"A Nation Divided, Sports United" ~ The Equality & Other Issues Thread

[CavemanDoctor]

Sorry but that's BS. You're getting very close to victim-shaming. Inner city students think the police are their enemy because the police, at alarming rates, act like their enemy. Not the other way around.

What you attack or fight a police officer you are not a victim you are a criminal. Stop making it sound like police go into poor neighborhoods, round up all the black people and execute them.

What is the alarming rate that police act like the enemy? What percentage of the time do police officers violate someone's civil rights verse help the situation? Are you saying police should just stay out of the ghetto all together? Would that make it a safer place?

Attack or fight a police officer? Huh?

And like truth said, this isn't only happening in inner cities.

[theman]

But there are many, many other issues, starting with the fact that policemen are taught to profile racially. If they see a Black kid in a White neighborhood they are trained to be suspicious. The racism is systemic, not just a trait of individual police officers.

It goes the other way too. White guy in a black neighborhood must be looking for drugs.

[truth18]

But there are many, many other issues, starting with the fact that policemen are taught to profile racially. If they see a Black kid in a White neighborhood they are trained to be suspicious. The racism is systemic, not just a trait of individual police officers.

It goes the other way too. White guy in a black neighborhood must be looking for drugs.

Precisely. Solving this issue as best we can only helps all of us.

You've made a great first step towards stopping binary thinking/argunent.

[OFWGKTA]

But there are many, many other issues, starting with the fact that policemen are taught to profile racially. If they see a Black kid in a White neighborhood they are trained to be suspicious. The racism is systemic, not just a trait of individual police officers.

It goes the other way too. White guy in a black neighborhood must be looking for drugs.

Um...who says that?

[truth18]

But there are many, many other issues, starting with the fact that policemen are taught to profile racially. If they see a Black kid in a White neighborhood they are trained to be suspicious. The racism is systemic, not just a trait of individual police officers.

It goes the other way too. White guy in a black neighborhood must be looking for drugs.

Um...who says that?

Lots of people. Including the police. If a white friend and I are standing on a North Philly corner the cops slow down and size us up because it "looks wrong" or whatever bs justification they have.

The police profile everyone. Training reform is needed to to bottom.

[OFWGKTA]

It goes the other way too. White guy in a black neighborhood must be looking for drugs.

Um...who says that?

Lots of people. Including the police. If a white friend and I are standing on a North Philly corner the cops slow down and size us up because it "looks wrong" or whatever bs justification they have.

Isn't that a result of racial discrimination against black people regardless though? It's a preconceived notion that the only reason a white person would be in a black neighborhood would be to buy drugs.

[truth18]

Um...who says that?

Lots of people. Including the police. If a white friend and I are standing on a North Philly corner the cops slow down and size us up because it "looks wrong" or whatever bs justification they have.

Isn't that a result of racial discrimination against black people regardless though? It's a preconceived notion that the only reason a white person would be in a black neighborhood would be to buy drugs.

Sure, but we are discussing police profiling. They profile white people too, man.

There is a huge disproportion between police brutality against people of color, particularly black people, but it still occurs in every community.

Again, trying to solve this issue helps everyone, including the police and white people.

[threrf23]

What you attack or fight a police officer you are not a victim you are a criminal. Stop making it sound like police go into poor neighborhoods, round up all the black people and execute them.

What is the alarming rate that police act like the enemy? What percentage of the time do police officers violate someone's civil rights verse help the situation? Are you saying police should just stay out of the ghetto all together? Would that make it a safer place?

And what is the alarming rate at which police officers are attacked, fought against, or ambushed? I suppose those who plot to kill honorable police officers should get a free pass, because they are the exception and not the rule?

Is this your argument?

[OFWGKTA]

Lots of people. Including the police. If a white friend and I are standing on a North Philly corner the cops slow down and size us up because it "looks wrong" or whatever bs justification they have.

Isn't that a result of racial discrimination against black people regardless though? It's a preconceived notion that the only reason a white person would be in a black neighborhood would be to buy drugs.

Sure, but we are discussing police profiling. They profile white people too, man.

There is a huge disproportion between police brutality against people of color, particularly black people, but it still occurs in every community.

Again, trying to solve this issue helps everyone, including the police and white people.

I agree solving the issue will help everyone, but I still feel it's a poor example. Granted, I've experienced a **** ton of white privilege imo, and have no doubt I would have been arrested on multiple occasions if I wasn't white so I already feel I have it very easy.


edit: Though my dad almost got arrested once when he went to the accident scene where my mom had a seizure while driving because the officer thought he was drunk due to his stutter.

[truth18]

Isn't that a result of racial discrimination against black people regardless though? It's a preconceived notion that the only reason a white person would be in a black neighborhood would be to buy drugs.

Sure, but we are discussing police profiling. They profile white people too, man.

There is a huge disproportion between police brutality against people of color, particularly black people, but it still occurs in every community.

Again, trying to solve this issue helps everyone, including the police and white people.

I agree solving the issue will help everyone, but I still feel it's a poor example. Granted, I've experienced a **** ton of white privilege imo, and have no doubt I would have been arrested on multiple occasions if I wasn't white so I already feel I have it very easy.


edit: Though my dad almost got arrested once when he went to the accident scene where my mom had a seizure while driving because the officer thought he was drunk due to his stutter.

It's a very poor example but at least he admitted police profiling is a thing. It's the first step towards changing how one thinks about this and we should be encouraging that in theman.

[OFWGKTA]

Sure, but we are discussing police profiling. They profile white people too, man.

There is a huge disproportion between police brutality against people of color, particularly black people, but it still occurs in every community.

Again, trying to solve this issue helps everyone, including the police and white people.

I agree solving the issue will help everyone, but I still feel it's a poor example. Granted, I've experienced a **** ton of white privilege imo, and have no doubt I would have been arrested on multiple occasions if I wasn't white so I already feel I have it very easy.


edit: Though my dad almost got arrested once when he went to the accident scene where my mom had a seizure while driving because the officer thought he was drunk due to his stutter.

It's a very poor example but at least he admitted police profiling is a thing. It's the first step towards changing how one thinks about this and we should be encouraging that in theman.

I see it more as a marginalization of the issue than any sort of progress. This is a subject that can no longer be denied fully by anyone trying to be taken seriously, and I think it's been made abundantly clear how he truly feels from these last couple pages of posts. Every one of them boils down to black people being at fault for the circumstances they're in with a splash of subtly. He admitted there is profiling, but he has also implied that it is justified.

[Andrew McCeltic]

Sorry but that's BS. You're getting very close to victim-shaming. Inner city students think the police are their enemy because the police, at alarming rates, act like their enemy. Not the other way around.

What you attack or fight a police officer you are not a victim you are a criminal. Stop making it sound like police go into poor neighborhoods, round up all the black people and execute them.

What is the alarming rate that police act like the enemy? What percentage of the time do police officers violate someone's civil rights verse help the situation? Are you saying police should just stay out of the ghetto all together? Would that make it a safer place?

Attack or fight a police officer? Huh?

And like truth said, this isn't only happening in inner cities.

Panicking or balking at aggressive policing, as psychological responses, are different from "attacking".

Anyone read the DOJ reports on Ferguson or Baltimore? Jeff Sessions magically waved them away as "politicized", but there are some pretty damning examples. Cavity searching a woman with a broken tail light was one. And in Ferguson, cops were way more likely to stop black motorists to search for drugs, even though their own data showed that white people, stopped less often, were more likely to have them.

Policing of black communities falls victim to, I think, self-fulfilling prophecy.

[Andrew McCeltic]

What you attack or fight a police officer you are not a victim you are a criminal. Stop making it sound like police go into poor neighborhoods, round up all the black people and execute them.

What is the alarming rate that police act like the enemy? What percentage of the time do police officers violate someone's civil rights verse help the situation? Are you saying police should just stay out of the ghetto all together? Would that make it a safer place?

And what is the alarming rate at which police officers are attacked, fought against, or ambushed? I suppose those who plot to kill honorable police officers should get a free pass, because they are the exception and not the rule?

Is this your argument?

I found a stat a few months ago that blew my mind.. if you look at the frequency with which cops are killed in the line of duty, it's actually a safer profession than TRUCKING and FARMING. It's a stressful job, and there is risk involved, but the conversations on this topic make it seem like police are uniquely endangered, that they're all men scared not to come home to their wives and children - and it's true, being an accountant is safer. But being a police officer is a relatively "safe" job, which also suggests something about the violence they encounter at work, that it's more often "resistance" or demonstration than danger.

[truth18]

I agree solving the issue will help everyone, but I still feel it's a poor example. Granted, I've experienced a **** ton of white privilege imo, and have no doubt I would have been arrested on multiple occasions if I wasn't white so I already feel I have it very easy.


edit: Though my dad almost got arrested once when he went to the accident scene where my mom had a seizure while driving because the officer thought he was drunk due to his stutter.

It's a very poor example but at least he admitted police profiling is a thing. It's the first step towards changing how one thinks about this and we should be encouraging that in theman.

I see it more as a marginalization of the issue than any sort of progress. This is a subject that can no longer be denied fully by anyone trying to be taken seriously, and I think it's been made abundantly clear how he truly feels from these last couple pages of posts. Every one of them boils down to black people being at fault for the circumstances they're in with a splash of subtly. He admitted there is profiling, but he has also implied that it is justified.

So how do we change his mind?

[OFWGKTA]

It's a very poor example but at least he admitted police profiling is a thing. It's the first step towards changing how one thinks about this and we should be encouraging that in theman.

I see it more as a marginalization of the issue than any sort of progress. This is a subject that can no longer be denied fully by anyone trying to be taken seriously, and I think it's been made abundantly clear how he truly feels from these last couple pages of posts. Every one of them boils down to black people being at fault for the circumstances they're in with a splash of subtly. He admitted there is profiling, but he has also implied that it is justified.

So how do we change his mind?

I've been typing and deleting things for 45 minutes, I will have to get back to this when I can focus on making a coherent post instead of a jumbled up mess of my thoughts. The short answer is I don't know though.

[fallguy]

If the problem is disproportionately bad treatment (not just violence) of minority communities by police and institutions and the solution offered is "take more personal responsibility" and "don't be scared of cops" the first thing to address is the massive empathy gap.

[claycarver]

What you attack or fight a police officer you are not a victim you are a criminal. Stop making it sound like police go into poor neighborhoods, round up all the black people and execute them.

What is the alarming rate that police act like the enemy? What percentage of the time do police officers violate someone's civil rights verse help the situation? Are you saying police should just stay out of the ghetto all together? Would that make it a safer place?

And what is the alarming rate at which police officers are attacked, fought against, or ambushed? I suppose those who plot to kill honorable police officers should get a free pass, because they are the exception and not the rule?

Is this your argument?

I found a stat a few months ago that blew my mind.. if you look at the frequency with which cops are killed in the line of duty, it's actually a safer profession than TRUCKING and FARMING. It's a stressful job, and there is risk involved, but the conversations on this topic make it seem like police are uniquely endangered, that they're all men scared not to come home to their wives and children - and it's true, being an accountant is safer. But being a police officer is a relatively "safe" job, which also suggests something about the violence they encounter at work, that it's more often "resistance" or demonstration than danger.

This sounds almost exactly like the other side. "Unarmed black people are far more likely to be killed by young black men than they are the police." There was a link earlier to the Washington Post reporting that there were 16 killings of unarmed black men by police last year.

What I'm hearing is that there's more FEAR of being killed on both sides than the stats bear out.

[theman]

Consistent enforcement and severe punishment for bodycam misconduct or incompetence

Who else would like to see more body cam use simply for the eventual entertainment value once they appear on youtube? Dash cam videos are great, imagine all the drunk chicanery that would be caught on body cams.

[kyphi]

Spoiler:

Consistent enforcement and severe punishment for bodycam misconduct or incompetence

Who else would like to see more body cam use simply for the eventual entertainment value once they appear on youtube? Dash cam videos are great, imagine all the drunk chicanery that would be caught on body cams.

Now you are moving the goalpost. Anyone with even a minute amount of empathy realizes it was not right to leave Brown's body in the middle of a neighborhood street for four hours. It was on St. Louis's stations almost the entire time. How some of these towns inside of St. Louis County got (get) their money stinks.

[fallguy]

And what is the alarming rate at which police officers are attacked, fought against, or ambushed? I suppose those who plot to kill honorable police officers should get a free pass, because they are the exception and not the rule?

Is this your argument?

I found a stat a few months ago that blew my mind.. if you look at the frequency with which cops are killed in the line of duty, it's actually a safer profession than TRUCKING and FARMING. It's a stressful job, and there is risk involved, but the conversations on this topic make it seem like police are uniquely endangered, that they're all men scared not to come home to their wives and children - and it's true, being an accountant is safer. But being a police officer is a relatively "safe" job, which also suggests something about the violence they encounter at work, that it's more often "resistance" or demonstration than danger.

This sounds almost exactly like the other side. "Unarmed black people are far more likely to be killed by young black men than they are the police." There was a link earlier to the Washington Post reporting that there were 16 killings of unarmed black men by police last year.

What I'm hearing is that there's more FEAR of being killed on both sides than the stats bear out.

It's not just about being killed. It's about harassment of all sorts.

To ignore this is to obfuscate.