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Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . .

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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#201 » by snowman » Thu Jul 27, 2023 12:17 pm

31to6 wrote:
captain green wrote:Just to get a pulse where are we weakest?
Pg: white, pp, banton, JD( Brogdon, tatum, al)
Sg: Brown, Brogdon, champ, scrubb (banton, white)
Sf: Tatum, Brissett, Walsh (brown Brogdon Hauser banton champ)
Pf: unicorn, Hauser ( Tatum, brissett, horford, timelord)
C: timelord, horford, kornet ( unicorn)
So the one free agent you can drop in this and smooth it out is whom? Also who is your? Third two way? I'm saying pf/c and going with Christian Wood ( rumor's withstanding decent stats for vet minimum. And then signing olex for third two way.
What is the weakest position? Who is your free agent? And who is your two way?


1. Weakest position is backup SG in that if JB and/or Malcolm gets banged up we have PP playing major minutes. And I like PP, but not that much. Or maybe they trust Banton, which would be cool, just again I’m not ready to.

2. The FA I want who I think is very realistic is Javonte Green. Give me that defensive and hustle and good vibes as a backup 2 (who’ll also be fine as 3rd string). Don’t mention goddamned Terrance Ross. I also have liked TJ Warren since his draft but I’d sign elsewhere if I were him.

If the team views another big as a bigger priority then I’m interested in keeping Azubuike as the 14th guy (goodbye Champaigne).

3. Don’t care about the 3rd two way, but trust Brad to find someone at least somewhat interesting. I look forward to googling him whenever he is signed.


I'll take a run at answering this.

For starters, I have our lineup a bit different to begin with. I think Brogdon is our 2nd team PG, and Pritchard our 3rd team PG, but will bet more minutes than he has in the past. I also think Banton will be Brown's backup at SG. Hauser is certainly not a PF.
I see our depth chart something like this:

1st team: White, Brown, Tatum, RW3, Porzingis
This lineup has the best of everything we have, offensively, defensively, shooting, rim protection, spacing, scoring, drive and kick, and one of the tallest starting lineups in the NBA.

2nd team: Brogdon, Banton, Hauser, Horford, Kornet.
Good shooting (Brogdon, Hauser, and usually Horford), plenty of size, drive and kick (Brogdon and Banton), rim protection, (Horford), and low post dump off (Kornet)

3rd team: Pritchard, Walsh, Brissette (....), (....)
These three can be thrown in the mix at any time, and bring shooting (Pritchard and Walsh), defense (Walsh and Brissette), energy, (all three), rim running, (Walsh and Brissette), add in JD and Scrubb, who also bring in energy.

All the questions relate back to the 1st question in what is the weakest spot? I think our weakest spot is back up center. Kornet seems like a great teammate, but he gets abused on defense. Even guards are able to dunk on him or rebound over him. He would be fine as a 3rd team big, but because of lack of depth he has to be our 2nd team big. With Porzingis and RW3 health concerns and Horford 37 years old, I feel we need more insurance for our big man rotation off the bench. I would sign Azubuike as our 14th man. Not the typical big Brad likes, but someone that can bang on the beefer centers out there, and use his 6 fouls banging in the post, so our more fragile bigs don't have too as much. He would come cheap, and, considering he can't be signed to another 2-way because of time in the league, could be insurance when Horford sits out back to backs, and be able to schedule rest for Rob and Porzingis. He could also learn a lot by working everyday with our big men, as I hope Kornet will working with Porzingis.

My hope for the 15th roster spot, also has to do with signing Azubuike to a cheap contract. If we have enough under the 2nd apron cap space, I would like one more PG/SG. I was holding out hope for JD, but I just don't see it. In summer league, he had a lot of assists, but way too many turnovers for a PG. Javonte Green, Danny Green or Austin Rivers would be a good fill in here. If we could get any one of those three along with Azubuike, our roster would be ready to go to war. Not sure if the money would work, but you can best bet that if it can be done, Brad will figure it out.

As for the third 2-way, Olek Balcerowski from our summer league team, would be another good project big, but I doubt he would sign that kind of contract and leave all the money in Europe that I'm sure he could get. I'll leave this one for Brad. It will probably be a name i can't pronounce or have never heard about.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#202 » by 31to6 » Thu Jul 27, 2023 12:43 pm

Snowman I like all of your post, just feel like you’re planning on double-big more than Coach Mazzulla may be.
KP/Al/Rob can all be centers.
JT and OB can be PF.
I am all for keeping Azubuike, but I don’t think Kornet is 2nd strong center.

If 9 guys play in the RS, it’s
White/JB/Brogdon
Tatum/Hauser/Brissette?
KP/Rob/Al

If any of those guys aren’t available I think they’re more likely to play small than double bigs. I do think Kornet will play, just not routinely.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#203 » by watsonthedragon » Thu Jul 27, 2023 12:54 pm

31to6 wrote:Snowman I like all of your post, just feel like you’re planning on double-big more than Coach Mazzulla may be.
KP/Al/Rob can all be centers.
JT and OB can be PF.
I am all for keeping Azubuike, but I don’t think Kornet is 2nd strong center.

If 9 guys play in the RS, it’s
White/JB/Brogdon
Tatum/Hauser/Brissette?
KP/Rob/Al

If any of those guys aren’t available I think they’re more likely to play small than double bigs. I do think Kornet will play, just not routinely.


I see your point and agree that injuries and rest days will probably force Joe's hand often, but I'd be very surprised if the plan wasn't to start KP and Rob together. They compliment each other really well on both ends.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#204 » by Hal14 » Thu Jul 27, 2023 1:01 pm

My take on Blake?

Both sides are playing a wait and see game. Blake knows that he did not play very much last season and with Rob healthy now (missed over half last season with knee surgery) and Porzingis onboard, he knows there's a good chance he'll play even less this season. So I think he is waiting to see if perhaps another team gives him a call - a team that can offer more playing time.

This might be the last season of his career. If the money is going to be the same either way, why not go where you will play more? I'm sure he wants to finally win a ring too. So I'm guessing that the team he chooses will offer the best combination of playing time with title chances.

Off the top of my head, Denver doesn't really have a backup center. He could probably get more playing time there - and obviously they have a good shot at winning the title. I could see him maybe going there for the minimum.

Meanwhile, the Celtics are waiting to see how things play out with other moves they are exploring, they probably have other free agents higher on their wish list than Blake, so they're waiting to see if those guys sign with other teams or if we end up signing them instead of Blake.

For both sides (Boston and Blake), him returning to the Celtics is probably the backup plan..
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#205 » by Edug27 » Thu Jul 27, 2023 1:08 pm

Larry_Russell wrote:
darrendaye wrote:
bigfoot_cryptozoology wrote:
Read on Twitter




Not exactly a quote that gives one comfort he is willing to accept a lesser offensive role. But I'm clearly focused on the one quote here and did not listen to any of the commentary myself...



Its pretty obvious that Brown will not accept a step back in role. HE thinks he is easily on par with Tatum and should be afforded al the same things.

He thinks KP is below him in the pecking order. Which is mond boggling to me.


Umm.. He absolutely is.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#206 » by Curmudgeon » Thu Jul 27, 2023 1:26 pm

Edug27 wrote:
Larry_Russell wrote:
darrendaye wrote:
Not exactly a quote that gives one comfort he is willing to accept a lesser offensive role. But I'm clearly focused on the one quote here and did not listen to any of the commentary myself...



Its pretty obvious that Brown will not accept a step back in role. HE thinks he is easily on par with Tatum and should be afforded al the same things.

He thinks KP is below him in the pecking order. Which is mond boggling to me.


Umm.. He absolutely is.


Talk is cheap. If Brown plays the way he did last year there will be no championship.
"Numbers lie alot. Wins and losses don't lie." - Jerry West
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"Offense sells tickets. Defense wins games. Rebounding wins championships." Pat Summit
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#207 » by Hal14 » Thu Jul 27, 2023 1:38 pm

Curmudgeon wrote:
Edug27 wrote:
Larry_Russell wrote:

Its pretty obvious that Brown will not accept a step back in role. HE thinks he is easily on par with Tatum and should be afforded al the same things.

He thinks KP is below him in the pecking order. Which is mond boggling to me.


Umm.. He absolutely is.


Talk is cheap. If Brown plays the way he did last year there will be no championship.

:lol:
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#208 » by ddb » Thu Jul 27, 2023 1:44 pm

165bows wrote:
ddb wrote:bring back Blake. Sign Austin. Be done. Reevaluate the roster and possible trades in-season.

White/JB/JT/Kristaps/Timelord
Brogdon/Al
Pritchard/Hauser/Brissett/Walsh
Banton/Rivers/Blake/Kornet

Davidson/Scrubb on 2-ways

I kind of don’t like the Austin Rivers idea at all but there is something to be said for a versatile guy - he could probably masquerade at anything 1-3 (not well but in a pinch) which has some value.

Same with Justise Winslow - not that good but he could be deep depth for a lot of positions.

If they really want a wing I like the Aaron Wiggins idea a lot, drawback being he won’t be emergency PG depth like Rivers.

Down to bring back Blake though.


Just seems like at this point Brad will focus on bringing in veteran leaders who will be good in the locker room, and available to play a few minutes in a pinch. Seems like they are preparing to give Pritchard a shot to show what he can do with regular minutes. Maybe the same with Hauser. And if it doesn't work out, they have Brissett, Walsh, Banton who they can try in the rotation. Beginning of the season is feeling it all out and seeing what works. Adjustments can be made in-season if need be. The core is set. The star power, etc. Top 8 set. White/JB/JT/Kristaps/Timelord/Brogdon/Al/Pritchard
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#209 » by shackles10 » Thu Jul 27, 2023 1:47 pm

Hal14 wrote:My take on Blake?

Both sides are playing a wait and see game. Blake knows that he did not play very much last season and with Rob healthy now (missed over half last season with knee surgery) and Porzingis onboard, he knows there's a good chance he'll play even less this season. So I think he is waiting to see if perhaps another team gives him a call - a team that can offer more playing time.

This might be the last season of his career. If the money is going to be the same either way, why not go where you will play more? I'm sure he wants to finally win a ring too. So I'm guessing that the team he chooses will offer the best combination of playing time with title chances.

Off the top of my head, Denver doesn't really have a backup center. He could probably get more playing time there - and obviously they have a good shot at winning the title. I could see him maybe going there for the minimum.

Meanwhile, the Celtics are waiting to see how things play out with other moves they are exploring, they probably have other free agents higher on their wish list than Blake, so they're waiting to see if those guys sign with other teams or if we end up signing them instead of Blake.

For both sides (Boston and Blake), him returning to the Celtics is probably the backup plan..


If there's interest from Denver I could definitely see them as a good fit for Blake.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#210 » by Hal14 » Thu Jul 27, 2023 1:52 pm

ddb wrote:
165bows wrote:
ddb wrote:bring back Blake. Sign Austin. Be done. Reevaluate the roster and possible trades in-season.

White/JB/JT/Kristaps/Timelord
Brogdon/Al
Pritchard/Hauser/Brissett/Walsh
Banton/Rivers/Blake/Kornet

Davidson/Scrubb on 2-ways

I kind of don’t like the Austin Rivers idea at all but there is something to be said for a versatile guy - he could probably masquerade at anything 1-3 (not well but in a pinch) which has some value.

Same with Justise Winslow - not that good but he could be deep depth for a lot of positions.

If they really want a wing I like the Aaron Wiggins idea a lot, drawback being he won’t be emergency PG depth like Rivers.

Down to bring back Blake though.


Just seems like at this point Brad will focus on bringing in veteran leaders who will be good in the locker room, and available to play a few minutes in a pinch. Seems like they are preparing to give Pritchard a shot to show what he can do with regular minutes. Maybe the same with Hauser. And if it doesn't work out, they have Brissett, Walsh, Banton who they can try in the rotation. Beginning of the season is feeling it all out and seeing what works. Adjustments can be made in-season if need be. The core is set. The star power, etc. Top 8 set. White/JB/JT/Kristaps/Timelord/Brogdon/Al/Pritchard

I guess anything is possible, but I would certainly expect (at least going into training camp) that Hauser is over Pritchard on the depth chart.

Hauser got way more playing time last season and was the much better player, on both ends of the floor.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#211 » by 31to6 » Thu Jul 27, 2023 2:17 pm

Edug27 wrote:
Larry_Russell wrote:
darrendaye wrote:
Not exactly a quote that gives one comfort he is willing to accept a lesser offensive role. But I'm clearly focused on the one quote here and did not listen to any of the commentary myself...



Its pretty obvious that Brown will not accept a step back in role. HE thinks he is easily on par with Tatum and should be afforded al the same things.

He thinks KP is below him in the pecking order. Which is mond boggling to me.


Umm.. He absolutely is.


It’s July. Let’s let them play some games together, see how it goes
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#212 » by 31to6 » Thu Jul 27, 2023 2:21 pm

watsonthedragon wrote:
31to6 wrote:Snowman I like all of your post, just feel like you’re planning on double-big more than Coach Mazzulla may be.
KP/Al/Rob can all be centers.
JT and OB can be PF.
I am all for keeping Azubuike, but I don’t think Kornet is 2nd strong center.

If 9 guys play in the RS, it’s
White/JB/Brogdon
Tatum/Hauser/Brissette?
KP/Rob/Al

If any of those guys aren’t available I think they’re more likely to play small than double bigs. I do think Kornet will play, just not routinely.


I see your point and agree that injuries and rest days will probably force Joe's hand often, but I'd be very surprised if the plan wasn't to start KP and Rob together. They compliment each other really well on both ends.


Oh I agree that hopefully they start double bigs. I just think they don’t need more than KP, Al, and Rob — and if one is out, filling in with Tatum and/or Oshae playing some four.

My point was I don’t think there’s a rotation in which Kornet is written in as the second string center. Joe didnt play a whole second string hardly ever if I recall.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#213 » by Larry_Russell » Thu Jul 27, 2023 2:30 pm

Edug27 wrote:
Larry_Russell wrote:
darrendaye wrote:
Not exactly a quote that gives one comfort he is willing to accept a lesser offensive role. But I'm clearly focused on the one quote here and did not listen to any of the commentary myself...



Its pretty obvious that Brown will not accept a step back in role. HE thinks he is easily on par with Tatum and should be afforded al the same things.

He thinks KP is below him in the pecking order. Which is mond boggling to me.


Umm.. He absolutely is.



KP is the superior scorer (and holder of defensand should be 2nd option.

(assuming health is maintained)

KP has a superior:


FG%
FT%
3PT%
eFG%
VORP
BPM
ORT
TS%
OWS
WS/48
WS
OBPM
BPM
PER



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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#214 » by Curmudgeon » Thu Jul 27, 2023 2:36 pm

Is this team going to be able to disrupt the other team's offense, and get stops when they need to get stops? That's the issue, and neither the numbers nor a discussion of the team's offensive pecking order is going to provide answers to that question.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#215 » by Larry_Russell » Thu Jul 27, 2023 2:38 pm

Curmudgeon wrote:Is this team going to be able to disrupt the other team's offense, and get stops when they need to get stops? That's the issue, and neither the numbers nor a discussion of the team's offensive pecking order is going to provide answers to that question.



Apparently Porzingis is an elite defender, add timelord who is elite, and Horford is elite, and White is elite...the tools are there.

Is the heart?
Is the brain?
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#216 » by Ben-N1ce » Thu Jul 27, 2023 2:42 pm

Larry_Russell wrote:
Curmudgeon wrote:Is this team going to be able to disrupt the other team's offense, and get stops when they need to get stops? That's the issue, and neither the numbers nor a discussion of the team's offensive pecking order is going to provide answers to that question.



Apparently Porzingis is an elite defender, add timelord who is elite, and Horford is elite, and White is elite...the tools are there.

Is the heart?
Is the brain?


Is the health is the bigger concern for me.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#217 » by Larry_Russell » Thu Jul 27, 2023 2:46 pm

Ben-N1ce wrote:
Larry_Russell wrote:
Curmudgeon wrote:Is this team going to be able to disrupt the other team's offense, and get stops when they need to get stops? That's the issue, and neither the numbers nor a discussion of the team's offensive pecking order is going to provide answers to that question.



Apparently Porzingis is an elite defender, add timelord who is elite, and Horford is elite, and White is elite...the tools are there.

Is the heart?
Is the brain?


Is the health is the bigger concern for me.



Whaaaa?

Concerned about:

"52 year old" horford
"never play more than 50% of the games" Timelord
"1 healthy season in career" Kristaps?
"Always hurt" Brogdon?

That is only 4 of the top 7 guys with injury concerns.

At least our recently signed 304 million dollar player is an ironman
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#218 » by Hal14 » Thu Jul 27, 2023 3:05 pm

Remaining free agents:

PJ Washington
Kelly Oubre
Christian Wood
Danny Green
Javonte Green
Austin Rivers
Derrick Jones Jr
Hamidou Diallo
Lamar Stevens
Blake Griffin
John Wall
Edmond Sumner
JaMychal Green
Bismack Biyombo
Justice Winslow
Kendrick Nunn
Trendon Watford
Will Barton
Terrence Ross
TJ Warren
Rudy Gay
Wenyen Gabriel
Kyle Guy
Terence Davis
Jaylen Nowell
Frank Ntilikina
Romeo Langford
Glenn Robinson III
Harry Giles
Alize Johnson
Ish Smith
Juan Toscano-Anderson
Darren Collison
Marko Simonovic
Stanley Johnson
KZ Okpala
RaiQuan Gray
Joe Wieskamp
Isaiah Thomas
PJ Dozier
Noah Vonleh
Rodney McGruder
RJ Hampton
Mo Harkless
Markieff Morris
Mamadi Diakite
James Johnson
Gorgui Dieng
Frank Kaminsky
Tony Bradley
DeMarcus Cousins
Dewayne Dedmon
Boban Marjanovic
Serge Ibaka
Derrick Favors
Moses Brown
Kevin Knox
Anthony Lamb
Nathan Knight
Raul Neto
Theo Pinson
Bryn Forbes
Malik Fitts
Tacko Fall
Lance Stephenson
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#219 » by Shak_Celts » Thu Jul 27, 2023 3:25 pm

Hal14 wrote:Remaining free agents:

PJ Washington
Kelly Oubre
Christian Wood
Danny Green
Javonte Green
Austin Rivers
Derrick Jones Jr
Hamidou Diallo
Lamar Stevens
Blake Griffin
John Wall
Edmond Sumner
JaMychal Green
Bismack Biyombo
Justice Winslow
Kendrick Nunn
Trendon Watford
Will Barton
Terrence Ross
TJ Warren
Rudy Gay
Wenyen Gabriel
Kyle Guy
Terence Davis
Jaylen Nowell
Frank Ntilikina
Romeo Langford
Glenn Robinson III
Harry Giles
Alize Johnson
Ish Smith
Juan Toscano-Anderson
Darren Collison
Marko Simonovic
Stanley Johnson
KZ Okpala
RaiQuan Gray
Joe Wieskamp
Isaiah Thomas
PJ Dozier
Noah Vonleh


Many of those players were talked about as being so much better than our guys and all of them are still looking for a team this late. Couple aren't in our price range but still, maybe we never have it as bad as people say.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, part 10 and Counting . . . 

Post#220 » by Celts17Pride » Thu Jul 27, 2023 3:29 pm

Shak_Celts wrote:
Hal14 wrote:Remaining free agents:

PJ Washington
Kelly Oubre
Christian Wood
Danny Green
Javonte Green
Austin Rivers
Derrick Jones Jr
Hamidou Diallo
Lamar Stevens
Blake Griffin
John Wall
Edmond Sumner
JaMychal Green
Bismack Biyombo
Justice Winslow
Kendrick Nunn
Trendon Watford
Will Barton
Terrence Ross
TJ Warren
Rudy Gay
Wenyen Gabriel
Kyle Guy
Terence Davis
Jaylen Nowell
Frank Ntilikina
Romeo Langford
Glenn Robinson III
Harry Giles
Alize Johnson
Ish Smith
Juan Toscano-Anderson
Darren Collison
Marko Simonovic
Stanley Johnson
KZ Okpala
RaiQuan Gray
Joe Wieskamp
Isaiah Thomas
PJ Dozier
Noah Vonleh


Many of those players were talked about as being so much better than our guys and all of them are still looking for a team this late. Couple aren't in our price range but still, maybe we never have it as bad as people say.

Other than Washington, Oubre and Wood they are all vet min. players. Welcome to the new NBA CBA. It's just taking the players longer to realize the situation.

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