardcap us?) along with ‘24 ‘26 ‘28 firsts for OG?

If Joe isn’t gonna lose his affinity for small ball lineups, the best thing we can do is give him more size on the court. Anunoby only makes 19 mill but has a player option after next year. Hopefully be moved on from some more salary by then.

[darrendaye]

4 teamer just to put it all together, but could easily be broken up.

BOS: 3, SloMo, Burks, Stewart, Prince, McLaughlin for Brown, Brogdon, Hauser
DET: Simons for Burks, Stewart
POR: Brown for 3, Simons
MIN: Prince, SloMo, McLaughlin for Brogdon, Hauser

MIN is the iffy part, imo. But they're back to the Jazz thing with scoring but no D everywhere and Gobert. McLaughlin is just salary ballast. (Not needed if you do White instead of Brogdon, but we'd want a pick or something).

Scoot/White
Smart/Burks
Tatum/Prince
SloMo/Grant
Rob/Stewart/Al

We also cut $21M in salary, so could take any salary dumps the other teams want or get a TPE.

I'll need to bounce this around in my mind a bit, but Brown for #3 pick and (somehow routing) a top 6 in the rotation level PF works for me.

[Cricket23]

What do we think about keeping the core and mortgaging our future firsts for a guy like Anunoby? One of our guards or sign and trade Grant (though that might hardcap us?) along with ‘24 ‘26 ‘28 firsts for OG?

If Joe isn’t gonna lose his affinity for small ball lineups, the best thing we can do is give him more size on the court. Anunoby only makes 19 mill but has a player option after next year. Hopefully be moved on from some more salary by then.

I am curious to the actual value of OG, or for that matter Siakam. I read one of those articles where they quote anonymous coaches and GMs, and they indicated that these player's value wasn't as high as most think. A rumor was out last trade deadline that NY offered 3 1sts for OG. Keith Smith responded that it was probably something like Fourier (bad money) and 3 conditional 1sts.

My idea of fair value for these guys if Boston traded for either looks like this-

OG for White and a top 4 protected 1st

Siakam for Brogdon, S & T Grant, Pritchard, and a top 4 protected 1st.

[165bows]

My guess is White and Anunoby are a lot closer in caliber than people think.

[Cricket23]

My guess is White and Anunoby are a lot closer in caliber than people think.

Especially since White is signed for an extra year

[big-shot-ROB]

Could be right, but I expect Smart to be dealt...

Read on Twitter

At this point, I would think there's a good chance that 1 of our 3 PG's (Smart, white, brogdon) could be traded.

There's 3 factors at play here which makes me think it could happen:

1) Egos. We know D-White has no ego. He's a quiet, humble, aw shucks kind of guy. But Smart and Brogdon definitely have egos - especially Smart. Brogdon for the most part has said all the right things this season about being cool with taking a lesser role, cool with coming off the bench. BUT his play on the court is a little concerning. In the preseason, I was so excited at the way Brogdon was playing - zipping passes all over the place, finding open shooters (especially making great passes to Hauser spotting up). He really seemed like the smooth ball handling, floor general, pass-first type of PG we have lacked since Rondo. But as the season went on, he did less and less of that, and he became more focused on getting his own. Just became a shooter, looked for his own shot. Sometimes forced drives and forced shots near the rim. Missed lots of layups. This stuff became harder to accept from Brogdon, since the defensive errors he made seemed to be happening more and more as well. And then in the playoffs, we've seen him make some comments in the media that have raised some eyebrows, that make you think he's not so happy here, some comments hinting that it's been hard for him to accept a lesser role on the team.

This is right on the money

[truth18]

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2293097

[big-shot-ROB]

OG isn't fixing anything. Now, if there was a way to get Siakam without giving up Brown, Tatum and Rob, then I'm listening

[hugepatsfan]

I disagree that OG isn't fixing anything. He'd be a big help in a number of areas.

The last 4 years, since he become a starter, he's shooting 38% from 3 on 5 attempts per game. No year lower than 36.3%. Derrick White shot a career best 38.1% this year and had a year at 36.6%, but otherwise has been about 34% each year. It's a much more consistent/reliable floor spacer.

White is an all NBA defense caliber guard. OG is an all defense caliber forward. We already have an all NBA defense guard in Smart, and Brown is better guarding on ball guards than off ball wings because he loses focus off the ball. OG makes us better defensively because he compliments what we have better than White.

His improved shooting also probably empowers team to start Rob over Horford to improve the rebounding.

It's not a magic wand that fixes everything, but it'd be a good addition and help contribute to some positive improvement.

[Larry_Russell]

another kick at the can

Brown to Portland, Simons and #3 (Scoot)

Brogdon to Minny
Conley Jr to Orlando
McDaniels and Harris to Boston

Simons/Scoot
Smart/White
Tatum/Harris
McDaniels/Grant
Timelord/Horford

would create a 5.5 million TPE from 2nd trade and a 7.7 million TPE from the brown trade.

Let Scoot come off the bench till he gets aclimated then trade Simons for a shooting guard upgrade

Scoot/Smart
trade/White
Tatum/HArris
McDaniels/Grant
Timelord/Horford

[bfchs123]

Like OG, not sure he's the guy I use all the picks/swaps on though - especially as a third wing

Now agree with others, if there is a way to get Siakam with some combo of White or Smart/Grant/Pritchard and a bunch of 1sts/swaps I'd be all over that. Probably need a third (or fourth team)

Smart / Brogdon
Brown
Tatum / Hauser
Siakam / Al
RWIII

[Larry_Russell]

4 teamer just to put it all together, but could easily be broken up.

BOS: 3, SloMo, Burks, Stewart, Prince, McLaughlin for Brown, Brogdon, Hauser
DET: Simons for Burks, Stewart
POR: Brown for 3, Simons
MIN: Prince, SloMo, McLaughlin for Brogdon, Hauser

MIN is the iffy part, imo. But they're back to the Jazz thing with scoring but no D everywhere and Gobert. McLaughlin is just salary ballast. (Not needed if you do White instead of Brogdon, but we'd want a pick or something).

Scoot/White
Smart/Burks
Tatum/Prince
SloMo/Grant
Rob/Stewart/Al

We also cut $21M in salary, so could take any salary dumps the other teams want or get a TPE.

I think Simons is work more than Burks and Stewart. More should be coming back from Detroit in this deal.

But I am pretty high on Anfernee and can 100% see him have a Markannen jump in value next season as a lead guard.

[Larry_Russell]

Like OG, not sure he's the guy I use all the picks/swaps on though - especially as a third wing

Now agree with others, if there is a way to get Siakam with some combo of White or Smart/Grant/Pritchard and a bunch of 1sts/swaps I'd be all over that. Probably need a third (or fourth team)

Smart / Brogdon
Brown
Tatum / Hauser
Siakam / Al
RWIII

To get Siakam, ou are moving Brown. Unless somehow Massai loses all his marbles or Siakam demands a trade.