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Tatum and Brown, as 1-2 Options

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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#901 » by sam_I_am » Mon Dec 5, 2022 2:09 pm

steefP2 wrote:
BostonCouchGM wrote:
zoyathedestroya wrote:Got my confirmation.

Teammates scoring 25+ ppg on 60+% TS% same season in NBA history:
• Bird and McHale (1987)
• KD and Curry (2017)
• KD and Curry (2018)
• KD and Curry (2019)

After 22 games, Tatum averaging 31.6 ppg on 63.5% TS and Brown averaging 26.1 ppg on 60.5% TS.

If it were that easy, more pairings would've done it.


you can't compare today's era to other eras since it's geared towards offense, players are allowed to use illegal screens, travel, carry and push off plus there's the lack of defense and the three ball. There's a reason only one duo had ever done it until 2017 and then now we're on our 4th since.

There's currently 14 players scoring 25 ppg.

In Bird and MJs era there were very few 25 ppg let alone teammates

1980-5
1981-5
1982-4
1983-4
1984-6
1985-8
1986-5
1987-7
1988-9
1989-9
1990-7
1991-9
1992-4
1993-5
1996-5
1997-4
1998-3

TS% is kinda garbage tbh.

There's currently like 57 players with a 60 TS%. Back when Bird and Mchale both did it there were only 20



that's why you look at ts% above league average, not just raw ts. League average ts atm is .574, which iirc is the highest ever. So jaylen is currently at +4 and jayson at +5 above league average efficiency.


The Rich Mokeski’s of the Bird era have been replaced with Embiids, Giannises, Lukas and Jokics. Bird and McHlae would still be elite today but the league never had as many superstar talents from all over the world like they do today.
"I think the criticism's stupid," Stevens said. "So I don't care. I'm with Jaylen (Brown) on that. Those two had achieved more than most 25 and 26 year olds ever had. I'd rather be in the mix and have my guts ripped out than suck."
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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#902 » by Celts17Pride » Mon Dec 5, 2022 2:44 pm

Big kudos to Tatum (8.1) and Brown (7.0) for both having career highs so far in rebounding the ball. Big help to the Celtics.
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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#903 » by bucknersrevenge » Mon Dec 5, 2022 6:01 pm

sam_I_am wrote:
steefP2 wrote:
BostonCouchGM wrote:
you can't compare today's era to other eras since it's geared towards offense, players are allowed to use illegal screens, travel, carry and push off plus there's the lack of defense and the three ball. There's a reason only one duo had ever done it until 2017 and then now we're on our 4th since.

There's currently 14 players scoring 25 ppg.

In Bird and MJs era there were very few 25 ppg let alone teammates

1980-5
1981-5
1982-4
1983-4
1984-6
1985-8
1986-5
1987-7
1988-9
1989-9
1990-7
1991-9
1992-4
1993-5
1996-5
1997-4
1998-3

TS% is kinda garbage tbh.

There's currently like 57 players with a 60 TS%. Back when Bird and Mchale both did it there were only 20



that's why you look at ts% above league average, not just raw ts. League average ts atm is .574, which iirc is the highest ever. So jaylen is currently at +4 and jayson at +5 above league average efficiency.


The Rich Mokeski’s of the Bird era have been replaced with Embiids, Giannises, Lukas and Jokics. Bird and McHlae would still be elite today but the league never had as many superstar talents from all over the world like they do today.


Thought it was Paul.
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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#904 » by sam_I_am » Mon Dec 5, 2022 6:37 pm

bucknersrevenge wrote:
sam_I_am wrote:
steefP2 wrote:

that's why you look at ts% above league average, not just raw ts. League average ts atm is .574, which iirc is the highest ever. So jaylen is currently at +4 and jayson at +5 above league average efficiency.


The Rich Mokeski’s of the Bird era have been replaced with Embiids, Giannises, Lukas and Jokics. Bird and McHlae would still be elite today but the league never had as many superstar talents from all over the world like they do today.


Thought it was Paul.


Yes you are correct.
"I think the criticism's stupid," Stevens said. "So I don't care. I'm with Jaylen (Brown) on that. Those two had achieved more than most 25 and 26 year olds ever had. I'd rather be in the mix and have my guts ripped out than suck."
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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#905 » by Homerclease » Mon Dec 5, 2022 6:40 pm

This thread is amazing. First 15 pages are comedy gold
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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#906 » by sam_I_am » Tue Dec 6, 2022 12:25 am

sam_I_am wrote:I have been hearing a lot of people talking about how we should trade Brown before we have to pay him and this makes no sense.

Anyway, my point is that both Tatum and Brown are on a trajectory to be top 10 wings especially when you consider that in the last 3 drafts only RJ Barrett, Doncic and maybe Michael Porter are in their class. It’s silly to even consider trading Brown unless you are getting an absolute stud big man in return. I think that is true even if Brown never gets any better which is highly unlikely. When Brown is 27 it will be 2023. How many guys out of top 7-8 will still be all stars? Kawhi @ 32 is probably the only one assuming he remains healthy.

There are not a lot of great young wings right now and we actually have 3 of them if Hayward bounces back like we expect. Hayward probably opts out this year for that very reason unless he sucks this year - so if I had to trade one it would be him.


Inspired by Homerclease I looked at the beginning of this thread. At least this post of mine aged well.
"I think the criticism's stupid," Stevens said. "So I don't care. I'm with Jaylen (Brown) on that. Those two had achieved more than most 25 and 26 year olds ever had. I'd rather be in the mix and have my guts ripped out than suck."
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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#907 » by 165bows » Tue Dec 6, 2022 12:36 am

Homerclease wrote:This thread is amazing. First 15 pages are comedy gold

Someone unearth the thread where I pronounce Avery Bradley is as good as Bradley Beal and that Giannis won’t eclipse Kelly Olynyk.
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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#908 » by zoyathedestroya » Tue Dec 6, 2022 12:40 am

If I said something outrageous, I was hacked.
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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#909 » by zoyathedestroya » Tue Dec 6, 2022 6:18 am

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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#910 » by zoyathedestroya » Wed Dec 7, 2022 6:06 am

Last season, Tatum had a game score of 15 or less in 27 of his 76 games. Celtics went 11-16 in those games. Cs also went 2-4 when he didn’t play. This season, he’s only had 2 of his 24 games where he had a sub-15 game score. Celtics were 1-1 in those and won the lone game he missed.

Last season, Brown had a game score of 15 or less in 31 of his 66 games. Celtics went 18-13 in those games. Cs also went 8-8 when he didn’t play. This season, he’s only had 6 of his 23 games where he had sub-15 game score. Celtics are 4-2 in those and won the two games he missed.

*GameScore is a stat on BBRef which is just a rough measure of a player’s productivity in a single game based on raw stats.

My point is we’re seeing more game-to-game consistency from both guys (and not just in terms of scoring/efficiency but in other aspects of the game as well). And it seems when one is having an “off night," the other has picked up the slack.
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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#911 » by sam_I_am » Wed Dec 7, 2022 12:42 pm

165bows wrote:
Homerclease wrote:This thread is amazing. First 15 pages are comedy gold

Someone unearth the thread where I pronounce Avery Bradley is as good as Bradley Beal and that Giannis won’t eclipse Kelly Olynyk.


Some of my favorite posters said some crazy stuff on this thread, such as Tatum/Brown ceiling is Danny Granger/Josh Howard. I myself declared Marcus Smart a bust after 1 summer league game.
"I think the criticism's stupid," Stevens said. "So I don't care. I'm with Jaylen (Brown) on that. Those two had achieved more than most 25 and 26 year olds ever had. I'd rather be in the mix and have my guts ripped out than suck."
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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#912 » by TommyPointGawd » Wed Dec 7, 2022 5:21 pm

sam_I_am wrote:
165bows wrote:
Homerclease wrote:This thread is amazing. First 15 pages are comedy gold

Someone unearth the thread where I pronounce Avery Bradley is as good as Bradley Beal and that Giannis won’t eclipse Kelly Olynyk.


Some of my favorite posters said some crazy stuff on this thread, such as Tatum/Brown ceiling is Danny Granger/Josh Howard. I myself declared Marcus Smart a bust after 1 summer league game.


I remember a poster kept calling Smart a ham and egger. Was it you lol?
I apologize for the things I have said in the past. :cry:
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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#913 » by sam_I_am » Thu Dec 8, 2022 4:14 am

Kawaii Leonard 4-15, 14 pts and Paul George 3-12, 11 pts tonight…..against the Magic!!!

Tatum and Brown are just on a different level right now. Around the league the SF position is trash and we have 2 great ones and the 2 of the best in the league right now.
"I think the criticism's stupid," Stevens said. "So I don't care. I'm with Jaylen (Brown) on that. Those two had achieved more than most 25 and 26 year olds ever had. I'd rather be in the mix and have my guts ripped out than suck."
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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#914 » by zoyathedestroya » Thu Dec 8, 2022 5:37 am

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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#915 » by zoyathedestroya » Thu Dec 8, 2022 8:18 am

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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#916 » by sam_I_am » Thu Dec 8, 2022 4:00 pm

TommyPointGawd wrote:
sam_I_am wrote:
165bows wrote:Someone unearth the thread where I pronounce Avery Bradley is as good as Bradley Beal and that Giannis won’t eclipse Kelly Olynyk.


Some of my favorite posters said some crazy stuff on this thread, such as Tatum/Brown ceiling is Danny Granger/Josh Howard. I myself declared Marcus Smart a bust after 1 summer league game.


I remember a poster kept calling Smart a ham and egger. Was it you lol?


Never used that expression in my life….never will.
"I think the criticism's stupid," Stevens said. "So I don't care. I'm with Jaylen (Brown) on that. Those two had achieved more than most 25 and 26 year olds ever had. I'd rather be in the mix and have my guts ripped out than suck."
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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#917 » by zoyathedestroya » Fri Dec 9, 2022 3:03 am

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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#918 » by Fencer reregistered » Fri Dec 9, 2022 8:15 am

sam_I_am wrote:Kawaii Leonard 4-15, 14 pts and Paul George 3-12, 11 pts tonight…..against the Magic!!!

Tatum and Brown are just on a different level right now. Around the league the SF position is trash and we have 2 great ones and the 2 of the best in the league right now.


Nobody in their age range is as good. The competition is just the older guys who are hanging on and the younger guys who haven't put it together yet.
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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#919 » by sam_I_am » Fri Dec 9, 2022 3:30 pm

Fencer reregistered wrote:
sam_I_am wrote:Kawaii Leonard 4-15, 14 pts and Paul George 3-12, 11 pts tonight…..against the Magic!!!

Tatum and Brown are just on a different level right now. Around the league the SF position is trash and we have 2 great ones and the 2 of the best in the league right now.


Nobody in their age range is as good. The competition is just the older guys who are hanging on and the younger guys who haven't put it together yet.


I think the consensus here is that Tatum is an elite top 5 first team all NBA guy. He is top 3 MVP candidate so far along with Luka and GA. Luka has been the best player in every game he has played for Mavs and highest scorer in all but 1-2 games. Giannis has been top scorer in 19/20 games he has played and was most productive player in all of them.

I do not dispute that Tatum is the difference maker….the guy that makes this team great. His gravity, his defensive disruptiveness, his great rebounding and his unbelievable ability to create maximum distress to opposing defenses makes him ahead of Luka and GA in my book in MVP race.

And yet….in 10 of the 26 games played this year….Brown was arguably player of the game for Celtics. That is an incredible accomplishment and awesome for this team.
"I think the criticism's stupid," Stevens said. "So I don't care. I'm with Jaylen (Brown) on that. Those two had achieved more than most 25 and 26 year olds ever had. I'd rather be in the mix and have my guts ripped out than suck."
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Re: Tatum and Brown 

Post#920 » by zoyathedestroya » Mon Dec 12, 2022 7:21 pm

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