Does Kyrie have a legitimate shot at being MVP next year?

[Higher Power]

well, he should focus of more of being a well rounded player and a team player this season to prove the doubters wrong, then he may have a chance.

he's very much woke so there is no distractions, he will win if he puts his mind to it.

#StayWoke

[SmartWentCrazy]

The MVP is completely a narrative award, so he has a chance. He won't be the best player in the league, though.

I'd bet the top 3 are LeBron, IrvIng and Kawhi.

[chrisab123]

At 15-1 odds he's worth putting $50 on. He's now the main alpha dog. That says something about his chances.

[24istheLAW]

Who cares? Kyrie making the improvements he needs to make, to be a legit top 10 player, isn't going to get him an MVP award. We already know he can score.

[Bostondave]

He has a trememdous shot at it. He's the best player on an improved team. Even if it isn't him he'll likely get the credit as the highest profile guy on the team.

[Big Baby]

He has a trememdous shot at it. He's the best player on an improved team. Even if it isn't him he'll likely get the credit as the highest profile guy on the team.

And we'll be on national TV a lot, too. That'll boost his chances. Not that it matters. The banner is the only thing that matters and I think Kyrie gets that.

[Curmudgeon]

He has no shot. First, he's a Celtic, and Stevens doesn't play hero basketball. Secondly, there is no way he beats out Westbrook,Harden, Leonard or LeBron.

I'd like to see him win finals MVP. That's the award that means something.

[Edug27]

First, he's a Celtic, and Stevens doesn't play hero basketball

Did you miss the whole Isaiah Thomas era?!? Or is this sarcasm that I missed?

[DarkAzcura]

First, he's a Celtic, and Stevens doesn't play hero basketball

Did you miss the whole Isaiah Thomas era?!? Or is this sarcasm that I missed?

Hero ball is isolation basketball/over dribbling into poor shots.

IT didn't really do this often at all. Most of his shots came within the flow of the offensive scheme.

Interestingly enough Kyrie is the most hero ball type of player in the NBA right now. Will be interesting to see if Stevens can coach that out of him a bit.

[Edug27]

First, he's a Celtic, and Stevens doesn't play hero basketball

Did you miss the whole Isaiah Thomas era?!? Or is this sarcasm that I missed?

Hero ball is isolation basketball/over dribbling into poor shots.

IT didn't really do this often at all. Most of his shots came within the flow of the offensive scheme.

Interestingly enough Kyrie is the most hero ball type of player in the NBA right now. Will be interesting to see if Stevens can coach that out of him a bit.

Again... did you watch IT?? IT did that veryyy often. Many of the game threads were full of posts complaining about his hero ball. He was just good enough to make the basket on a lot of those plays. Kyrie will do the same.

[DarkAzcura]

Did you miss the whole Isaiah Thomas era?!? Or is this sarcasm that I missed?

Hero ball is isolation basketball/over dribbling into poor shots.

IT didn't really do this often at all. Most of his shots came within the flow of the offensive scheme.

Interestingly enough Kyrie is the most hero ball type of player in the NBA right now. Will be interesting to see if Stevens can coach that out of him a bit.

Again... did you watch IT?? IT did that veryyy often. Many of the game threads were full of posts complaining about his hero ball. He was just good enough to make the basket on a lot of those plays. Kyrie will do the same.

Yes, I did watch IT? Doesn't change my point, which was that statistically IT didn't play much isolation and didn't actually dribble a ton relative to his peers. You are wrong that he did it very often, at least relative to his peers. Every time someone complained that IT was being a ball hog/playing hero ball/isolating, the first thought I had was that if you think IT is bad, some of you would be in for a rude awakening with ISO heavy guards like Lillard, Walker, and Irving. Unless Stevens completely helps Irving change his game, which I am hoping for.

FYI, I believe Kyrie scored about 20% of his points in isolation while IT scored 9% of his points in isolation. It's a gigantic difference. Irving is well known for dribbling the clock out and holding on to it for 7+ seconds often. IT uncommonly did this.

[Edug27]

Hero ball is isolation basketball/over dribbling into poor shots.

IT didn't really do this often at all. Most of his shots came within the flow of the offensive scheme.

Interestingly enough Kyrie is the most hero ball type of player in the NBA right now. Will be interesting to see if Stevens can coach that out of him a bit.

Again... did you watch IT?? IT did that veryyy often. Many of the game threads were full of posts complaining about his hero ball. He was just good enough to make the basket on a lot of those plays. Kyrie will do the same.

Yes, I did watch IT? Doesn't change my point, which was that statistically IT didn't play much isolation and didn't actually dribble a ton relative to his peers. You are wrong that he did it very often, at least relative to his peers. Every time someone complained that IT was being a ball hog/playing hero ball/isolating, the first thought I had was that if you think IT is bad, some of you would be in for a rude awakening with ISO heavy guards like Lillard, Walker, and Irving. Unless Stevens completely helps Irving change his game, which I am hoping for.

FYI, I believe Kyrie scored about 20% of his points in isolation while IT scored 9% of his points in isolation. It's a gigantic difference. Irving is well known for dribbling the clock out and holding on to it for 7+ seconds often. IT uncommonly did this.

You're limiting hero ball to strictly ISO. IT had the ball in his hands a ton.. and most of the time he was looking for his shot.. he wasn't looking to pass it up ...whether it was coming off the picks, or taking a man off the dribble. Kyrie played iso because, as he explained, its what was asked of him in that system. In Brads system, he is going to have ball in his hands a ton, and he more often than not, will be looking to get his shot off.. within the system.. just like IT. Hero ball is "give me the ball, and I'll get buckets".

[DarkAzcura]

Again... did you watch IT?? IT did that veryyy often. Many of the game threads were full of posts complaining about his hero ball. He was just good enough to make the basket on a lot of those plays. Kyrie will do the same.

Yes, I did watch IT? Doesn't change my point, which was that statistically IT didn't play much isolation and didn't actually dribble a ton relative to his peers. You are wrong that he did it very often, at least relative to his peers. Every time someone complained that IT was being a ball hog/playing hero ball/isolating, the first thought I had was that if you think IT is bad, some of you would be in for a rude awakening with ISO heavy guards like Lillard, Walker, and Irving. Unless Stevens completely helps Irving change his game, which I am hoping for.

FYI, I believe Kyrie scored about 20% of his points in isolation while IT scored 9% of his points in isolation. It's a gigantic difference. Irving is well known for dribbling the clock out and holding on to it for 7+ seconds often. IT uncommonly did this.

You're limiting hero ball to strictly ISO. IT had the ball in his hands a ton.. and most of the time he was looking for his shot.. he wasn't looking to pass it up ...whether it was coming off the picks, or taking a man off the dribble. Kyrie played iso because, as he explained, its what was asked of him in that system. In Brads system, he is going to have ball in his hands a ton, and he more often than not, will be looking to get his shot off.. within the system.. just like IT. Hero ball is "give me the ball, and I'll get buckets".

Nah I disagree. That's not hero ball. Hero ball is literally isolation and poorly advised shots, and yes, that is what I will limit it to. Scoring a ton on its own is not hero ball. It's how you do it that defines it.

IT got his buckets in the flow of the offense. He took some bad shots every now and then like most volume scorers, but his game wasn't hero ball for the most part. Irving's game has a ton of hero ball, which hopefully Stevens can help change.

Semantics I guess, but I completely disagree with what you are calling hero ball. It isn't 'give me the ball and get buckets.' It's getting the ball and scoring outside the flow of the offense rather than within.

[Edug27]

Yes, I did watch IT? Doesn't change my point, which was that statistically IT didn't play much isolation and didn't actually dribble a ton relative to his peers. You are wrong that he did it very often, at least relative to his peers. Every time someone complained that IT was being a ball hog/playing hero ball/isolating, the first thought I had was that if you think IT is bad, some of you would be in for a rude awakening with ISO heavy guards like Lillard, Walker, and Irving. Unless Stevens completely helps Irving change his game, which I am hoping for.

FYI, I believe Kyrie scored about 20% of his points in isolation while IT scored 9% of his points in isolation. It's a gigantic difference. Irving is well known for dribbling the clock out and holding on to it for 7+ seconds often. IT uncommonly did this.

You're limiting hero ball to strictly ISO. IT had the ball in his hands a ton.. and most of the time he was looking for his shot.. he wasn't looking to pass it up ...whether it was coming off the picks, or taking a man off the dribble. Kyrie played iso because, as he explained, its what was asked of him in that system. In Brads system, he is going to have ball in his hands a ton, and he more often than not, will be looking to get his shot off.. within the system.. just like IT. Hero ball is "give me the ball, and I'll get buckets".

Nah I disagree. That's not hero ball. Hero ball is literally isolation and poorly advised shots, and yes, that is what I will limit it to. Scoring a ton on its own is not hero ball. It's how you do it that defines it.

IT got his buckets in the flow of the offense. He took some bad shots every now and then like most volume scorers, but his game wasn't hero ball for the most part. Irving's game has a ton of hero ball, which hopefully Stevens can help change.

Semantics I guess, but I completely disagree with what you are calling hero ball. It isn't 'give me the ball and get buckets.' It's getting the ball and scoring outside the flow of the offense rather than within.

We'll have to agree to disagree I guess.. Just because IT needs a couple screens and picks to get his shot off, doesn't mean it's not hero ball.

[DarkAzcura]

You're limiting hero ball to strictly ISO. IT had the ball in his hands a ton.. and most of the time he was looking for his shot.. he wasn't looking to pass it up ...whether it was coming off the picks, or taking a man off the dribble. Kyrie played iso because, as he explained, its what was asked of him in that system. In Brads system, he is going to have ball in his hands a ton, and he more often than not, will be looking to get his shot off.. within the system.. just like IT. Hero ball is "give me the ball, and I'll get buckets".

Nah I disagree. That's not hero ball. Hero ball is literally isolation and poorly advised shots, and yes, that is what I will limit it to. Scoring a ton on its own is not hero ball. It's how you do it that defines it.

IT got his buckets in the flow of the offense. He took some bad shots every now and then like most volume scorers, but his game wasn't hero ball for the most part. Irving's game has a ton of hero ball, which hopefully Stevens can help change.

Semantics I guess, but I completely disagree with what you are calling hero ball. It isn't 'give me the ball and get buckets.' It's getting the ball and scoring outside the flow of the offense rather than within.

We'll have to agree to disagree I guess.. Just because IT needs a couple screens and picks to get his shot off, doesn't mean it's not hero ball.

By your definition, it seems like you think every volume scorer plays a lot of hero ball (Curry, Durant, Lebron, Leonard, etc).

Yeah haha we will have to agree to disagree. The very definition of hero ball originated from players who did their own thing with no respect to their team's offense (like Kobe..and even Pierce once and a while). Using screens and picks is pretty much the exact opposite of that. =p

[Edug27]

Nah I disagree. That's not hero ball. Hero ball is literally isolation and poorly advised shots, and yes, that is what I will limit it to. Scoring a ton on its own is not hero ball. It's how you do it that defines it.

IT got his buckets in the flow of the offense. He took some bad shots every now and then like most volume scorers, but his game wasn't hero ball for the most part. Irving's game has a ton of hero ball, which hopefully Stevens can help change.

Semantics I guess, but I completely disagree with what you are calling hero ball. It isn't 'give me the ball and get buckets.' It's getting the ball and scoring outside the flow of the offense rather than within.

We'll have to agree to disagree I guess.. Just because IT needs a couple screens and picks to get his shot off, doesn't mean it's not hero ball.

By your definition, it seems like you think every volume scorer plays a lot of hero ball (Curry, Durant, Lebron, Leonard, etc).

Yeah haha we will have to agree to disagree. The very definition of hero ball originated from players who did their own thing with no respect to their team's offense (like Kobe..and even Pierce once and a while). Using screens and picks is pretty much the exact opposite of that. =p

Well, actually... By your definition, Lebron (20%) is just as much of an ISO player as Kyrie. And in fact, in 2016, Kyrie (14%) was less of an ISO player than KD and Chris Paul. And that 14% in 2016, isn't much of a differene than Kawhis 12% in 2017.

[NormanDale]

There is a non-zero chance he is the closest thing to Curry as you can get next season. His ability to shoot is phenomenal and I'm excited to see Brad force him to rip off 9 threes a game. But no, he's not gonna win the MVP.

It's funny, I feel exactly the opposite of this post. I don't think Kyrie is close to as good as Curry--but I still think he could win MVP. But then again, I don't think Westbrook is as good as Curry and he was MVP last year (deservedly so, imo).

If (a) Kyrie has an equivalent season to IT last year, (b) the Celtics win 5-8 more games than last year, and (c) no one does anything statistically insane like Westbrook and Harden's seasons last year, then I think Kyrie will win MVP.

I don't think it's likely that all three of those things I mentioned will happen, but it's certainly not out of the realm of possibility.

[Big Baby]

There is a non-zero chance he is the closest thing to Curry as you can get next season. His ability to shoot is phenomenal and I'm excited to see Brad force him to rip off 9 threes a game. But no, he's not gonna win the MVP.

It's funny, I feel exactly the opposite of this post. I don't think Kyrie is close to as good as Curry--but I still think he could win MVP. But then again, I don't think Westbrook is as good as Curry and he was MVP last year (deservedly so, imo).

If (a) Kyrie has an equivalent season to IT last year, (b) the Celtics win 5-8 more games than last year, and (c) no one does anything statistically insane like Westbrook and Harden's seasons last year, then I think Kyrie will win MVP.

I don't think it's likely that all three of those things I mentioned will happen, but it's certainly not out of the realm of possibility.

Steph Curry is overrated. Makes a bunch of stupid mistakes in big moments and chokes in big games.

Kyrie >>> Curry. You'll find out soon enough.

[NormanDale]

There is a non-zero chance he is the closest thing to Curry as you can get next season. His ability to shoot is phenomenal and I'm excited to see Brad force him to rip off 9 threes a game. But no, he's not gonna win the MVP.

It's funny, I feel exactly the opposite of this post. I don't think Kyrie is close to as good as Curry--but I still think he could win MVP. But then again, I don't think Westbrook is as good as Curry and he was MVP last year (deservedly so, imo).

If (a) Kyrie has an equivalent season to IT last year, (b) the Celtics win 5-8 more games than last year, and (c) no one does anything statistically insane like Westbrook and Harden's seasons last year, then I think Kyrie will win MVP.

I don't think it's likely that all three of those things I mentioned will happen, but it's certainly not out of the realm of possibility.

Steph Curry is overrated. Makes a bunch of stupid mistakes in big moments and chokes in big games.

Kyrie >>> Curry. You'll find out soon enough.

Steph Curry is most definitely not overrated. But I hope you're right that Kyrie can be better than him, because if he is, the Celtics become a real contender, and are probably favored over Cleveland.

I don't see it happening, but I hope I'm wrong.

[VeryMuchWoke]

Yes, I did watch IT? Doesn't change my point, which was that statistically IT didn't play much isolation and didn't actually dribble a ton relative to his peers. You are wrong that he did it very often, at least relative to his peers. Every time someone complained that IT was being a ball hog/playing hero ball/isolating, the first thought I had was that if you think IT is bad, some of you would be in for a rude awakening with ISO heavy guards like Lillard, Walker, and Irving. Unless Stevens completely helps Irving change his game, which I am hoping for.

FYI, I believe Kyrie scored about 20% of his points in isolation while IT scored 9% of his points in isolation. It's a gigantic difference. Irving is well known for dribbling the clock out and holding on to it for 7+ seconds often. IT uncommonly did this.

You're limiting hero ball to strictly ISO. IT had the ball in his hands a ton.. and most of the time he was looking for his shot.. he wasn't looking to pass it up ...whether it was coming off the picks, or taking a man off the dribble. Kyrie played iso because, as he explained, its what was asked of him in that system. In Brads system, he is going to have ball in his hands a ton, and he more often than not, will be looking to get his shot off.. within the system.. just like IT. Hero ball is "give me the ball, and I'll get buckets".

Nah I disagree. That's not hero ball. Hero ball is literally isolation and poorly advised shots, and yes, that is what I will limit it to. Scoring a ton on its own is not hero ball. It's how you do it that defines it.

IT got his buckets in the flow of the offense. He took some bad shots every now and then like most volume scorers, but his game wasn't hero ball for the most part. Irving's game has a ton of hero ball, which hopefully Stevens can help change.

Semantics I guess, but I completely disagree with what you are calling hero ball. It isn't 'give me the ball and get buckets.' It's getting the ball and scoring outside the flow of the offense rather than within.

And what if the offense calls for isolation? Is it still hero ball? I'm Cleveland Kyrie was asked to score in isolation, which seems to be related to him wanting out.

To me hero ball is trying to do too much (ie "be the hero") in big spots. Could be over-dribbling, or trying to thread the needle on a "homerun" pass instead of making the simple play and trusting your teammates.