Free Agent/Trade/Waiver Thread, 2025-26, part 2

[tfribs45]

love Al and all that he did for the C's when he was here, but lets not forget he left us twice. LOL at wanting to retire #42 , that's a JOKE!

[Curmudgeon]

Horford's number should be retired for all teams in every professional sport.

[cl2117]

I don't think you can really fault Horford for walking away when we just traded KP and Jrue. He's looking at his swan-song years and decided to go to a place that's actively taking big chances to squeeze the last out of its aging stars, they just align way better than we do. Plus he's getting more money, going to a market people want to be in, he's getting more meaningful minutes, good coach/owner, the best facilities etc. money can buy.

Him leaving for Philly was far more egregious but I think ultimately that was a required step in getting this team a championship. When Philly blew up in his face and getting to play PF not C didn't seem to matter any more, he comes back to Boston with a different mindset just about playing and winning and that set the tone for what would be a super-team.

Should his jersey be in the rafters? I don't think so. Does he deserve a standing ovation in the Garden for the rest of his career? Yeah, absolutely.

[Fierce1]

Horford left the Cs this time because he doesn't want to play for the minimum.

Simple as that.

If money isn't the issue then he would have accepted the minimum and retired a Celtic.

I won't be surprised if GSW is not playing in May and the Celtics are still playing in the middle of May.

[Hal14]

love Al and all that he did for the C's when he was here, but lets not forget he left us twice. LOL at wanting to retire #42 , that's a JOKE!

Yeah I think if he stayed here for the rest of his career, it was a possibility. But not anymore.

We probably won't put anymore numbers in the rafters until Tatum and Brown.

[bucknersrevenge]

I know some would feel better about this team if we had been able to keep Luke or even Al, but I'm all set on load managing a 39 year old this season, as much as I love Al. It's time. So I have no hard feelings about him leaving. Surprised about the multi-year deal but it's fine. I know Al's been receiving a little backlash due to the idea that he keeps leaving when struggle hits this team but for me this time is different. As far as I'm concerned, he got us Banner 19 and I was ready to move on this time with some younger players.

As for Luke, I dunno if this is a weird idea but does anyone else feel like we kinda "built" Luke? I mean, as recent as the beginning of last season people laughed about the idea of Luke being our 3rd center. But we coached him up here with our staff. We upskilled him. We put him in positions that best benefit the skills he had to use them most effectively. We surrounded him with excellent teammates. I mean Tatum probably deserves 1/3 of his next contract for what he did for Luke. Another 1/3 could go to the coaching staff. The culture here, breeds player development at varying levels here. More wistful what-if-idness than anything.

I just look at Neemy's raw traits and Luka, offensive talents and see good lumps of clay to do the same things as they did with Luke, and make possibly even better players. I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility here at all and am looking forwards to not having to load manage our bigs anymore. Sure, maybe both don't hit but I see what Brad likes in them and why both deserve a shot to see if they can be more.

We definitely built Luke, which is kinda why it sucks to see him go for a relatively cheap deal. Doesn’t even matter who started - him or Queta - but just having multiple dudes. I’m assuming Queta is a big rotation guy in the keep Luke scenario either way.

I’m definitely more on board with Al going, I wouldn’t have gone nearly as high in his deal as Luke’s.

Garza, I’m open but it took years to build Luke. If it takes that long with Luka, we still need someone else before he’s ready. Hopefully he is a revelation. Most likely we gotta make a move for another big by next season, though.

Not reeeeeaalllyyyy complaining as I get the $ and timing of it all. But Luke, Queta, Boucher is a good, cheap set of bigs to roll with.

DWhite singled out Luka when he got pressed to pick someone:

Watch on YouTube

JB singled him out as well. I know everyone hates our bigs and all but what they look like right now is irrelevant. How they ramp up into our system and learn the defensive rotations and learn how and where to set the proper picks and rebound and do the little things. That's what matters.

[Dogen]

It would have been great to have Horford on vet min, starting but with limited minutes and helping bring the other guys along. Instead we have the three-headed rotation from the island of misfit toys. However, a few promising signs.

Queta: maybe ready to turn the corner after two years in Boston and a promising Euro tourney. He's got the size and athleticism, just needs to work on his NBA D and not get exposed. Probably still not a legit starter, but the gap is closing.

Garza: He's never had the consistent minutes, and maybe for good reason, but he's come in slimmed down and seems committed to taking that next step. Offense will be his calling card on offensive boards and the long ball, but like Queta, can he stay on the floor or will he get hunted and exposed on D?

Tillman: Also slimmed down and reports that his knee is not swelling. Good diet, physical recovery, and has been working on his shooting. X could be the surprise big of the season as he has a history of being a solid, if undersized, defender/rebounder who can switch and even has a few nifty moves on offense. If his health holds up he and Boucher could make for an undersized but efficient, experienced front court that may surprise people.

[redslastlaugh]

I second this notion of the "promising signs" ... I think each of Tillman, Queta and Garza bring valuable traits to the table (when healthy) and Queta ad Garza can still get better -- bigmen sometimes take longer to develop

And, even if none of these guys is the ultimate answer at the position, if they boost their value, they may be one piece going out in a trade that brings the right guy in.

People used to knock IT, saying "yeah, it's nice he's averaging 25, but you're not winning a championship with a 5-9 franchise player," and this proved true. But, injuries not withstanding, IT becoming an All Star (with a Brooklyn pick) is how we acquired a HOFer: Kyrie Irving. And Kyrie, theoretically, would have been THAT guy

Point is: Queta, Garza developing is valuable in and of itself, even if Queta/Garza never become THAT GUY in the middle on a title team

It would have been great to have Horford on vet min, starting but with limited minutes and helping bring the other guys along. Instead we have the three-headed rotation from the island of misfit toys. However, a few promising signs.

Queta: maybe ready to turn the corner after two years in Boston and a promising Euro tourney. He's got the size and athleticism, just needs to work on his NBA D and not get exposed. Probably still not a legit starter, but the gap is closing.

Garza: He's never had the consistent minutes, and maybe for good reason, but he's come in slimmed down and seems committed to taking that next step. Offense will be his calling card on offensive boards and the long ball, but like Queta, can he stay on the floor or will he get hunted and exposed on D?

Tillman: Also slimmed down and reports that his knee is not swelling. Good diet, physical recovery, and has been working on his shooting. X could be the surprise big of the season as he has a history of being a solid, if undersized, defender/rebounder who can switch and even has a few nifty moves on offense. If his health holds up he and Boucher could make for an undersized but efficient, experienced front court that may surprise people.

[djFan71]

We definitely built Luke, which is kinda why it sucks to see him go for a relatively cheap deal. Doesn’t even matter who started - him or Queta - but just having multiple dudes. I’m assuming Queta is a big rotation guy in the keep Luke scenario either way.

I’m definitely more on board with Al going, I wouldn’t have gone nearly as high in his deal as Luke’s.

Garza, I’m open but it took years to build Luke. If it takes that long with Luka, we still need someone else before he’s ready. Hopefully he is a revelation. Most likely we gotta make a move for another big by next season, though.

Not reeeeeaalllyyyy complaining as I get the $ and timing of it all. But Luke, Queta, Boucher is a good, cheap set of bigs to roll with.

DWhite singled out Luka when he got pressed to pick someone:

Spoiler:

Watch on YouTube

JB singled him out as well. I know everyone hates our bigs and all but what they look like right now is irrelevant. How they ramp up into our system and learn the defensive rotations and learn how and where to set the proper picks and rebound and do the little things. That's what matters.

Garza is now my key to the season, lol.

If he’s a valid rotation big (or they make a move to upgrade) they can squeak into the 40+ wins range. If he’s what he’s been to date, it’s not gonna be pretty. I'm already assuming Queta will be legit and Simons/Boucher will help. So, we got 7 guys you can trust. Need a couple youngins to step up.

Any game missing one of JB, White or Pritchard could be ugly. Doubt we win too many of those. I'm going 8-14 in the 22 games one/more of them miss. 33-27 in the other games. That's a 41 win / .500 team as a baseline.

More games missed by top 3 => worse record. Any surprise on number / quality of new rotation guys => more wins. I'm in kool-aid binging mode right now, so I'm gonna go slightly over.

For reference, your 2015-2016 Boston Celtics that won 48 games:
IT4 / Bradley / Crowder / Amir / Sully
Smart / ET / Jerebko / Zellstar
Rookie mode: Rozier
Deep stash mode: Jordan Mickey

[Fierce1]

Because of the Kuminga deal, Horford now only gets the 5.7m tax ML, instead of the 14m non-tax ML.

GSW now hard capped at the 2nd apron.

[Hal14]

Because of the Kuminga deal, Horford now only gets the 5.7m tax ML, instead of the 14m non-tax ML.

GSW now hard capped at the 2nd apron.

Most we could have given him was probably like $3.6mil a year..which is the vet min for players with 10+ years experience.

[djFan71]

Kuminga news was a bit of a fizzle. SAC can either pivot now and try to make a different move, or just settle with what they got - not much beyond some tank keys. Lakers, Bucks may yet do something. Beyond that, this off-season might be a wrap.

Spoiler:

If something major beyond the above happens now it's cuz I intentionally just jinxed it into existence!

[Fierce1]

Because of the Kuminga deal, Horford now only gets the 5.7m tax ML, instead of the 14m non-tax ML.

GSW now hard capped at the 2nd apron.

Most we could have given him was probably like $3.6mil a year..which is the vet min for players with 10+ years experience.

Agree.

Hard to believe that Horford is still about the money.

Another poster even said Horford already accumulated generational money over the years.

[Parliament10]

Because of the Kuminga deal, Horford now only gets the 5.7m tax ML, instead of the 14m non-tax ML.

GSW now hard capped at the 2nd apron.

Most we could have given him was probably like $3.6mil a year..which is the vet min for players with 10+ years experience.

Agree.

Hard to believe that Horford is still about the money.

Another poster even said Horford already accumulated generational money over the years.

I'd be really surprised if we could only offer Al the minimum?
Can we get some of our Cap Experts to weigh in on this?

A) What is the Max that we could have paid Horford?
B) And stayed in fairly decent Salary Cap space?

Horford was our player, despite being an UFA. We also had/have some TPE's.

[Parliament10]

Despite the money situation, I think that Horford just left too carelessly.
Isn't that what he did the first time; saying later something like he may have stayed, if Kyrie was gone?

Much respect to/for Horford, as a player and basketball mind.
But, he seems to have jumped the gun, again?

I still would like to see him as a Big-Man Coach in the future, for the Celtics.

[Fierce1]

Most we could have given him was probably like $3.6mil a year..which is the vet min for players with 10+ years experience.

Agree.

Hard to believe that Horford is still about the money.

Another poster even said Horford already accumulated generational money over the years.

I'd be really surprised if we could only offer Al the minimum?
Can we get some of our Cap Experts to weigh in on this?

A) What is the Max that we could have paid Horford?
B) And stayed in fairly decent Salary Cap space?

Horford was our player, despite being an UFA. We also had/have some TPE's.

Cs had Horford's Bird rights, so Cs could give Al any amount of money.

But I think the Cs would only offer Al the 3.6m minimum because Al is already 39 years old and he's not capable of playing heavy minutes and 70 games in the regular season.

The cap situation of the Cs really does not allow them to overpay for a 39-year old backup Center.

You can see the pattern of the Cs just signing guys like Garza for the minimum.

Brad is saving the big bucks for a real difference maker.

[ThePigeon]

Despite the money situation, I think that Horford just left too carelessly.
Isn't that what he did the first time; saying later something like he may have stayed, if Kyrie was gone?

Much respect to/for Horford, as a player and basketball mind.
But, he seems to have jumped the gun, again?

I still would like to see him as a Big-Man Coach in the future, for the Celtics.

Once you can forgive, twice is a pattern. Great player and guy, but a mercenary mentality
If he will be a coach - what will make him not jump to other teams if they offer more money?

I think we have great bigs coaches (I don't know who they are) - look at the progress Luke made, Queta is coming up nice and we'll see what they can do with X (who looks better on video) and Garza

[Hal14]

Most we could have given him was probably like $3.6mil a year..which is the vet min for players with 10+ years experience.

Agree.

Hard to believe that Horford is still about the money.

Another poster even said Horford already accumulated generational money over the years.

I'd be really surprised if we could only offer Al the minimum?
Can we get some of our Cap Experts to weigh in on this?

A) What is the Max that we could have paid Horford?
B) And stayed in fairly decent Salary Cap space?

Horford was our player, despite being an UFA. We also had/have some TPE's.

We had no salary cap space.

We're $12mil over the tax line. We have a current tax bill of $39.4mil and we aren't going to do deeper into the tax and have a higher tax bill to sign a 39 year old big during a bridge year when we aren't even competing for a championship.

Brad said he made an offer to both Luke and Al but he said he knew they'd both sign for more $ elsewhere and he said look at how much the guys we signed signed for..implying Garza, Minott and Boucher..all signed for the minimum which means because of our tax situation and this being a bridge year, we weren't gonna sign any free agents for more than the minimum.

And Al of course wanted to go somewhere where he can compete for a championship and make more $. It's not that complicated.

A team led by Steph Curry, Jimmy Butler and Draymond Green has a much better chance at competing for a championship than a team led by Brown, White and Pritchard.

I'm sure there were open and honest conversations that took place behind closed doors with Al and Brad. There wasn't any rumors all offseason that indicated Al might resign here. Probably because Brad was open and honest right from the beginning with Al that the goal was slashing payroll, moving Jrue and KP, getting under the 2nd apron and having a bridge year to hopefully get back to competing for championships in 26-27 when Tatum is back healthy. Brad probably told Al this, so all along Al knew he was either gonna sign elsewhere or retire.

Bottom line, Al wants to compete for a championship this season..if we look at each team's offseason moves, BOS was trying to slash payroll this offseason whereas GS is trying to win a championship.

[celtics543]

Rooting for Al to succeed with the Warriors. Not on board with retiring his jersey. He left twice and was a top five guy on a title for us. I think if we're retiring jerseys I'd go Rondo before Al.

As much as Al is respected, he was basically 2024 James Posey for the title team. And now he's left twice, so its' not like he's a lifer or anything.

[Shak_Celts]

The vet min must be way less than 6m per. He’s at 12/2 GSW.