Knicks Series Retrospective

[wangyou18]

This iteration of Celtics has always had a tendency to mess around, and I think it finally caught up with them.

Our crunch time execution really isn't that good compared to other good teams - we rely much more on talent than basketball smarts. Watching Tatum/Brown isos in crunch time (or when we are up 20) makes me cringe so much that I think I'd be ok with Celtics trading one of them

[The Corey's]

Yeah they played like ***. So he wanted them to play well last year but like *** this year? I’m confused.

The rest of us aren't confused. You can't bomb your way through every game. It catches up to you.

Ok so the seven three elite post threat they used last year couldn’t score on the leagues smallest guys

I’m not saying you are def wrong but these aren’t convincing arguments other than muh echo chamber

It's weird to me you're taking the position that the players are worse at their job than the coach is.

The players aren't the problem. If it's bad simple as the players played better last year than they did this year and it's not because of the coach which your implication seems to indicate then why have a coach at all.

[SuperDeluxe]

This iteration of Celtics has always had a tendency to mess around, and I think it finally caught up with them.

Our crunch time execution really isn't that good compared to other good teams - we rely much more on talent than basketball smarts. Watching Tatum/Brown isos in crunch time (or when we are up 20) makes me cringe so much that I think I'd be ok with Celtics trading one of them

This is spot on.

[165bows]

The rest of us aren't confused. You can't bomb your way through every game. It catches up to you.

Ok so the seven three elite post threat they used last year couldn’t score on the leagues smallest guys

I’m not saying you are def wrong but these aren’t convincing arguments other than muh echo chamber

It's weird to me you're taking the position that the players are worse at their job than the coach is.

The players aren't the problem. If it's bad simple as the players played better last year than they did this year and it's not because of the coach which your implication seems to indicate then why have a coach at all.

Well that’s not what the position I took or what I said. I said the difference between this year and last was the players were playing worse

[return2glory]

I will say it again and again. This team is as good as White and Jrue take us. Tatum and Brown are really good, but if White and Jrue don't both play well and add to what Tatum and Brown give us, we are in trouble.

White and Jrue were great last season. This season, Jrue's game dropped off the map and that was basically the reason we didn't get out of the 2nd round. Also, Brown playing at about 60-70% of his potential with the bad knee was huge.

KP being ill had no importance on this team's success. Just like last year's playoff run. KP played in only 2 or 2.5 playoff games last season and we won without him.

Joe was better last season. This season, from the jump, he had his players take more 3s and his team became one dimensional and heavily relied on 3s.
He still sucks at making adjustments during the game. When you have 20 plus point leads, twice in the 2nd half of games, you adjust your game. You have the players slow the pace down just a little, cut down on 3s, attack the basket into of settling for 3s. And no one tell me we can't attack the basket, because the Magic took away our 3s and we won by going to the basket in that 1st round. If Joe, the coaching staff and the players took the same approach in the series against the Magic for the 2nd of of games 1 and 2, Boston would be in the ECF now.

It takes common sense and basic basketball IQ to understand that and adjust but coach Joe, the coaching staff and the players didn't grasp that basic concept. It starts with Joe, Tatum and Brown and all 3 failed in games 1 and 2, costing us the series.

[The Corey's]

Ok so the seven three elite post threat they used last year couldn’t score on the leagues smallest guys

I’m not saying you are def wrong but these aren’t convincing arguments other than muh echo chamber

It's weird to me you're taking the position that the players are worse at their job than the coach is.

The players aren't the problem. If it's bad simple as the players played better last year than they did this year and it's not because of the coach which your implication seems to indicate then why have a coach at all.

Well that’s not what the position I took or what I said. I said the difference between this year and last was the players were playing worse

And my position was because of the coach.

[robbie84]

Brown and Tatum were dog $&*# in the Knicks series. That's all there is to it.
Look at their shooting numbers.
We lost because of injuries. Tatum playing with a bone bruise in his shooting wrist. Brown playing with a torn meniscus.
Porzingis getting some virus or pneumonia and completely ruining him.
Holiday getting injured and sitting out vs Magic.
Championships are about health. We simply weren't healthy enough.
And blowing a 20 point lead isn't Joe's fault.
He could have called a few more time outs here and there but he can't defend for our guys out there. He can't make Tatum and Brown shoot better.

We were unlucky with injuries. Plain and simple.

[Fierce1]

This iteration of Celtics has always had a tendency to mess around, and I think it finally caught up with them.

Our crunch time execution really isn't that good compared to other good teams - we rely much more on talent than basketball smarts. Watching Tatum/Brown isos in crunch time (or when we are up 20) makes me cringe so much that I think I'd be ok with Celtics trading one of them

This is spot on.

100%

JT broke my heart in Game 1 because he was going for home run shots near the end of the game.

Their messing around finally cost them.

[Parasite]

If it's a 'fire Joe' thread just call it that

Yeah it’s kind of stupid imo. Same coach and scheme as last year.

You just inadvertently made the argument to fire Joe. Zero adjustments. What, did he think nobody would make adjustments to the Celtics offense this year? He was helpless when the shots weren’t falling. Just slamming his head into a brick wall over and over. Unacceptable. Pair that with his horrendous clock management, putrid end-of-game management, unwillingness to rein in Brown’s minutes handling the ball or Tatum’s terrible shot selection, questionable substitutions and failure to get the bench more involved, and I’d say Joe **** the bed mightily this year. Next!

[Jammer]

This iteration of Celtics has always had a tendency to mess around, and I think it finally caught up with them.

Our crunch time execution really isn't that good compared to other good teams - we rely much more on talent than basketball smarts. Watching Tatum/Brown isos in crunch time (or when we are up 20) makes me cringe so much that I think I'd be ok with Celtics trading one of them

This is spot on.

100%

JT broke my heart in Game 1 because he was going for home run shots near the end of the game.

Their messing around finally cost them.

I started a thread about Tatum not being a Top 10 closer at the start of this season but still believe that the coach could have improved both J’s, and the team’s, game 1 and game 2 efficiency by teaching and executing different strategies over the past 3 years. Board Member VeryMuchWoke has summed Joe’s strategy up as “No Plan B.”

[165bows]

If it's a 'fire Joe' thread just call it that

Yeah it’s kind of stupid imo. Same coach and scheme as last year.

You just inadvertently made the argument to fire Joe. Zero adjustments. What, did he think nobody would make adjustments to the Celtics offense this year? He was helpless when the shots weren’t falling. Just slamming his head into a brick wall over and over. Unacceptable. Pair that with his horrendous clock management, putrid end-of-game management, unwillingness to rein in Brown’s minutes handling the ball or Tatum’s terrible shot selection, questionable substitutions and failure to get the bench more involved, and I’d say Joe **** the bed mightily this year. Next!

I’m not saying people have to love Joe but guys Brad Stevens isn’t walking through that door

[phincsfan]

Any other coach would be held accountable for what the Celtics have accomplished against the Knicks this year and the Heat two year ago.

Where were the adjustments? Where was your backup plan? Why doesn't this team run a offense outside of iso 3 bombing?

Seriously. Tatum and Brown don't move without the ball. They just stand around.

That's not good enough in the god damn NBA.

Bingo.

Multiple BIG leads with a healthy Tatum against a coach who also makes zero adjustments. A few adjustments and wrinkles could have made a difference.

[Fierce1]

This is spot on.

100%

JT broke my heart in Game 1 because he was going for home run shots near the end of the game.

Their messing around finally cost them.

I started a thread about Tatum not being a Top 10 closer at the start of this season but still believe that the coach could have improved both J’s, and the team’s, game 1 and game 2 efficiency by teaching and executing different strategies over the past 3 years. Board Member VeryMuchWoke has summed Joe’s strategy up as “No Plan B.”

I don't think it's having no Plan B.

It's just a case of Joe letting the Jays do what they want to do.

The Cs keep talking about trust.
In this case, it's just too much trust on the star players.

This is on Joe.

It's like the Jays own Joe.

Maybe this tragedy will wake them up.

Celts deserve to lose this series because Game 1 was where the Knicks broke the Celtics.

Tatum had multiple chances to win the game.
But he kept going for home run shots.

Maybe Joe was hoping JT would save the day.

Didn't happen.

[itrsteve]

We don’t have to overthink this one.

It was lost in games 1 & 2 when we were playing with our food.

Two games decided by a total of four points on 225 points of missed 3s.

225

[Jammer]

One thing that bugs me is in Game 2, which was a 1 point loss, when Holiday is 4-6, Zinger 3-5, Pritch 3-5 why dan't those guys get some 4th quarter shots when everyone else is off and we have the guys off keep brickin. The coach should have plays designed LONG AGO where he runs an action with Holiday, Pritch and Zinger as the 1rst or 2nd option. THAT DIDN"T HAPPEN. That's part of the reason I think Joe is a LOSER (despite the overall team record). Joe lost a winnable game. Simple as that. You can say the kids were playing with their food, but momma could have said for Pritch, Zinger or Holiday to have some 4th quarter shots over the brickers. It's called leadership, and ideally, it's setup over a season where guys in sync are rewarded over guys out of sync. Not with Joe.

[tfmiii]

One thing that bugs me is in Game 2, which was a 1 point loss, when Holiday is 4-6, Zinger 3-5, Pritch 3-5 why dan't those guys get some 4th quarter shots when everyone else is off and we have the guys off keep brickin. The coach should have plays designed LONG AGO where he runs an action with Holiday, Pritch and Zinger as the 1rst or 2nd option. THAT DIDN"T HAPPEN. That's part of the reason I think Joe is a LOSER (despite the overall team record). Joe lost a winnable game. Simple as that. You can say the kids were playing with their food, but momma could have said for Pritch, Zinger or Holiday to have some 4th quarter shots over the brickers. It's called leadership, and ideally, it's setup over a season where guys in sync are rewarded over guys out of sync. Not with Joe.

So much THIS!

[Deivork]

Thanks for this thread. I'll read it thoroughly, but for now let's call this series for what it was: a failure of the Boston Celtics.

[Red2]

Porzingis…, 2 years in a row

[NotAKnicksFan]

I was at msg row 108 celtics green jacket and celtics hat and shorts, i had a suite next to celtics locker, i got harrassed outside msg it was a zoo

Best moment is seeing wyc grousbeck with his championship ring on before the game he acknowledged me and gave and a fist bump with cs ring on …

[NotAKnicksFan]

I was also at the april 8 game with cs gear on Porzingis had 32 that game

I do not know his name but guy with white hair and mustache had a celtics ring on and was hype to see me a cs fan there. I see him at games on tv front row all the time, maybe part owner ?