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2023 NBA Draft – Thurs, 8PM, June 22

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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#641 » by Dogen » Thu Apr 20, 2023 4:04 am

Hal14 wrote:
Dogen wrote:
cl2117 wrote:Even if he does make it out of the 1st round, he seems like a classic Spurs picks and they'll be picking ahead of us regardless of whether we're 33 or 35.

I'd see if we could use Yam's rights to move up even a spot or two to snag him. Upside is well worth it.


The Yam ship has sailed, methinks. He didn't come over after summer league, and if he had, he'd be behind Payton Pritchard, who isn't even in the rotation. And it seems the team likes Davison.

I don't know if I'd go that far. He didn't come to training camp last year, because what would be the point? We had a stacked back court with JB, smart, white and brogdon. Plus Pritchard as the 5th guy, who was getting rotation minutes in the NBA finals.

Yam is obviously gonna just stay overseas (where he's been the starting PG for a good EuroLeague team, playing for the GOAT europe basketball coach) until he has a realistic shot at making the roster and possibly even competing for some minutes.

We're all assuming Pritchard gets traded this offseason. I would think JD probably gets that roster spot. BUT i wouldn't be surpised if Yam gets it and JD stays on a 2-way next season.

Yam's case for getting the spot over JD is simple. Yam has 5 years experience playing pro ball, he's 2 years older and he's a 40% shooter from 3, whereas JD has 1 year experience playing pro ball, he's 2 years younger and is a 30% shooter from 3. Yam's game is more mature, more polished.

With that being said, JD obviously has higher upside. He's got a stronger build, much more athletic. But if we need a guy to fill the role Pritchard had this season (get spot mins off the bench, don't turn the ball over, don't make mistakes, hit open shots, move the ball, hold your own on D), Mazzulla might trust Yam in that role more.

Summer league will be interesting. I assume Yam and JD will both be on the team. As well as Begarin and Champagnie..


I hope he does come to summer league again. He's eligible, correct? It would be year three.

The roster crunch is the issue. Yeah if the team decides to move Pritchard (which seems to be what he wants) then that at least can open up some regular season minutes behind Smart, Brogdon and White. JD gets bumped down the pecking order, as it were. He's got got the athleticism and some skills but in limited minutes does not look quite ready. I'm obviously a believer in his upside (see profile pic).

Question I have is if Madar wants to be here. It's been very quiet since he had that injury and finished with summer league. If he has developed his game and body, he really looked like a player that can come in, play pesky defense, set the table and hit the open three.

I'm seeing more news about Madar not being in a rush to come over than "I wanna be in Boston": https://celticswire.usatoday.com/2022/09/16/nba-boston-celtics-madar-abroad/
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#642 » by Bill Lumbergh » Thu Apr 20, 2023 4:51 am

I'm just getting started with the draft, but I do like Tubelis. Think he's maybe getting undervalued a bit. He's quite a fluid athlete for his size. Sidy Cissoko was the first guy I liked after seeing his videos, but, I agree that he'll likely be gone before we pick. Positionally, I suppose I'd like a 3-4 or a 4-5 who can shoot. I'm not crazy about our backup options at the 4 at present. I kinda like Brown at the 2 and Tatum at the 3, so we're bigger than most teams. Otoh, I love having White in the lineup, too. I don't really think we need to draft a PG. We're set at the 2, too, and White can play some 3. Malcolm can a little bit, too, though that's not ideal. Yeah, so, a biggish 3-4 wing, or a developmental big for me.
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#643 » by cl2117 » Thu Apr 20, 2023 7:17 am

Dogen wrote:
Hal14 wrote:
Dogen wrote:
The Yam ship has sailed, methinks. He didn't come over after summer league, and if he had, he'd be behind Payton Pritchard, who isn't even in the rotation. And it seems the team likes Davison.

I don't know if I'd go that far. He didn't come to training camp last year, because what would be the point? We had a stacked back court with JB, smart, white and brogdon. Plus Pritchard as the 5th guy, who was getting rotation minutes in the NBA finals.

Yam is obviously gonna just stay overseas (where he's been the starting PG for a good EuroLeague team, playing for the GOAT europe basketball coach) until he has a realistic shot at making the roster and possibly even competing for some minutes.

We're all assuming Pritchard gets traded this offseason. I would think JD probably gets that roster spot. BUT i wouldn't be surpised if Yam gets it and JD stays on a 2-way next season.

Yam's case for getting the spot over JD is simple. Yam has 5 years experience playing pro ball, he's 2 years older and he's a 40% shooter from 3, whereas JD has 1 year experience playing pro ball, he's 2 years younger and is a 30% shooter from 3. Yam's game is more mature, more polished.

With that being said, JD obviously has higher upside. He's got a stronger build, much more athletic. But if we need a guy to fill the role Pritchard had this season (get spot mins off the bench, don't turn the ball over, don't make mistakes, hit open shots, move the ball, hold your own on D), Mazzulla might trust Yam in that role more.

Summer league will be interesting. I assume Yam and JD will both be on the team. As well as Begarin and Champagnie..


I hope he does come to summer league again. He's eligible, correct? It would be year three.

The roster crunch is the issue. Yeah if the team decides to move Pritchard (which seems to be what he wants) then that at least can open up some regular season minutes behind Smart, Brogdon and White. JD gets bumped down the pecking order, as it were. He's got got the athleticism and some skills but in limited minutes does not look quite ready. I'm obviously a believer in his upside (see profile pic).

Question I have is if Madar wants to be here. It's been very quiet since he had that injury and finished with summer league. If he has developed his game and body, he really looked like a player that can come in, play pesky defense, set the table and hit the open three.

I'm seeing more news about Madar not being in a rush to come over than "I wanna be in Boston": https://celticswire.usatoday.com/2022/09/16/nba-boston-celtics-madar-abroad/

This is why I think it makes the most sense to trade his rights in pursuit of another draft and stash guy.

I've got JD as having higher upside, but it doesn't really matter which guy ends up taking Pritchard's role because as we've seen this year, it's not a significant one. Even if one of our main guards gets injured for extended periods I think the role that would be carved out for them is still pretty marginal and non-existent in the playoffs.

Send Yam to a team that'd actually bring him over and give him a chance for minutes even if it's for peanuts. Spurs are a great example. Rebuilding team, minutes at the guard, swap 33/35 and Yam for 32. Jump up to snag best draft and stash guy available and reset the clock (ideally Coulibaly). Could try with basically anyone in the early 30's and see if they jump at that.
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#644 » by Dogen » Thu Apr 20, 2023 7:51 am

cl2117 wrote:
Dogen wrote:
Hal14 wrote:I don't know if I'd go that far. He didn't come to training camp last year, because what would be the point? We had a stacked back court with JB, smart, white and brogdon. Plus Pritchard as the 5th guy, who was getting rotation minutes in the NBA finals.

Yam is obviously gonna just stay overseas (where he's been the starting PG for a good EuroLeague team, playing for the GOAT europe basketball coach) until he has a realistic shot at making the roster and possibly even competing for some minutes.

We're all assuming Pritchard gets traded this offseason. I would think JD probably gets that roster spot. BUT i wouldn't be surpised if Yam gets it and JD stays on a 2-way next season.

Yam's case for getting the spot over JD is simple. Yam has 5 years experience playing pro ball, he's 2 years older and he's a 40% shooter from 3, whereas JD has 1 year experience playing pro ball, he's 2 years younger and is a 30% shooter from 3. Yam's game is more mature, more polished.

With that being said, JD obviously has higher upside. He's got a stronger build, much more athletic. But if we need a guy to fill the role Pritchard had this season (get spot mins off the bench, don't turn the ball over, don't make mistakes, hit open shots, move the ball, hold your own on D), Mazzulla might trust Yam in that role more.

Summer league will be interesting. I assume Yam and JD will both be on the team. As well as Begarin and Champagnie..


I hope he does come to summer league again. He's eligible, correct? It would be year three.

The roster crunch is the issue. Yeah if the team decides to move Pritchard (which seems to be what he wants) then that at least can open up some regular season minutes behind Smart, Brogdon and White. JD gets bumped down the pecking order, as it were. He's got got the athleticism and some skills but in limited minutes does not look quite ready. I'm obviously a believer in his upside (see profile pic).

Question I have is if Madar wants to be here. It's been very quiet since he had that injury and finished with summer league. If he has developed his game and body, he really looked like a player that can come in, play pesky defense, set the table and hit the open three.

I'm seeing more news about Madar not being in a rush to come over than "I wanna be in Boston": https://celticswire.usatoday.com/2022/09/16/nba-boston-celtics-madar-abroad/

This is why I think it makes the most sense to trade his rights in pursuit of another draft and stash guy.

I've got JD as having higher upside, but it doesn't really matter which guy ends up taking Pritchard's role because as we've seen this year, it's not a significant one. Even if one of our main guards gets injured for extended periods I think the role that would be carved out for them is still pretty marginal and non-existent in the playoffs.

Send Yam to a team that'd actually bring him over and give him a chance for minutes even if it's for peanuts. Spurs are a great example. Rebuilding team, minutes at the guard, swap 33/35 and Yam for 32. Jump up to snag best draft and stash guy available and reset the clock (ideally Coulibaly). Could try with basically anyone in the early 30's and see if they jump at that.


Yam is worth more than moving up one spot in the second round, no?

Spurs and Celtics have been pretty equitable trade partners, I doubt they'd try to extract a pick unless from us the player at 32 is one they really want, in which case they'd probably just take it and forgo the trade.
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#645 » by cl2117 » Thu Apr 20, 2023 9:03 am

Dogen wrote:
cl2117 wrote:
Dogen wrote:
I hope he does come to summer league again. He's eligible, correct? It would be year three.

The roster crunch is the issue. Yeah if the team decides to move Pritchard (which seems to be what he wants) then that at least can open up some regular season minutes behind Smart, Brogdon and White. JD gets bumped down the pecking order, as it were. He's got got the athleticism and some skills but in limited minutes does not look quite ready. I'm obviously a believer in his upside (see profile pic).

Question I have is if Madar wants to be here. It's been very quiet since he had that injury and finished with summer league. If he has developed his game and body, he really looked like a player that can come in, play pesky defense, set the table and hit the open three.

I'm seeing more news about Madar not being in a rush to come over than "I wanna be in Boston": https://celticswire.usatoday.com/2022/09/16/nba-boston-celtics-madar-abroad/

This is why I think it makes the most sense to trade his rights in pursuit of another draft and stash guy.

I've got JD as having higher upside, but it doesn't really matter which guy ends up taking Pritchard's role because as we've seen this year, it's not a significant one. Even if one of our main guards gets injured for extended periods I think the role that would be carved out for them is still pretty marginal and non-existent in the playoffs.

Send Yam to a team that'd actually bring him over and give him a chance for minutes even if it's for peanuts. Spurs are a great example. Rebuilding team, minutes at the guard, swap 33/35 and Yam for 32. Jump up to snag best draft and stash guy available and reset the clock (ideally Coulibaly). Could try with basically anyone in the early 30's and see if they jump at that.


Yam is worth more than moving up one spot in the second round, no?

Spurs and Celtics have been pretty equitable trade partners, I doubt they'd try to extract a pick unless from us the player at 32 is one they really want, in which case they'd probably just take it and forgo the trade.

In a vacuum yes, in reality maybe not. He was the 47th pick two years ago, value hasn't changed much since then realistically.

One spot is probably a bit rich but if its an either/or proposition in terms of getting your guy, it'd be worth it (e.g. Spurs like Bilal at 32, so you gotta really incentivize them to move off it). You gotta give up something to move up and Yam is at the bottom end of the totem pole in terms of our trade chips since our own seconds have been traded away or are projected to be in the 50's and likely don't move the needle at all.

It's more of an equitable trade if its 35 and Yam for 32 but either way I'm fine losing some marginal value to convert those assets into a higher upside lottery ticket.
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#646 » by cl2117 » Thu Apr 20, 2023 9:39 am

The other option with Yam that I think makes sense is using him and cash to just straight buy a high 30's pick.

Hornets are notoriously cheap and have #34 as well as 2 first rounders (#4 pre lottery and #27) and two other 2nds (#39 and #41). There is no way they make all those picks. Last year they sold #35 to the Lakers for cash and a distant future 2nd. I could see them running that back this year for #34 if we ponied up the cash and Yam. Or even just straight cash for one of the later 2nds that is then used to move up from #33/35.

If we land at #35 instead of #33, then the Pacers get #32 from Houston. They've already got 3 first rounders (#7 pre lottery, #26 and #29) plus #55. Again, zero chance they make all those picks. Cash and Yam for #32 and maybe we can double dip on early 30's guys.
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#647 » by 165bows » Thu Apr 20, 2023 10:23 am

cl2117 wrote:
Dogen wrote:
cl2117 wrote:This is why I think it makes the most sense to trade his rights in pursuit of another draft and stash guy.

I've got JD as having higher upside, but it doesn't really matter which guy ends up taking Pritchard's role because as we've seen this year, it's not a significant one. Even if one of our main guards gets injured for extended periods I think the role that would be carved out for them is still pretty marginal and non-existent in the playoffs.

Send Yam to a team that'd actually bring him over and give him a chance for minutes even if it's for peanuts. Spurs are a great example. Rebuilding team, minutes at the guard, swap 33/35 and Yam for 32. Jump up to snag best draft and stash guy available and reset the clock (ideally Coulibaly). Could try with basically anyone in the early 30's and see if they jump at that.


Yam is worth more than moving up one spot in the second round, no?

Spurs and Celtics have been pretty equitable trade partners, I doubt they'd try to extract a pick unless from us the player at 32 is one they really want, in which case they'd probably just take it and forgo the trade.

In a vacuum yes, in reality maybe not. He was the 47th pick two years ago, value hasn't changed much since then realistically.

One spot is probably a bit rich but if its an either/or proposition in terms of getting your guy, it'd be worth it (e.g. Spurs like Bilal at 32, so you gotta really incentivize them to move off it). You gotta give up something to move up and Yam is at the bottom end of the totem pole in terms of our trade chips since our own seconds have been traded away or are projected to be in the 50's and likely don't move the needle at all.

It's more of an equitable trade if its 35 and Yam for 32 but either way I'm fine losing some marginal value to convert those assets into a higher upside lottery ticket.

Yam’s shooting as far as I can tell has dramatically improved, at least in what is publicly available. All of his publicly available stats show he was a <30% three point shooter before he was drafted, and has been over 40% from three for two years now. I don’t think he’s got great value but I think he makes sense on a team like Miami or the Lakers that are going to have a guy like Butler or Lebron do a ton of ball handling and can get away with a Pritchard-like 1/2 combo guard who’s more of a two on offense and one on defense.

He also seems a lot like Pritchard in that he is small as a defender but Yam seems like even more of a high-effort, 94-foot ballhawk kind of guy when you watch him.
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#648 » by Smart2Nesmith43 » Thu Apr 20, 2023 11:55 am

cl2117 wrote:The other option with Yam that I think makes sense is using him and cash to just straight buy a high 30's pick.

Hornets are notoriously cheap and have #34 as well as 2 first rounders (#4 pre lottery and #27) and two other 2nds (#39 and #41). There is no way they make all those picks. Last year they sold #35 to the Lakers for cash and a distant future 2nd. I could see them running that back this year for #34 if we ponied up the cash and Yam. Or even just straight cash for one of the later 2nds that is then used to move up from #33/35.

If we land at #35 instead of #33, then the Pacers get #32 from Houston instead. They've already got 3 first rounders (#7 pre lottery, #26 and #29) plus #55. Again, zero chance they make all those picks. Cash and Yam for #32 and maybe we can double dip on early 30's guys.

I don't disagree with your overall point but it was Orlando that traded 35 last year (after picking at 1 and 32). The Magic is already picking twice in the lottery and their roster is pretty full of young guys that need playing time already so I doubt they are looking to hold on to their second rounder (#36) this year either. Probably another candidate if the Celtics want to follow your plan to double dip.
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#649 » by cl2117 » Thu Apr 20, 2023 1:00 pm

165bows wrote:
cl2117 wrote:
Dogen wrote:
Yam is worth more than moving up one spot in the second round, no?

Spurs and Celtics have been pretty equitable trade partners, I doubt they'd try to extract a pick unless from us the player at 32 is one they really want, in which case they'd probably just take it and forgo the trade.

In a vacuum yes, in reality maybe not. He was the 47th pick two years ago, value hasn't changed much since then realistically.

One spot is probably a bit rich but if its an either/or proposition in terms of getting your guy, it'd be worth it (e.g. Spurs like Bilal at 32, so you gotta really incentivize them to move off it). You gotta give up something to move up and Yam is at the bottom end of the totem pole in terms of our trade chips since our own seconds have been traded away or are projected to be in the 50's and likely don't move the needle at all.

It's more of an equitable trade if its 35 and Yam for 32 but either way I'm fine losing some marginal value to convert those assets into a higher upside lottery ticket.

Yam’s shooting as far as I can tell has dramatically improved, at least in what is publicly available. All of his publicly available stats show he was a <30% three point shooter before he was drafted, and has been over 40% from three for two years now. I don’t think he’s got great value but I think he makes sense on a team like Miami or the Lakers that are going to have a guy like Butler or Lebron do a ton of ball handling and can get away with a Pritchard-like 1/2 combo guard who’s more of a two on offense and one on defense.
He also seems a lot like Pritchard in that he is small as a defender but Yam seems like even more of a high-effort, 94-foot ballhawk kind of guy when you watch him.

I may well be underrating Yam's value, my knowledge of him is mostly from his thread on here and the occasional tidbit you see on twitter. From my understanding on it though I'd peg his value as being a 2nd round pick still and so if we're looking to make any moves in the draft, even minor ones, he'd be arguably the best tool outside of Pritchard (who I'd want a much more significant return on). With him being on the older side (22) and with a lower ceiling due to physical limitations (PP feels like an apt comparison), I'd still be keen on swapping him out for a higher upside ticket.

I could see that as a role/fit for him. Not sure he'd be ready for it but I guess the same could be said about Austin Reaves until recently so you never know. I guess the real issue is that those teams just don't have picks in the range that I'm looking at. Maybe the Clippers at #30?

Smart2Nesmith43 wrote:I don't disagree with your overall point but it was Orlando that traded 35 last year (after picking at 1 and 32). The Magic is already picking twice in the lottery and their roster is pretty full of young guys that need playing time already so I doubt they are looking to hold on to their second rounder (#36) this year either. Probably another candidate if the Celtics want to follow your plan to double dip.

Ah yeah you're right that was Orlando. Hornets were the ones who did that ugly trade with Detroit for a future Milwaukee pick in exchange for Duren.
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#650 » by Hal14 » Thu Apr 20, 2023 1:14 pm

Dogen wrote:
Hal14 wrote:
Dogen wrote:
The Yam ship has sailed, methinks. He didn't come over after summer league, and if he had, he'd be behind Payton Pritchard, who isn't even in the rotation. And it seems the team likes Davison.

I don't know if I'd go that far. He didn't come to training camp last year, because what would be the point? We had a stacked back court with JB, smart, white and brogdon. Plus Pritchard as the 5th guy, who was getting rotation minutes in the NBA finals.

Yam is obviously gonna just stay overseas (where he's been the starting PG for a good EuroLeague team, playing for the GOAT europe basketball coach) until he has a realistic shot at making the roster and possibly even competing for some minutes.

We're all assuming Pritchard gets traded this offseason. I would think JD probably gets that roster spot. BUT i wouldn't be surpised if Yam gets it and JD stays on a 2-way next season.

Yam's case for getting the spot over JD is simple. Yam has 5 years experience playing pro ball, he's 2 years older and he's a 40% shooter from 3, whereas JD has 1 year experience playing pro ball, he's 2 years younger and is a 30% shooter from 3. Yam's game is more mature, more polished.

With that being said, JD obviously has higher upside. He's got a stronger build, much more athletic. But if we need a guy to fill the role Pritchard had this season (get spot mins off the bench, don't turn the ball over, don't make mistakes, hit open shots, move the ball, hold your own on D), Mazzulla might trust Yam in that role more.

Summer league will be interesting. I assume Yam and JD will both be on the team. As well as Begarin and Champagnie..


I hope he does come to summer league again. He's eligible, correct? It would be year three.

You can be in year 10 and still play in summer league. The only restriction is with 2-way contracts - you can only be on one if you have 3 or less years of NBA experience.

Summer league is typically for guys with less years of NBA experience. Typically all rookies play, and only 2nd or 3rd year guys who haven't gotten consistent rotation mins yet in the NBA. But it could be any player (even a 28 year old guy) who has bounced in and out of the NBA, played overseas, and is a fringe NBA guy who's trying to make a training camp roster). Yam has literally no NBA experience and is still just 21 yrs old. I would think he'll play for us this summer.

As for Yam's trade value, I really don't think he has much of it. No one is gonna want to trade for a small/skinny PG who got drafted 3 yrs ago but still hasn't played in an NBA game and has put up good (but not great) numbers overseas. I mean, if he was over in Europe dominating, then sure, he'd have some trade value. But at this point, he would just be a throw-in for a trade, imo. Mine as well keep him. Or, if he asks the celtics to release his draft rights so he can sign with a bad team (one where he could actually compete for meaningful minutes) they may do that, or just include him in a trade to a bad team..

It's tough for a young, unproven guy to make it on a team as good and as deep as the celtics. Pritchard, Madar, Begarin, Champagnie, whoever we draft this year. It's a tough road for these guys. But it's a good problem to have if you're the celtics - to be so good and so deep that you can't find playing time for everyone.
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#651 » by 165bows » Thu Apr 20, 2023 4:26 pm

Hal14 wrote:
Dogen wrote:
Hal14 wrote:I don't know if I'd go that far. He didn't come to training camp last year, because what would be the point? We had a stacked back court with JB, smart, white and brogdon. Plus Pritchard as the 5th guy, who was getting rotation minutes in the NBA finals.

Yam is obviously gonna just stay overseas (where he's been the starting PG for a good EuroLeague team, playing for the GOAT europe basketball coach) until he has a realistic shot at making the roster and possibly even competing for some minutes.

We're all assuming Pritchard gets traded this offseason. I would think JD probably gets that roster spot. BUT i wouldn't be surpised if Yam gets it and JD stays on a 2-way next season.

Yam's case for getting the spot over JD is simple. Yam has 5 years experience playing pro ball, he's 2 years older and he's a 40% shooter from 3, whereas JD has 1 year experience playing pro ball, he's 2 years younger and is a 30% shooter from 3. Yam's game is more mature, more polished.

With that being said, JD obviously has higher upside. He's got a stronger build, much more athletic. But if we need a guy to fill the role Pritchard had this season (get spot mins off the bench, don't turn the ball over, don't make mistakes, hit open shots, move the ball, hold your own on D), Mazzulla might trust Yam in that role more.

Summer league will be interesting. I assume Yam and JD will both be on the team. As well as Begarin and Champagnie..


I hope he does come to summer league again. He's eligible, correct? It would be year three.

You can be in year 10 and still play in summer league. The only restriction is with 2-way contracts - you can only be on one if you have 3 or less years of NBA experience.

Summer league is typically for guys with less years of NBA experience. Typically all rookies play, and only 2nd or 3rd year guys who haven't gotten consistent rotation mins yet in the NBA. But it could be any player (even a 28 year old guy) who has bounced in and out of the NBA, played overseas, and is a fringe NBA guy who's trying to make a training camp roster). Yam has literally no NBA experience and is still just 21 yrs old. I would think he'll play for us this summer.

As for Yam's trade value, I really don't think he has much of it. No one is gonna want to trade for a small/skinny PG who got drafted 3 yrs ago but still hasn't played in an NBA game and has put up good (but not great) numbers overseas. I mean, if he was over in Europe dominating, then sure, he'd have some trade value. But at this point, he would just be a throw-in for a trade, imo. Mine as well keep him. Or, if he asks the celtics to release his draft rights so he can sign with a bad team (one where he could actually compete for meaningful minutes) they may do that, or just include him in a trade to a bad team..

It's tough for a young, unproven guy to make it on a team as good and as deep as the celtics. Pritchard, Madar, Begarin, Champagnie, whoever we draft this year. It's a tough road for these guys. But it's a good problem to have if you're the celtics - to be so good and so deep that you can't find playing time for everyone.

J. Jackson I think was 27 this past summer playing for Boston.
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#652 » by Hal14 » Thu Apr 20, 2023 4:27 pm

165bows wrote:
Hal14 wrote:
Dogen wrote:
I hope he does come to summer league again. He's eligible, correct? It would be year three.

You can be in year 10 and still play in summer league. The only restriction is with 2-way contracts - you can only be on one if you have 3 or less years of NBA experience.

Summer league is typically for guys with less years of NBA experience. Typically all rookies play, and only 2nd or 3rd year guys who haven't gotten consistent rotation mins yet in the NBA. But it could be any player (even a 28 year old guy) who has bounced in and out of the NBA, played overseas, and is a fringe NBA guy who's trying to make a training camp roster). Yam has literally no NBA experience and is still just 21 yrs old. I would think he'll play for us this summer.

As for Yam's trade value, I really don't think he has much of it. No one is gonna want to trade for a small/skinny PG who got drafted 3 yrs ago but still hasn't played in an NBA game and has put up good (but not great) numbers overseas. I mean, if he was over in Europe dominating, then sure, he'd have some trade value. But at this point, he would just be a throw-in for a trade, imo. Mine as well keep him. Or, if he asks the celtics to release his draft rights so he can sign with a bad team (one where he could actually compete for meaningful minutes) they may do that, or just include him in a trade to a bad team..

It's tough for a young, unproven guy to make it on a team as good and as deep as the celtics. Pritchard, Madar, Begarin, Champagnie, whoever we draft this year. It's a tough road for these guys. But it's a good problem to have if you're the celtics - to be so good and so deep that you can't find playing time for everyone.

J. Jackson I think was 27 this past summer playing for Boston.

Exactly. And he had been in the league for like 7 years. But he played summer league cause he was a fringe NBA guy who didn't have a contract.
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#653 » by 165bows » Thu Apr 20, 2023 5:04 pm

cl2117 wrote:The other option with Yam that I think makes sense is using him and cash to just straight buy a high 30's pick.

Hornets are notoriously cheap and have #34 as well as 2 first rounders (#4 pre lottery and #27) and two other 2nds (#39 and #41). There is no way they make all those picks. Last year they sold #35 to the Lakers for cash and a distant future 2nd. I could see them running that back this year for #34 if we ponied up the cash and Yam. Or even just straight cash for one of the later 2nds that is then used to move up from #33/35.

If we land at #35 instead of #33, then the Pacers get #32 from Houston. They've already got 3 first rounders (#7 pre lottery, #26 and #29) plus #55. Again, zero chance they make all those picks. Cash and Yam for #32 and maybe we can double dip on early 30's guys.

Could do #33 to Charlotte for 2/3 of 34/39/41. Or to OKC for 35/37. Or Magic have 36 and a bunch of future seconds (including most of Boston's looks like lol) so could get a future pick back.

Memphis also seems to love dropping back and doing generally some pretty specific maneuvering so maybe #25 would be in play for some combo of #33 and some of the deeper Celtics' assets mentioned.

Edit: or a bit of a stretch but Portland has depth/salary issues, so maybe Pritchard, #33 etc could get into the conversation for #23.
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#654 » by Hal14 » Thu Apr 20, 2023 9:34 pm

Ok, I've been going down a rabbit hole last couple of days watching Aliou Diarra film.

First off, he might be a little bit of a reach at the 33 or 35 spot. But there's something about him. I just got a feeling that he's got a chance to be REALLY good.

Reasons why he might be a reach (and might be a guy we just try and target as an UDFA) is:

-Undersized center at 6'9", 192 lbs
-Old for a draft prospect (21...turns 22 in December)
-Doesn't shoot 3's

Closest comps for Diarra are Isaiah Jackson and Nic Claxton. Diarra has lots of similarities (size, skill set, strengths, weaknesses) to Jackson and Claxton. But Jackson was 2 yrs younger when he was drafted and Claxton was 1 year younger. As a result, Jackson was picked 22nd and Claxton was picked 31st. It also helped Jackson and Claxton that they played in the SEC (Jackson at Kentucky, Claxton at Georgia) so that helped them get more exposure and scouts have a better understanding of what the level of competition is in the SEC.

But Diarra is older than them and is under the radar, playing in the Africa pro league. So he might be a long shot to get drafted. And if he does get drafted, it'll probably be mid to late 2nd round. So again, might be a reach for us at 33 or 35.

But I'm telling you, there's just something about this guy. He's probably the fastest, most athletic big man in the draft.

Averaging 18 PPG, 13 RPG, 2 BPG, 2 SPG in a pro league against grown men at age 21.

Here's his highlights. He's number 15:


Now, let's look at some actual game film.

:51 has the ball out on the perimeter. Closely guarded by opposing big. Takes him off the dribble, attacks the basket. Takes it strong to the rim, strong finish over the defender's contest. Shows quickness and ability to handle the ball
1:03 out on an island defensively, defending a wing. Decent defense, forces him baseline. Just a really good move and finish by the offensive player - just tip your hat to him
1:11 roll man, finds the open spot in the defense, in dunker's spot. Strong, powerful, athletic finish with the dunk
1:20 out on the perimeter, beyond the 3 pt line. But does nice job moving without the ball, cuts in towards the basket. Catches it in the lane. Really nice up-fake to get the defender in the air, which gives himself an easy layup
1:42 runs the floor very well (fast and fluid), strong, powerful, athletic with the put-back dunk
2:20 scores here on 2 defenders. So active, so quick for a big man, has some skill and polish, not that raw
3:15 the offensive player hits a TOUGH shot here, but it was a very good contest by Diarra. He switched out onto the perimeter and closed out really well, getting as close as humanly possibly on the contest, without fouling
3:53 shows good hustle and quickness to get the loose ball. Then turns and hits the jumper from the FT line



2:41 wow. Finds open spot in the defense, catches it, makes the shot, through a ton of contact, and-1
2:51 look how fast and how fluid he runs up the floor
3:01 soft touch on the shot inside. And no wasted motion. Just catches it and immediately shoots it - was already getting himself squared up and ready to shoot before catching the pass
3:53 the length and the tenacity here, gets the deflection which results in a steal for his team
4:33 calls for the ball in the mid post area, around the FT line, even though his man is draped all over him. Catches the pass, 1 dribble, takes it strong to the rim, strong finish through contact for the and-1
6:36 rolls to the rim, after the guard throws the lob pass up there, Diarra jumps up in the air, while in mid-air turns his body towards the hoop, catches the ball and throws it down - all in 1 fluid motion.
7:28 another crazy lob dunk. Hell of an athlete!
7:50 another lob finish, this guy is a machine
;pp=ygUec3RhZGUgbWFsaWVuIGJhc2tldGJhbGwgdnMgYWJj


:23 oh man, you just knew when the ball went up there, that Diarra was gonna go get it and make the put-back. He's so quick, so tenacious on the boards. Such a good finisher around the basket.
:35 catches it in the mid range area. Looks around, surveys the floor. Doesn't see an open teammate in a scoring position so hits the mid range J.
3:41 nice switchability here. Defends out on the perimeter, stays with the driver, contests the shot closely (without fouling) and forces him to miss the shot badly
3:56 draws 2 defenders in the post - kicks it to the open shooter, who hits the 3
4:08 again, you just knew when the shot went up that Diarra was gonna go and get the rebound. He uses those long arms to snag it, takes 1 dribble, turns and hits the mid range baby hook shot
4:17 look at how freaking quick Diarra moves as he runs up the floor here. Good lord. And he doesn't even look like he's trying to run his fastest. Like this is only 3/4 speed for him, cause he knows his teammate has a wide open layup
4:27 nice tip-out with those long arms - leads to a 3 for his teammate
4:37 man, this guy is a freak. Runs the floor like a deer, throws down the lob dunk, crazy athleticism and length
5:05 Look at how damn quick and nimble he is going after this rebound. And also the way he reads where the ball is going to come off the rim to know where he should go for the rebound. Then, the monster finish at the rim, through contact.
5:21 again, look at the way he runs the floor. So quick and so fluid with the way he runs. Beats everyone down the floor, catches it and lays it in for the easy transition bucket
5:46 my lord. This guy is a freak. Anytime a teammate misses a shot, this dude always seems to get the put-back. So active, such a high motor, he's always going hard, always making plays.
6:54 another strong, powerful, athletic lob finish for Diarra
7:40 nice job here. He gets the ball but isn't in scoring position, doesn't have a good angle to the hoop so he scans the floor and quickly moves the ball to the open man, resulting in an open 3 for a teammate
8:08 another lob finish. Not an easy finish at all, as the defender jumps up to contest it and very nearly blocks the shot



:37 good athleticism and tenacity on the put-back dunk
4:23 over-helps here and leaves his man open for the 3
4:36 slips the screen, rolls to the rim, catch and finish at the rim. Smooth
4:44 his long arms and good leaping ability, along with good timing, help to get the rebound over everyone else
4:47 again, runs the floor so fast - beats everyone else down the floor, results in an easy dunk
4:56 shot goes up, guess who's gonna get the rebound? Diarra, of course! Again, we see how good he is at reading the ball coming off the rim to know where it's gonna go - he hustles to the spot and uses those long arms to grab the rebound. Then, with no wasted motion, takes 1 dribble along the baseline and lays it in on the other side of the hoop. This guy is GOOD
5:18 again, he over-helps here and leaves his man too much space to shoot the 3. That seems to be something he needs to work on a little bit
5:48 nice job here hitting the open man. Then his teammate shoots it. Guess who gets the rebound? Diarra! Again, nice job reading the ball off the rim to go to where the ball is headed - uses those long arms to grab the board. Then no wasted motion - just goes right up with the put-back shot, using nice touch on the shot to get it in
6:10 my god, this guy is a freak. They say the hardest shot to rebound is an airball - you can't read it off the rim cause it doesn't hit the rim. But guess who reads where this ball is going perfectly and comes up with the rebound? Diarra! Goes after this board, 1 dribble, up-fake and slams home the put-back dunk like an animal.
6:19 nice defense here out on the perimeter. The offensive player makes a really shifty move to the basket but Diarra defends it well, and forces the missed shot
7:41 hesitates here with the pump fake, but you like that he is still able to know down the jumper from the FT line


The guys in the league he's playing in aren't very big/strong and the league doesn't appear to be that physical. With Diarra being so skinny, he might struggle with the size/physicality of the NBA a little bit. But I think once he adjusts to the NBA game and can hopefully get a little bigger/stronger with more time in the weight room, he should be alright.

We see a few plays in these vids where he finishes strong through contact, so I think he'll handle physicality well - especially if he can bulk up a little bit more.

Look, all I'm saying is he might be the fastest big man in the NBA. And he's a monster on the boards - and rebounding has been an issue for us at times this season.

How good of a rebounder is he? He had a 24.5% rebounding % which is insane. And a 6.3% blocks % which is crazy high for an international player. His PER, offensive rating and defensive ratings are also extremely good.
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#655 » by djFan71 » Fri Apr 21, 2023 12:13 am

Bilal's in (for now):
https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/36244098/bilal-coulibaly-joins-teammate-victor-wembanyama-nba-draft

"I'm taking things one after the other," Coulibaly said. "After the season, I'll go to Dallas, where my agency is based in the U.S., to work out and prepare, with my mindset on the fact that I will be staying in the draft. I'll discuss with my agents after and see what we decide.
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#656 » by djFan71 » Fri Apr 21, 2023 12:56 am

^^^ Kinda feels like a make me a promise or there are really high odds I'll be first round and I stay in sort of thing.
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#657 » by Hal14 » Fri Apr 21, 2023 1:49 am

It'd probably be a reach to take him at 33 or 35, but would be pumped if we snag Coleman Hawkins as an UDFA.

Then again, if it appears likely that he'll go undrafted, he'll probably withdraw his name and go back to school..
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#658 » by bigfoot_cryptozoology » Fri Apr 21, 2023 2:10 am

I don't want the Celtics to get Diarrhea...
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#659 » by 165bows » Fri Apr 21, 2023 2:25 pm

Hal14 wrote:
Dogen wrote:
Hal14 wrote:I don't know if I'd go that far. He didn't come to training camp last year, because what would be the point? We had a stacked back court with JB, smart, white and brogdon. Plus Pritchard as the 5th guy, who was getting rotation minutes in the NBA finals.

Yam is obviously gonna just stay overseas (where he's been the starting PG for a good EuroLeague team, playing for the GOAT europe basketball coach) until he has a realistic shot at making the roster and possibly even competing for some minutes.

We're all assuming Pritchard gets traded this offseason. I would think JD probably gets that roster spot. BUT i wouldn't be surpised if Yam gets it and JD stays on a 2-way next season.

Yam's case for getting the spot over JD is simple. Yam has 5 years experience playing pro ball, he's 2 years older and he's a 40% shooter from 3, whereas JD has 1 year experience playing pro ball, he's 2 years younger and is a 30% shooter from 3. Yam's game is more mature, more polished.

With that being said, JD obviously has higher upside. He's got a stronger build, much more athletic. But if we need a guy to fill the role Pritchard had this season (get spot mins off the bench, don't turn the ball over, don't make mistakes, hit open shots, move the ball, hold your own on D), Mazzulla might trust Yam in that role more.

Summer league will be interesting. I assume Yam and JD will both be on the team. As well as Begarin and Champagnie..


I hope he does come to summer league again. He's eligible, correct? It would be year three.

You can be in year 10 and still play in summer league. The only restriction is with 2-way contracts - you can only be on one if you have 3 or less years of NBA experience.

Summer league is typically for guys with less years of NBA experience. Typically all rookies play, and only 2nd or 3rd year guys who haven't gotten consistent rotation mins yet in the NBA. But it could be any player (even a 28 year old guy) who has bounced in and out of the NBA, played overseas, and is a fringe NBA guy who's trying to make a training camp roster). Yam has literally no NBA experience and is still just 21 yrs old. I would think he'll play for us this summer.

As for Yam's trade value, I really don't think he has much of it. No one is gonna want to trade for a small/skinny PG who got drafted 3 yrs ago but still hasn't played in an NBA game and has put up good (but not great) numbers overseas. I mean, if he was over in Europe dominating, then sure, he'd have some trade value. But at this point, he would just be a throw-in for a trade, imo. Mine as well keep him. Or, if he asks the celtics to release his draft rights so he can sign with a bad team (one where he could actually compete for meaningful minutes) they may do that, or just include him in a trade to a bad team..

It's tough for a young, unproven guy to make it on a team as good and as deep as the celtics. Pritchard, Madar, Begarin, Champagnie, whoever we draft this year. It's a tough road for these guys. But it's a good problem to have if you're the celtics - to be so good and so deep that you can't find playing time for everyone.

I think you might have made a strong call on M. Gueye. Was randomly looking at mocks. He's not that high currently but I think he fits what this team likes in their second round picks so far under Brad - athletes with high upside and skill but need refinement in the areas of the game that improve the most (or most improvable, let me say), like shooting and decision making. Seems like he's got the size/length/athleticism/defensive versatility potential combo with some glimmer of all around ball skills that just need work.

Wouldn't surprise me at all if they took that guy or slid back a hair and got an extra pick for the future from one of these teams that wants to consolidate and took him, and put him on the two-way train.
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Re: 2023 NBA Draft 

Post#660 » by Hal14 » Fri Apr 21, 2023 3:11 pm

A swiss army knife wing. Can slash to the rim, handle the ball, shoot it, defend, hit the open man. Likes to push the pace, get out and run in transition.

6'6", good athleticism. He's only 19.

Would probably be a reach at 33 or 35, but someone to keep an eye on as an UDFA.

Perhaps too much overlap with him, Begarin and Champagnie, though. Have the 3 of them battle it out in summer league haha

Nothing wrong with having a different opinion - as long as it's done respectfully. It'd be lame if we all agreed on everything :)

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