Celtics 112 @ Hornets 117 Post-game Notes (9-8)

[Infinite Llamas]

We are going to have the same record as the Kingz by the end of the night! That's just Mind Bottling!!!!

And Kings fans are having a lot more fun watching their games than Celtics fans.

Young overachieving teams are always fun to watch. expectations are low and when you win, it's always a great bonus. Look at the Clippers...in a tie for first place in the west and they have no big stars on their team. But they mesh so well and they just click as a team and their fanbase must be loving this success post trades of griffin and paul.

[Tiny ball]

Kyrie Smart, and Morris have been good but not great this year.

Horford and Tatum have underperformed but aren't the problem.

Everyone else has been terrible.

True but blame goes to Stevens for playing 10 guys little league minutes and not committing to a rotation. Giving Baynes a fake start (7 minutes) just to give the optics of an adjustment is weak. You can't call your team out for lack of toughness and then play the guy who is struggling most (Hayward) 31 minutes. Meanwhile Jaylen and Terry came out hard tonight and got 19 minutes a piece.

No way Hayward should be out there over Brown. Stevens has been out coached by everyone this year.

I was Hayward fan but he is not getting the job done.

I think Williams would help this team more than Hayward by far. I would give him 4 or five fouls a game when these guards are going off. He will be blocking some shots.

[Tiny ball]

Sure you can think it's lazy. If we're the 7th seed come January then i'll totally agree with you.

If we're not a top-2 seed by January we'll still be a massive disappointment in regards to expectations

Not even really worried about seeding. There isn't a single team in the East we can't beat in a 7 game series even as things stand. It's just frustrating to look so awful in the meantime. You look at that 4th quarter and OT against Toronto and compare it to the last two games and it's like..what the actual ****.

We are playing like there is no team in the east that we can beat in 7

[Tiny ball]

FWIW, the biggest problem by far, and I mean more than the next three problems combined, is our crunch time offense.

Over and over again, we are closing these games with big scoring droughts due to a disjointed, disorganized, flat offense. If Kyrie or maybe Tatum doesn't go off while playing iso hero ball, we literally have nothing.

Yep 100% agreed.

They'll figure it out. Too much talent not to figure it out. I have faith but can understand why people are seriously questioning the team given the hype the media was spewing out and the fact that it seems like the guys have bought that hype.

Lazy phrase ignoring the massive problems with this team. We're now the 7th seed. Too much talent doesn't land you in the 7 spot.

It does when you start the season with 3 guys coming back from major injuries.

[FlatearthZorro]

Tommy called out the key time Irving was on the bench for a while and our 10 point lead was blown.

Jokes aside. Brad does this so often. A player is doing great, Brad benches them, we are losing the lead, Brad wont bring them back in for a LONG periods of time.

Anyhow we're trash, yea. Middle of the pack team right now.

[peachbucket]

Yep 100% agreed.

They'll figure it out. Too much talent not to figure it out. I have faith but can understand why people are seriously questioning the team given the hype the media was spewing out and the fact that it seems like the guys have bought that hype.

Lazy phrase ignoring the massive problems with this team. We're now the 7th seed. Too much talent doesn't land you in the 7 spot.

It does when you start the season with 3 guys coming back from major injuries.

Thank you. Everybody needs to relax. The goal is not to win 55 games but to get everyone playing as cohesively as possible in the designed system come playoffs. The way to do that is to go through those growing pains now...that means Hayward and Brown need to be out there.

Our defense is on point and arguably better than last year only giving up 31% on 3's.

The offense is designed to generate good three point shots and is doing exactly that. For whatever reason Horford, Brown, Tatum, and Rozier have all simultaneously **** the bed from 3 (especially wide open) to open the season...I am sure they are feeling the pressure of their collective poor start which is exacerbating the problem...they will eventually revert to form and we will start playing up to expectations.

I would be much more concerned if we were the hottest shooting team in the league with a bottom of the barrel defense.

[cloverleaf]

Lazy phrase ignoring the massive problems with this team. We're now the 7th seed. Too much talent doesn't land you in the 7 spot.

It does when you start the season with 3 guys coming back from major injuries.

Thank you. Everybody needs to relax. The goal is not to win 55 games but to get everyone playing as cohesively as possible in the designed system come playoffs. The way to do that is to go through those growing pains now...that means Hayward and Brown need to be out there.

Our defense is on point and arguably better than last year only giving up 31% on 3's.

The offense is designed to generate good three point shots and is doing exactly that. For whatever reason Horford, Brown, Tatum, and Rozier have all simultaneously **** the bed from 3 (especially wide open) to open the season...I am sure they are feeling the pressure of their collective poor start which is exacerbating the problem...they will eventually revert to form and we will start playing up to expectations.

I would be much more concerned if we were the hottest shooting team in the league with a bottom of the barrel defense.

Tatum's at .394 on the year from 3--that's pretty good. Terry at .339 isn't bad. The big disappointments on that front are AH at .304, GH at .298, JB at .273 and MS at .255. All of those guys, except Smart, are taking more attempts per game than Terry.

Kyrie and Tatum should probably be taking more shots, and those bottom-dwellers fewer. But no offense in the NBA can thrive with just perimeter shooting. Even the Warriors take it to the hole more than these C's.

[cloverleaf]

Kyrie Smart, and Morris have been good but not great this year.

Horford and Tatum have underperformed but aren't the problem.

Everyone else has been terrible.

People just look at raw shooting averages and overrate Morris, underrate Tatum. Defense counts too.

[BillTheGOAT]

Stevens is a lame duck, I think he's lost the locker room. Lets end this right now! Honeymoon is over, stop saying he's the best coach in the league. He is good coaching teams that doesnt have stars. He is not a players coach he is all about X's and O's.

[pac213up]

Can't shoot, can't win. Teams at the top of TS% are winning, teams at the bottom....not so much. Offensively this team is a mess.

[cloverleaf]

Kemba just brutalized Smart for the big 3 at the end there.

[Gooner]

Hayward has to play less,it's that simple.He is dragging this team's energy down right now,and that energy has been the trademark of this team last year.He didn't just break his leg,his spirit got broken too,and he'll need more time for that to heal.You can't blame him,but you can blame Stevens for not making an adjustment.He acts like it's the same Hayward he signed from Utah.

Hayward should be playing about 20 minutes off the bench at this point,that's the role that would suit him and the team right now.

As someone said,starting Baynes instead of Hayward,and then only playing him 7 minutes,with Hayward playing 31,was such a weak move.If you make a change,then make a change.These fake changes won't help at all.It just exposes Brad's unwillingness to adress the real issue.

Stevens is a proven coach in regards to helping average teams overachieve,but he still has to prove that he is a championship level coach.His leadership will be tested this season more than ever.

[Saint Lazarus]

speechless

[Silky]

A change MUST be made.

It become imperative.


Need more role players.
Trade hayward trade brown trade terry.



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[peachbucket]

It does when you start the season with 3 guys coming back from major injuries.

Thank you. Everybody needs to relax. The goal is not to win 55 games but to get everyone playing as cohesively as possible in the designed system come playoffs. The way to do that is to go through those growing pains now...that means Hayward and Brown need to be out there.

Our defense is on point and arguably better than last year only giving up 31% on 3's.

The offense is designed to generate good three point shots and is doing exactly that. For whatever reason Horford, Brown, Tatum, and Rozier have all simultaneously **** the bed from 3 (especially wide open) to open the season...I am sure they are feeling the pressure of their collective poor start which is exacerbating the problem...they will eventually revert to form and we will start playing up to expectations.

I would be much more concerned if we were the hottest shooting team in the league with a bottom of the barrel defense.

Tatum's at .394 on the year from 3--that's pretty good. Terry at .339 isn't bad. The big disappointments on that front are AH at .304, GH at .298, JB at .273 and MS at .255. All of those guys, except Smart, are taking more attempts per game than Terry.

Kyrie and Tatum should probably be taking more shots, and those bottom-dwellers fewer. But no offense in the NBA can thrive with just perimeter shooting. Even the Warriors take it to the hole more than these C's.

Tatum shot .434 last year and Rozier shot .381...that means that 5 out of the top 7 guys are shooting significantly worse than last year
with only Morris shooting better...and Hayward's .283 on nearly 4 attempts a game is not helping anything.

The problem is that to take it to the hole effectively you have to start hitting your outside shots...otherwise, the defense will continue to play off, go under screens, and send help leaving guys open outside. Golden State gets to the rim because they shoot such a high percentage from three forcing the defense all the way out to the three point line...they are also a much better at cutting and passing then the young Celtics.

[Silky]

Thank you. Everybody needs to relax. The goal is not to win 55 games but to get everyone playing as cohesively as possible in the designed system come playoffs. The way to do that is to go through those growing pains now...that means Hayward and Brown need to be out there.

Our defense is on point and arguably better than last year only giving up 31% on 3's.

The offense is designed to generate good three point shots and is doing exactly that. For whatever reason Horford, Brown, Tatum, and Rozier have all simultaneously **** the bed from 3 (especially wide open) to open the season...I am sure they are feeling the pressure of their collective poor start which is exacerbating the problem...they will eventually revert to form and we will start playing up to expectations.

I would be much more concerned if we were the hottest shooting team in the league with a bottom of the barrel defense.

Tatum's at .394 on the year from 3--that's pretty good. Terry at .339 isn't bad. The big disappointments on that front are AH at .304, GH at .298, JB at .273 and MS at .255. All of those guys, except Smart, are taking more attempts per game than Terry.

Kyrie and Tatum should probably be taking more shots, and those bottom-dwellers fewer. But no offense in the NBA can thrive with just perimeter shooting. Even the Warriors take it to the hole more than these C's.

Tatum shot .434 last year and Rozier shot .381...that means that 5 out of the top 7 guys are shooting significantly worse than last year
with only Morris shooting better...and Hayward's .283 on nearly 4 attempts a game is not helping anything.

The problem is that to take it to the hole effectively you have to start hitting your outside shots...otherwise, the defense will continue to play off, go under screens, and send help leaving guys open outside. Golden State gets to the rim because they shoot such a high percentage from three forcing the defense all the way out to the three point line...they are also a much better at cutting and passing then the young Celtics.

Execution of plays will get you to the rim.

Run post ups, cuts, curls, ball movement.


In isolation plays, yes, if your man is playing off of you it is significantly harder to get to rim.

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[cl2117]

Kemba Walker is good at basketball. That is all.

[radcot]

The problem with benching Hayward - and I agree that he hasn't played (mainly shot) well in most games - is that he is often the only guy playing offense as though basketball is a team sport.

[cloverleaf]

The problem with benching Hayward - and I agree that he hasn't played (mainly shot) well in most games - is that he is often the only guy playing offense as though basketball is a team sport.

He's also a surprisingly good defender. My guess is that he got sent to the bench first because of the feared perception that he started though still recovering from injury because he is Stevens's pet. But note he got the more minutes and was the guy in closing instead of Brown. (Note: It was Smart being humiliated on D by Kemba and Kyrie and Tatum missing shots late that sealed the loss, but at least that's who you want on Kemba and who you want taking the late shots.)

[philing00]

Thought the game was entertaining for the most part. The hornets have really improved this year.
We played horrible first and last 5 minutes. Lost our composure when we lost the lead. Kyrie was trying to score himself every trip down.
Liked how we were making an effort to drive and finish at the rim more for most of the game.
Should’ve doubled Kemba when he was hot.