Why the Pessimism?

[Patsfan1081]

In short, strategy for path to championship was the 90's Pistons model of 4-5 all-stars team might topple 2 megastar team. When Kyrie left, Horford left, and now Hayward, and only getting Kemba back, it diminishes that formula. Additionally, not getting at least a draft pick compensation for them leaving, it reduces the opportunity to potentially hit on a pick to find that additional star.

While you might be able to argue to puncher's chance idea still with the current team, it's weakened at the top no matter how you slice it.

The direction now is likely to take another swing this year, then try to shed Walker's salary and create salary space next offseason or the following to try to lure another star free agent to sign. Might also mean trading Smart or Brown.

But that's where we are.

With Tatum’s max coming next year it’s going to be almost impossible to create another max spot. If Danny is trying to move off Kemba’s contract then that’s four max players that haven’t worked out in a span of four years. It’s a shame they couldnt trade up in this draft to land a young big man, trading Smart would have been the move to make now, he’ll only have a year left next season.

[AgentGreen]

We played mostly without Hayward, so losing him isn't really a big loss. Our guys are used to having Hayward on the injured reserve and really wont miss his production.We did it without him against the Sixers and the Raptors. We had him at 80% against the Heat which eventually just made a slight difference.

So our main core who has together the most playing time will add TT and Teague to their roster. This should only make our roster stronger and definitely not weaker. With TT and Teague in the bubble we would've been in the Finals and probably would've made the Finals more interesting than the Heat.

[celticfan42487]

In short, strategy for path to championship was the 90's Pistons model of 4-5 all-stars team might topple 2 megastar team. When Kyrie left, Horford left, and now Hayward, and only getting Kemba back, it diminishes that formula. Additionally, not getting at least a draft pick compensation for them leaving, it reduces the opportunity to potentially hit on a pick to find that additional star.

While you might be able to argue to puncher's chance idea still with the current team, it's weakened at the top no matter how you slice it.

The direction now is likely to take another swing this year, then try to shed Walker's salary and create salary space next offseason or the following to try to lure another star free agent to sign. Might also mean trading Smart or Brown.

But that's where we are.

With Tatum’s max coming next year it’s going to be almost impossible to create another max spot. If Danny is trying to move off Kemba’s contract then that’s four max players that haven’t worked out in a span of four years. It’s a shame they couldnt trade up in this draft to land a young big man, trading Smart would have been the move to make now, he’ll only have a year left next season.

Sadly the way to go is to trade Kemba and Smart for high draft picks but Ainge also would NEED to hit on them, which he has recently with Brown/ Tatum/ Smart.

This draft may not have been the time to hit on them but at the same time there was probably the opportunity before Klay got hurt to get the #2 overall for Smart this year.

The contracts that are being given out right now makes me think Smart will get a MAX contract in the off season. These teams can't help themselves. Maybe it'll be the Knicks, maybe the Hornets, maybe ATL but it doesn't look like we'll be able to realistically hold onto Smart. And Kemba looks like damaged goods.

In the end it's always been about drafting or trading and we need to do some more work with the future of Tatum and Brown's team in mind.

[captain green]

I'm generally happy with the Celtics.
Ainge is about done in my opinion in his mind I think. I can live with him but overall the last 4 years have had some mistakes that were kinda easy to avoid. Not enough for me to type fire ainge so that's it on ainge he's the leadership he takes most the blame.
Brad I'm team Brad all day every day I expect a similar career of popovich light I believe he eventually wins a ring. Is he perfect nope but he has had the most ridiculous rosters to work with each of the last 4 years we've been to 3 ex championship games. Plus I like his growth he is better every year wile maintaining a great respect and professional demeans that this day and age is a win.
I hated last year's draft not going lie I also am not thrilled about the blindsided player option deals and the 55 protected 2nd picks crap. We're small and young nobody is scared of our roster nobody. I'm a optimistic person in general so what ever 17 members we have I'm rooting for it to work. But I'm a factual based person too this team could have been a whole lot better indeed.
The game has changed and we need to adapt or die. No sense of would of could of the course isn't clear of dangers but good owners good gm and a great coach with 3 great player 3 good players and a few shots of someone leaping should be above the tread mill team and right below the great teams. Five years on the clock for Tatum let's capitalize on it.

[nic4747]

Well we resigned Tatum, which is honestly all we need to do. Tatum and Brown will improve next year, Kemba will hopefully recover from his injury. TT and Teague are great signings relative to who they are replacing. If Grant Williams or Timelord takes the next step forward, our team will be very good.

[celticfan42487]

Wow... and Baynes for 3 mil less a year than TT.

MUCH rather have Baynes that TT, like infinitely so. He's maybe twice the player TT is.

[MagicBagley18]

Just ask yourself when this team will be considered a favorite to win a ring? Not a punchers chance, not if teams x,y,z get hurt but a legitimate top 2-3 team to genuinely win. I’m not on fire ainge. Not even close yet. I can admit he makes mistakes tho and he’s not above criticism but happy to have him run this team.

That said while it’s not as bad as some make it out to be - the path to a banner isn’t as clear as others think it is and besides tatum whose a legitimate stud making a leap into the top 4 players in the league which is possible but many could argue not probable playing the odds and how hard it is to be that good I fail to see a path to true contention.

The kill shots are gone, the stars have come and gone and are few and far between.

[K For Three]

Finals chances depend heavily on Tatum becoming an MVP caliber player, thats it........thats all. It's his team basically or should be. He has to become "that guy" full time. Everyone else can have their moments, but Tatum has to become a superstar if he isn't already considered one.

The bubble playoff experience is also being over analyzed. We weren't healthy and it became quite clear that it was going to the Lakers after the Clippers/Bucks bowed out early. And do the Clippers/Bucks lose that early outside the bubble? Do we beat the Raptors? Does Miami make it? Nobody knows.

It's been a very strange and crazy year so I sometimes believe the bubble playoffs were overly analyzed and still are.

Gordon is also not the loss some imagine he is, he never ever fit in here. Like ever. I know he is a good glue guy who helped the team, but he didn't literally "fit" this group of guys on and off the court in any way shape or form in terms of obvious vibes.

[akidlittle]

Just imagine the next scenario...
Our free agency & injury bad luck (Al, Kyrie and Gordon) summed up with drafting Dunn and Josh Jackson instead of Jays (those guys definitely were in a discussion before the drafts). That's what a real disaster would've looked like. So we're in a pretty good situation and let's trust our guys! As for me I've a really good feeling about our young core, these guys will make it!

[AKFO]

The meltdown last night was hilarious. I hope people came to their senses after sleeping on that. Ainge ended up with Thompson instead of Turner. It's not gonna take long for people to feel dumb for thinking they thought Myles **** Turner would be a much better option.

In the modern NBA you really only get to truly invest in one big man. Why should Danny want to commit to that being Myles Turner?

I mean, how sure even are we that Danny didn't start the trade negotiations by saying 'Myles Turner has 0 value, what more can you give me?' Or even that Danny didn't hang up the phone at that Indy offer. Danny prolly tried to flip Myles to another team and guess what; nobody wanted him.

I'll take Thompson, who actually fills a void on the team as a rebounder

[Pacino62]

Haven’t read the thread, so it’s probably been said - but - you can think Danny missed on the Hayward play and still support he and the team.

[Red2]

We need more depth up front and at the wing before I think this team is as good or better than last years team . Maybe sign Cousins on a one year deal? We need more than a washed up Tristan Thompson and jeff Teague .

[The_Ghost_of_JB]

I think people are upset that Ainge didn't move the draft picks and move up or in the draft. Add in that those picks end up being wasted and the fact the team lost three big FA in the past year and people are skeptical of the direction of the team. People are upset that Ainge, according to some (me included) is that he shanked moving Hayward because he was asking too much from Indy. Plus the bench has not been great and the bigs are been underwhelming to say the least.

The team is not horrible by any means and the Teague and TT were decent signings but this is not a just not a championship team. I have them as a 4th of 5th seed in the east behind the Nets, Bucks, Heat, raps and Sixers.

[Smeff10]

The only thing that will lead to optimism is Ainge's picks coming through.

His signing of Teague is probably a sign that Edwards and the rest of the guard picks from the season prior are ****. And isn't the greatest sign that he thinks Pritchard is even backup PG level worthy.

So let's see what Romeo and Nesmith can do. If both look to be good bench pieces people will be optimistic again.

I also guess theoretically the TimeLord could play half the season this go around and that would boost his stock. Right now he averages about 30 games a year. But I think Ainge also doesn't have much faith in him and hence why he went to get TT to play his minutes.

Edwards and Pritchard are 22 years old. Teague is an established vet. That bench needed to get. Same goes for Williams. If he didn’t sign Teague and TT people would be complaining he didn’t get any Vet presence.

[MagicBagley18]

Also let’s just look at the outcome of certain decisions and ignore why they happened momentarily - just briefly, even tho they were correct decisions on most decisions.

We passed on ; butler, pg, kawhi, ad, and now probably harden. For whatever reason or circumstance we missed on those players (either willingly or couldn’t find common ground on a deal) and that’s really nuts when u step back and reflect.

Again, different circumstances for all those players and most of us agreed on certain ones. Whatever circumstance may be those players aren’t Boston Celtics and never suited up and played a game here. Now we have Tatum and are lucky to have him and brown is a good player and a much better leader in his community off the court and person in the community and a champion on social issues but he’s not on Tatums level and it’s not close.

So we missed on butler, george, KD, kawhi, ad, harden.........................That’s a finals mvp an actual mvp, another player with mvp potential. Really crazy in 10 years when we look back

[tfribs45]

last year the C's made the ECF (granted they got lucky someone knocked off the Bucks) in large part without Hayward

They have upgraded bigs with TT (Kanter) and point guard with JT (Brad W)

Stands to reason Smart, Tatum and Brown will all be better than last year as they approach their peak years.

Grant and Timelord will be useful. Theis is good.

So if one of Langford or Nesmith is actually good - just one of them - the Celtics should be in the mix.

And Ainge may not be done yet.

So I ask: why so much pessimism?? And what did you want Ainge to do (be realistic). And not looking for a referendum of his tenure but from end of season until now.

exactly….. This roster is much more polished then last years...TT is a huge upgrade at the 5 and Teague can ball. Langford, Waters, and our rookies will get a chance to contribute! Add another vet and I still like our chances in the East...