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General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2

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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1441 » by Bleeding Green » Wed Mar 17, 2021 5:48 pm

FlatearthZorro wrote:
Bleeding Green wrote:I feel like the bidding for Watson is going to be obscene. Patriots have the capspace, but is it worth it? Surely the Jets, Lions, Broncos, Dolphins could beat whatever the Patriots have to offer.


NFL has kinda turned into the NBA. If Watson says "I ain't playing for Jets, Lions, Dolphins, I want to go to the Pats", there is a good likelihood he's on the Pats. Problem here is that it would still take A LOT to get him.

Nah, NFL players don't have anywhere close to that leverage save for a few players.
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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1442 » by FlatearthZorro » Wed Mar 17, 2021 6:07 pm

SmartWentCrazy wrote:
FlatearthZorro wrote:
Bleeding Green wrote:I feel like the bidding for Watson is going to be obscene. Patriots have the capspace, but is it worth it? Surely the Jets, Lions, Broncos, Dolphins could beat whatever the Patriots have to offer.


NFL has kinda turned into the NBA. If Watson says "I ain't playing for Jets, Lions, Dolphins, I want to go to the Pats", there is a good likelihood he's on the Pats. Problem here is that it would still take A LOT to get him.


The NFL players want to have power like the NBA players, but NFL owners are not NBA owners and could not give a **** less.


That's good. I kinda thought it was becoming the same, but it's good.
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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1443 » by threrf23 » Wed Mar 17, 2021 6:20 pm

In any event, I don't think Watson necessarily cares where he goes, he just wants to be the hell away from the Texans.
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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1444 » by 1st banana » Wed Mar 17, 2021 7:03 pm

Pats bring back karras looking like they’re letting Andrews walk I am crushed totally killing our free agency win for me.
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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1445 » by threrf23 » Thu Mar 18, 2021 3:36 am

Umm

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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1446 » by The Comedian » Thu Mar 18, 2021 3:50 am

1st banana wrote:Pats bring back karras looking like they’re letting Andrews walk I am crushed totally killing our free agency win for me.


Lol is it really killing it for you?
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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1447 » by Captain_Caveman » Thu Mar 18, 2021 3:53 am

Van Noy back to the NE. 2 years, up to $13m.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/31084031/new-england-patriots-welcome-lb-kyle-van-noy-back-fold-just-one-season-miami-dolphins

Pats basically still have enough to still add Watson, or Jimmy G if Gilmore is involved.

Nuuuuts.
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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1448 » by The Comedian » Thu Mar 18, 2021 3:57 am

Captain_Caveman wrote:Van Noy back to the NE. 2 years, up to $13m.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/31084031/new-england-patriots-welcome-lb-kyle-van-noy-back-fold-just-one-season-miami-dolphins

Pats basically still have enough to still add Watson, or Jimmy G if Gilmore is involved.

Nuuuuts.


Has been an INSANE few days. They are not done either, it’s pretty crazy.

The defense is going to be bonkers next year, they have one of the best RB cores in the league, are loaded at TE, got a good possession receiver, a good over the top threat. And they still have 25ish million to play with, then the draft.

And people doubted Bill lol.
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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1449 » by 1st banana » Thu Mar 18, 2021 4:09 am

The Comedian wrote:
1st banana wrote:Pats bring back karras looking like they’re letting Andrews walk I am crushed totally killing our free agency win for me.


Lol is it really killing it for you?

Well no of course not just live andrews lol but he’s really good and I don’t think karras is anywhere near as good. Our line was significantly worse when Andrews was out for the season and karras replaced him.

Edit: would rather us pick up Alex Mack for dirt cheap.
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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1450 » by Captain_Caveman » Thu Mar 18, 2021 5:17 am

The Comedian wrote:
Captain_Caveman wrote:Van Noy back to the NE. 2 years, up to $13m.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/31084031/new-england-patriots-welcome-lb-kyle-van-noy-back-fold-just-one-season-miami-dolphins

Pats basically still have enough to still add Watson, or Jimmy G if Gilmore is involved.

Nuuuuts.


Has been an INSANE few days. They are not done either, it’s pretty crazy.

The defense is going to be bonkers next year, they have one of the best RB cores in the league, are loaded at TE, got a good possession receiver, a good over the top threat. And they still have 25ish million to play with, then the draft.

And people doubted Bill lol.


I got it at about $15m, minus whatever they need for the draft and emergency purposes. Watson cap hit at $14.5m.

LOL @ no one wants to play for Belichick.
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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1451 » by SmartWentCrazy » Thu Mar 18, 2021 1:33 pm

A) were pretty close to done. At about 15M in space, draft class will take 3-5 and we historically like to take 10M in cap into the season for flexibility and to protect vs incentives. We can always be opportunistic and trade Gilly [frees up 7] and restructure Hightower [could free 8-10 if we extend], but guessing were done with large moves as of now.

B) there is virtually zero chance McNair or Easterby would allow the Caserio to send Watson to the Pats.
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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1452 » by Celtics_Champs » Thu Mar 18, 2021 1:36 pm

I don't get the hysteria and the crying over Cam Newton. They didn't sign him to a 3 year 45 million dollar deal. He got another prove it deal with a much better team and its day 3 into the off season. We missed out on who? Red Rifle? Yuck. Kissing Tiddy's Trubisky? That wouldn't have helped.

Bill is set up just fine. He will draft his QB of the future and have Cam do one of two things..
-Plays bad for like 3 million dollars but helps the new kid out and mentors him.
-Or he actually does play well makes the playoffs and earns up to less than what most backups are making

It also gives BB the flexibility to trade for a star if they shake loose. There's DeShaun, Wilson, or well....Jimmy. First two I would cream, Jimmy....I'd rather just draft a kid.
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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1453 » by The Comedian » Thu Mar 18, 2021 4:42 pm

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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1454 » by Bleeding Green » Thu Mar 18, 2021 7:42 pm

Celtics_Champs wrote:I don't get the hysteria and the crying over Cam Newton. They didn't sign him to a 3 year 45 million dollar deal. He got another prove it deal with a much better team and its day 3 into the off season. We missed out on who? Red Rifle? Yuck. Kissing Tiddy's Trubisky? That wouldn't have helped.

Bill is set up just fine. He will draft his QB of the future and have Cam do one of two things..
-Plays bad for like 3 million dollars but helps the new kid out and mentors him.
-Or he actually does play well makes the playoffs and earns up to less than what most backups are making

It also gives BB the flexibility to trade for a star if they shake loose. There's DeShaun, Wilson, or well....Jimmy. First two I would cream, Jimmy....I'd rather just draft a kid.

I think Cam can be fine. He was brutal last year and the team, with zero offensive threats besides running backs was still in position to win at least 3 more games in the final drive of the game. Add in the two great tight ends alone to last years roster and surely they find a way to win a couple of those games. And the defense is miles better, especially the front seven which was bottom-5 in the NFL last year. I just worry if his shoulder can hold up for a full season. Look at him against Seattle early season and then what he looked like later in the season.
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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1455 » by soxfan2003 » Thu Mar 18, 2021 9:24 pm

1st banana wrote:Pats bring back karras looking like they’re letting Andrews walk I am crushed totally killing our free agency win for me.


I am fine with Patriots moving on from Andrews. Seems like a good decision. Patriots success in drafting/developing offensive lineman is better than wide receivers so I can see why the team didn't want to pay a premium for Andrews but was willing to probably overpay a bit at the receiver position. Andrews better overall than Karras but perhaps asking for twice the salary in a relatively long term commitment.

They may have already identified a guard/center in the draft who they think will be as good as both Karras and Andrews.

I really like what the Patriots have done so far. I do hope they get a better veteran backup QB than at least Hoyer especially if the team isn't already planning on moving on from Stidham. The Bills just got a good backup QB that still has some potential for cheap.

Trubisky has won 8 more games 8 more regular season games than he has lost. The narrative of him sucking may not be as true as some fans indicate. Even though he can run some from what I saw his receivers at times really struggled to get open the playoffs so he may have been unfairly ridiculed for Chicago's playoff failures.

There have been HOF QB's given up on their original teams as busts or just not that good. Steve Young may be best example but not only one.

When Tom Brady was the starting QB given his durability and value to the team, it was okay to go with lousy backups some years since the season was probably lost if Brady missed a playoff game or half the regular season.

Cam Newton is no longer MVP Cam Newton but the Patriots should position the team so the season is not lost if Newton gets hurt or regresses.

Maybe if Bill Belichick doesn't draft a QB, he is going after a QB from a team that does.
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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1456 » by 1st banana » Thu Mar 18, 2021 9:37 pm

soxfan2003 wrote:
1st banana wrote:Pats bring back karras looking like they’re letting Andrews walk I am crushed totally killing our free agency win for me.


I am fine with Patriots moving on from Andrews. Seems like a good decision. Patriots success in drafting/developing offensive lineman is better than wide receivers so I can see why the team didn't want to pay a premium for Andrews but was willing to probably overpay a bit at the receiver position. Andrews better overall than Karras but perhaps asking for twice the salary in a relatively long term commitment.

They may have already identified a guard/center in the draft who they think will be as good as both Karras and Andrews.

I really like what the Patriots have done so far. I do hope they get a better veteran backup QB than at least Hoyer especially if the team isn't already planning on moving on from Stidham. The Bills just got a good backup QB that still has some potential for cheap.

Trubisky has won 8 more games 8 more regular season games than he has lost. The narrative of him sucking may not be as true as some fans indicate. Even though he can run some from what I saw his receivers at times really struggled to get open the playoffs so he may have been unfairly ridiculed for Chicago's playoff failures.

There have been HOF QB's given up on their original teams as busts or just not that good. Steve Young may be best example but not only one.

When Tom Brady was the starting QB given his durability and value to the team, it was okay to go with lousy backups some years since the season was probably lost if Brady missed a playoff game or half the regular season.

Cam Newton is no longer MVP Cam Newton but the Patriots should position the team so the season is not lost if Newton gets hurt or regresses.

Maybe if Bill Belichick doesn't draft a QB, he is going after a QB from a team that does.

Yea I was more just being dramatic because karras isn’t even really a center and struggles with snaps and just knowing the right checks and protections. He is a better pass blocker tho with Andrews being a much better run blocker fwiw.

This is supposedly a deep center/interior line draft tho so maybe in the 2nd or 3rd they like someone.

As not crazy as I am about cam the Trubiscuit isn’t great either. He had an awesome defense for basically every start he had and a solid #1 pass catcher and never really improved even regressed last year.

Hopefully we draft Lance or jones or whoever and cam can mentor and be the bridge or surprise me and play well. Cams shoulder is still worrisome tho.
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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1457 » by soxfan2003 » Thu Mar 18, 2021 11:29 pm

1st banana wrote:
soxfan2003 wrote:
1st banana wrote:Pats bring back karras looking like they’re letting Andrews walk I am crushed totally killing our free agency win for me.


I am fine with Patriots moving on from Andrews. Seems like a good decision. Patriots success in drafting/developing offensive lineman is better than wide receivers so I can see why the team didn't want to pay a premium for Andrews but was willing to probably overpay a bit at the receiver position. Andrews better overall than Karras but perhaps asking for twice the salary in a relatively long term commitment.

They may have already identified a guard/center in the draft who they think will be as good as both Karras and Andrews.

I really like what the Patriots have done so far. I do hope they get a better veteran backup QB than at least Hoyer especially if the team isn't already planning on moving on from Stidham. The Bills just got a good backup QB that still has some potential for cheap.

Trubisky has won 8 more games 8 more regular season games than he has lost. The narrative of him sucking may not be as true as some fans indicate. Even though he can run some from what I saw his receivers at times really struggled to get open the playoffs so he may have been unfairly ridiculed for Chicago's playoff failures.

There have been HOF QB's given up on their original teams as busts or just not that good. Steve Young may be best example but not only one.

When Tom Brady was the starting QB given his durability and value to the team, it was okay to go with lousy backups some years since the season was probably lost if Brady missed a playoff game or half the regular season.

Cam Newton is no longer MVP Cam Newton but the Patriots should position the team so the season is not lost if Newton gets hurt or regresses.

Maybe if Bill Belichick doesn't draft a QB, he is going after a QB from a team that does.

Yea I was more just being dramatic because karras isn’t even really a center and struggles with snaps and just knowing the right checks and protections. He is a better pass blocker tho with Andrews being a much better run blocker fwiw.

This is supposedly a deep center/interior line draft tho so maybe in the 2nd or 3rd they like someone.

As not crazy as I am about cam the Trubiscuit isn’t great either. He had an awesome defense for basically every start he had and a solid #1 pass catcher and never really improved even regressed last year.

Hopefully we draft Lance or jones or whoever and cam can mentor and be the bridge or surprise me and play well. Cams shoulder is still worrisome tho.


I am not even stating that Trubisky will be a top 10 QB with any consistency ever but based upon what I saw of him vs the Saints he is being scapegoated for Bears playoff failures over the years and not that far off of top 15 right now. Without a doubt, Mitch Trubisky is one of the top 25 quarterbacks in the NFL right now. Trubisky has been up and down stats wise. He has been near the bottom in QBR and near the very top in QBR.... Seems just as much of a reflection on the team as on him.

He is unfairly compared to Mahomes. Mahomes went to the team in the NFL with the best weapons on offense that was a perennial playoff team. Even a declining Alex Smith was suddenly rejuvenated when the Chiefs added Tyreek Hill. Trubisky went to a bad team with crap weapons in comparison to KC. Yes, Mahomes is better but I doubt Mahomes would be anywhere nearly as highly regarded as he is right now if drafted by the Bears. When Mahomes lost a bunch of games in college with a bad team he was underrated. See a pattern.

Except on a trick play, it was often a huge struggle for Bears receivers from what I saw to get open when they played the Saints in this years playoffs. I mean big time struggle for Bears receivers. They looked overmatched which isn't a surprise since Saints were great defensively. Trubisky had more than a few great throws in that game to go along with one bad decision into a tight window I saw that wasn't even intercepted. By the media for whatever reason, he wasn't credited enough for them since his name is Trubisky. I believe Brady/Mahomes/Rodgers whoever starting that game for Chicago would have lost it based upon what I saw.

Bears receiver dropped a 50 yard perfect TD pass right threw his hands when he was wide open by a couple of steps. That dropped pass was clearly not Trubisky's fault -- pass was perfect -- but that dropped pass and a Saints player fumbling against Tampa Bay may have ended up being the reason Trubisky is no longer with the Bears. Do the Bears move on from Trubisky if the Saints do better in playoffs?

Trubisky may end up a QB the Bears regret letting go. An offense isn't usually made by 1 receiver either. Overall, Bears offensive weapons are not that good.... They are a team that appears to focus more on defense which isn't surprising since they play in Chicago.

I can see refusing to pay Trubisky decent money when you have the clear leverage over him but if he was willing to stay around for cheap money and compete for a job like he sort of indicated he was, I would not have let him get away when you are forced to turn to an inferior option.

29-21 Bears with Trubisky.
28-25 Texans with Deshaun Watson. (granted skewed by this past season but still this stat does show something worth mentioning)

And Trubisky was the player drafted by the worse team. Not saying Trubisky is as good as Watson -- he isn't right now -- but if the two flipped teams, I think peoples perspectives would be different since Trubisky would have better stats than he has had and Watson worse.

And Nick Foles is Nick Foles but he lost games with Chicago and Trubisky won more games than he lost with the Bears. And even moving beyond Foles, Bears if my quick math are correct are 4-14 without Trubisky and 29-21 without him.

Andy Dalton at this stage of his career appears to be a clear downgrade over Trubisky and I believe Chicago is paying him more than Bills will be paying the younger Trubisky. Makes no sense unless I am missing something....

The Bears just appear to be a "dumb as rocks" franchise. And their fan base, may be "dumb as rocks" for probably urging the team to scapegoat Trubisky.

If Bears had to pay Trubisky anywhere near or even half of what Wentz or Goff got in any sort of long term contract, I can certainly see moving on but the huge mistake they appeared to make is when he was willing to stay pretty much on probably a Cam bargain like deal.

I think Bills management is very convinced that they got a steal in their backup QB and Trubisky is going to get a chance to start for a smarter team than the Bears very soon.
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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1458 » by 1st banana » Fri Mar 19, 2021 12:39 am

soxfan2003 wrote:
1st banana wrote:
soxfan2003 wrote:
I am fine with Patriots moving on from Andrews. Seems like a good decision. Patriots success in drafting/developing offensive lineman is better than wide receivers so I can see why the team didn't want to pay a premium for Andrews but was willing to probably overpay a bit at the receiver position. Andrews better overall than Karras but perhaps asking for twice the salary in a relatively long term commitment.

They may have already identified a guard/center in the draft who they think will be as good as both Karras and Andrews.

I really like what the Patriots have done so far. I do hope they get a better veteran backup QB than at least Hoyer especially if the team isn't already planning on moving on from Stidham. The Bills just got a good backup QB that still has some potential for cheap.

Trubisky has won 8 more games 8 more regular season games than he has lost. The narrative of him sucking may not be as true as some fans indicate. Even though he can run some from what I saw his receivers at times really struggled to get open the playoffs so he may have been unfairly ridiculed for Chicago's playoff failures.

There have been HOF QB's given up on their original teams as busts or just not that good. Steve Young may be best example but not only one.

When Tom Brady was the starting QB given his durability and value to the team, it was okay to go with lousy backups some years since the season was probably lost if Brady missed a playoff game or half the regular season.

Cam Newton is no longer MVP Cam Newton but the Patriots should position the team so the season is not lost if Newton gets hurt or regresses.

Maybe if Bill Belichick doesn't draft a QB, he is going after a QB from a team that does.

Yea I was more just being dramatic because karras isn’t even really a center and struggles with snaps and just knowing the right checks and protections. He is a better pass blocker tho with Andrews being a much better run blocker fwiw.

This is supposedly a deep center/interior line draft tho so maybe in the 2nd or 3rd they like someone.

As not crazy as I am about cam the Trubiscuit isn’t great either. He had an awesome defense for basically every start he had and a solid #1 pass catcher and never really improved even regressed last year.

Hopefully we draft Lance or jones or whoever and cam can mentor and be the bridge or surprise me and play well. Cams shoulder is still worrisome tho.


I am not even stating that Trubisky will be a top 10 QB with any consistency ever but based upon what I saw of him vs the Saints he is being scapegoated for Bears playoff failures over the years and not that far off of top 15 right now. Without a doubt, Mitch Trubisky is one of the top 25 quarterbacks in the NFL right now. Trubisky has been up and down stats wise. He has been near the bottom in QBR and near the very top in QBR.... Seems just as much of a reflection on the team as on him.

He is unfairly compared to Mahomes. Mahomes went to the team in the NFL with the best weapons on offense that was a perennial playoff team. Even a declining Alex Smith was suddenly rejuvenated when the Chiefs added Tyreek Hill. Trubisky went to a bad team with crap weapons in comparison to KC. Yes, Mahomes is better but I doubt Mahomes would be anywhere nearly as highly regarded as he is right now if drafted by the Bears. When Mahomes lost a bunch of games in college with a bad team he was underrated. See a pattern.

Except on a trick play, it was often a huge struggle for Bears receivers from what I saw to get open when they played the Saints in this years playoffs. I mean big time struggle for Bears receivers. They looked overmatched which isn't a surprise since Saints were great defensively. Trubisky had more than a few great throws in that game to go along with one bad decision into a tight window I saw that wasn't even intercepted. By the media for whatever reason, he wasn't credited enough for them since his name is Trubisky. I believe Brady/Mahomes/Rodgers whoever starting that game for Chicago would have lost it based upon what I saw.

Bears receiver dropped a 50 yard perfect TD pass right threw his hands when he was wide open by a couple of steps. That dropped pass was clearly not Trubisky's fault -- pass was perfect -- but that dropped pass and a Saints player fumbling against Tampa Bay may have ended up being the reason Trubisky is no longer with the Bears. Do the Bears move on from Trubisky if the Saints do better in playoffs?

Trubisky may end up a QB the Bears regret letting go. An offense isn't usually made by 1 receiver either. Overall, Bears offensive weapons are not that good.... They are a team that appears to focus more on defense which isn't surprising since they play in Chicago.

I can see refusing to pay Trubisky decent money when you have the clear leverage over him but if he was willing to stay around for cheap money and compete for a job like he sort of indicated he was, I would not have let him get away when you are forced to turn to an inferior option.

29-21 Bears with Trubisky.
28-25 Texans with Deshaun Watson. (granted skewed by this past season but still this stat does show something worth mentioning)

And Trubisky was the player drafted by the worse team. Not saying Trubisky is as good as Watson -- he isn't right now -- but if the two flipped teams, I think peoples perspectives would be different since Trubisky would have better stats than he has had and Watson worse.

And Nick Foles is Nick Foles but he lost games with Chicago and Trubisky won more games than he lost with the Bears. And even moving beyond Foles, Bears if my quick math are correct are 4-14 without Trubisky and 29-21 without him.

Andy Dalton at this stage of his career appears to be a clear downgrade over Trubisky and I believe Chicago is paying him more than Bills will be paying the younger Trubisky. Makes no sense unless I am missing something....

The Bears just appear to be a "dumb as rocks" franchise. And their fan base, may be "dumb as rocks" for probably urging the team to scapegoat Trubisky.

If Bears had to pay Trubisky anywhere near or even half of what Wentz or Goff got in any sort of long term contract, I can certainly see moving on but the huge mistake they appeared to make is when he was willing to stay pretty much on probably a Cam bargain like deal.

I think Bills management is very convinced that they got a steal in their backup QB and Trubisky is going to get a chance to start for a smarter team than the Bears very soon.

I’ll concede that trubisky is top 25 and that the red rifle isn’t any better. I also agree to the max that the bears brass is dumb as rocks there’s at least mild upside to trubisky as **** as he was last year.

As far as mahomes and Watson trubisky isn’t half good as either of them and Watson’s team and ownership/management is pure trash even compared to the bears. If Watson was on the bears last year or even past years they’d be significantly better and the Texans would be horrid with trubiscuit instead.

I am with you partly on mahomes in regards to his supporting cast being otherworldly helps him a lot. That aside tho he’s still a top 3 qb at worst if not the clear number 1.
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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1459 » by The Comedian » Fri Mar 19, 2021 2:30 am

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Re: General Boston Sports Thread, Phase 2 

Post#1460 » by GoCeltics123 » Fri Mar 19, 2021 2:53 am

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