Hal’s Draft Thread

[Celts17Pride]

Davion Mitchell is a danny and Brad wet dream IMO.

Defends relentlessly, can hit the outside shot, can set teammates up.
And with Browns and Tatums marked improvement this year in playmaking the team could be a switch all defense and also about anyone could bring ball up and initiate offense.

Mitchell
Smart
Brown
Tatum
Timelord

Plenty of playmaking, shot making, iso play, defense, hustle, transition.

Wouldn’t mind Mitchell at all but doubt he is there at 16

[Hal14]

Davion Mitchell is a danny and Brad wet dream IMO.

Defends relentlessly, can hit the outside shot, can set teammates up.
And with Browns and Tatums marked improvement this year in playmaking the team could be a switch all defense and also about anyone could bring ball up and initiate offense.

Mitchell
Smart
Brown
Tatum
Timelord

Plenty of playmaking, shot making, iso play, defense, hustle, transition.

In your scenario do they just magically snap their fingers and poof, Kemba and his contract disappear? He's under contract for 2 more years beyond this one and it'll be damn near impossible to find a team willing to take him in a trade.

Or are you just projecting a possible 2023-2024 celtics lineup? If so, I doubt Smart is still starting for this team 3 years from now..

Given the fact that we still have Kemba under contract for 2 more years, Smart under contract for 1 more year, we drafted Pritchard in the 1st round last year and also have Yam Madar stashed overseas, i really don't think we should pick a PG this year.

Only way I'm onboard with drafting a PG is if Giddey is still there at no. 16 since guys like him (the combination of what he's already accomplished at the professional level, the fact that he's a 6'8" PG combined with the fact that dudes with his type of passing ability, passing instincts, court vision and ability to create offense for teammates as good as he does, guys like that simply don't come around very often and he'd be a steal at the 16 spot)..

[Hal14]

I consider "big man" to be a 5.

I see Garuba as a natural 4, who can sometimes play small ball 5. He's 6'8" and doesn't jump that high and 7'2" wingspan. Definitely undersized at the 5.

You need either your 4 or 5 to be able to shoot the 3 in the modern NBA.

I like Garuba, how hard he plays, his strong build, he's arguably the best defender in the draft. Would like him more if he had better perimeter skills (ball handling, dribble drive moves, 3 point shooting)..but then again, if he had better perimeter skills, he probably would get picked before the 16 spot.

spot on, if he already had those offensive skills polished, he'd probably go top 3, or maybe not, some GMs would pick the Bagleys and Aytons of the NCAA before him.

I'd like the Cs to pick him, he doesn't jump that high but he jumps 2,3,4 times to hunt the ball. Is undersized like a Draymond Green, but he's already a better defender and a comparable passer. He needs to polish his 3 point shoot and also to protect himself to finish under the basket, but his basketball IQ is better than advertised. And of course, his dribble needs some work, but those things can be developed. His tenacity and motor can't be teached o transplanted.

That said, and although I'm a fan of Usman (also a Luka fan), I'd take Kai Jones before him, because of Jones length and skills, but either one can form a great frontcourt with Tatum and TimeLord in the short term.

After those two, the big I'd pick is Filip Petrusev, he's growing as a player this year, on both sides, and he'd be a steal in the second round (his stock will probably rise in the next weeks, though):

Watch on YouTube

Pretty much agree with what you wrote. Garuba will be a terrific defender and I think he will develop a three point shot. I do have him as a small ball 5, though. Do not know if he will be quick enough to play at the 4 so successfully.

Kai Jones? Have only seen clips of him...unbelievably athletic but his defense is bad. Also, with Timelord here do we need another guy like him? Of course, if Williams can only play half of games then, yes. Can Jones develop a three point shot?

1) Garuba is absolutely quick enough to play the 4. I see him as a natural 4 who can occasionally play small ball 5.
2) What makes you think Kai Jones defense is bad? You might need to see more footage/read more write ups on him. Everything I've seen indicates he is a very good shot blocker/rim protecting and outstanding defensive versatility with the ability to defend 1-5, but consistency on D is an issue, sometimes makes mistakes but you can chalk that up to the fact that he's only 20 and literally just started playing basketball when he was 15. His upside/potential is insane, I've seen him go as high as 7th in mock drafts
3) Jones is a good 3 point shooter. He shot 38% from 3 this past season, a huge jump from 29% the year before. NBA league average for 3 point shooting is 36%, so he's already better than that.

[Hal14]

Garuba isn't a guard, and he's developing a 3-point shot. We'll see.

I consider "big man" to be a 5.

I see Garuba as a natural 4, who can sometimes play small ball 5. He's 6'8" and doesn't jump that high and 7'2" wingspan. Definitely undersized at the 5.

You need either your 4 or 5 to be able to shoot the 3 in the modern NBA.

I like Garuba, how hard he plays, his strong build, he's arguably the best defender in the draft. Would like him more if he had better perimeter skills (ball handling, dribble drive moves, 3 point shooting)..but then again, if he had better perimeter skills, he probably would get picked before the 16 spot.

spot on, if he already had those offensive skills polished, he'd probably go top 3, or maybe not, some GMs would pick the Bagleys and Aytons of the NCAA before him.

I'd like the Cs to pick him, he doesn't jump that high but he jumps 2,3,4 times to hunt the ball. Is undersized like a Draymond Green, but he's already a better defender and a comparable passer. He needs to polish his 3 point shoot and also to protect himself to finish under the basket, but his basketball IQ is better than advertised. And of course, his dribble needs some work, but those things can be developed. His tenacity and motor can't be teached o transplanted.

That said, and although I'm a fan of Usman (also a Luka fan), I'd take Kai Jones before him, because of Jones length and skills, but either one can form a great frontcourt with Tatum and TimeLord in the short term.

Yup, we're in agreement again.

1) I do like Garuba. Like you said, he's got a lot of things you can't teach - a strong/cut NBA-ready frame already at age 19, the tenacity, effort, motor, hustle on both ends of the floor, defensive instincts and good passing.
2) I too can see that Draymond Green comparison with Garuba. Not sure if I'd go so far as saying Garuba is already a better defender than Green. Green is a top 10 defender in the entire NBA and has been quite a few times. Garuba does seem to be a better shot blocker though. I also wouldn't say Garuba is as good a passer as Green. Green is a really good freaking passer from the forward position. Garuba could get there - he isn't too far off now. One note in terms of the comparison - Garuba is only 19. When Green was 19 it was his freshman year of college - Green shot literally 0% from 3, averaged 3 points and 0.8 assists per game. Green stayed in school all 4 years though, so when he got to the NBA he was more of a finished product. Garuba will need some time to develop if we pick him, but then again any of these guys would since pretty much everyone projected to go in the top 20 is 18 or 19 years old, Jones is 20 and has only been playing basketball since he was 15.

Plus, Garuba is 2 inches taller than Green which helps and combined between the 2 leagues he played in this season he shot 31% from 3 which is clearly better than Green at the same age.

3) Agreed, that I'd be happy if we picked Garuba. Bottom line, this team took a step backwards defensively this season. We were top 10 in defense for the past several years before this one, but this season we were pretty bad defensively for the most part. So I'm A okay with us drafting the guy who is arguably the best defender in the draft. Another weakness for us has been lack of size, and Garuba would help there as well. You put Garuba at the 4, and he's 2 inches taller and way longer wingspan than both Ojeleye and Grant W, Garuba has better leaping ability than both of them and he makes us bigger by playing at the 4 and Tatum at the 3..and even as a small ball 5, Garuba is bigger than Grant W.

4) But I agree, that while I like Garuba, I would definitely pick Jones over him because Jones is 3 inches taller and much more skilled offensively (dribble drive moves, outside shooting, etc.) and Jones is more athletic too. And yeah, either one could definitely form a scary front court alongside Tatum and Time Lord

[return2glory]

Right now I would take:

1. Chris Duarte with the 16th. He is a Dillion Brooks type of player. They both played for Oregon.

2. Jericho Sims with the 2nd round pick. He is tall and athletics with great defensive instincts. Has the ability to guard 3-4 positions.

Or Garza if he can drop some about 15 lbs and improve his quickness. If he can be anything close to Vuc, he would be gamble.

[BillessuR6]

spot on, if he already had those offensive skills polished, he'd probably go top 3, or maybe not, some GMs would pick the Bagleys and Aytons of the NCAA before him.

I'd like the Cs to pick him, he doesn't jump that high but he jumps 2,3,4 times to hunt the ball. Is undersized like a Draymond Green, but he's already a better defender and a comparable passer. He needs to polish his 3 point shoot and also to protect himself to finish under the basket, but his basketball IQ is better than advertised. And of course, his dribble needs some work, but those things can be developed. His tenacity and motor can't be teached o transplanted.

That said, and although I'm a fan of Usman (also a Luka fan), I'd take Kai Jones before him, because of Jones length and skills, but either one can form a great frontcourt with Tatum and TimeLord in the short term.

After those two, the big I'd pick is Filip Petrusev, he's growing as a player this year, on both sides, and he'd be a steal in the second round (his stock will probably rise in the next weeks, though):

Watch on YouTube

Pretty much agree with what you wrote. Garuba will be a terrific defender and I think he will develop a three point shot. I do have him as a small ball 5, though. Do not know if he will be quick enough to play at the 4 so successfully.

Kai Jones? Have only seen clips of him...unbelievably athletic but his defense is bad. Also, with Timelord here do we need another guy like him? Of course, if Williams can only play half of games then, yes. Can Jones develop a three point shot?

1) Garuba is absolutely quick enough to play the 4. I see him as a natural 4 who can occasionally play small ball 5.
2) What makes you think Kai Jones defense is bad? You might need to see more footage/read more write ups on him. Everything I've seen indicates he is a very good shot blocker/rim protecting and outstanding defensive versatility with the ability to defend 1-5, but consistency on D is an issue, sometimes makes mistakes but you can chalk that up to the fact that he's only 20 and literally just started playing basketball when he was 15. His upside/potential is insane, I've seen him go as high as 7th in mock drafts
3) Jones is a good 3 point shooter. He shot 38% from 3 this past season, a huge jump from 29% the year before. NBA league average for 3 point shooting is 36%, so he's already better than that.

I do not know how many games of Garuba you have seen but he is much better suited to play C right now. To use him at the 4 he needs to develop a good 3 point shot and more perimeter skills.

For Jones, like I said I have only seen clips but he seems to have low defensive awareness and is similar to Rob. He does have a bit better jumper but still he only made 13 threes last season, so the sample is really small. His form definitely needs work. Guy is oozing with potential, so I am all for picking him...

We do not need just a role player for us to make a jump to contender status we need another star, so I certainly want potential over ready now player...but like you said I do not believe Jones will be there at 16.

[playa-hater]

Here is a different question. what player that may be available around 5-10 pick would you want for Boston? (in case Boston does a trade up etc.. Smart etc..)

[return2glory]

Davion Mitchell is a danny and Brad wet dream IMO.

Defends relentlessly, can hit the outside shot, can set teammates up.
And with Browns and Tatums marked improvement this year in playmaking the team could be a switch all defense and also about anyone could bring ball up and initiate offense.

Mitchell
Smart
Brown
Tatum
Timelord

Plenty of playmaking, shot making, iso play, defense, hustle, transition.

Wouldn’t mind Mitchell at all but doubt he is there at 16

Yeah, he won’t be there at 16. I think he will go anywhere from 5-11.

Love his game, on both ends. Reminds me a lot of Donovan Mitchell for so many reasons. I feel he improved his stock the most in the tournament.

[return2glory]

Watch on YouTube

[sportfan6197]

Davion Mitchell is a danny and Brad wet dream IMO.

Defends relentlessly, can hit the outside shot, can set teammates up.
And with Browns and Tatums marked improvement this year in playmaking the team could be a switch all defense and also about anyone could bring ball up and initiate offense.

Mitchell
Smart
Brown
Tatum
Timelord

Plenty of playmaking, shot making, iso play, defense, hustle, transition.

In your scenario do they just magically snap their fingers and poof, Kemba and his contract disappear? He's under contract for 2 more years beyond this one and it'll be damn near impossible to find a team willing to take him in a trade.

Or are you just projecting a possible 2023-2024 celtics lineup? If so, I doubt Smart is still starting for this team 3 years from now..

Given the fact that we still have Kemba under contract for 2 more years, Smart under contract for 1 more year, we drafted Pritchard in the 1st round last year and also have Yam Madar stashed overseas, i really don't think we should pick a PG this year.

Only way I'm onboard with drafting a PG is if Giddey is still there at no. 16 since guys like him (the combination of what he's already accomplished at the professional level, the fact that he's a 6'8" PG combined with the fact that dudes with his type of passing ability, passing instincts, court vision and ability to create offense for teammates as good as he does, guys like that simply don't come around very often and he'd be a steal at the 16 spot)..

Smart can be gone. We have no idea on Kemba's longevity. Pritchard will probably max out to 6th man.

Ainge drafted Rozier after IT became an all star. He's going to go with BPA over fit

[Hal14]

Pretty much agree with what you wrote. Garuba will be a terrific defender and I think he will develop a three point shot. I do have him as a small ball 5, though. Do not know if he will be quick enough to play at the 4 so successfully.

Kai Jones? Have only seen clips of him...unbelievably athletic but his defense is bad. Also, with Timelord here do we need another guy like him? Of course, if Williams can only play half of games then, yes. Can Jones develop a three point shot?

1) Garuba is absolutely quick enough to play the 4. I see him as a natural 4 who can occasionally play small ball 5.
2) What makes you think Kai Jones defense is bad? You might need to see more footage/read more write ups on him. Everything I've seen indicates he is a very good shot blocker/rim protecting and outstanding defensive versatility with the ability to defend 1-5, but consistency on D is an issue, sometimes makes mistakes but you can chalk that up to the fact that he's only 20 and literally just started playing basketball when he was 15. His upside/potential is insane, I've seen him go as high as 7th in mock drafts
3) Jones is a good 3 point shooter. He shot 38% from 3 this past season, a huge jump from 29% the year before. NBA league average for 3 point shooting is 36%, so he's already better than that.

I do not know how many games of Garuba you have seen but he is much better suited to play C right now. To use him at the 4 he needs to develop a good 3 point shot and more perimeter skills.

For Jones, like I said I have only seen clips but he seems to have low defensive awareness and is similar to Rob. He does have a bit better jumper but still he only made 13 threes last season, so the sample is really small. His form definitely needs work. Guy is oozing with potential, so I am all for picking him...

We do not need just a role player for us to make a jump to contender status we need another star, so I certainly want potential over ready now player...but like you said I do not believe Jones will be there at 16.

1) You might be right about Garuba, but if that's true that he can't play the 4 then the Celtics should cross him right off the list of possible guys they draft because IMO he's too small to play the 5, unless it's just occasionally, rare spot minutes here or there. He's 6'8" which typically is too small to play the 5. Time Lord is the very rate exception of guys who are 6'8" but can play the 5 but that's only because time lord has a 7'6" wingspan and 40 inch vertical leap. Garuba only has a 7'2" wingspan and his vertical isn't anywhere close to 40 inches.

Like others have said though, I am optimistic he'll develop and improve his perimeter skills. He shot 31% from 3 this season combined between 2 pro leagues, which is higher than Giddey and no one has a problem calling Giddey a lottery pick. Again, Garuba and develop his perimeter skills but he has many things that you can't teach (high motor, high effort, hustle, tenacity, defensive instincts, good vision and timing with passing, strong frame, etc.

2) If you want someone with star potential, there's Jones (seems like a 50/50 on whether he'll still be there at 16) or Jalen Johnson - everything I'm hearing is saying his stick is plummeting because of how he left Duke, work ethic/character concerns and how he went to 3 high schools in 3 years. Because of those red flags, it seems like a pretty high chance he will still be on the board at 16. Before he left Duke he was considered a top 5-6 pick. The talent, size, athleticism is off the charts with him. If Jones or Johnson is still there at 16, I say we go for it. I'm ok with rolling the dice on Johnson..he's high risk, high reward, but at the 16 spot, there's less risk - and plus, Johnson is young, he's only 19, chances are he'll mature and he'll grow up. And he could pay big dividends for which ever teams takes a chance on him.

[Hal14]

This mock draft seems really off:

https://fansided.com/2021/05/21/nba-mock-draft-2021-houston-rockets-lottery-winner/

-they have us picking Cooper 16th, with Giddey still on the board. Are they on crack?
-They have Giddey going 20th and Mitchell going 26th, huh?
-I'm thinking whoever wrote the article is clueless - in their blurb about Jalen Johnson they call James Wiseman "Jameis Winston" lol

[playa-hater]

This mock draft seems really off:

https://fansided.com/2021/05/21/nba-mock-draft-2021-houston-rockets-lottery-winner/

-they have us picking Cooper 16th, with Giddey still on the board. Are they on crack?
-They have Giddey going 20th and Mitchell going 26th, huh?
-I'm thinking whoever wrote the article is clueless - in their blurb about Jalen Johnson they call James Wiseman "Jameis Winston" lol

fanside is near the worst in general.

[playa-hater]

My Priority is getting a player that can contribute sooner than later but still have some upside. I don't care for Garuba at all. No sign of shooting and will not surprise me if he measures 6'7.. Maybe he grows and does become a shooter since he is only 18, but a long term talent in my eyes. If we were going for a long term ceiling I would have preferred Poku last draft.

[playa-hater]

Still taking peaks at prospects, I am intrigued by Gregg Brown. Upside is athletics with size. A modern day 4 man perhaps. Looks like he has pretty good mechanics. But has low intangibles. But is that because he is so young or just the way he is?

Ceiling might be John Collins 2.0

[Hal14]

Still taking peaks at prospects, I am intrigued by Gregg Brown. Upside is athletics with size. A modern day 4 man perhaps. Looks like he has pretty good mechanics. But has low intangibles. But is that because he is so young or just the way he is?

Ceiling might be John Collins 2.0

So Garuba is out of the question because of his lack of shooting but Greg Brown is totally fine?

Garuba shot 31% from 3 this year combined between 2 leagues. Brown shot 33% against easier competition.

You think Garuba is 6'7". That's purely speculation. He's listed at 6'8" and in his highlight video he blocks a dude who looks like he's 7'1"...twice.

That being said, at this point my 2 favorite guys based on talent/skill set/physical tools and fit are Johnson and Jones. Hoping 1 of them falls to us at 16..

[playa-hater]

Still taking peaks at prospects, I am intrigued by Gregg Brown. Upside is athletics with size. A modern day 4 man perhaps. Looks like he has pretty good mechanics. But has low intangibles. But is that because he is so young or just the way he is?

Ceiling might be John Collins 2.0

So Garuba is out of the question because of his lack of shooting but Greg Brown is totally fine?

Garuba shot 31% from 3 this year combined between 2 leagues. Brown shot 33% against easier competition.

You think Garuba is 6'7". That's purely speculation. He's listed at 6'8" and in his highlight video he blocks a dude who looks like he's 7'1"...twice.

That being said, at this point my 2 favorite guys based on talent/skill set/physical tools and fit are Johnson and Jones. Hoping 1 of them falls to us at 16..

Please don't change my words. Never said G brown is "fine". Said I am intrigued. Also don't put as much into shooting % stats as some. I am looking for technique/flow/balance type of things. Also never said I would think Brown would make a good/better pick at 16 for Boston. Garuba seems to be mocked there often and I am not in favor of him, that's all.

Every draft has some sleepers. I think Gregg Brown may be one of them

[GoGreen]

At 16, you're not going to get the top flight prospects. Just gotta take a chance at that point. I think Garuba would be solid there. Not my favorite, but it is what it is

[Hal14]

At 16, you're not going to get the top flight prospects. Just gotta take a chance at that point. I think Garuba would be solid there. Not my favorite, but it is what it is

You might be right, but I checked out 4 recent mocks (CBS, Bleacher Report, NBC Sports, Tankathon) + ESPN's Big Board...all of these were updated within the past week:

Kai Jones - 18th in CBS mock and 17th on ESPN's Big Board
Jalen Johnson - 23rd in CBS mock and 24th in NBC Sports mock
Davion Mitchell - picked 16th by Celtics in NBC Sports mock

Seems like at least a decent chance that 1 of them falls to us..

[Hal14]

Davion Mitchell is a danny and Brad wet dream IMO.

Defends relentlessly, can hit the outside shot, can set teammates up.
And with Browns and Tatums marked improvement this year in playmaking the team could be a switch all defense and also about anyone could bring ball up and initiate offense.

Mitchell
Smart
Brown
Tatum
Timelord

Plenty of playmaking, shot making, iso play, defense, hustle, transition.

In your scenario do they just magically snap their fingers and poof, Kemba and his contract disappear? He's under contract for 2 more years beyond this one and it'll be damn near impossible to find a team willing to take him in a trade.

Or are you just projecting a possible 2023-2024 celtics lineup? If so, I doubt Smart is still starting for this team 3 years from now..

Given the fact that we still have Kemba under contract for 2 more years, Smart under contract for 1 more year, we drafted Pritchard in the 1st round last year and also have Yam Madar stashed overseas, i really don't think we should pick a PG this year.

Only way I'm onboard with drafting a PG is if Giddey is still there at no. 16 since guys like him (the combination of what he's already accomplished at the professional level, the fact that he's a 6'8" PG combined with the fact that dudes with his type of passing ability, passing instincts, court vision and ability to create offense for teammates as good as he does, guys like that simply don't come around very often and he'd be a steal at the 16 spot)..

Smart can be gone. We have no idea on Kemba's longevity. Pritchard will probably max out to 6th man.

Ainge drafted Rozier after IT became an all star. He's going to go with BPA over fit

Ok, I'm watching more Mitchell footage here and like what I see. Some things I like most about him:

-A few people have talked in this thread about their preference for a guy who's more polished, more of a finished product, someone who's less raw, less of a project so they can help us get back on track sooner rather than later - I'm onboard with this strategy as well. Well, Mitchell is your guy. He's 22 and will be 23 when next NBA season tips off.
-He's got a fire, and intensity to the way he plays
-Defensive Player of the Year? Yes please
-6'2", ok that is solid for a PG since we need to get bigger at that position. Mitchell actually plays bigger than that too, though - he's got a 6'5" wingspan and a 41 inch vertical leap
-Shooting, 44.7% from 3 and he has a really smooth stroke, good mechanics, shoots with confidence, can shoot it well off the catch or off the dribble
-Also has good blow by speed to get by his man off the dribble and penetrate
-One thing I've noticed is that most PGs in today's NBA, their assist % is at least a few percentage points higher than their usage %. That's not the case however for Kemba or Pritchard. Both have them, their usage % is actually a few percentage points higher than their assist %. Clearly we need a PG who is more of a play maker so the ball is moving more and our PG can be more of a facilitator and setting up Tatum/Brown/Fournier/Rob for open looks.

Kemba = high usage % of 26.1 (teams that I've seen who are contending do not have 3 guys on the same team with usage % over 25% like we do) and low assist % of 23.8% (this assist % is lower than pretty much every starting PG I've looked up so far)
Mitchell = low usage of 20.3% and high assist % of 27.7% (yes, this is exactly what we need)

This guy would be a great pick if he's still there at 16. Yes, we would be super crowded at the PG position (Kemba, Mitchell, Smart, Pritchard and Madar waiting overseas) but this guy is too good to pass up. I'd be surprised if he's still there at the 16 spot, but you never know - NBC Sports latest mock has him going 16th to Boston..

Watch on YouTube