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Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24 – (Trade Deadline Feb. 8, 3PM, ET)

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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#441 » by hugepatsfan » Fri Jan 5, 2024 3:07 pm

RickyDizzle wrote:
hugepatsfan wrote:
cl2117 wrote:Realistically if the weren't already on the team I think Brissett, Stevens and Svi would be solid targets for a "big wing". Of the guys that fit into the TPE and are obtainable, there's not really anyone that stands out as a massive upgrade over that trio.

Oshae in particular fits the bill really well. 6'7 but I think plays bigger because of his physicality. Jack of all trades master of none. Box score stats look great this year and the eye test suggests he's a hustle player who isn't going to get in the way of our studs. I have to imagine that's what Brad is looking for. We don't need more shooting, playmaking, defense in particular, so a guy who can do a bit of everything and just fill the space between the better players on the court makes perfect sense. I'm honestly surprised he hasn't been given more of a chance to carve out a more regular role.

Stevens as well jumps out. Not as big of a wing, but still plays bigger than his physical profile. More of a defensive focused option, which also works well given the rest of the roster. Svi makes the least sense because I think he needs the ball more than the others to be effective but if he's hot from three he could be really useful.

I don't think he's ready but Walsh could be a darkhorse in terms of an internal candidate for the role. He's got the physical profile and based on what we'd ask him to do, which would be very limited, he could still be an option. Similar to Queta it probably comes down to whether or not he can keep from fouling his way back to the bench or not.

I'm all for pushing our chips in and acquiring whomever Brad thinks helps us get over the hump, but there's a part of me that feels like Brad's mom and wants to say "No, we have big wings at home".


Neither Brissett or Stevens will be playable in the playoffs IMO. If you're a wing that can't shoot we've seen time and time again that defenses will sag off of you to the point that it f's up the whole offense. It's a tale as old as time. That's just how it goes. Same with Queta and Kornet... bigs who can't defend the pick and roll can't stick in the playoff rotation. That's just what it is.

It's pretty foolish IMO to expect any of those guys to be any sort of factor in the playoffs.


Don't think Brissett and Stevens are necessarily unplayable. Playing good defense is more important than shooting in the playoffs for spot minutes. Think you could play one of these for 3 or 4 minutes, get some tough D, offensive rebounds, maybe they make an open corner three maybe not. See how it goes and maybe play the same guy for 3 or 4 minutes in the second half, or if the first half didn't go well, you switch from Stevens to Brisset or vice versa.

Neither guy has really gotten a shot at this point in a steady role. I'd probably use the rest of the regular season to experiment with things and lower tatums minutes, see if one of those guys can emerge as a consistent bench contributor.


This just isn't what teams do. You don't play a guy 3-4 minutes and then yank him if it didn't go well. No one thrives like that and you put too much pressure on him.

Maybe Brissett or Stevens would buck the trend, but you go through past playoff series and guys like that get run off the court in the playoffs. Their "energy" on defense and the boards is less of a standout because in the playoffs everyone is playing hard vs in the regular season where not everyone is. And while maybe they make a few 3s in a game, their track records show they aren't reliable so defenses will sag off them and make life hell on your best players.

Look at a guy like Tony Allen. Truly one of the best defenders maybe ever from his MEM days. They had to bench him in the playoffs at times because of how teams defended him. Playoffs is just a different game and our wings (Brissett, Stevens) and bigs (Kornet, Queta) are the exact profiles that time and time again have been rendered useless in the playoffs.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#442 » by cl2117 » Fri Jan 5, 2024 3:18 pm

hugepatsfan wrote:I think Otto Porter Jr. makes the most sense of guys realistically available for the TPE. His contract is one that TOR should be happy to shed without anything coming back other than salary relief. Championship-tested from his time against us with GS. Low usage player who teams need to respect from 3.

PF is a nice position for us to add depth because it's multi=faceted. We can play less of Horford/Porzingis together to use that depth to cover us at the C spot. Or we can use the extra PF depth to play Tatum at the 3 more slide guys down to provide relief on the wing and in the backcourt.

Looking around the options, I'm not sure we're realistically going to be able to upgrade over Hauser/Pritchard as our #7/#8 guys in the rotation. So it's about what you can add in behind them as a 9th guy to go to. Kornet/Queta show deficiencies on defense that likely phase them out of any playoff rotation. Brissett/Stevens are the type of weak or non shooters that defenses have made obsolete in the playoffs. OPJ fits the profile of someone who would be more playable in the playoffs than anyone else we have outside of the top 8 and should be available for basically nothing besides a bigger tax bill.

Tillman is interesting but we don't need the TPE for that. Just send them a min contract guy and however many 2nds you need to. If they would intend to seriously think about re-signing him that could be a nice move.

Does OPJ fit the TPE? He's $6.3m the TPE is $6.2. I know usually there is a small balancing amount where it doesn't have to match exactly, but I'm not sure teams over the apron can avail of that.

hugepatsfan wrote:Neither Brissett or Stevens will be playable in the playoffs IMO. If you're a wing that can't shoot we've seen time and time again that defenses will sag off of you to the point that it f's up the whole offense. It's a tale as old as time. That's just how it goes. Same with Queta and Kornet... bigs who can't defend the pick and roll can't stick in the playoff rotation. That's just what it is.

It's pretty foolish IMO to expect any of those guys to be any sort of factor in the playoffs.

To be fair I think it's foolish to expect any of the guys who fit that Grant TPE and are obtainable to be any sort of factor in the playoffs. Which begs the question, what does Brad actually expect to get out of these guys?

Brissett isn't an unplayably bad shooter, at least not in spot minutes (Lamar less so). I think that with how much offensive firepower we have elsewhere, if you use him as a screener/cutter you can get by for short bursts without too much of an issue.

You could go out and get a guy like Fonteccio, who I do in fact like as a target, but then you have the potential issue of him getting isolated on defense and getting played off the floor that way. And if his shot isn't falling then he's not bringing much to the table, whereas at least Brissett gives you a floor with his defense/rebounding.

Is there any guy who we'd be targeting with the TPE that realistically cracks the top 8? I'm not sure. So it's spot minutes/emergency depth regardless.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#443 » by Celts17Pride » Fri Jan 5, 2024 3:52 pm

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Moses Moody anyone?
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#444 » by 31to6 » Fri Jan 5, 2024 4:04 pm

I used to be all about him (before his latest injury problems), but now when I think 'washed' I think of Otto Porter Jr.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#445 » by 165bows » Fri Jan 5, 2024 4:15 pm

31to6 wrote:I used to be all about him (before his latest injury problems), but now when I think 'washed' I think of Otto Porter Jr.

Yeah he seems like more of a buyout guy to me.

Toronto saves money if he takes a buyout, Celtics get him cheaper (way cheaper really with the tax) than if they just took him in in a trade, and he would prob end up with a solid raise as well.

Especially if Toronto can't get a real trade asset for him, I'm not sure what the benefit is of the trade really. But agree he seems more like a buy out guy talent-wise as well.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#446 » by Hal14 » Fri Jan 5, 2024 4:33 pm

hugepatsfan wrote:
RickyDizzle wrote:
hugepatsfan wrote:
Neither Brissett or Stevens will be playable in the playoffs IMO. If you're a wing that can't shoot we've seen time and time again that defenses will sag off of you to the point that it f's up the whole offense. It's a tale as old as time. That's just how it goes. Same with Queta and Kornet... bigs who can't defend the pick and roll can't stick in the playoff rotation. That's just what it is.

It's pretty foolish IMO to expect any of those guys to be any sort of factor in the playoffs.


Don't think Brissett and Stevens are necessarily unplayable. Playing good defense is more important than shooting in the playoffs for spot minutes. Think you could play one of these for 3 or 4 minutes, get some tough D, offensive rebounds, maybe they make an open corner three maybe not. See how it goes and maybe play the same guy for 3 or 4 minutes in the second half, or if the first half didn't go well, you switch from Stevens to Brisset or vice versa.

Neither guy has really gotten a shot at this point in a steady role. I'd probably use the rest of the regular season to experiment with things and lower tatums minutes, see if one of those guys can emerge as a consistent bench contributor.


This just isn't what teams do. You don't play a guy 3-4 minutes and then yank him if it didn't go well. No one thrives like that and you put too much pressure on him.

Maybe Brissett or Stevens would buck the trend, but you go through past playoff series and guys like that get run off the court in the playoffs. Their "energy" on defense and the boards is less of a standout because in the playoffs everyone is playing hard vs in the regular season where not everyone is. And while maybe they make a few 3s in a game, their track records show they aren't reliable so defenses will sag off them and make life hell on your best players.

Look at a guy like Tony Allen. Truly one of the best defenders maybe ever from his MEM days. They had to bench him in the playoffs at times because of how teams defended him. Playoffs is just a different game and our wings (Brissett, Stevens) and bigs (Kornet, Queta) are the exact profiles that time and time again have been rendered useless in the playoffs.

Yeah, I'm leaning in this direction.

Lamar Stevens was a solid role player for cleveland in the reg season but his mins got cut big time in the playoffs last year. Cleveland desperately needed a wing in there who could shoot.

Phoenix had Josh Okogie in there (a wing defender who can't shoot) quite a bit in the playoffs last year but overall he was not very effective and in the end Phoenix fizzled out in the 2nd round. Then they made a point of adding only wings this summer who could shoot (Watanabe, Eric Gordon, etc.).

Denver just won the title. All 8 of their rotation players were decent shooters.

OPJ is just sitting there in Toronto, not being used. He's only 30, should still have a little bit of gas left in the tank. He fits in the Grant TPE. He's more of a 4 but can play some at the 3 and maybe even some small ball 5.

He made like 55% from 3 in the NBA finals just 2 yrs ago. If he was on Boston that series instead of GS, there's a decent chance we would have won the title.

Why not just get him?
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#447 » by Hal14 » Fri Jan 5, 2024 4:36 pm

cl2117 wrote:Does OPJ fit the TPE? He's $6.3m the TPE is $6.2. I know usually there is a small balancing amount where it doesn't have to match exactly, but I'm not sure teams over the apron can avail of that.

I believe you can go $100K over so technically we could get a player making $6.3 mil (so OPJ barely fits).

I believe that's just a rule regarding how TPE's work - it doesn't matter whether the team is over the apron or not..I could be wrong, though.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#448 » by KillahGhostface » Fri Jan 5, 2024 4:39 pm

I can’t imagine that they’re going to trade for anyone who will make any difference in the playoffs. That’s why Brad kept saying they are really limited in what they can offer, and that the player may come from within.

I’d love to get a guy to eat up some regular season minutes though.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#449 » by KillahGhostface » Fri Jan 5, 2024 4:44 pm

That said, bring JellyO home

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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#450 » by playa-hater » Fri Jan 5, 2024 4:59 pm

Why Bring in KO.. We have Kornet.. Kornet is longer :o
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#451 » by Dogen » Fri Jan 5, 2024 4:59 pm

bigfoot_cryptozoology wrote:I'm sold
On Fontecchio being a very good addition to the Celtics, might be the best 3-pointer shooting addition that they could get in the NBA but Ainge won't exchange him for a reasonable price .


I had to look this guy Fontecchio up. I haven't kept up with the Jazz.

He checks off a few boxes: big wing, nice shooter, willing passer, sub-Hayward-level haircut.

Can he defend? And he may be to inexperienced for what Brad is looking for.

But all options are open, I think Brad and Danny could be good trading partners if Jazz belly up and Danny starts to focus more on future assets. Fontecchio has a contract that is tradable to Boston, and looks like he fits in the TPE. But the Jazz are still in the mix, and deadline is looming. Danny likely will want to keep a decent player on rookie contract.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#452 » by Memokerobi » Fri Jan 5, 2024 5:38 pm

Memokerobi wrote:If the Warriors season keeps going like this, any chance they trade Kuminga for say 2 1sts?


Ooohh that's interesting

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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#453 » by Larry_Russell » Fri Jan 5, 2024 5:40 pm

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Moses Moody anyone?



im a pretty big moody fan.

Would glady trade a few seconds for him. Gladly.

kid will explode once gets some minutes imo.


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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#454 » by Larry_Russell » Fri Jan 5, 2024 5:41 pm

Memokerobi wrote:
Memokerobi wrote:If the Warriors season keeps going like this, any chance they trade Kuminga for say 2 1sts?


Ooohh that's interesting

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fits the TPE
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#455 » by 165bows » Fri Jan 5, 2024 5:48 pm

KillahGhostface wrote:That said, bring JellyO home

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Ha doesn’t look like he would mind.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#456 » by Hal14 » Fri Jan 5, 2024 5:55 pm

Dogen wrote:I had to look this guy Fontecchio up. I haven't kept up with the Jazz.

He checks off a few boxes: big wing, nice shooter, willing passer, sub-Hayward-level haircut.

Yeah, he's pretty good.

Dogen wrote:Can he defend?

I've only watched a little bit of film but his defense seems to be okay, Not great, not terrible.

Dogen wrote:And he may be to inexperienced for what Brad is looking for.

Yeah, no playoff experience. And not a lot of NBA experience.

But he has experience playing in international competitions for Italy's national team, like in 2022 EuroBasket tournament where he was one of the best players in the tournament (a tournament that had Giannis, Jokic, Doncic, etc.). And he has played in 77 EuroLeague games, which isn't NBA level competition but lots of those games have a playoff atmosphere/intensity to them.

Dogen wrote:But all options are open, I think Brad and Danny could be good trading partners if Jazz belly up and Danny starts to focus more on future assets. Fontecchio has a contract that is tradable to Boston, and looks like he fits in the TPE. But the Jazz are still in the mix, and deadline is looming.

Yeah, the Jazz are kind of in the mix. They're currently the 12 seed, but just 1 game out of the 10 seed which makes the play-in.

But Danny seems intent to do a long term rebuild in Utah. He blew it up, traded Gobert and Mitchell as soon as he took the job. Then last season, even though they were kind of close to the play-in at the deadline, they kept trading more guys away (Vanderbilt, Beasley, Conley) for draft picks. Then drafted 3 guys in the 1st round in the 2023 draft.

So they are likely going to be sellers at the deadline again this year. It shouldn't shock anyone if Olynyk, Fontecchio, Clarkson or even Sexton gets moved.

Dogen wrote:Danny likely will want to keep a decent player on rookie contract.

Fontecchio went undrafted in 2017. He recently turned 28. While it's his 2nd NBA season (so technically he might be considered on his rookie contract) when they signed him last year it was more of just signing a random FA guy who was 26 yrs old..

I doubt he's in Utah's long term rebuilding plans.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#457 » by Hal14 » Fri Jan 5, 2024 6:03 pm

Not sure how realistic it is that GS would actually trade Moody and/or Kuminga since they're still trying to win right now, while Steph/Klay/Draymond/Wiggins/CP3 are there. And they won't want them trade them b/c then they won't have enough young talen left for when those old guys are gone/washed.

And if they trade them, I wouldn't think they would want to do boston any favors and make the best team in the league even better. They'd probably rather trade them to brooklyn, houston, indy, Orlando or whatever.

With that being said, I'm sure Brad is at least making the call and seeing what he can do..
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#458 » by Smart2Nesmith43 » Fri Jan 5, 2024 6:11 pm

KillahGhostface wrote:That said, bring JellyO home

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I bet the analytics say the Celtics need to increase their pump fakes per 100 possessions.
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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#459 » by Hal14 » Fri Jan 5, 2024 6:22 pm

Trade rumor season heating up..

This one seems weird. Why would SAC trade 3 rotation players when they're the 5 seed in the west? Perhaps looking to package up 2 or 3 of these guys for a 3rd star to go alongside sabonis and Fox?

I have heard some rumors that the kings may be interested in Lavine..

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Re: Trade/Free Agency Thread 2023-24, Lucky Part 13 

Post#460 » by hugepatsfan » Fri Jan 5, 2024 6:28 pm

Hal14 wrote:Trade rumor season heating up..

This one seems weird. Why would SAC trade 3 rotation players when they're the 5 seed in the west? Perhaps looking to package up 2 or 3 of these guys for a 3rd star to go alongside sabonis and Fox?

I have heard some rumors that the kings may be interested in Lavine..

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Full context of that article implies that they'd use Barnes/Huerter as the salary piece to make a trade for a bigger level addition. Doesn't seem like a scenario where they'd be interested a deal that's classified as "trading those guys away". They'd be looking for a deal of "trading those guys for ____".

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