Revote: Where is Evan Turner best Positioned at?

[ddb]

when Turner is on the court, he's our point guard. plain and simple. He is playing very well.

[2Mas]

From my perspective I don't really think it is bashing. I just think he is not a fit with Rondo at all and Rondo is a much better player who I would rather keep.

I'd love to see him play well and turn into a solid trade chip, and advocated he deserved the opportunity to at least try to land the starting role with Rondo out.

Like how Houston signed Asik, used him as a starter, then role player, then when his role diminished he had enough value to land a potential solid lotto pick, that's what I'd like to see. And Dallas isn't a backwater, they are a much more competitive team that should be able to use a bigger, younger ball handler in the back court, and will have great spacing around him. Win-win-win.

I'll play along. What do you get back in a deal with Dallas then?

Felton and their protected first this year.

I know his contract runs into next year but I think it gets dumped cheaply as a small expiring next summer.

I just think they really need to land the guys they want in the upcoming drafts, and short of being able to rig the lotto, having a ton of picks ensures they get the best chance at their favorites. And if no big fish show up in FA, just eat Felton's deal as they will have plenty of space. I suppose it could also be Jameer Nelson, whoever looks most washed up.

No way on earth Dallas trades a pick for ANOTHER ball dominant, non shooter. lol Their spacing sucks as is.

[2Mas]

Sorry, but when hasn't Iguodala been an elite defender? I mean, are you serious with this?

And Iguodala has been a statistical joke? Really? Do you even look at stats before you post stuff like this?

Iggy had a TS% of 57 percent and an eFG% of 54.8 percent last season. He even shot a respectable 35.4 percent from three while shooting a solid 48 percent from the floor.

Defensively, teams averaged 99 points per 100 possessions with Iguodala on the court and 106 with him off the court.

I'm not even a huge Iguodala fan (never have been), but let's call a spade a spade here.

I also don't know why you keep bringing up "other guys on the roster" because that has nothing to do with Turner as an individual player, but if you want to go that route, fine. Jared Sullinger is entering his third year and could make a big leap at the age of 22. Kelly Olynyk was awesome in the second half of last season and is going into his sophomore campaign. Marcus Smart and James Young are extremely talented rookies.

Likening Turner to a lot of the guys on this roster just isn't fair.

Your acting like Turner is 30.

If your can read you would understand I said

"I don't think Turner is quite as good as Iguodala but in 3/4 of a season he did a pretty good impression when he got a hold of that role."

As importantly is that Iguodala in 63 games as a starter in Golden State put up roughly the some production and per 36's as Turner did in IND he is just making 12 mil a season on a 4 year deal. Now that is only getting worse as Iggy is likely going to the bench making 12 mil a year and scoring 9 ppg he is overrated as a defender and is approaching Gerald Wallace production.. The difference between Iggy and Turner hasn't really been on the defensive end it is on the offensive end. Not that Iggy is a great offensive player plenty of poor 3 pt shooting years when it didn't stop him from gunning away and plenty of high turnover years and bad FT shooting but his team played pretty well with him on the floor and a lot of the offense running through him.

Turner has not performed very well offensively and his team hasn't performed well offensively. `That said he hasn't really been in a position for that to be the case. Does that happen in Boston maybe maybe not. But there has just been a big difference between the opportunity that Iggy has had in his career and what Turner has had. Sometimes there is a very good reason for that and that we shall see.

With Vaild on this bruh. Iggy isn't a good comparison for Turner. A ball dominant "I need the offense centered around me" type, vs the Iggy "blends well with any system". Turners good, Iggy (4 years older) is still good. Iggy is not a stats player. Turner is. When John Wall & DLee were going for a rebound & Iggy just sprinted past Wall to stop him & let Lee get the rebound, he "stats" don't do anything, but it's an offensive board for Lee.

Similarities - both light skinned? triple double threats? Both can't shoot? Both drafted to Philly?

But their games are incredibly opposite. Turner couldn't even do what Iggy is doing in GSW. Of course he's overpaid though.

[Cyclical]

If ever there was a case for a new coach bringing out the best in a maligned player we're seeing it right now with Stevens and Turner. You couldn't use Turner any better and there's an argument to be made that there's no other team he could thrive on as much as he does with the C's.

Right now we have no better option at point guard. Too big for most PGs to defend and too quick and crafty for most 3's to handle. The juggling act Stevens is performing between ET, Smart, Bradley and IT/Pressey is pretty impressive.

[jfs1000d]

This guy is a good player. His issue is he is more a jack of all trades, master of none. That, and he's ball dominant.

I see the talent that got him to the No. 2 pick. Its evident, and he was worth it talent wise. He just isnt a great enough shooter right now. That limits what he can do off the ball. On the ball? He just can't score enough to be a dominant on ball guy.

To me, he is a PG. Hard player to figure. But, we got him on the cheap and I think he's a good player.

[bigdavid]

Nice to see he got a triple dub tonight. That means for the next 3 games he's scoring 2/2/2.

Can't he even enjoy this game without the putdowns. Must the haters always pop-up even after a triple-double and the 5th VC.Go Figure!

He is best positioned as a tough player who wants to win. Go Celts

[humblebum]

People who hate on Turner likely aren't watching him compete defensively night in and night out regardless of who he's tasked with covering. He's giving great effort and providing a real dose of versatility out there as well. He's also an excellent defensive rebounder.

Sure his offense can be a bit tough to watch at times because he has that probing dribble style... but he's generally looking to get into the paint (which is a big positive), he's got pretty decent touch/skill in the mid range, and he's willing to take big shots down the stretch. It's not a bad combination to have.

I think he's a guy who needs the ball. So point or point forward. Think he could actually work long term as a starter if Ainge can add more offensive talent along the front line.

[165bows]

I'll play along. What do you get back in a deal with Dallas then?

Felton and their protected first this year.

I know his contract runs into next year but I think it gets dumped cheaply as a small expiring next summer.

I just think they really need to land the guys they want in the upcoming drafts, and short of being able to rig the lotto, having a ton of picks ensures they get the best chance at their favorites. And if no big fish show up in FA, just eat Felton's deal as they will have plenty of space. I suppose it could also be Jameer Nelson, whoever looks most washed up.

No way on earth Dallas trades a pick for ANOTHER ball dominant, non shooter. lol Their spacing sucks as is.

Pretty sure I posted the above prior to the Rondo trade lol.

[RondoToKG]

Nice to see he got a triple dub tonight. That means for the next 3 games he's scoring 2/2/2.

Can't he even enjoy this game without the putdowns. Must the haters always pop-up even after a triple-double and the 5th VC.Go Figure!

He is best positioned as a tough player who wants to win. Go Celts

lol Sorry, I agree with you. I never get to join in on the Turner bashing though!

[FakeScreenName123]

There's only 3 options for positions and he's not a center, so I choose:

Guard.

or Forward.

[sully00]

Sorry, but when hasn't Iguodala been an elite defender? I mean, are you serious with this?

And Iguodala has been a statistical joke? Really? Do you even look at stats before you post stuff like this?

Iggy had a TS% of 57 percent and an eFG% of 54.8 percent last season. He even shot a respectable 35.4 percent from three while shooting a solid 48 percent from the floor.

Defensively, teams averaged 99 points per 100 possessions with Iguodala on the court and 106 with him off the court.

I'm not even a huge Iguodala fan (never have been), but let's call a spade a spade here.

I also don't know why you keep bringing up "other guys on the roster" because that has nothing to do with Turner as an individual player, but if you want to go that route, fine. Jared Sullinger is entering his third year and could make a big leap at the age of 22. Kelly Olynyk was awesome in the second half of last season and is going into his sophomore campaign. Marcus Smart and James Young are extremely talented rookies.

Likening Turner to a lot of the guys on this roster just isn't fair.

Your acting like Turner is 30.

If your can read you would understand I said

"I don't think Turner is quite as good as Iguodala but in 3/4 of a season he did a pretty good impression when he got a hold of that role."

As importantly is that Iguodala in 63 games as a starter in Golden State put up roughly the some production and per 36's as Turner did in IND he is just making 12 mil a season on a 4 year deal. Now that is only getting worse as Iggy is likely going to the bench making 12 mil a year and scoring 9 ppg he is overrated as a defender and is approaching Gerald Wallace production.. The difference between Iggy and Turner hasn't really been on the defensive end it is on the offensive end. Not that Iggy is a great offensive player plenty of poor 3 pt shooting years when it didn't stop him from gunning away and plenty of high turnover years and bad FT shooting but his team played pretty well with him on the floor and a lot of the offense running through him.

Turner has not performed very well offensively and his team hasn't performed well offensively. `That said he hasn't really been in a position for that to be the case. Does that happen in Boston maybe maybe not. But there has just been a big difference between the opportunity that Iggy has had in his career and what Turner has had. Sometimes there is a very good reason for that and that we shall see.

With Vaild on this bruh. Iggy isn't a good comparison for Turner. A ball dominant "I need the offense centered around me" type, vs the Iggy "blends well with any system". Turners good, Iggy (4 years older) is still good. Iggy is not a stats player. Turner is. When John Wall & DLee were going for a rebound & Iggy just sprinted past Wall to stop him & let Lee get the rebound, he "stats" don't do anything, but it's an offensive board for Lee.

Similarities - both light skinned? triple double threats? Both can't shoot? Both drafted to Philly?

But their games are incredibly opposite. Turner couldn't even do what Iggy is doing in GSW. Of course he's overpaid though.

It is kind of funny how you jumping on something I wrote in October and I was completely on point on Iggy that dude is 6th on his team in offensive rating and 11th in defensive rating he is avg at best he is Gerald Wallace in Brooklyn. But your still missing the point read what I wrote. This isn't about Turner being better or as good as Iggy it was about opportunity and role. Iggy is putting up 8/3/3 in 27 mpg and Turner is putting up 9/5/5 27 mpg. Turners percentages and ratings still leave a lot to be desired even though he has turned a corner in March. The really interesting thing with Turner is his impact when he plays well this team wins and when he doesn't they lose and it isn't even close it is almost Jekle and Hyde.

As far as comparable player at this point I would say my hope for Turner is to be like Boris Diaw. He is really valuable to your team maybe not so much for everyone else.

[2Mas]

Felton and their protected first this year.

I know his contract runs into next year but I think it gets dumped cheaply as a small expiring next summer.

I just think they really need to land the guys they want in the upcoming drafts, and short of being able to rig the lotto, having a ton of picks ensures they get the best chance at their favorites. And if no big fish show up in FA, just eat Felton's deal as they will have plenty of space. I suppose it could also be Jameer Nelson, whoever looks most washed up.

No way on earth Dallas trades a pick for ANOTHER ball dominant, non shooter. lol Their spacing sucks as is.

Pretty sure I posted the above prior to the Rondo trade lol.

Lmao. Wowwwww apologies bro. Seen it up on the recent posts so I figured it was last night. My fault.

[2Mas]

Your acting like Turner is 30.

If your can read you would understand I said

"I don't think Turner is quite as good as Iguodala but in 3/4 of a season he did a pretty good impression when he got a hold of that role."

As importantly is that Iguodala in 63 games as a starter in Golden State put up roughly the some production and per 36's as Turner did in IND he is just making 12 mil a season on a 4 year deal. Now that is only getting worse as Iggy is likely going to the bench making 12 mil a year and scoring 9 ppg he is overrated as a defender and is approaching Gerald Wallace production.. The difference between Iggy and Turner hasn't really been on the defensive end it is on the offensive end. Not that Iggy is a great offensive player plenty of poor 3 pt shooting years when it didn't stop him from gunning away and plenty of high turnover years and bad FT shooting but his team played pretty well with him on the floor and a lot of the offense running through him.

Turner has not performed very well offensively and his team hasn't performed well offensively. `That said he hasn't really been in a position for that to be the case. Does that happen in Boston maybe maybe not. But there has just been a big difference between the opportunity that Iggy has had in his career and what Turner has had. Sometimes there is a very good reason for that and that we shall see.

With Vaild on this bruh. Iggy isn't a good comparison for Turner. A ball dominant "I need the offense centered around me" type, vs the Iggy "blends well with any system". Turners good, Iggy (4 years older) is still good. Iggy is not a stats player. Turner is. When John Wall & DLee were going for a rebound & Iggy just sprinted past Wall to stop him & let Lee get the rebound, he "stats" don't do anything, but it's an offensive board for Lee.

Similarities - both light skinned? triple double threats? Both can't shoot? Both drafted to Philly?

But their games are incredibly opposite. Turner couldn't even do what Iggy is doing in GSW. Of course he's overpaid though.

It is kind of funny how you jumping on something I wrote in October and I was completely on point on Iggy that dude is 6th on his team in offensive rating and 11th in defensive rating he is avg at best he is Gerald Wallace in Brooklyn. But your still missing the point read what I wrote. This isn't about Turner being better or as good as Iggy it was about opportunity and role. Iggy is putting up 8/3/3 in 27 mpg and Turner is putting up 9/5/5 27 mpg. Turners percentages and ratings still leave a lot to be desired even though he has turned a corner in March. The really interesting thing with Turner is his impact when he plays well this team wins and when he doesn't they lose and it isn't even close it is almost Jekle and Hyde.

As far as comparable player at this point I would say my hope for Turner is to be like Boris Diaw. He is really valuable to your team maybe not so much for everyone else.

Dude -- I had no idea this thread was this old. I already apologized to 165, cause I had NO clue this thread was so old. Please ignore this lol.

[sully00]

With Vaild on this bruh. Iggy isn't a good comparison for Turner. A ball dominant "I need the offense centered around me" type, vs the Iggy "blends well with any system". Turners good, Iggy (4 years older) is still good. Iggy is not a stats player. Turner is. When John Wall & DLee were going for a rebound & Iggy just sprinted past Wall to stop him & let Lee get the rebound, he "stats" don't do anything, but it's an offensive board for Lee.

Similarities - both light skinned? triple double threats? Both can't shoot? Both drafted to Philly?

But their games are incredibly opposite. Turner couldn't even do what Iggy is doing in GSW. Of course he's overpaid though.

It is kind of funny how you jumping on something I wrote in October and I was completely on point on Iggy that dude is 6th on his team in offensive rating and 11th in defensive rating he is avg at best he is Gerald Wallace in Brooklyn. But your still missing the point read what I wrote. This isn't about Turner being better or as good as Iggy it was about opportunity and role. Iggy is putting up 8/3/3 in 27 mpg and Turner is putting up 9/5/5 27 mpg. Turners percentages and ratings still leave a lot to be desired even though he has turned a corner in March. The really interesting thing with Turner is his impact when he plays well this team wins and when he doesn't they lose and it isn't even close it is almost Jekle and Hyde.

As far as comparable player at this point I would say my hope for Turner is to be like Boris Diaw. He is really valuable to your team maybe not so much for everyone else.

Dude -- I had no idea this thread was this old. I already apologized to 165, cause I had NO clue this thread was so old. Please ignore this lol.

Actually as far as bumps this one isn't bad.

[KGboss]

Seems to work best as a point forward.

[Fencer reregistered]

Ideally, Ainge's signing of Turner plays out similarly to Dumars' signing of Billups.

[humblebum]

Your acting like Turner is 30.

If your can read you would understand I said

"I don't think Turner is quite as good as Iguodala but in 3/4 of a season he did a pretty good impression when he got a hold of that role."

As importantly is that Iguodala in 63 games as a starter in Golden State put up roughly the some production and per 36's as Turner did in IND he is just making 12 mil a season on a 4 year deal. Now that is only getting worse as Iggy is likely going to the bench making 12 mil a year and scoring 9 ppg he is overrated as a defender and is approaching Gerald Wallace production.. The difference between Iggy and Turner hasn't really been on the defensive end it is on the offensive end. Not that Iggy is a great offensive player plenty of poor 3 pt shooting years when it didn't stop him from gunning away and plenty of high turnover years and bad FT shooting but his team played pretty well with him on the floor and a lot of the offense running through him.

Turner has not performed very well offensively and his team hasn't performed well offensively. `That said he hasn't really been in a position for that to be the case. Does that happen in Boston maybe maybe not. But there has just been a big difference between the opportunity that Iggy has had in his career and what Turner has had. Sometimes there is a very good reason for that and that we shall see.

With Vaild on this bruh. Iggy isn't a good comparison for Turner. A ball dominant "I need the offense centered around me" type, vs the Iggy "blends well with any system". Turners good, Iggy (4 years older) is still good. Iggy is not a stats player. Turner is. When John Wall & DLee were going for a rebound & Iggy just sprinted past Wall to stop him & let Lee get the rebound, he "stats" don't do anything, but it's an offensive board for Lee.

Similarities - both light skinned? triple double threats? Both can't shoot? Both drafted to Philly?

But their games are incredibly opposite. Turner couldn't even do what Iggy is doing in GSW. Of course he's overpaid though.

It is kind of funny how you jumping on something I wrote in October and I was completely on point on Iggy that dude is 6th on his team in offensive rating and 11th in defensive rating he is avg at best he is Gerald Wallace in Brooklyn. But your still missing the point read what I wrote. This isn't about Turner being better or as good as Iggy it was about opportunity and role. Iggy is putting up 8/3/3 in 27 mpg and Turner is putting up 9/5/5 27 mpg. Turners percentages and ratings still leave a lot to be desired even though he has turned a corner in March. The really interesting thing with Turner is his impact when he plays well this team wins and when he doesn't they lose and it isn't even close it is almost Jekle and Hyde.

As far as comparable player at this point I would say my hope for Turner is to be like Boris Diaw. He is really valuable to your team maybe not so much for everyone else.

Iggy hasn't been great statistically, sure. But when you watch that GS team his leadership, passion, and energy are clearly infectious. They feed off of him and while he's not displaying the volume of scoring/aggressiveness he used to he shows flashes of dominance attacking the rim or shooting with confidence. He plays a ton of minutes for them for a reason.

But Turner is a comparable player but just in a completely different aspect/role. Turner can really function as a volume scorer/playmaker. When he complements that with competing and defending at a high level... he really shows potential as being a second tier type star player.

Just also want to say that I freaking love Draymond Green. And if the Celtics are going to make one of these useful RFA pushes I would vote making a push for Dray. And on the subject of positions... what is Dray a SF-PF? I don't care, dude can ball. Now I don't love Turner like that, LMAO, but dude can ball too. I think of him as a point forward. But really he's kind of an "x-factor" type, which makes his contract perfect. And in that respect, he's a guy whos difficult to gameplan for due to his unpredictability.

[TheOGJabroni]

I mean he's clearly the PG on offense but that doesn't matter. The only times labeling positions matter is on defense really, where he's fine at either wing position. If Crowder is in the lineup, he can defend SGs. If it's Bradley and Smart on the court, he'll defend SFs.

[rzzzzz]

what Turner lacks in world class athleticism, he compensates for with superior court vision. he's always been a competitor, but has been plagued by wearing his emotions on his sleeve, at least in the past. basically, he is outstanding at creating good looks at the basket, but his shot runs hot and cold to the extreme. when his shot is falling, he will completely take over the game, and it's a guaranteed win if the coach keeps him on the floor. Stevens has done a good job maximizing his other talents for all those other games when the ball is clanking the iron.

[voodooguru]

I'm a Sixers phan who, as a young vinnie del, saw Wilt Chamberlain play for both the Philadelphia Warriors and the Philadelphia 76ers.

The one "thing" missin' from y'alls ET debate is Doug Collins. If you want me to do the research on Doug's overbearing, hyper-emotional, failed stints in Chicago, DETROIT, and Washington I will. I do believe that some guy named Michael Jordan once said that Doug Collins cried e'ry day.

My one-fan's-opinion might sound, in part, crazy, but this is it, summarized :

1. Doug Collins intentionally ruined ET's development. Doug is real close with Jrue Holiday's daddy and was determined to make Jrue The Man in Illadelphia. Jrue's daddy, Jrue and Doug are all 24-7-365 christians, which deepened Doug's devotion to making Jrue a star (the crazy part?). ET was a Number Two pick on-baller who could easily crash Doug's donkey cart.

2 Doug didn't want ET coming out of college, he wanted a big. That was fair enough, but the GM (Stiff-phan-ski?) took the BPA, ET.

3. ET recently said that anyone who tries to make him a catch and shoot player is no genius. That's exactly what Doug did. Exclusively. On 75ish% of offensive sets he had ET come down the court and plant himself behind the arc in the corner and raise his hand if he was open. It's true, he had Holiday and some Iguodala to initiate his "offence", but thanks to your coach, you guys already know how effective ET can be on the ball.

4. I'm not saying that ET would have made a better PG than Jrue, but dang - ET had just won the NCAA MVP playing on the ball, you'd think he'd get some time there. Jrue would have been better at SG than PG, but Doug wanted him to have the spotlight, exclusively

5. I don't remember exactly when it was but there was a stretch of 5 games, coinciding with a rare (only?) trip to Philly by ET's "agent", where ET spent most of the games at PG on offence. The team won four of five, scored over a century in 4 and 90+ in the other, and e'rybody (ET, Holiday and Enigmadala) got theirs. In the sixth game Evan was back in the corner (for the duration) waving his hand. Predicatbly, the losing, losing, losing recommenced and Doug got fired [EDIT-resigned before he got fired] from his final coaching job.

Right from the beginning Doug would bench ET after every mistake and after virtually every little run of form. Compare John "Two Major Injuries" Wall's career minutes with Evan's, and while you're there compare their shooting percentage. Don't worry about "Brick" Wall's turnovers, Evan has yet to spend any significant time on the ball like Wall.

If anything good came out of the Reverend Doctor Doogie Wowser, NBA Coach/Couch's utterly cactus approach to ET, it's that Evan can probably hit the trey at at a break even percentage, he has a money stop and pop on the baseline, and he can play some decent SF. My ideal perimeter for Philly was ET - PG/SF, Jrue SG/PG and Enigmadala SF/PtF (o-f-o).

In a way, the Celtics are ET's first team. Your coach knows his game. As an old-arsed Philly phan I'd venture to say that in spite of his ill treatment in "'Illy", he's still got what could end up as Ye Olde Celtic Spirit.

I-think-if-Brad-found-a-way-to-start-him-at-point-he-could-drop-six-or-seven-triple-doubles-BUMP