"We Tried So Hard, and (Haven't) Got so Far, But in the End, It Doesn't Even Matter" Trade Thread

[Fencer reregistered]

Trivia questions that I don't have the answer to:

• Which top three franchises have the Cs made trades with the last 10 seasons?
• Which three franchises do we rarely/never deal/trade with?

We traded with Cleveland at least twice. I have the feeling it's more.
We did S&Ts w/ Charlotte a couple of times recently.

I don't think we deal much with Miami, if at all, despite considerable flow of players between the two teams. Besides, much of that flow was more of a decade ago. (Has Riley ever badmouthed another rival exec the way he did Ainge?)

Teams I recall no deals with ever include (partial list) Bulls, Knicks, Jazz, Spurs, Pelicans, Rockets, Raptors. Of course, I could very easily be forgetting some deals.

CHA seems right. CLE for Zeller which later led to IT. Then Kyrie of course. And Memphis is another one, but I'm just guessing. Suns at least twice too (IT and Baynes).

We did deal with the Heat when we acquired Zoran Dragic and a 2nd? I think it was for cap/tax relief for Miami. Then we acquired Courtney Lee from HOU via S&T. Can't think of others from the teams you named.

I think there was some action around Courtney Lee and/or Jeff Green with Memphis. Also, long ago, I think the Vancouver Grizz were involved in a Popeye Jones trade.

I just checked -- the first Semih was traded to Cleveland in a deal separate from the others (trivia: Who else did we send in that deal?).

[Fencer reregistered]

MarShan Brooks/JaJuan Johnson was a separate deal w/ the Nets.

And I think 2 early seconds for a first was a deal with the Grizz.

Big Baby/Bass was surely a deal with Orlando.

[gocelts]

Order of preference.
1. Trade picks and whomever for a sure fire Allstar. (I’m over Barnes...this is getting ridiculous, he’s not Pippen)
2. Mini move involving trading minor assets (2nds, Edwards, Fall) for someone who fits/balances our roster
3. Dump Kemba and start Pritchard.

Tired of watching this bad product every other night. My little business could never be run this way. I get the owners and GM don’t care that much, but it’s super frustrating as a competitor to just watch your team lose knowing you can try and do something to improve.

[Fencer reregistered]

Order of preference.
1. Trade picks and whomever for a sure fire Allstar. (I’m over Barnes...this is getting ridiculous, he’s not Pippen)
2. Mini move involving trading minor assets (2nds, Edwards, Fall) for someone who fits/balances our roster
3. Dump Kemba and start Pritchard.

Tired of watching this bad product every other night. My little business could never be run this way. I get the owners and GM don’t care that much, but it’s super frustrating as a competitor to just watch your team lose knowing you can try and do something to improve.

How many "sure-fire all-stars" do you think there are in the league? Depending on exactly what you mean by the term, I presume the answer is somewhere in the 15-35 range, given that the actual number of all-stars in a given year is 24 plus a few injury replacements.

[zoyathedestroya]

Read on Twitter

[darrendaye]

Order of preference.
1. Trade picks and whomever for a sure fire Allstar. (I’m over Barnes...this is getting ridiculous, he’s not Pippen)
2. Mini move involving trading minor assets (2nds, Edwards, Fall) for someone who fits/balances our roster
3. Dump Kemba and start Pritchard.

Tired of watching this bad product every other night. My little business could never be run this way. I get the owners and GM don’t care that much, but it’s super frustrating as a competitor to just watch your team lose knowing you can try and do something to improve.

How many "sure-fire all-stars" do you think there are in the league? Depending on exactly what you mean by the term, I presume the answer is somewhere in the 15-35 range, given that the actual number of all-stars in a given year is 24 plus a few injury replacements.

I do agree they need another all-star conversation level player, but they don't have the capital to acquire one already at that level. Or at least without stripping the cupboard bare using depreciated player assets and multiple future first round picks. But then you end up with great difficulty acquiring low salaried significant rotation contributors that most, if not all, championship teams have had.

[Curmudgeon]

I doubt if the Suns would make a move, but they'd be better positioned for the playoffs if they were willing to trade Crowder or Saric. I'd offer TT and Nesmith. They could use a more experienced backup to Ayton, someone better than Damion Jones or Jalen Smith.

[gocelts]

Order of preference.
1. Trade picks and whomever for a sure fire Allstar. (I’m over Barnes...this is getting ridiculous, he’s not Pippen)
2. Mini move involving trading minor assets (2nds, Edwards, Fall) for someone who fits/balances our roster
3. Dump Kemba and start Pritchard.

Tired of watching this bad product every other night. My little business could never be run this way. I get the owners and GM don’t care that much, but it’s super frustrating as a competitor to just watch your team lose knowing you can try and do something to improve.

How many "sure-fire all-stars" do you think there are in the league? Depending on exactly what you mean by the term, I presume the answer is somewhere in the 15-35 range, given that the actual number of all-stars in a given year is 24 plus a few injury replacements.

Then move on to plan B and C. This “waiting for the perfect deal” has ultimately cost us WAY more than a slight overpay in a trade. We’ve lost too many players for nothing and literally wasted picks we didn’t need.

[RajonsGotARondo]

That ddb bomb this morning

Please share I need some type of false hope and can’t find it

[CeltsfanSinceBirth]

That ddb bomb this morning

Please share I need some type of false hope and can’t find it

Ainge is looking at multiple trades.

[RajonsGotARondo]

That ddb bomb this morning

Please share I need some type of false hope and can’t find it

Ainge is looking at multiple trades.

My fellow Celtic.. thank you my brudda

[RajonsGotARondo]

George Hill, in my opinion is exactly what we need. A high-IQ veteran point gawd. Besides a wing player, I’d be extremely happy getting him. Just a matter of trade or buyout ( although i can see him being heavily coveted if he’s bought out).

[bisme37]

Hey guys if you stop obsessing about all these trades we're going to make it will really soften the blow when no trades are actually made.

[BK_2020]

I doubt if the Suns would make a move, but they'd be better positioned for the playoffs if they were willing to trade Crowder or Saric. I'd offer TT and Nesmith. They could use a more experienced backup to Ayton, someone better than Damion Jones or Jalen Smith.

Damian Jones and Smith played 150 minutes total for them this season. Jones isn’t even on the team anymore. Saric is who spells Ayton.

[mrmorrill]

Hey guys if you stop obsessing about all these trades we're going to make it will really soften the blow when no trades are actually made.

Newish guy here, that statement is true however it’s fun to dream haha. But I don’t get all that bent out of shape. I think they will come together and have a nice little run. Now I don’t think they are contenders by all means but they will have some fight. However I’m game for a shake up also.

[SMTBSI]

I get the owners and GM don’t care that much, but it’s super frustrating as a competitor to just watch your team lose knowing you can try and do something to improve.

One thing you can do to try to improve in the NBA is to draft and develop. It's not instant gratification, but it is viable. There are a lot worse things you can do in this league than add a first-round graded kid to your organization every year. I know that, as Celtics fans, we assume that we're always going to miss on every pick, but that's not how it works.

If you could say that trading picks for established players is systematically always the right thing to do, then that's what everyone would try to do, you'd have a clear market inefficiency, and the market would adjust to a new equilibrium, until it was no longer systematically always the right thing to do.

It will only systematically always be the right thing to do to trade picks for established players, if you know as a fact that your organization will systematically always underperform on their own picks, and underperform by enough to outweigh any value you lose by forcing yourself to accept losing trades, since you're requiring yourself to get something done even though there's not always guaranteed to be a reasonable trade to be made.

I don't acknowledge that we do and always will systematically underperform in drafting. So I don't arrive at the conclusion that we should always trade our picks and young players, even if we have to accept losing value to do so. You make a trade when the value is fair, and you don't when it's not.

[SMTBSI]

George Hill, in my opinion is exactly what we need. A high-IQ veteran point gawd. Besides a wing player, I’d be extremely happy getting him. Just a matter of trade or buyout ( although i can see him being heavily coveted if he’s bought out).

I try to be an optimistic person, but it's really hard for me to see us snagging anyone of note via buyout. Only chance is if it's a guy who values playtime more than ring-chasing. A decent 3/4 that could supplant Semi and Grant could easily get 30+ minutes here.

[Bohemian]

Hey guys if you stop obsessing about all these trades we're going to make it will really soften the blow when no trades are actually made.

There's no way Danny stands pat with this version of the team. Their play is putrid. Team has little talent and no identity. Danny will do his job

[gocelts]

I get the owners and GM don’t care that much, but it’s super frustrating as a competitor to just watch your team lose knowing you can try and do something to improve.

One thing you can do to try to improve in the NBA is to draft and develop. It's not instant gratification, but it is viable. There are a lot worse things you can do in this league than add a first-round graded kid to your organization every year. I know that, as Celtics fans, we assume that we're always going to miss on every pick, but that's not how it works.

If you could say that trading picks for established players is systematically always the right thing to do, then that's what everyone would try to do, you'd have a clear market inefficiency, and the market would adjust to a new equilibrium, until it was no longer systematically always the right thing to do.

It will only systematically always be the right thing to do to trade picks for established players, if you know as a fact that your organization will systematically always underperform on their own picks, and underperform by enough to outweigh any value you lose by forcing yourself to accept losing trades, since you're requiring yourself to get something done even though there's not always guaranteed to be a reasonable trade to be made.

I don't acknowledge that we do and always will systematically underperform in drafting. So I don't arrive at the conclusion that we should always trade our picks and young players, even if we have to accept losing value to do so. You make a trade when the value is fair, and you don't when it's not.

I agree and I actually think Danny is one of the best at drafting and finding talent in the back end of the draft...I just think we've really tapped that well as much as we can. This team is LOADED with young players.

This roster really needs some trades to mix it up and improve.

[SMTBSI]

I get the owners and GM don’t care that much, but it’s super frustrating as a competitor to just watch your team lose knowing you can try and do something to improve.

One thing you can do to try to improve in the NBA is to draft and develop. It's not instant gratification, but it is viable. There are a lot worse things you can do in this league than add a first-round graded kid to your organization every year. I know that, as Celtics fans, we assume that we're always going to miss on every pick, but that's not how it works.

If you could say that trading picks for established players is systematically always the right thing to do, then that's what everyone would try to do, you'd have a clear market inefficiency, and the market would adjust to a new equilibrium, until it was no longer systematically always the right thing to do.

It will only systematically always be the right thing to do to trade picks for established players, if you know as a fact that your organization will systematically always underperform on their own picks, and underperform by enough to outweigh any value you lose by forcing yourself to accept losing trades, since you're requiring yourself to get something done even though there's not always guaranteed to be a reasonable trade to be made.

I don't acknowledge that we do and always will systematically underperform in drafting. So I don't arrive at the conclusion that we should always trade our picks and young players, even if we have to accept losing value to do so. You make a trade when the value is fair, and you don't when it's not.

I agree and I actually think Danny is one of the best at drafting and finding talent in the back end of the draft...I just think we've really tapped that well as much as we can. This team is LOADED with young players.

This roster really needs some trades to mix it up and improve.

Oh, yeah, I definitely agree there are times and places where you have no choice but to give away some value/leverage, and you have to choose what's the best way to do it. "We have more young players than we can reasonably develop" and "we have more picks than we can roster" are a couple of those times. In those cases, it can make sense to take even a losing deal, if it loses you less than you lose by not being able to appropriately develop the kids you got.

I don't personally think that's where we are, but it's a totally fair take.


Edit: I don't mean to put words in your mouth and say that that's your take. All I really mean is that I don't think we're so overwhelmed with youth that we "need" to make a deal for that reason alone. I just want a deal if it's fair. If it's not, I pass, and stick with our kids.