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Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20

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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#521 » by Gomes3PC » Mon Dec 2, 2019 3:21 am

Wes-J wrote:
Gomes3PC wrote:Ainge knows a guy like Turner is not enough to win a title. We need to find a way to get a true top 10 talent. One of Giannis, Harden, AD, Kawhi, Lillard - a guy like that. You just can't win without one, no disrespect to those Pistons teams.
l


Funny, of those guys you mentioned only Kawhi has a title to his name. The others haven't come close to sniffing one.

Mind sharing the last team that didn't have a top 10 guy and won a title? Because Curry is definitely a top-10 guy, Durant when healthy is, Lebron duh. Having a top-10 guy is a necessary, not sufficient, requirement.
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#522 » by Wes-J » Mon Dec 2, 2019 3:34 am

Gomes3PC wrote:
Wes-J wrote:
Gomes3PC wrote:Ainge knows a guy like Turner is not enough to win a title. We need to find a way to get a true top 10 talent. One of Giannis, Harden, AD, Kawhi, Lillard - a guy like that. You just can't win without one, no disrespect to those Pistons teams.
l


Funny, of those guys you mentioned only Kawhi has a title to his name. The others haven't come close to sniffing one.

Mind sharing the last team that didn't have a top 10 guy and won a title? Because Curry is definitely a top-10 guy, Durant when healthy is, Lebron duh. Having a top-10 guy is a necessary, not sufficient, requirement.


Uh yeah name dropping guys that have titles are a given but the others mentioned have not even made the finals. Bottomline I don't think it's as simple as that.
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#523 » by Gomes3PC » Mon Dec 2, 2019 3:58 am

Wes-J wrote:
Gomes3PC wrote:
Wes-J wrote:
Funny, of those guys you mentioned only Kawhi has a title to his name. The others haven't come close to sniffing one.

Mind sharing the last team that didn't have a top 10 guy and won a title? Because Curry is definitely a top-10 guy, Durant when healthy is, Lebron duh. Having a top-10 guy is a necessary, not sufficient, requirement.


Uh yeah name dropping guys that have titles are a given but the others mentioned have not even made the finals. Bottomline I don't think it's as simple as that.

Of course it isn't, but the fact of the matter is we don't have a top 10 guy and nobody on the roster reasonably projects to that right now. Maybe Tatum if you really squint your eyes, but he's probably closer to a Paul George / Paul Pierce in his upside than a KG or Kawhi.
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#524 » by Wes-J » Mon Dec 2, 2019 4:10 am

Gomes3PC wrote:
Wes-J wrote:
Gomes3PC wrote:Mind sharing the last team that didn't have a top 10 guy and won a title? Because Curry is definitely a top-10 guy, Durant when healthy is, Lebron duh. Having a top-10 guy is a necessary, not sufficient, requirement.


Uh yeah name dropping guys that have titles are a given but the others mentioned have not even made the finals. Bottomline I don't think it's as simple as that.

Of course it isn't, but the fact of the matter is we don't have a top 10 guy and nobody on the roster reasonably projects to that right now. Maybe Tatum if you really squint your eyes, but he's probably closer to a Paul George / Paul Pierce in his upside than a KG or Kawhi.


Really just depends on what they decide on Hayward. Trade him and picks for that somebody but I can't tell you who that player is that makes us better than Hayward.
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#525 » by Fencer reregistered » Mon Dec 2, 2019 5:22 am

Gomes3PC wrote:
Wes-J wrote:
Gomes3PC wrote:Mind sharing the last team that didn't have a top 10 guy and won a title? Because Curry is definitely a top-10 guy, Durant when healthy is, Lebron duh. Having a top-10 guy is a necessary, not sufficient, requirement.


Uh yeah name dropping guys that have titles are a given but the others mentioned have not even made the finals. Bottomline I don't think it's as simple as that.

Of course it isn't, but the fact of the matter is we don't have a top 10 guy and nobody on the roster reasonably projects to that right now. Maybe Tatum if you really squint your eyes, but he's probably closer to a Paul George / Paul Pierce in his upside than a KG or Kawhi.


The most recent case I could identify of a champion not having an all-NBA first- or second-team guy that season was when Hakeem for some reason was only on the third team. Now, that may be a bit circular in that it's influenced by team success, but there are only a few cases where there's even any doubt about a championship team having a top-ten player that season (the most recent Pistons, the most recent Spurs, and who else?). THAT said, few people would have predicted that Isaiah Thomas would be a top ten player even for one year, so let's not be too quick to rule the current Celtics players out.
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#526 » by sully00 » Mon Dec 2, 2019 6:33 am

Gomes3PC wrote:
Wes-J wrote:
Gomes3PC wrote:Ainge knows a guy like Turner is not enough to win a title. We need to find a way to get a true top 10 talent. One of Giannis, Harden, AD, Kawhi, Lillard - a guy like that. You just can't win without one, no disrespect to those Pistons teams.
l


Funny, of those guys you mentioned only Kawhi has a title to his name. The others haven't come close to sniffing one.

Mind sharing the last team that didn't have a top 10 guy and won a title? Because Curry is definitely a top-10 guy, Durant when healthy is, Lebron duh. Having a top-10 guy is a necessary, not sufficient, requirement.


Curry wasn't a top 10 guy going into '14-'15 he became an MVP and the recognition in that season. If Kemba Walker leads the Boston Celtics to an NBA championship he will be viewed as a top 10 player. He has been statistically a top 15 player and a top 5 guard he was just not in a particularly interesting environment.

While Boston's roster is lacking perfect balance as far as frontcourt talent vs backcourt and wing talent I think coaches would prefer what Boston has going on than relying on an individual star to carry the team. Obviously nobody is going to turn down Giannis or Durant but if you could have 4 20ppg guys who are relatively efficient and can play together I think most coaches would take that. When you win the accolades come not the year before.
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#527 » by BRUNiNHO91 » Mon Dec 2, 2019 7:20 am

I don't think you need a top 10 guy anymore. Maybe back when LeBron had 2 super stars around him or when the 70 win Warriors added Durant..

Now it's a two star per team league..coaching, depth and all around talent is going to be a factor this season. What we need is consistent vet contributors around our 5 best players. Wanamaker has proved he can be one and Kanter is slowly coming around as his minutes go up. Everybody else is kind of up and down..you see flashes with Rob, Theis, Grant, Carsen..but outside our top 5 and Wanamaker, the other guys are more down than up most games. If we are serious about making a deep run this year, you'll see Ainge open some roster spots and add a few 'over 30's' type of guys on the team.
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#528 » by Fencer reregistered » Mon Dec 2, 2019 7:35 am

sully00 wrote:
Gomes3PC wrote:
Wes-J wrote:
Funny, of those guys you mentioned only Kawhi has a title to his name. The others haven't come close to sniffing one.

Mind sharing the last team that didn't have a top 10 guy and won a title? Because Curry is definitely a top-10 guy, Durant when healthy is, Lebron duh. Having a top-10 guy is a necessary, not sufficient, requirement.


Curry wasn't a top 10 guy going into '14-'15 he became an MVP and the recognition in that season. If Kemba Walker leads the Boston Celtics to an NBA championship he will be viewed as a top 10 player. He has been statistically a top 15 player and a top 5 guard he was just not in a particularly interesting environment.

While Boston's roster is lacking perfect balance as far as frontcourt talent vs backcourt and wing talent I think coaches would prefer what Boston has going on than relying on an individual star to carry the team. Obviously nobody is going to turn down Giannis or Durant but if you could have 4 20ppg guys who are relatively efficient and can play together I think most coaches would take that. When you win the accolades come not the year before.


There's nobody standing clearly in the way of Kemba being viewed as a top guard in the league. Harden and Doncic seem solidly ahead, but that's all. Lilliard and Irving are probably ahead in most people's estimations, but the margin is small enough to be outweighed by intangibles and team success, should things so unfold -- especially in Irving's case. The Golden Staters, Oladipo and Wall are injured this year. Both sides of the CP3/Westbrook trade have declined. Beal is rightly ranked closely with Kemba. Simmons has been, but opinions about him are rightly growing more negative. Trae and other young -- as it were -- guys aren't in the discussion yet.

While Kemba has no guarantee of even repeating on third team all-NBA, he has a clear path to do so, and second team is well within reach.
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#529 » by Wes-J » Mon Dec 2, 2019 7:43 am

Top 10 what's that?? It's really subjective.

LeBron and his teams (maybe greatest player ever) and Golden State (arguably greatest team ever) is a tough way to put together a blueprint for success.

We're fine as constructed it's just a matter of when Tatum and to a lesser extent Brown take that next step. I expect more from Tatum too.
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#530 » by Fencer reregistered » Mon Dec 2, 2019 12:11 pm

Wes-J wrote:Top 10 what's that?? It's really subjective.


I think the real concern is that:

-- There are a number of guys who deserve max salaries.
-- There are a few guys who are much better than many of the other max salary guys.
-- The guys in the second group are the biggest bargains in a salary-capped league.
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#531 » by 100proof » Mon Dec 2, 2019 12:52 pm

Hypothetically speaking, if the memphis pick does not convey this year, then a deal involving Brown, Tatum and that pick cannot be topped by any team in the league, imo.

That could net team many superstar level players, if they were available.

I do not think though, that that is the route the team takes. I believe they are looking to raise the value of a few pieces (langford, Edwards, Kanter, Poirier) and cash them along with a pick or 2 to nab a center that accommodates the lineup we have been seeing alot of.

And wannamaker has more than proven himself a more than capapble backup playmaker, and add Hayward and Thies to the bench and you are looking really strong there.

They key is that center cog in the starting lineup.

Langford, Kanter and Edwards allows team to take back up to 14.4 million in salary.

Leonard, Nurkic, plumblee, Bryant, Harrell all fall into that range.
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#532 » by 100proof » Mon Dec 2, 2019 1:02 pm

anyone else getting the feeling that JJJ might become available too?
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#533 » by Dannyboy36 » Mon Dec 2, 2019 2:27 pm

100proof wrote:anyone else getting the feeling that JJJ might become available too?


He’s soo young but I’m not impressed with how JJJ moves. He kinda lumbers around.
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#534 » by ddb » Mon Dec 2, 2019 2:45 pm

just throwing some thoughts on here. first of all, I love this team. Once Hayward is back they have a really good shot at coming together and making a strong push at the finals. Of course, they will need to guard the 3pt line better, and probably add a solid veteran or two to supplement the current bench....but the foundation is there. Kemba, Tatum, Hayward, Brown, Smart as your top 5 players is pretty special. Sure, the Bucks have Giannis and a lot of shooting around him. So they are very dangerous. Sure, Philly is big and has Embiid...but do you really trust Philly? Sure, Toronto is experienced and Siakam has developed into a star... Sure, Miami is playing well. But Boston has all the ingredients to get to the Finals. I think we are all a little too hard on Tatum & Brown. First of all, those guys are awesome. There isn't a team in the league that wouldn't LOVE to have those two guys. so enjoy them because neither one of them is going ANYWHERE in a trade anytime soon. Before the season started I thought Jaylen could be a guy that would be flipped. But he's signed now and playing very well.

As the trade market starts to take shape there are really only 2 bigs that I can think of that could make sense fo this team. Factoring in that Ainge most likely isn't moving a big salary core piece, that would mean that he's going to have to target bigs that are lower in salary.....very limited options. 2 guys I could see Boston being interested in: Harry Giles & Aron Baynes. But I'm not as concerned as most people about the Celtics current big man rotation. I think Kanter is filling a need with his post scoring and rebounding. He's finding his place on this team and I like him. Theis has been solid despite being undersized. Rob Williams shows flashes. Grant Williams I believe will get better as the season goes on. Adding Baynes would be nice but it's not as easy as you think. Ainge would need to either move Kanter & a 1st OR move Rob Williams/Semi/pick to make the deal work and worth it for the Suns. So the question then becomes, is Baynes worth it to Boston? ehhhhhh. IDK.
the guy I really want, and I've said this for about a year, is Harry Giles. Hear me out. He fits the mold that Danny likes. Big-time HS recruit. Still raw and loaded with talent. He plays for a team who's front office doesn't have the best track record of dealing....so could this be an opportunity to steal Giles before he proves his worth in this league? He's young, athletic, has upside, he's cheap, best buddies with Tatum.... I love the idea. He's the low risk, high upside big I want to see Boston target.
the OTHER need is it would be very nice to see Ainge score another wing that can light it up from 3. Davis Bertans type guy if he is available out there. Find someone like that.
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#535 » by sam_I_am » Mon Dec 2, 2019 6:16 pm

Gomes3PC wrote:
Wes-J wrote:
Gomes3PC wrote:Mind sharing the last team that didn't have a top 10 guy and won a title? Because Curry is definitely a top-10 guy, Durant when healthy is, Lebron duh. Having a top-10 guy is a necessary, not sufficient, requirement.


Uh yeah name dropping guys that have titles are a given but the others mentioned have not even made the finals. Bottomline I don't think it's as simple as that.

Of course it isn't, but the fact of the matter is we don't have a top 10 guy and nobody on the roster reasonably projects to that right now. Maybe Tatum if you really squint your eyes, but he's probably closer to a Paul George / Paul Pierce in his upside than a KG or Kawhi.


KG wasn’t top 10 or even top 20 in 2010 and yet the Celtics came very close. He was much closer to Al Horford than the Big Ticket that year.
"I think the criticism's stupid," Stevens said. "So I don't care. I'm with Jaylen (Brown) on that. Those two had achieved more than most 25 and 26 year olds ever had. I'd rather be in the mix and have my guts ripped out than suck."
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#536 » by ddb » Mon Dec 2, 2019 6:45 pm

sam_I_am wrote:
Gomes3PC wrote:
Wes-J wrote:
Uh yeah name dropping guys that have titles are a given but the others mentioned have not even made the finals. Bottomline I don't think it's as simple as that.

Of course it isn't, but the fact of the matter is we don't have a top 10 guy and nobody on the roster reasonably projects to that right now. Maybe Tatum if you really squint your eyes, but he's probably closer to a Paul George / Paul Pierce in his upside than a KG or Kawhi.


KG wasn’t top 10 or even top 20 in 2010 and yet the Celtics came very close. He was much closer to Al Horford than the Big Ticket that year.


Yes, Tatum is headed in the PG13/PP category which is a very good place to be for JT. KG was never quite the same again after his injury in 08-09. But he was still very good for the Celtics throughout the duration of his tenure.

JT has the potential to be a Top 10 player during his prime. No doubt about it. JB can be a Top 25-30. Kemba is a Top 20 player today. Hayward if he's back healthy is a Top 20-25 player as well. Danny needs to manage the cap so that they can sign Giannis in 2021 when he is a free agent. That's the next big play. Like the Warriors signing KD, Boston just needs to prove that they are the place to be for Giannis. and it's 2 seasons out so nobody break your neck wondering how it would be possible $$ wise.
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#537 » by Celts17Pride » Mon Dec 2, 2019 7:36 pm

Davis Bertrans is the guy I would love but his play might be making Washington think about keeping him.
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#538 » by 100proof » Mon Dec 2, 2019 8:17 pm

Celts17Pride wrote:Davis Bertrans is the guy I would love but his play might be making Washington think about keeping him.


Wizards have a few guys i wouldnt mind getting
Bryant (love to have him)
Wagner (intriguing)
Bertrans (interested)
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#539 » by Banks2Pierce » Mon Dec 2, 2019 8:51 pm

sam_I_am wrote:KG wasn’t top 10 or even top 20 in 2010 and yet the Celtics came very close. He was much closer to Al Horford than the Big Ticket that year.


He was probably 10th-ish at this time. It was when the baton was being passed to the next era where Dirk, KG, Duncan, and Kobe were still winning all of the titles.
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Re: Trade Ideas Thread, 2019-20 

Post#540 » by Banks2Pierce » Mon Dec 2, 2019 8:53 pm

Celts17Pride wrote:Davis Bertrans is the guy I would love but his play might be making Washington think about keeping him.


He's in the Mirotic/Tyreke zone where an expiring guy is not enough of an upgrade to give up a 1st for. Maybe for Milwaukee or something that are playing on the margins, but it would be a bad move for us to do it.

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