Jackie Mac on Marcus Smart's RFA--"He's going for the money"

[celticgreenie]

Westbrook, and I also believe Blake Griffin, both signed supermax contracts when the argument could be made that their situations did not reflect anything that close to a championship. So with Anthony Davis, I could believe it too.

[Edug27]

Yeah, it is.

Once again, there is someone CURRENTLY walking away from the supermax. You are not all knowing, you can't say definitively 100% it's not happening. You're coming off incredibly arrogant

Not happening.

Topic shall be revisited in a few years.

[SmartWentCrazy]

Once again, there is someone CURRENTLY walking away from the supermax. You are not all knowing, you can't say definitively 100% it's not happening. You're coming off incredibly arrogant

Not happening.

Topic shall be revisited in a few years.

I dont see him walking from a deal that would be the highest in NBA history, personally. He’d also be a FA again after his age 31 season and in line to sign another earth-shattering deal.

[Bill Bradley]

Smart seems to be pegging his value in relation to Dante Exum’s 3/33 deal. I cant see him accepting less than 12 because he’s significantly more accomplished than Exum.

Ainge isnt going to peg Smarts value off of an overpay by another team. I dont see a long term deal getting done.

I agree that this is what is happening.

I hope that they can work it out because a) Smart's an emotional guy and I don't want to see what he plays like on his QO and b) I think signing him to a 3-4 year deal would be great as insurance if *gulps Kyrie does leave.... because if he does leave we're going to need more than just Rozier at PG.

Like I said earlier, just lock him up, keep him happy, and at the very least he will be a beefier contract if we're ever going to trade for another star in the future. Not that I really think that we will trade for one but it will be nice to know that we wouldn't have to move 3-4+ guys to get someone like Leonard or Butler. Also, I think that Smart at $10-11 million will have a market next offseason when teams have a little more cash to throw around.

On that note, if we do resign Rozier to an extension after Smart takes the QO, I see Smart becoming very bitter and disenfranchised.

Except if Rozier is offered the same exact contract Smart turned down.

[Edug27]

What most Smart supporters believe is fair value: 11-12M
What Smart non-supporters think his true value is: below MLE or QO or minimum

As the self proclaimed leader of the Smart non-supporters, I don't think that's completely true. Guess it depends on how you look at it. Theres a players perceived value based on what other similar players are getting paid.... and then there is restricted free agency and testing the market.

Skill wise, I think he should be making in the 9-10 mil range on a short year deal... Like an Andre Roberson. That's fair.

Danny gave him that option already. Now RFA is a different monster. You have to go out there and see what other teams are willing to pay you. I knew no team would offer Smart big money. He's more valuable in Boston than anywhere else. Smart really only works on certain teams, and those teams aren't knocking. His ceiling isn't really high. He's a glue guy. He's really hoping a team with cap is looking for a glue guy.

So now Danny can offer less than his original estimated value.. or Smart can choose to go through this again next summer. Personally I'd like a nice cheap short tradable contract.

[jinx8402]

I think a 3/36 contract with the 3rd year being a player option would be fair for both sides.

For Boston, gives some security over next years free agency with Kyrie and Rozier. Danny already indicated they are expecting to be in the tax this upcoming year anyways. If they lose one or both, they will still have Smart for at least a year. If they are able to keep both, Smart becomes a trade-able mid-level salary that they are currently missing. Only keeping one of Kyrie or Rozier and Smart is your backup.

For Smart, he gets relatively the same per year C's offered last year. Since the cap is expected to jump the next two off seasons, he could be looking at getting the contract he is looking for if he opts out after year 2. It looks like a lot of players went for 1 year contracts this year, so skipping a year of free agency may help reduce the amount of players in his tier.

[Captain_Caveman]

Not happening.

Topic shall be revisited in a few years.

I dont see him walking from a deal that would be the highest in NBA history, personally. He’d also be a FA again after his age 31 season and in line to sign another earth-shattering deal.

$25m extra over the first 4 years, plus a 5th year in the neighborhood of $50m that no one else can offer. And he can sign it a year before he would hit unrestricted free agency.

[celticfan42487]

What the hell are you talking about? Just because he is their #1 priority doesn't mean they have to bring him back. They can't just blindlessly throw whatever amount at him because he's their top priority. I want Smart back as much as anybody, but if he goes elsewhere it's not because of the Celtics "lying", it's because they didn't want to give him more than 12 million a year.

There's no celtic offer on the table that we know of aside from the QO. So if they don't at least make an offer at a number they'd be happy with and give him the option to stay, that to me says they never really cared about keeping him. Which runs contrary to what Danny has been saying to the media.

There's been negotiations. They've likely not made an official offer because they're still well below what Marcus is interested in so they're letting things settle down. It's not like they haven't had talks with Smart's people.

Danny is probably happy around $10m. Smart probably wants $14m. Celtics know they can have him back at the QO. No need to bid against yourselves (and that doesn't mean they don't care about keeping him, just that they're not dumb).

Well Danny has what 8.5 million before he goes in the luxury tax? He can't really go above that and justify it as doing his job, and in that scenario there's no reason to talk to Smart.

He basically can't afford Smart at higher than the QO unless he knows he can trade him and lower his cap hit.

He also needs to leave wiggle room before the luxury tax so he can make an in season acquisition after the trade deadline as there always is for a team like the Celtics (especially with how injury prone our players seem to be). Ainge's hands are financially tied.

IF Ainge actually gave that offer last year (which I doubt he offered that much given the contracts on this team post Hayward), it's a sign that Ainge honestly really believed in Smart and felt he'd have a breakout year and raise his value to be extremely tradable (or Ainge is concerned that Irving will walk and in that case can afford Smart and Rozier). Smart had a horrible contract year in terms of improving his market value, showed no discipline on or off the court, and did not raise his stock. No reason for Ainge to mortgage this team's future then and overpay him. And even less reason when we truly do not have the space before the luxury tax to do so.

[Edug27]

Topic shall be revisited in a few years.

I dont see him walking from a deal that would be the highest in NBA history, personally. He’d also be a FA again after his age 31 season and in line to sign another earth-shattering deal.

$25m extra over the first 4 years...

Isn't that exactly what Kyrie missed out on?

[Captain_Caveman]

I dont see him walking from a deal that would be the highest in NBA history, personally. He’d also be a FA again after his age 31 season and in line to sign another earth-shattering deal.

$25m extra over the first 4 years...

Isn't that exactly what Kyrie missed out on?

$20m, and only if he had made All-NBA or won MVP as a Cav this past year.

[Edug27]

$25m extra over the first 4 years...

Isn't that exactly what Kyrie missed out on?

$20m, and only if he had made All-NBA or won MVP as a Cav this past year.

Ok. So a mil per year diff. And he wanted out. If AD wants to wins as badly as he mentioned numerous times last year, he’ll inform N.O. he won’t resign like PG did and they’ll move him. But again.. long ways away. Time will tell.

[Captain_Caveman]

Isn't that exactly what Kyrie missed out on?

$20m, and only if he had made All-NBA or won MVP as a Cav this past year.

Ok. So a mil per year diff. And he wanted out. If AD wants to wins as badly as he mentioned numerous times last year, he’ll inform N.O. he won’t resign like PG did and they’ll move him. But again.. long ways away. Time will tell.

The “diff” is that AD is already supermax eligible, while Kyrie had a below 50% chance to become that.

And when did AD say he wanted out?

[Edug27]

$20m, and only if he had made All-NBA or won MVP as a Cav this past year.

Ok. So a mil per year diff. And he wanted out. If AD wants to wins as badly as he mentioned numerous times last year, he’ll inform N.O. he won’t resign like PG did and they’ll move him. But again.. long ways away. Time will tell.

The “diff” is that AD is already supermax eligible, while Kyrie had a below 50% chance to become that.

And when did AD say he wanted out?

I was referring to Kyrie there.

[Bad-Thoma]

Respectually disagree. As much for him chucking 14 bad shots a game and forcing bad passes as for the salary. I'm going to leave it at this (nothing against or your stance but I'm sure the board doesn't want me to keep repeating myself).

WTF is it with Smart's detractors and hyperbole? He took 9.5 total shots a game, and not all of them were bad. Are you just making **** up because you don't feel like looking it up or are you just trying to weight your argument? I don't get it.

I haven’t looked it up and maybe am overstating because he bricks at the most inopportune times but was that 9.5 attempts in the playoffs/and or after Kyrie went down? Even if not why I is the worst shooter on the team (very possibly the league) taking 9.5?

Id just like to make clear I’m not a hater if he’s a specialist vs rotation guy. Which colors my view on his value. If they sign him for the QO you’ll find a new Smart fan in me.

9.5 was his season average, the largest possible sample size, and the average in this seasons playoffs was also 9.5. His fga per 36 ranked him at 274th in the league, hardly chucker territory. He takes some bad shots but people really need to back off the hyperbole about it, it's really just ridiculous.

[Feed Your Head]

WTF is it with Smart's detractors and hyperbole? He took 9.5 total shots a game, and not all of them were bad. Are you just making **** up because you don't feel like looking it up or are you just trying to weight your argument? I don't get it.

I haven’t looked it up and maybe am overstating because he bricks at the most inopportune times but was that 9.5 attempts in the playoffs/and or after Kyrie went down? Even if not why I is the worst shooter on the team (very possibly the league) taking 9.5?

Id just like to make clear I’m not a hater if he’s a specialist vs rotation guy. Which colors my view on his value. If they sign him for the QO you’ll find a new Smart fan in me.

9.5 was his season average, the largest possible sample size, and the average in this seasons playoffs was also 9.5. His fga per 36 ranked him at 274th in the league, hardly chucker territory. He takes some bad shots but people really need to back off the hyperbole about it, it's really just ridiculous.

Smart detractors using hyperbole to try to prove points? No ******* way.

[CelticFaninLBC]

I believe this trade works financially...

BOS In: Korver, BKN's 29th pick Musa and 45th pick Diallo, and Bkn 2019 2nd rd pick. Ainge can stash Musa overseas.
BOS Out: Nader, Smart - deal starts at over $11m.

BKN in: Smart
BKN Out: Whitehead, Musa, Diallo. 2019 2nd red pick

CLE In: Whitehead, Nader
CLE Out: Korver

Roster:
Horford, Tatum, Hayward, Brown, Irving
Baynes, Theis, Morris, Korver, Rozier
Williams, Ojeleye, Bird, Diallo. Wannamaker, Diallo

[cloverleaf]

What most Smart supporters believe is fair value: 11-12M
What Smart non-supporters think his true value is: below MLE or QO or minimum

As the self proclaimed leader of the Smart non-supporters, I don't think that's completely true. Guess it depends on how you look at it. Theres a players perceived value based on what other similar players are getting paid.... and then there is restricted free agency and testing the market.

Skill wise, I think he should be making in the 9-10 mil range on a short year deal... Like an Andre Roberson. That's fair.

Danny gave him that option already. Now RFA is a different monster. You have to go out there and see what other teams are willing to pay you. I knew no team would offer Smart big money. He's more valuable in Boston than anywhere else. Smart really only works on certain teams, and those teams aren't knocking. His ceiling isn't really high. He's a glue guy. He's really hoping a team with cap is looking for a glue guy. (Kadeem on a 2-way as an emergency 4th-stringer.)

So now Danny can offer less than his original estimated value.. or Smart can choose to go through this again next summer. Personally I'd like a nice cheap short tradable contract.

2 years for $20M total is what I'd be up for--but I don't think he takes it. Anything more then 2 years I want under $10M per year--and I don't think he takes it.

And yes, I'd rather a S&T than his bitter butt here for an untradeable $6M for 1 year. I'm okay with Wanamaker and Rozier backing up Kyrie. If Kyrie has to go at the deadline before leaving for nothing, I could even see Bird in the 3rd PG role, with other players (Al and Gordon at least) prepared to be the primary ballhandler when he's out there in that role.

[Jammer]

Of course he's not heard, he has to bring his best offer to them.

The only teams with cap space are:

Atlanta 21 Million
Sacramento 19.4 Million
Chicago 15.3 Million
Dallas 11.8 Million

None of those teams should be expected to make a run at Marcus Smart.
So the best offer Smart has on the table for next season is the Celtics Qualifying Offer of $6,050,000.

Teams that are talking Sign & Trade would want to dump salary back to the Celtics, which ain't happening.
Memphis will not give up a 1rst Round Pick in a Smart Sign & Trade, plus they would have to dump salary back.
The Nets will not give up a 1rst Round Pick in a Smart Sign & Trade, plus they would have to dump salary back.

So the Sign & Trades are pure smoke. The Nets don't even have an exception left. The only exception the Grizzlies have is a $3.4 Million trade exception. So without up 1rst Round Picks, their is nothing to discuss, plus the Celtics would have no interest in the salary that the Grizzlies or Nets would need to send back to make the Trade work under the CBA.

That would be perfect for the Celtics since they are likely to have a Top 10 pick next spring from Sacramento and something in the
9 thru 17 range from the much improved Grizzlies (who now have Mike Conley and Marc Gasol healthy, Jaren Jackson Jr. Looking good and Kyle Anderson signed as a Free Agent with San Antonio not matching).

And if they are going into the luxury tax, they would be better served to bring in Kahwi than Smart.

Perfect outcome for Celtics would be if Smart signs the QO for 1 year at 6 Million, or they can up it to 1 year for 7.8 Million, which would still let them add a minimum salary player later if they need to.

In addition, the lack of a call would support the thought that Hayward and Irving will be able to play from Game 1. I would not have thought that possible for Hayward. I would have given him until the All-Star break. But that's why Morris is still here. If you look at all the alternatives to giving Smart playing time, knowing Irving will be playing his heart out in a contract year, there just are no minutes for Smart unless someone gets hurt.

PG: Irving 32 / Rozier 16 / Wanamaker (ready and willing)

SG: Jalen Brown 32 / Rozier 16 / Wanamaker (ready and willing)

SF: Hayward 20 / Tatum 28 / Nader (final year with team)

PF: Jayson Tatum 6 / Al Horford 10 / Marcus Morris 24 / Daniel Theis 8 / Semi Ojeleye (blow outs) / Yabusele (final year with team)

Al Horford 20 / Aron Baynes 20 / Daniel Theis 8

It's blatantly obvious that Smart has no place on the team if Hayward can play 20 minutes and Irving 32. Smart is done, except as insurance. He'd get a one year deal, if he's lucky for the 6,050,000 Qualifying Offer or perhaps as much as 7.8 million. Forget about him.

Next June, the Celtics could have a 7 to 10 pick from Sacramento that should yield a very good guard, and if Memphis cracks the Top 8, a pick in the 9-10 range from Memphis. The Celtics could end up adding TWO very good guards in June thru the draft.

[sam_I_am]

The sign and trade rumors suggest to me that the original thread premise is correct. Jackie McMullin was spot on when she said Smart was going for the money.

[darrendaye]

I believe this trade works financially...

BOS In: Korver, BKN's 29th pick Musa and 45th pick Diallo, and Bkn 2019 2nd rd pick. Ainge can stash Musa overseas.
BOS Out: Nader, Smart - deal starts at over $11m.

BKN in: Smart
BKN Out: Whitehead, Musa, Diallo. 2019 2nd red pick

CLE In: Whitehead, Nader
CLE Out: Korver

Roster:
Horford, Tatum, Hayward, Brown, Irving
Baynes, Theis, Morris, Korver, Rozier
Williams, Ojeleye, Bird, Diallo. Wannamaker, Diallo

Any 2nd round pick Ainge negotiates for, at this point forward, should definitely be for the 2021 draft or later. No age limit usually = deeper draft talent pools.