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return2glory wrote:If Ime is coach again next season, does it matter who we draft? What will the Celtics being looking at in draft pick with Ime? Someone who can sit well on the bench and cheer?
We have 2 back to back 1st round picks with the 14th overall and neither one gets any minutes.
return2glory wrote:If Ime is coach again next season, does it matter who we draft? What will the Celtics being looking at in draft pick with Ime? Someone who can sit well on the bench and cheer?
We have 2 back to back 1st round picks with the 14th overall and neither one gets any minutes.
CelticFaninLBC wrote:return2glory wrote:If Ime is coach again next season, does it matter who we draft? What will the Celtics being looking at in draft pick with Ime? Someone who can sit well on the bench and cheer?
We have 2 back to back 1st round picks with the 14th overall and neither one gets any minutes.
Might as well trade the pick.
Hal14 wrote:CelticFaninLBC wrote:return2glory wrote:If Ime is coach again next season, does it matter who we draft? What will the Celtics being looking at in draft pick with Ime? Someone who can sit well on the bench and cheer?
We have 2 back to back 1st round picks with the 14th overall and neither one gets any minutes.
Might as well trade the pick.
I wouldn't be surprised if we traded it.
Unless we get a top 5 or 10 pick, cause then you have a greater probability of the pick being a stud who can make a significant impact on a cheap rookie contract - then again, if it's a pick in the top 5 or 10, then we can get much more in return if we trade it..
BostonCouchGM wrote:Hal14 wrote:CelticFaninLBC wrote:
Might as well trade the pick.
I wouldn't be surprised if we traded it.
Unless we get a top 5 or 10 pick, cause then you have a greater probability of the pick being a stud who can make a significant impact on a cheap rookie contract - then again, if it's a pick in the top 5 or 10, then we can get much more in return if we trade it..
A lottery talent in this year’s draft could be a starter level player. I’m keeping it. Then again I’m never for trading picks because there’s always someone who can help. But as others have said, with Ime, will they even play?
Hal14 wrote:BostonCouchGM wrote:Hal14 wrote:I wouldn't be surprised if we traded it.
Unless we get a top 5 or 10 pick, cause then you have a greater probability of the pick being a stud who can make a significant impact on a cheap rookie contract - then again, if it's a pick in the top 5 or 10, then we can get much more in return if we trade it..
A lottery talent in this year’s draft could be a starter level player. I’m keeping it. Then again I’m never for trading picks because there’s always someone who can help. But as others have said, with Ime, will they even play?
I don't know. Starter level talent eventually - yes. But starter level talent immediately from day 1 as a rookie, I'm not so sure.
Some of the guys I have as lottery picks (Griffin, Wesley, Mathurin, Kendall Brown, etc.) would probably need some time to develop, adjust to NBA game - they'd probably have to come off the bench at first and work their way into minutes on a good team. Even guys like Johnny Davis, Eason and Ivey might not be ready to start right away on a good team.
There might only be 3 guys in this class who are no question about it, starters from day 1 on pretty much any team in the league (Chet, Paolo, Jabari).
We'll see, though. Still plenty of time left in the season - some of these guys outside of the top 3 might take more of a leap..
Then again, me saying this is less of an indictment on the guys in this year's draft class and more of just an observation of reality for any recent class. Look at this year's rookie class. For the most part, the top 10-15 teams in the NBA right now, none of them have rookies in the starting lineup - and the rookies who are starting, are all on bad teams. It's just the way it is..
The Hornets are barely over .500. They picked Bouknight 11th. Bouknight can't get any minutes their other than garbage time or half the team out with COVID. And it's not like he's a super young 19 yr old rookie - he's 21.
Hal14 wrote:BostonCouchGM wrote:Hal14 wrote:I wouldn't be surprised if we traded it.
Unless we get a top 5 or 10 pick, cause then you have a greater probability of the pick being a stud who can make a significant impact on a cheap rookie contract - then again, if it's a pick in the top 5 or 10, then we can get much more in return if we trade it..
A lottery talent in this year’s draft could be a starter level player. I’m keeping it. Then again I’m never for trading picks because there’s always someone who can help. But as others have said, with Ime, will they even play?
I don't know. Starter level talent eventually - yes. But starter level talent immediately from day 1 as a rookie, I'm not so sure.
Some of the guys I have as lottery picks (Griffin, Wesley, Mathurin, Kendall Brown, etc.) would probably need some time to develop, adjust to NBA game - they'd probably have to come off the bench at first and work their way into minutes on a good team. Even guys like Johnny Davis, Eason and Ivey might not be ready to start right away on a good team.
There might only be 3 guys in this class who are no question about it, starters from day 1 on pretty much any team in the league (Chet, Paolo, Jabari).
We'll see, though. Still plenty of time left in the season - some of these guys outside of the top 3 might take more of a leap..
Then again, me saying this is less of an indictment on the guys in this year's draft class and more of just an observation of reality for any recent class. Look at this year's rookie class. For the most part, the top 10-15 teams in the NBA right now, none of them have rookies in the starting lineup - and the rookies who are starting, are all on bad teams. It's just the way it is..
The Hornets are barely over .500. They picked Bouknight 11th. Bouknight can't get any minutes their other than garbage time or half the team out with COVID. And it's not like he's a super young 19 yr old rookie - he's 21.
Hal14 wrote:-What position does he play? His skill set is more of a wing, but I don't think he's quick enough to play the wing in the NBA. He's skinny, lacks physicality, good but not great rebounder, below average rim protection so not sure about him playing PF. He's kind of like a tweener, in between the 3 and the 4 spot.
Hal14 wrote:-His advanced stats so far this season (net rating, PER, TS%, assist to turnover rate) are pretty bad. This tells me that while he's scoring points, he might be an empty stats kind of guy
Hal14 wrote:-Not loving the body language. Often times has a pouty face or will flail his arms about when he or a teammate has a call go against them
Hal14 wrote:-Might be the worst defender in this draft class, which goes along with point above about poor net rating this season
-Really upright, doesn't really get down in his stance defensively and doesn't get down low enough when handling the ball (obviously makes it easier for defender to steal it from him, makes it so he has less control of the ball)
BostonCouchGM wrote:I'm not at all interested. I get the appeal. Legit 6'10" and shoots 40% from three. And at least one of these stretch bigs seems to be taken in the first half of the 1st round each year but I don't want it to be us. He seems to lack maturity from the footage I've seen. Very low BBIQ. It could just be boredom but it's a turnoff to me. There's plenty of talent that should be available at the 4 for us at our pick where we don't need to take a project with issues.
Dogen wrote:Celtics win despite Smart having -1 points for the game.
Scoonie wrote:I like both AJ Griffin and Mark WIlliams from Duke. Both played very well in their win over Louisville this afternoon.
AJ Griffin (former Celtic Adrian Griffin's son) is a 6'6 bull of a Small Forward, very strong, long arms, good defender, and really good 3-point shooter (5-5 3 PT against Louisville today). Tons of upside. If he keeps playing like he did today, he'll be a lottery pick. Had injury problems his last two years of high school and hasn't played a ton of basketball, but definitely seems to have a pro game. Looked like the best player on the court for much of the game today.
Mark Williams is a 6'11/7'0 athletic Center, not quite as explosive as Robert Williams, but similar type of game in that he can jump, finishes lobs, blocks shots, gets rebounds, and can actually hit the mid-range open jumper a little as well. Doesn't put up huge scoring numbers, but would give us a 2nd athletic Center to play behind TimeLord and start when TimeLord is injured (which is often). He seems underrated to me, and right now is mostly projected as a late 1st round pick. He had 14 points, 11 rebounds, and 2 blocks against Louisville today and played well down the stretch when they retook and extended their lead.
Scoonie wrote:I like both AJ Griffin and Mark WIlliams from Duke. Both played very well in their win over Louisville this afternoon.
AJ Griffin (former Celtic Adrian Griffin's son) is a 6'6 bull of a Small Forward, very strong, long arms, good defender, and really good 3-point shooter (5-5 3 PT against Louisville today). Tons of upside. If he keeps playing like he did today, he'll be a lottery pick. Had injury problems his last two years of high school and hasn't played a ton of basketball, but definitely seems to have a pro game. Looked like the best player on the court for much of the game today.
Mark Williams is a 6'11/7'0 athletic Center, not quite as explosive as Robert Williams, but similar type of game in that he can jump, finishes lobs, blocks shots, gets rebounds, and can actually hit the mid-range open jumper a little as well. Doesn't put up huge scoring numbers, but would give us a 2nd athletic Center to play behind TimeLord and start when TimeLord is injured (which is often). He seems underrated to me, and right now is mostly projected as a late 1st round pick. He had 14 points, 11 rebounds, and 2 blocks against Louisville today and played well down the stretch when they retook and extended their lead.
Hal14 wrote:Scoonie wrote:I like both AJ Griffin and Mark WIlliams from Duke. Both played very well in their win over Louisville this afternoon.
AJ Griffin (former Celtic Adrian Griffin's son) is a 6'6 bull of a Small Forward, very strong, long arms, good defender, and really good 3-point shooter (5-5 3 PT against Louisville today). Tons of upside. If he keeps playing like he did today, he'll be a lottery pick. Had injury problems his last two years of high school and hasn't played a ton of basketball, but definitely seems to have a pro game. Looked like the best player on the court for much of the game today.
Mark Williams is a 6'11/7'0 athletic Center, not quite as explosive as Robert Williams, but similar type of game in that he can jump, finishes lobs, blocks shots, gets rebounds, and can actually hit the mid-range open jumper a little as well. Doesn't put up huge scoring numbers, but would give us a 2nd athletic Center to play behind TimeLord and start when TimeLord is injured (which is often). He seems underrated to me, and right now is mostly projected as a late 1st round pick. He had 14 points, 11 rebounds, and 2 blocks against Louisville today and played well down the stretch when they retook and extended their lead.
They're good. but Griffin is likely going in the top 6 or 7 picks. very slim chance we get a pick that high.
we're lightly picking in the 13-18 range. Williams will likely be available then but i doubt we pick a center that high, with the continued emergence of rob and how the team is saying they consider him part of the future core alongside Tatum/Brown.
playa-hater wrote:Hal14 wrote:Scoonie wrote:I like both AJ Griffin and Mark WIlliams from Duke. Both played very well in their win over Louisville this afternoon.
AJ Griffin (former Celtic Adrian Griffin's son) is a 6'6 bull of a Small Forward, very strong, long arms, good defender, and really good 3-point shooter (5-5 3 PT against Louisville today). Tons of upside. If he keeps playing like he did today, he'll be a lottery pick. Had injury problems his last two years of high school and hasn't played a ton of basketball, but definitely seems to have a pro game. Looked like the best player on the court for much of the game today.
Mark Williams is a 6'11/7'0 athletic Center, not quite as explosive as Robert Williams, but similar type of game in that he can jump, finishes lobs, blocks shots, gets rebounds, and can actually hit the mid-range open jumper a little as well. Doesn't put up huge scoring numbers, but would give us a 2nd athletic Center to play behind TimeLord and start when TimeLord is injured (which is often). He seems underrated to me, and right now is mostly projected as a late 1st round pick. He had 14 points, 11 rebounds, and 2 blocks against Louisville today and played well down the stretch when they retook and extended their lead.
They're good. but Griffin is likely going in the top 6 or 7 picks. very slim chance we get a pick that high.
we're lightly picking in the 13-18 range. Williams will likely be available then but i doubt we pick a center that high, with the continued emergence of rob and how the team is saying they consider him part of the future core alongside Tatum/Brown.
don't know enough to agree or disagree but maybe some players can rise up and push Griffen down to us.
Dogen wrote:Celtics win despite Smart having -1 points for the game.
Scoonie wrote:Mark Williams is a 6'11/7'0 athletic Center, not quite as explosive as Robert Williams, but similar type of game in that he can jump, finishes lobs, blocks shots, gets rebounds, and can actually hit the mid-range open jumper a little as well. Doesn't put up huge scoring numbers, but would give us a 2nd athletic Center to play behind TimeLord and start when TimeLord is injured (which is often). He seems underrated to me, and right now is mostly projected as a late 1st round pick. He had 14 points, 11 rebounds, and 2 blocks against Louisville today and played well down the stretch when they retook and extended their lead.
Smart2Nesmith43 wrote:Scoonie wrote:Mark Williams is a 6'11/7'0 athletic Center, not quite as explosive as Robert Williams, but similar type of game in that he can jump, finishes lobs, blocks shots, gets rebounds, and can actually hit the mid-range open jumper a little as well. Doesn't put up huge scoring numbers, but would give us a 2nd athletic Center to play behind TimeLord and start when TimeLord is injured (which is often). He seems underrated to me, and right now is mostly projected as a late 1st round pick. He had 14 points, 11 rebounds, and 2 blocks against Louisville today and played well down the stretch when they retook and extended their lead.
If the Celtics are looking for a discount version of Robert Williams they should also give a good look at Ismäel Kamagate (which I think they will considering he's Begarin's teammate and they should have more inside info). 6'11 with a 7'3 wingspan and pretty mobile. He can get lost in space a little and his pick and roll defense is a bit raw but if you're willing to invest a couple years on ironing out the kinks he can became a positive on that end. Down the line I think he'll even be able to do a decent job on switches. He is a very good roll man, runs the floor hard and I promise you'll never have to worry about him going up soft.
Here's the highlights of his best defensive game of the year which does a good job of highlighting what he can do on that end:
And here's what he can do on offense when he has room to roll and when he kept Wembanyama the number one prospect in the 2023 class in foul trouble all game:
Just turned 21 so not the youngest guy out there but I think that he still has a lot of untapped potential. He started playing fairly late I think like 13. He used to be a goalkeeper in football and he stopped because he became too tall and kept hitting his head on the crossbar. He has had a meteoric rise since then, not too long ago he was still playing in the fifth division in France. His coach raves about his work ethic. He has been a regular at the French national team camps since serving as a sparing partner before the olympic games last year. The staff kept talking about how fast he picks things up. On top of that, his skill set is a bit more versatile than what he's allowed to show in games. He can knock down mid range jumpers and even makes threes in practice (might never translate to games but still better than missing them). 71% from the line so clearly the shot isn't broken.
He almost never has the ball in his hand because the coach runs a dumb offense but on the rare occasions when he's allowed to playmake the result are usually decent. Every three games or so, on the short roll, he'll throw a laser to the shooting pocket of a teammate in the corner and it does leave you wondering how consistenly he could do that if he wasn't being held back by his coach. Every interview when he's asked like who do you look up to in the NBA ? Bam. Who do you model your game after ? Bam. So he clearly has the self awareness to know what kind of player he is and can become. Add his physical tools and his work ethic and there's a good player there down the line.
Half-Full wrote:Smart2Nesmith43 wrote:Scoonie wrote:Mark Williams is a 6'11/7'0 athletic Center, not quite as explosive as Robert Williams, but similar type of game in that he can jump, finishes lobs, blocks shots, gets rebounds, and can actually hit the mid-range open jumper a little as well. Doesn't put up huge scoring numbers, but would give us a 2nd athletic Center to play behind TimeLord and start when TimeLord is injured (which is often). He seems underrated to me, and right now is mostly projected as a late 1st round pick. He had 14 points, 11 rebounds, and 2 blocks against Louisville today and played well down the stretch when they retook and extended their lead.
If the Celtics are looking for a discount version of Robert Williams they should also give a good look at Ismäel Kamagate (which I think they will considering he's Begarin's teammate and they should have more inside info). 6'11 with a 7'3 wingspan and pretty mobile. He can get lost in space a little and his pick and roll defense is a bit raw but if you're willing to invest a couple years on ironing out the kinks he can became a positive on that end. Down the line I think he'll even be able to do a decent job on switches. He is a very good roll man, runs the floor hard and I promise you'll never have to worry about him going up soft.
Here's the highlights of his best defensive game of the year which does a good job of highlighting what he can do on that end:
And here's what he can do on offense when he has room to roll and when he kept Wembanyama the number one prospect in the 2023 class in foul trouble all game:
Just turned 21 so not the youngest guy out there but I think that he still has a lot of untapped potential. He started playing fairly late I think like 13. He used to be a goalkeeper in football and he stopped because he became too tall and kept hitting his head on the crossbar. He has had a meteoric rise since then, not too long ago he was still playing in the fifth division in France. His coach raves about his work ethic. He has been a regular at the French national team camps since serving as a sparing partner before the olympic games last year. The staff kept talking about how fast he picks things up. On top of that, his skill set is a bit more versatile than what he's allowed to show in games. He can knock down mid range jumpers and even makes threes in practice (might never translate to games but still better than missing them). 71% from the line so clearly the shot isn't broken.
He almost never has the ball in his hand because the coach runs a dumb offense but on the rare occasions when he's allowed to playmake the result are usually decent. Every three games or so, on the short roll, he'll throw a laser to the shooting pocket of a teammate in the corner and it does leave you wondering how consistenly he could do that if he wasn't being held back by his coach. Every interview when he's asked like who do you look up to in the NBA ? Bam. Who do you model your game after ? Bam. So he clearly has the self awareness to know what kind of player he is and can become. Add his physical tools and his work ethic and there's a good player there down the line.
Thanks for sharing this. He certainly looks interesting, and as you say, the Celtics should be well aware of him.