Trade Thread 2017: Not Once, Not twice, But Thrice!

[cl2117]

I'd worry about Lavine being empty offense. Not saying he is, but just from the outside looking in, he seems like might be one of those guys who is an offensive stud, but doesn't have the same impact on winning as he does on the boxscore if that makes sense. Kind of like the reverse Marcus Smart (impacts winning, but doesn't light up the box score).

That being said he could also be an absolute stud as he continues to develop. Crazy athleticism, scores in a myriad of ways, has the body to play good defense.

I think I'd still rather ride with Jae because he's better suited to help us win sooner rather than later, while I think Lavine would be great but would go with Brown/BKN picks as far as our new development plan and puts us further away from the "1 piece and we're a contender" spot we're in now.

The same could have been said about IT when Danny first acquired him. It's all about the fit in our offense. He can create his own shot and I think that's something we are desperately missing. Bradley, Crowder, Smart, KO.. all sort of the same offensive players. Can't create, sparingly get inside the paint, and depend on he kick out 3. Also, everything move has to be made with a long term vision. I don't think that "1 piece" you mention is available. In order for us to be a contender off 1 addition, that's going to have to be a super elite player.

Yeah I see how Lavine fits better for our offense, but still don't see how he gets us closer to a championship sooner than keeping Jae would. I think that super-elite player would be that offensive spark that we need, so rather than trading Jae for an offensive spark and still be searching for a super-elite player to take us over the top, why not just keep Jae and keep looking?

If we were committing to keeping the BKN picks and building around them and Brown while staying competitive for a couple years with IT/Bradley/Horford, then Lavine fits better. But I'm not there yet. I think it's an option if everything falls through, but I'd still like to hold out hope that we can make one of those trades for a super-elite player. No there isn't one currently available, but that can always change. Alternatively you could swing a deal for a pair of elite (but not SUPER) players like Butler and Whiteside and you're set.

Unless you see Lavine as on the road to being that level of player, which I don't doubt he could become, but I wouldn't count on it.

[Edug27]

I'd worry about Lavine being empty offense. Not saying he is, but just from the outside looking in, he seems like might be one of those guys who is an offensive stud, but doesn't have the same impact on winning as he does on the boxscore if that makes sense. Kind of like the reverse Marcus Smart (impacts winning, but doesn't light up the box score).

That being said he could also be an absolute stud as he continues to develop. Crazy athleticism, scores in a myriad of ways, has the body to play good defense.

I think I'd still rather ride with Jae because he's better suited to help us win sooner rather than later, while I think Lavine would be great but would go with Brown/BKN picks as far as our new development plan and puts us further away from the "1 piece and we're a contender" spot we're in now.

The same could have been said about IT when Danny first acquired him. It's all about the fit in our offense. He can create his own shot and I think that's something we are desperately missing. Bradley, Crowder, Smart, KO.. all sort of the same offensive players. Can't create, sparingly get inside the paint, and depend on he kick out 3. Also, everything move has to be made with a long term vision. I don't think that "1 piece" you mention is available. In order for us to be a contender off 1 addition, that's going to have to be a super elite player.

Yeah I see how Lavine fits better for our offense, but still don't see how he gets us closer to a championship sooner than keeping Jae would. I think that super-elite player would be that offensive spark that we need, so rather than trading Jae for an offensive spark and still be searching for a super-elite player to take us over the top, why not just keep Jae and keep looking?

If we were committing to keeping the BKN picks and building around them and Brown while staying competitive for a couple years with IT/Bradley/Horford, then Lavine fits better. But I'm not there yet. I think it's an option if everything falls through, but I'd still like to hold out hope that we can make one of those trades for a super-elite player. No there isn't one currently available, but that can always change. Alternatively you could swing a deal for a pair of elite (but not SUPER) players like Butler and Whiteside and you're set.

Unless you see Lavine as on the road to being that level of player, which I don't doubt he could become, but I wouldn't count on it.

1. LaVine is younger.
2. LaVine has a higher ceiling
3. LaVine will be a better trade chip IMO if an elite player were to hit the market.
4. IMO that's absolutely the plan. Compete as a top 3 team in the East while rebuilding through the draft.

[165bows]

I'd worry about Lavine being empty offense. Not saying he is, but just from the outside looking in, he seems like might be one of those guys who is an offensive stud, but doesn't have the same impact on winning as he does on the boxscore if that makes sense. Kind of like the reverse Marcus Smart (impacts winning, but doesn't light up the box score).

That being said he could also be an absolute stud as he continues to develop. Crazy athleticism, scores in a myriad of ways, has the body to play good defense.

I think I'd still rather ride with Jae because he's better suited to help us win sooner rather than later, while I think Lavine would be great but would go with Brown/BKN picks as far as our new development plan and puts us further away from the "1 piece and we're a contender" spot we're in now.

The same could have been said about IT when Danny first acquired him. It's all about the fit in our offense. He can create his own shot and I think that's something we are desperately missing. Bradley, Crowder, Smart, KO.. all sort of the same offensive players. Can't create, sparingly get inside the paint, and depend on he kick out 3. Also, everything move has to be made with a long term vision. I don't think that "1 piece" you mention is available. In order for us to be a contender off 1 addition, that's going to have to be a super elite player.

Yeah I see how Lavine fits better for our offense, but still don't see how he gets us closer to a championship sooner than keeping Jae would. I think that super-elite player would be that offensive spark that we need, so rather than trading Jae for an offensive spark and still be searching for a super-elite player to take us over the top, why not just keep Jae and keep looking?

If we were committing to keeping the BKN picks and building around them and Brown while staying competitive for a couple years with IT/Bradley/Horford, then Lavine fits better. But I'm not there yet. I think it's an option if everything falls through, but I'd still like to hold out hope that we can make one of those trades for a super-elite player. No there isn't one currently available, but that can always change. Alternatively you could swing a deal for a pair of elite (but not SUPER) players like Butler and Whiteside and you're set.

Unless you see Lavine as on the road to being that level of player, which I don't doubt he could become, but I wouldn't count on it.

Plus Lavine is going to cost twice as much over the life of Jae's contract. Maybe even more.

[cl2117]

The same could have been said about IT when Danny first acquired him. It's all about the fit in our offense. He can create his own shot and I think that's something we are desperately missing. Bradley, Crowder, Smart, KO.. all sort of the same offensive players. Can't create, sparingly get inside the paint, and depend on he kick out 3. Also, everything move has to be made with a long term vision. I don't think that "1 piece" you mention is available. In order for us to be a contender off 1 addition, that's going to have to be a super elite player.

Yeah I see how Lavine fits better for our offense, but still don't see how he gets us closer to a championship sooner than keeping Jae would. I think that super-elite player would be that offensive spark that we need, so rather than trading Jae for an offensive spark and still be searching for a super-elite player to take us over the top, why not just keep Jae and keep looking?

If we were committing to keeping the BKN picks and building around them and Brown while staying competitive for a couple years with IT/Bradley/Horford, then Lavine fits better. But I'm not there yet. I think it's an option if everything falls through, but I'd still like to hold out hope that we can make one of those trades for a super-elite player. No there isn't one currently available, but that can always change. Alternatively you could swing a deal for a pair of elite (but not SUPER) players like Butler and Whiteside and you're set.

Unless you see Lavine as on the road to being that level of player, which I don't doubt he could become, but I wouldn't count on it.

1. LaVine is younger.
2. LaVine has a higher ceiling
3. LaVine will be a better trade chip IMO if an elite player were to hit the market.
4. IMO that's absolutely the plan. Compete as a top 3 team in the East while rebuilding through the draft.

1. Doesn't help us get closer to championship sooner

2. Fair enough, but he's got a ways to go to develop into that player (if he does)

3. Also fair, but I'm not trying to trade Crowder for an elite player. I'm trying to add an elite player to a team that can benefit from Crowder's amazing deal and glue presence

4. That's a reasonable approach, but as I said I'm not there yet. Still holding out hope that with luck from BKN we'd have the trade firepower to strike a deal for someone to take us over the top. We can always come back to that approach and divest ourselves of the likes of Crowder/IT/Bradley over the course of the next year if that's the path we are pushed down. I don't think Lavine is the only young talent we could get for Crowder given his bargain deal and high floor of play. I'm down to keep waiting to see how things fall with at least hte BKN '17 pick and see if any unexpected names come on the market (AD, PG, Love, Aldridge, someone else).

[CelticFaninLBC]

Boston's very likely to draft an impact guard. They don't need LaVine. Also, LaVine doesn't play much defense right?

If they do such a trade, they need to flip LaVine for a big, cause the big man options are very thin.

[Banks2Pierce]

LaVine's a polarizing prospect. Bottom 10 defender in the league for multiple metrics, but a gifted offensive player already as a 21 year old. When I watch him, I really end up questioning the bbiq. Just not my type of prospect. Will have to get to the Lillard level of offense or get to a passable level on D to be a genuinely good player. Would screw ourselves if we ended up not liking him as he's in the Nerlens Noel year of his contract next season where the trade value tanks. You can't get him to be a trade chip. Has to be a guy you actually want to acquire.

[jfs1000d]

LaVine's a polarizing prospect. Bottom 10 defender in the league for multiple metrics, but a gifted offensive player already as a 21 year old. When I watch him, I really end up questioning the bbiq. Just not my type of prospect. Will have to get to the Lillard level of offense or get to a passable level on D to be a genuinely good player. Would screw ourselves if we ended up not liking him as he's in the Nerlens Noel year of his contract next season where the trade value tanks. You can't get him to be a trade chip. Has to be a guy you actually want to acquire.

Before we grab guards the question is, will they produce better than IT or Bradley in the next 3 years? If not, don't want them.

IT is 28 PPG. Bradley is having an all-star caliber year and play All-NBA defense when he wants to.

Then, we have Marcus Smart, who might be the best guard coming off the bench in the NBA. The guy is a starting guard on a team that is loaded with guards. So, the next guy we bring in whether it be Lopnzo Ball, Fultz, or anyone else, they are going to be behind IT, Bradley and Smart from the getgo.

There is more PT at the 3,4,5 spot to look at IMO if we want to maximize asset. The only caveat is if you think any of the guards you want to trade for or draft is going to be be better.

[CelticFaninLBC]

Before we grab guards the question is, will they produce better than IT or Bradley in the next 3 years? If not, don't want them.

IT is 28 PPG. Bradley is having an all-star caliber year and play All-NBA defense when he wants to.

Then, we have Marcus Smart, who might be the best guard coming off the bench in the NBA. The guy is a starting guard on a team that is loaded with guards. So, the next guy we bring in whether it be Lopnzo Ball, Fultz, or anyone else, they are going to be behind IT, Bradley and Smart from the getgo.

There is more PT at the 3,4,5 spot to look at IMO if we want to maximize asset. The only caveat is if you think any of the guards you want to trade for or draft is going to be be better.

Bottom line is if they're dealing Crowder, they need to get a big man in return. They have depth at the 1, 2 & 3 (I'm assuming Brown will be very good in a couple of years), and Josh Jackson is a draft option too. Whereas there are no big man options in this draft. Picking Giles in the top 5 is a huge gamble.

[Writebloc]

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[claycarver]

People in this forum don't understand how the Celtics view Bradley and how coveted Bradley is throughout the rest of the league. An efficient shooting guard averaging 18 ppg and 7 rpg who is one of the best on the ball defenders in the game and shoots 48% including 42% from 3 point land. People toss him in these trade proposals like he is Gerald Green.

If we trade in Kelly and Avery for Hayward, Noel and Ball/Fultz this offseason, I'm VERY happy. That's where I'm trying to go.

If we can grab Hayward as a free agent and do a sign and trade for Noel without giving up any BK picks, we're looking good. I see Avery as the necessary casualty. His contract coming due and the glut at guard (assuming a guard in the draft) makes him the one to go.

If we can't get Hayward, none of the rest really matters to me. Assuming he doesn't make an All-NBA team, I think we have a real shot.

[Banks2Pierce]

Matt Moore has been much more measured about the Celtics than he was the last 2 years where he was crying that we should be willing to give Smart and BKN picks for Gallinari or whatever.

Not sure why the price for George looked much higher than Butler out of his trade ideas.

[Celts17Pride]

Matt Moore has been much more measured about the Celtics than he was the last 2 years where he was crying that we should be willing to give Smart and BKN picks for Gallinari or whatever.

Not sure why the price for George looked much higher than Butler out of his trade ideas.

Those trades are terrible

[Celts17Pride]

By the way it is interesting that Bradley, Brown, Amir, Zeller and Jimmy Butler in Chicago have all come up with some late injuries or sickness the past few days just a few days before Zeller can be traded.

I'm sure it's a coincidence but maybe not.

Interested to see what happens with these players tonight.

[chrisab123]

Lavine for Crowder only makes sense if Lavine is swung to a 3rd team. Boston has plenty of guards.

But they're all the same type of guards other than IT. Boston needs a scorer regardless of it being a guard or big. 17-20 PPG would be a huge boost to this team.

What happens to AB and Smart? Deal off AB?

AB to the 3

[Smitty731]

But they're all the same type of guards other than IT. Boston needs a scorer regardless of it being a guard or big. 17-20 PPG would be a huge boost to this team.

What happens to AB and Smart? Deal off AB?

AB to the 3

This team already gets crushed on the boards. Going even smaller only makes that worse.

[165bows]

What happens to AB and Smart? Deal off AB?

AB to the 3

This team already gets crushed on the boards. Going even smaller only makes that worse.

Saw your Aaron Gordon thread on twitter.

Agreed with most of it but isn't there an issue in ORL for their two best players playing the same position?

[redbeamer]

I really think any trade we make should be centered around AB. I love Avery but I feel like he is the epitome of a sell high player right now. IMO, his offense is as good as it will get and his defense is on a slight decline. Not to mention he can't seem to go a full season without injury. I think you package him with a Brooklyn pick and filler and bring Butler to Boston.

[Smitty731]

AB to the 3

This team already gets crushed on the boards. Going even smaller only makes that worse.

Saw your Aaron Gordon thread on twitter.

Agreed with most of it but isn't there an issue in ORL for their two best players playing the same position?

Oh for sure. Orlando is a mess. They have way too much duplication at some spots and giant holes at others. But they aren't moving Gordon for lesser pieces to try and fix it. Certainly not for AB and Jerebko.

[claycarver]

I really think any trade we make should be centered around AB. I love Avery but I feel like he is the epitome of a sell high player right now. IMO, his offense is as good as it will get and his defense is on a slight decline. Not to mention he can't seem to go a full season without injury. I think you package him with a Brooklyn pick and filler and bring Butler to Boston.

I agree. Love him and I'm really impressed with the improvements he's made, but I think he's at the peak of his value. Factoring in the coming contract and deep guard play, I'm seeing him as the very best trade chip we have.

[Andrew McCeltic]

This is what I've been pointing out for awhile.. We're all thinking about how to make the leap by trade to contender status, but since it's unlikely to happen this year - everything would have to break perfectly in the next month for us to pull even with Golden State and Cleveland - we might profit more taking one or two steps back to take three or four forward.

I would have a hard time saying no to Crowder for Lavine, for one thing because we could get Rudy Gay, for another because Lavine may have more trade value in the kinds of deals we're looking to do.