Trade Thread #6: I Wood Walk 500 Myles

[jirrit]

I thought Bogdan's already signed.

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Is Ingram unrestricted?

[ConstableGeneva]

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At least we're not the Magic or Pistons.

Oh i remeber when the 76er fans went nuts about their lottery talent, MCW, Okafor and Noel. They all were supposed to be future all stars, look at them now ...

Their 3rd pick in the 2017 draft seems to be doing well. Gotta give them that.

[Froob]

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[Celtics_85]

maybe they are looking to reroute Dougie to another team

[ConstableGeneva]

I thought Bogdan's already signed.

Spoiler:

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Is Ingram unrestricted?

Restricted. For sure back with Pelicans.

[celticfan42487]

I have family business to attend to. Won't be back until around 7:30 PM.

Okay Mr. Corleone

[jirrit]

If Ainge bungles this and Hayward goes to NY due to believing that Danny isn't negotiating in good faith (hes not) then something needs to be done. You can't ask for Oladipo and Turner for Hayward when he could just walk.

Meanwhile...players are currently signing...not sure if Danny is aware or even cares.

You obviously have a bias against Ainge, but the Haywards have done this to themselves and made the negotiations harder on Indiana, Ainge being a good business person is not a fault in this situation it is a positive. The Haywards are all in on Indiana, everyone knows it, there's total transparency. He's not going to go to New York for less money, plus he doesn't want to be a Knick, so in this situation where Hayward wants to play in one specific location, and Indiana wants the services of Hayward Ainge has the leverage.

Ainge and the rest of the league know that Indiana wants to trade Turner away, the coach as well as multiple reporters have mentioned this - so Hayward for Turner is a no brainer part of this deal. Since the contracts don't add up Indy needs to give more. As it has also been highlighted Indy has been looking to dump McDermott since they signed his deal. That shouldn't be on Ainge to accept that bad money and as a fan of the team you should be able to respect that. Especially since we drafted a player that likely fits McDermott's role better than McDermott. The Celtics don't want to be in a position where they have to play Doug minutes and disrupt the development of Nesmith just because Indy wants to foist this contract on Boston to make this deal work for the Haywards who are already living in their palatial estate in Indiana,

Ainge has the leverage and that is why he's asking for either Oladipo or Warren. It isn't bargaining in bad faith, it is straight bargaining. Hayward wants his money, and he wants the Pacers. Danny is getting Turner, but the Celtics don't need to take on bad money to make this thing work for the Haywards.

Anyone who believes Danny does anything wrong has an agenda or bias against him. This has been the line on the site since always. You can't criticize "Trader Danny" ever.

So asking for the Pacers two best players for a guy who can literally walk out the door and sign elsewhere is negotiating in good faith? I think Ainge is good at his job in regards to trades. However, this is a different kind of circumstance where the player is able to legitimately control the situation and sign with the Knicks if these trade negotiations draw out. He's operating like that isn't an option. Sure maybe there's something he knows that we all don't but asking the other team for their two best players is not negotiating in good faith at all.

Only leverage Hayward has is that he could just say F it I just sign with Indy for whatever money they can give me. Maybe Robyn has a very bad influence and if he already got a free PS5 he might really consider it.

[ConstableGeneva]

Doug McDermotts salary isn't that bad BTW. 7.3 for this year and next. It isn't like he has a 20 million dollar contract.

Expiring after this season. Lamb is the one with two years left.

[sully00]

Getting McDermott puts Doug and Grant WIlliams at PF,
Tatum and Aaron Nesmith at SF,
Brown and Smart at SG,
Walker and Smart/Pritchard at PG,
and you are looking at undersized centers in Theis, Williams III and Potentially Turner.

I still believe Indiana has to take Edwards, give back a 1rst Round pick that actually conveys, and even then, the Celtics may be looking to dump more salary like Langford if they want to be able to add a veteran at the deadline, should they NEED one or the right one frees up and is willing to come.

IND can't take on salary they are up against the lux tax and they will be hard capped by this deal. Ainge isn't going to include last years lottery pick who has gotten a chance to show what he can do. That is why he wants Warren or Oladipo. Boston can plug either into the starting line up or look to deal them for a better fit. Its that type of contract Boston lacks in trade talks with Smart being the only Celtic making that kind of money.

[ILC]

Instead of asking for Warren if I were Danny I'd 'settle' for a 1st round pick along with Turner and McDermott and then reroute the pick and McDermott to HOU or SAC for Tucker or Bjelica.

[Fencer reregistered]

Steven Adams went for a first rounder heavily protected and a couple of seconds.

Even if we got Miles Turner we could have used him. That just seems like a good pickup.

I'm pretty confident Adams is solidly better than Turner or Theis. And we can always play Turner minutes at PF for spacing, heck we played Theis at PF for some time.

Thats not how it works mate. You have to send out some salary to get someone in return or have cap space. We dont have either, unless you suggested a S&T of Hayward for Adams or trade Kemba for him. Both wouldnt work because OKC dont want long term money.

Good point. If Adams was traded into cap room, then the price to get him while sending empty salary back would likely have been a lot higher.

Presumably it would have been a three-way, with us sending out Hayward and getting Adams (but not Turner), and Indiana sending OKC enough to make them happy with the deal. Tough to see exactly how that would have worked.

[greenroom31]

This trade Should have already been done if McDermott and Turner where on the table. If he leaves for nothing when they could have gotten a reasonable return he should be fired which he won't of course.

He drives a hard bargain

Hayward probably wants Ainge to push for a more expensive guy than McDermott (i.e. Dipo or Warren) as well, really for two reasons. First, it might mean the Pacers have to pay him more to match salaries. Second, taking a guy like Warren or Dipo out of the picture would mean that Hayward gets to be more of a focal point on offense. So I actually wouldn't be surprised if Hayward wants Ainge to stand firm.

[Writebloc]

If Ainge bungles this and Hayward goes to NY due to believing that Danny isn't negotiating in good faith (hes not) then something needs to be done. You can't ask for Oladipo and Turner for Hayward when he could just walk.

Meanwhile...players are currently signing...not sure if Danny is aware or even cares.

You obviously have a bias against Ainge, but the Haywards have done this to themselves and made the negotiations harder on Indiana, Ainge being a good business person is not a fault in this situation it is a positive. The Haywards are all in on Indiana, everyone knows it, there's total transparency. He's not going to go to New York for less money, plus he doesn't want to be a Knick, so in this situation where Hayward wants to play in one specific location, and Indiana wants the services of Hayward Ainge has the leverage.

Ainge and the rest of the league know that Indiana wants to trade Turner away, the coach as well as multiple reporters have mentioned this - so Hayward for Turner is a no brainer part of this deal. Since the contracts don't add up Indy needs to give more. As it has also been highlighted Indy has been looking to dump McDermott since they signed his deal. That shouldn't be on Ainge to accept that bad money and as a fan of the team you should be able to respect that. Especially since we drafted a player that likely fits McDermott's role better than McDermott. The Celtics don't want to be in a position where they have to play Doug minutes and disrupt the development of Nesmith just because Indy wants to foist this contract on Boston to make this deal work for the Haywards who are already living in their palatial estate in Indiana,

Ainge has the leverage and that is why he's asking for either Oladipo or Warren. It isn't bargaining in bad faith, it is straight bargaining. Hayward wants his money, and he wants the Pacers. Danny is getting Turner, but the Celtics don't need to take on bad money to make this thing work for the Haywards.

So asking for the Pacers two best players for a guy who can literally walk out the door and sign elsewhere is negotiating in good faith? I think Ainge is good at his job in regards to trades. However, this is a different kind of circumstance where the player is able to legitimately control the situation and sign with the Knicks if these trade negotiations draw out. He's operating like that isn't an option. Sure maybe there's something he knows that we all don't but asking the other team for their two best players is not negotiating in good faith at all.

You seem to be missing one of main points of context in this situation. The Haywards want Indiana and they don't want New York City. The have the kids enrolled in school in Indiana, they are living in Indiana - Gordon only wants to play in for the Pacers. So in this case where the entire league knows that Gordon won't literally walk out the door to play for New York the equation shifts and the power leans Boston as opposed to the Haywards. Also layer the coronavirus on top of this whole thing. Do you really think Gordon wants to live in NYC away from his family for the whole season? I don't think Robyn would let him, nor do I think Gordon would want that. He wants to go home and try to live as much of a normal life as he can next season, that means Indiana.

In any negotiation you are going to ask for a higher asking point than you think you are going to receive. It is on Indiana to find a solution for this problem, because likely it has been widely known that Gordon has been working this under the cover of night for a while or else his kids wouldn't be enrolled in Indiana schools.

[jirrit]

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[ConstableGeneva]

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A cool $13M is the price you pay to see if Turner can do better.

[celticfan42487]

Steven Adams went for a first rounder heavily protected and a couple of seconds.

Even if we got Miles Turner we could have used him. That just seems like a good pickup.

I'm pretty confident Adams is solidly better than Turner or Theis. And we can always play Turner minutes at PF for spacing, heck we played Theis at PF for some time.

Thats not how it works mate. You have to send out some salary to get someone in return or have cap space. We dont have either, unless you suggested a S&T of Hayward for Adams or trade Kemba for him. Both wouldnt work because OKC dont want long term money.

Good point. If Adams was traded into cap room, then the price to get him while sending empty salary back would likely have been a lot higher.

Presumably it would have been a three-way, with us sending out Hayward and getting Adams (but not Turner), and Indiana sending OKC enough to make them happy with the deal. Tough to see exactly how that would have worked.

Hayward into capspace, NYKs. TPE to Celtics.

Or same with Hawks.

Steven Adams is somewhere around 3x the player Turner is.

Steven Adams has an 8.6 on/off rating greater than Turner.

Myles Turner has had a negative on off rating for the past 2 years.

And every year since his sophmore year his on off rating has fallen. As the league gets more 3 point trick players from the big spot. Myles Turner is a more athletic but less aware and 0 passing talent version of Kelly 0.

[Fencer reregistered]

This trade Should have already been done if McDermott and Turner where on the table. If he leaves for nothing when they could have gotten a reasonable return he should be fired which he won't of course.

He drives a hard bargain

Hayward probably wants Ainge to push for a more expensive guy than McDermott (i.e. Dipo or Warren) as well, really for two reasons. First, it might mean the Pacers have to pay him more to match salaries. Second, taking a guy like Warren or Dipo out of the picture would mean that Hayward gets to be more of a focal point on offense. So I actually wouldn't be surprised if Hayward wants Ainge to stand firm.

You think Hayward would rather go to a weaker team than a stronger one?

[jirrit]

Instead of asking for Warren if I were Danny I'd 'settle' for a 1st round pick along with Turner and McDermott and then reroute the pick and McDermott to HOU or SAC for Tucker or Bjelica.

Yeah I’m pretty sure Danny’s gotta be looking for something in that category.

[MagicBagley18]

Bogdanovic s&t to the lakers is happening I’d bet. They have retooled nicely

[Drax]

A cool $13M is the price you pay to see if Turner can do better.

But we would have both, so its an upgrade to our big men rotation.