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Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier)

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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#461 » by Gant » Sat Feb 22, 2020 2:40 pm

Brad Stevens said this...
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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#462 » by Bleeding Green » Sat Feb 22, 2020 4:09 pm

GuyClinch wrote:Rookies been disappointing. Langford looks decent - i kind of like Green and Poirier who I think can contribute on most NBA teams but are not real rookies..

I think like most Ainge rookies a lot of these guys will gone and forgotten by the end of next year. It's amazing how Ainge does that.. brings guys in. People here get hyped - and poof - they don't even remember their names.

The playoff rotation minutes will be comprised of 70 pct guys who Ainge drafted or signed out of foreign leagues and have never played on a different NBA roster. And they're gonna win 55+ games. Where do you even come up with claims like this? You think all these rookies on guaranteed 3 year deals will be gone and forgotten after two years. They will be so bad that the Celtics will release them out of the last year of their contract.

Sure, I agree on Javonte Green, a guy who literally doesn't play 1 minute between now and Game 82 if everyone else is healthy.
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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#463 » by bucknersrevenge » Sat Feb 22, 2020 7:57 pm

Bleeding Green wrote:
GuyClinch wrote:Rookies been disappointing. Langford looks decent - i kind of like Green and Poirier who I think can contribute on most NBA teams but are not real rookies..

I think like most Ainge rookies a lot of these guys will gone and forgotten by the end of next year. It's amazing how Ainge does that.. brings guys in. People here get hyped - and poof - they don't even remember their names.

The playoff rotation minutes will be comprised of 70 pct guys who Ainge drafted or signed out of foreign leagues and have never played on a different NBA roster. And they're gonna win 55+ games. Where do you even come up with claims like this? You think all these rookies on guaranteed 3 year deals will be gone and forgotten after two years. They will be so bad that the Celtics will release them out of the last year of their contract.

Sure, I agree on Javonte Green, a guy who literally doesn't play 1 minute between now and Game 82 if everyone else is healthy.


Feel pretty comfortable in saying that Grant's gonna be a player. As he gains more experience and works on his game in the offseasons I feel pretty good that he will become an essential big in the rotation. As for Carsen and Langford, if we hit on just one of those 2 we're golden. We got time. And we're likely not making a ton of changes this offseason; certainly not at the top of the roster.
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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#464 » by cloverleaf » Sat Feb 22, 2020 9:49 pm

bucknersrevenge wrote:
Bleeding Green wrote:
GuyClinch wrote:Rookies been disappointing. Langford looks decent - i kind of like Green and Poirier who I think can contribute on most NBA teams but are not real rookies..

I think like most Ainge rookies a lot of these guys will gone and forgotten by the end of next year. It's amazing how Ainge does that.. brings guys in. People here get hyped - and poof - they don't even remember their names.

The playoff rotation minutes will be comprised of 70 pct guys who Ainge drafted or signed out of foreign leagues and have never played on a different NBA roster. And they're gonna win 55+ games. Where do you even come up with claims like this? You think all these rookies on guaranteed 3 year deals will be gone and forgotten after two years. They will be so bad that the Celtics will release them out of the last year of their contract.

Sure, I agree on Javonte Green, a guy who literally doesn't play 1 minute between now and Game 82 if everyone else is healthy.


Feel pretty comfortable in saying that Grant's gonna be a player. As he gains more experience and works on his game in the offseasons I feel pretty good that he will become an essential big in the rotation. As for Carsen and Langford, if we hit on just one of those 2 we're golden. We got time. And we're likely not making a ton of changes this offseason; certainly not at the top of the roster.


Yep Romeo and Grant look good. The others are 2nd rounders or freebies, and a couple of them could pan out next season. Brandon Clarke would have been nice.
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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#465 » by zoyathedestroya » Sat Feb 22, 2020 10:08 pm

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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#466 » by snowman » Sat Feb 22, 2020 11:24 pm

We have 7 rookies on the 17 man roster.
Langford is going to be a scorer/slasher, and a good def guy. Certainly a keeper.
G. Williams has already shown he is going to be a really good roll player in the league. Keeper
T. Waters will be in the big league for us next season, and has proved he can ball. Keeper
Tacko is still a project. Wouldn't surprise me if he remains in Maine for another year.
Poirier is still getting use to the speed of the NBA, but at 7 ' and just 26, he'll be around at least until he is replaced by Tacko. keeper
Edwards needs to find his shot when he is with the Celts, not just in Maine. I think he has until training camp next season to find it or he may be gone. I don't think every year of his contract is guaranteed.
Green is a great athlete, probable the best on the team. But like Edwards, he had better find his shot or he will be gone. First to go IMO

With 3 firsts and 1 second (Whom ever is picked with the second rounder will replace Waters on a 2-way) Green and Edwards are on the bubble right now. Green would be the first to go if we signed a player off the buyout market. He is the only one not on a partial guarantee next season. All in all though to have 7 rookies in one year on a team, and AT LEAST 3 will be with the team long term (again, IMO) and another 2 being project bigs, that's pretty good.
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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#467 » by Gant » Sat Feb 22, 2020 11:35 pm

Within seconds of stepping on to the floor in the first quarter Friday night against Minnesota, the Celtics' Romeo Langford knew he was going to be tested.

“Put him in action,” Langford heard one of the Timberwolves players tell a teammate when he saw Langford was the primary defender.

That’s basketball lingo for, “go at that dude!”


snip


“When [teams] isolate him late, I feel really good about Romeo being isolated,” said Stevens. “He’s got great length, great agility.” And tremendous confidence, courtesy of the time spent preparing for opponents with Celtics assistant Joe Mazzulla.

That confidence was on display Friday night, with Langford showing the ability to consistently contest shots, which led a strong night defensively.

Langford defended 10 Minnesota players who combined to shoot just 1-for-7 against him, with the lone made basket coming in transition in the first quarter by Malik Beasley, who had a team-high 27 points.


https://www.nbcsports.com/boston/celtics/theres-lot-love-about-what-romeo-langford-doing-defensively-celtics

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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#468 » by GuyClinch » Sun Feb 23, 2020 12:34 am

Bleeding Green wrote:
GuyClinch wrote:Rookies been disappointing. Langford looks decent - i kind of like Green and Poirier who I think can contribute on most NBA teams but are not real rookies..

I think like most Ainge rookies a lot of these guys will gone and forgotten by the end of next year. It's amazing how Ainge does that.. brings guys in. People here get hyped - and poof - they don't even remember their names.

The playoff rotation minutes will be comprised of 70 pct guys who Ainge drafted or signed out of foreign leagues and have never played on a different NBA roster. And they're gonna win 55+ games. Where do you even come up with claims like this? You think all these rookies on guaranteed 3 year deals will be gone and forgotten after two years. They will be so bad that the Celtics will release them out of the last year of their contract.

Sure, I agree on Javonte Green, a guy who literally doesn't play 1 minute between now and Game 82 if everyone else is healthy.


Been following the team for years - Rondo and Rozier are the really only notable standouts from late 1st or 2nd round picks..

Ainge has probably drafted 50+ guy in that category - and none of them are here now or are bleh.. Guys like olynyk to hunter to Sullinger, West - just so many - just so many guys that just disappear. Ainge sees the draft as cheap filler for the rest of his roster. That might be a smart way to think about it.

Of course at the TOP of the draft - those are the guys that are meant to be the core of the team.. Guys like Brown, Smart, Tatum..
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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#469 » by Bleeding Green » Sun Feb 23, 2020 12:37 am

GuyClinch wrote:
Bleeding Green wrote:
GuyClinch wrote:Rookies been disappointing. Langford looks decent - i kind of like Green and Poirier who I think can contribute on most NBA teams but are not real rookies..

I think like most Ainge rookies a lot of these guys will gone and forgotten by the end of next year. It's amazing how Ainge does that.. brings guys in. People here get hyped - and poof - they don't even remember their names.

The playoff rotation minutes will be comprised of 70 pct guys who Ainge drafted or signed out of foreign leagues and have never played on a different NBA roster. And they're gonna win 55+ games. Where do you even come up with claims like this? You think all these rookies on guaranteed 3 year deals will be gone and forgotten after two years. They will be so bad that the Celtics will release them out of the last year of their contract.

Sure, I agree on Javonte Green, a guy who literally doesn't play 1 minute between now and Game 82 if everyone else is healthy.


Been following the team for years - Rondo and Rozier are the really only notable standouts from late 1st or 2nd round picks..

Ainge has probably drafted 50+ guy in that category - and none of them are here now or are bleh.. Guys like olynyk to hunter to Sullinger, West - just so many - just so many guys that just disappear. Ainge sees the draft as cheap filler for the rest of his roster. That might be a smart way to think about it.

Of course at the TOP of the draft - those are the guys that are meant to be the core of the team.. Guys like Brown, Smart, Tatum..

Maybe I don't get your point, are you saying that Olynyk should still be here or that Delonte West should still be here or that Terry Rozier should still be here? Guys drafted outside the lottery are not worth keeping beyond their rookie-scale contracts unless they turn into Siakam or something. They suffice because they are really cheap, then they require their salary to be doubled so you replace them. You keep the guys who are max-contract worthy (or undervalued on the open market like Marcus Smart), then use all your draft picks to fill in the roster with cheap players/sign cheap FAs like Theis/Wanamaker/Kanter/et al.

Semi Ojeleye will be gone after his rookie deal, it's how things go. You draft Olynyk and he's a starter from game 1 and you get a lot of value out of him because he's really cheap. Then the Heat come in and offer him a ton of money for some reason, so you do the smart thing and replace him with Marcus Morris on a cheap deal (that you acquired by trading away Avery Bradley, who has sucked since leaving Boston). Then Morris g ets a big offer from the Knicks and you replace him with more minutes to Tatum, Hayward, draft Grant Wiliams. Maybe Grant develops into a player worth keeping beyond his rookie deal, but maybe not, so his replacement will be drafted, or they'll acquire the next Marcus Morris to replace him. But he's here for 3-4 years making less money in total than Marcus Morris is paid this season.

When Rozier is expensive, you replace him with Brad Wanamaker, making one-eighth as much money. When Wanamaker needs a new contract, you replace him with Tremont Waters, making the league minimum most likely. The cycle continues. Ainge wins again.

Maybe Brown was going to be too expensive or he wanted to pursue the open market, so they drafted Romeo Langford. Maybe he turns into a high-level player (I'm hyperbullish on him). Maybe not. But he's currently finishes out games in his rookie season on a 55+ win team, making like 2 million dollars a year for the 4 years. Oh, and he's from a free pick (Tatum/Fultz swap).
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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#470 » by Setshot33 » Sun Feb 23, 2020 12:46 am

Jaylen Brown's been hurt and he fouled out last night.

Who else was Brad going to throw out there? Glad to see Romeo's getting some playing time but he still stays parked in a corner on offense(just like Semi) and acts timid on offense.
Think folks are reading too much into this.
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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#471 » by Gant » Sun Feb 23, 2020 1:47 am

Setshot33 wrote:Jaylen Brown's been hurt and he fouled out last night.

Who else was Brad going to throw out there? Glad to see Romeo's getting some playing time but he still stays parked in a corner on offense(just like Semi) and acts timid on offense.
Think folks are reading too much into this.


Brown fouled out with 4 and a half minutes left. The other players on the floor were Smart, Tatum, Hayward, and Theis.

Stevens could have subbed any of Ojeleye, Wanamaker or Green. Those are 3 he's played all season. Now that Langford is up to speed, at least last night, he chose Romeo.
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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#472 » by Setshot33 » Sun Feb 23, 2020 2:02 am

Gant wrote:
Setshot33 wrote:Jaylen Brown's been hurt and he fouled out last night.

Who else was Brad going to throw out there? Glad to see Romeo's getting some playing time but he still stays parked in a corner on offense(just like Semi) and acts timid on offense.
Think folks are reading too much into this.


Brown fouled out with 4 and a half minutes left. The other players on the floor were Smart, Tatum, Hayward, and Theis.

Stevens could have subbed any of Ojeleye, Wanamaker or Green. Those are 3 he's played all season. Now that Langford is up to speed, at least last night, he chose Romeo.

He knows what he has in all three of the aforementioned.

He doesn't fully know what he has in Romeo in that situation.

Pulling for the kid but let's not get carried away that he's some defensive stopper that he's getting hyped up to be in the press right now.
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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#473 » by Gant » Sun Feb 23, 2020 2:08 am

Sample size, but still...

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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#474 » by GuyClinch » Sun Feb 23, 2020 5:29 am

Bleeding Green wrote:
GuyClinch wrote:
Bleeding Green wrote:The playoff rotation minutes will be comprised of 70 pct guys who Ainge drafted or signed out of foreign leagues and have never played on a different NBA roster. And they're gonna win 55+ games. Where do you even come up with claims like this? You think all these rookies on guaranteed 3 year deals will be gone and forgotten after two years. They will be so bad that the Celtics will release them out of the last year of their contract.

Sure, I agree on Javonte Green, a guy who literally doesn't play 1 minute between now and Game 82 if everyone else is healthy.


Been following the team for years - Rondo and Rozier are the really only notable standouts from late 1st or 2nd round picks..

Ainge has probably drafted 50+ guy in that category - and none of them are here now or are bleh.. Guys like olynyk to hunter to Sullinger, West - just so many - just so many guys that just disappear. Ainge sees the draft as cheap filler for the rest of his roster. That might be a smart way to think about it.

Of course at the TOP of the draft - those are the guys that are meant to be the core of the team.. Guys like Brown, Smart, Tatum..

Maybe I don't get your point, are you saying that Olynyk should still be here or that Delonte West should still be here or that Terry Rozier should still be here? Guys drafted outside the lottery are not worth keeping beyond their rookie-scale contracts unless they turn into Siakam or something. They suffice because they are really cheap, then they require their salary to be doubled so you replace them. You keep the guys who are max-contract worthy (or undervalued on the open market like Marcus Smart), then use all your draft picks to fill in the roster with cheap players/sign cheap FAs like Theis/Wanamaker/Kanter/et al.

Semi Ojeleye will be gone after his rookie deal, it's how things go. You draft Olynyk and he's a starter from game 1 and you get a lot of value out of him because he's really cheap. Then the Heat come in and offer him a ton of money for some reason, so you do the smart thing and replace him with Marcus Morris on a cheap deal (that you acquired by trading away Avery Bradley, who has sucked since leaving Boston). Then Morris g ets a big offer from the Knicks and you replace him with more minutes to Tatum, Hayward, draft Grant Wiliams. Maybe Grant develops into a player worth keeping beyond his rookie deal, but maybe not, so his replacement will be drafted, or they'll acquire the next Marcus Morris to replace him. But he's here for 3-4 years making less money in total than Marcus Morris is paid this season.

When Rozier is expensive, you replace him with Brad Wanamaker, making one-eighth as much money. When Wanamaker needs a new contract, you replace him with Tremont Waters, making the league minimum most likely. The cycle continues. Ainge wins again.

Maybe Brown was going to be too expensive or he wanted to pursue the open market, so they drafted Romeo Langford. Maybe he turns into a high-level player (I'm hyperbullish on him). Maybe not. But he's currently finishes out games in his rookie season on a 55+ win team, making like 2 million dollars a year for the 4 years. Oh, and he's from a free pick (Tatum/Fultz swap).


See you got it your head that I am attacking Ainge. I am not. I marvel at how he can select so many guys - get useful minutes out of them and convince the fans that these guys are the future. I am very impressed with his drafting..

My point is that as a fan - most of these guys are going nowhere fast. Historically that has been the case and Ainge has illustrated that better then almost anyone. The year to year turnover of his roster is HUGE - the amount of draft picks he picks ever year is MASSIVE. It's great fun - but if you look at the big trends - most of the guys he picks won't do anything in the long run - especially his later picks.

Again Ainge sees these late picks as a way to cheaply round out his roster. I think this is in part why he often picks these solid but undersized guys. He knows they can play - but also knows that they are replaceable.. It's pretty amazing and a lot of fun..
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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#475 » by Bleeding Green » Sun Feb 23, 2020 9:01 am

GuyClinch wrote:
Bleeding Green wrote:
GuyClinch wrote:
Been following the team for years - Rondo and Rozier are the really only notable standouts from late 1st or 2nd round picks..

Ainge has probably drafted 50+ guy in that category - and none of them are here now or are bleh.. Guys like olynyk to hunter to Sullinger, West - just so many - just so many guys that just disappear. Ainge sees the draft as cheap filler for the rest of his roster. That might be a smart way to think about it.

Of course at the TOP of the draft - those are the guys that are meant to be the core of the team.. Guys like Brown, Smart, Tatum..

Maybe I don't get your point, are you saying that Olynyk should still be here or that Delonte West should still be here or that Terry Rozier should still be here? Guys drafted outside the lottery are not worth keeping beyond their rookie-scale contracts unless they turn into Siakam or something. They suffice because they are really cheap, then they require their salary to be doubled so you replace them. You keep the guys who are max-contract worthy (or undervalued on the open market like Marcus Smart), then use all your draft picks to fill in the roster with cheap players/sign cheap FAs like Theis/Wanamaker/Kanter/et al.

Semi Ojeleye will be gone after his rookie deal, it's how things go. You draft Olynyk and he's a starter from game 1 and you get a lot of value out of him because he's really cheap. Then the Heat come in and offer him a ton of money for some reason, so you do the smart thing and replace him with Marcus Morris on a cheap deal (that you acquired by trading away Avery Bradley, who has sucked since leaving Boston). Then Morris g ets a big offer from the Knicks and you replace him with more minutes to Tatum, Hayward, draft Grant Wiliams. Maybe Grant develops into a player worth keeping beyond his rookie deal, but maybe not, so his replacement will be drafted, or they'll acquire the next Marcus Morris to replace him. But he's here for 3-4 years making less money in total than Marcus Morris is paid this season.

When Rozier is expensive, you replace him with Brad Wanamaker, making one-eighth as much money. When Wanamaker needs a new contract, you replace him with Tremont Waters, making the league minimum most likely. The cycle continues. Ainge wins again.

Maybe Brown was going to be too expensive or he wanted to pursue the open market, so they drafted Romeo Langford. Maybe he turns into a high-level player (I'm hyperbullish on him). Maybe not. But he's currently finishes out games in his rookie season on a 55+ win team, making like 2 million dollars a year for the 4 years. Oh, and he's from a free pick (Tatum/Fultz swap).


See you got it your head that I am attacking Ainge. I am not. I marvel at how he can select so many guys - get useful minutes out of them and convince the fans that these guys are the future. I am very impressed with his drafting..

My point is that as a fan - most of these guys are going nowhere fast. Historically that has been the case and Ainge has illustrated that better then almost anyone. The year to year turnover of his roster is HUGE - the amount of draft picks he picks ever year is MASSIVE. It's great fun - but if you look at the big trends - most of the guys he picks won't do anything in the long run - especially his later picks.

Again Ainge sees these late picks as a way to cheaply round out his roster. I think this is in part why he often picks these solid but undersized guys. He knows they can play - but also knows that they are replaceable.. It's pretty amazing and a lot of fun..

I agree, Ainge (or whoever is in charge of the drafts) is **** killing it. The draft is used to provide cheap ballast to the roster to fill out around the elite max players as far as I'm concerned. He has his draft picks in the top 5 and nails every single one of them so far, then drafts players that provide cheap, reliable production elsewhere. Sometimes he hits on later picks, sometimes he **** absolutely whiffs, that's the way she goes.

I agree, the YoY turnover is huge. That's why the Celtics are good. Only **** teams pay mediocre players. Ainge pays top talent and supplements with min salaries.

Ainge doesn't draft undersized players or oversized players. He drafts players. Some are "undersized" some aren't. If you've done an analysis of all NBA draft picks in the last 15 years that suggests otherwise I would very much love to see it.
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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#476 » by Bleeding Green » Sun Feb 23, 2020 9:07 am

Gant wrote:Sample size, but still...

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OMG this dude is literally going to be better than Tatum, I can't even contain my excitement. Ainge got him for FREE. And got Tatum in the same trade as well. What an absolute God. Imagine turning Markelle Fultz (garbage player who will be out of the league by 25) into Tatum (hall of fame level talent for sure) and Langford (leading the 3rd ranked defense in defensive rating in his rookie season). Can't even make it up, Ainge is the GOAT.

If only he drafted Draymond, Siakam, and Giannis, then we would have nothing to complain about.
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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#478 » by bucknersrevenge » Sun Feb 23, 2020 6:38 pm

zoyathedestroya wrote:


I'm noting the increased agility in the lane. I'm noting the increased conditioning and rim running; the decisiveness in the post. He has come a long way in just one year. No question in my mind that he makes the team next year. Would love to see him continue to work on his strength and conditioning this offseason. But all positive stuff right here. When he starts consistently playing with some real aggression (and he's doing it now occasionally) and throwing his weight around, it's gonna be real interesting.
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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#479 » by Powesknees » Mon Feb 24, 2020 6:07 am

They wasted too much time with Romeo in the g league. He’s still finding his spots and his teammates are doing a great job encouraging him but I can’t help but feel he should have been given these oops earlier in the season so he would be further along or at least more comfortable.. maybe he makes another couple baskets tonight if he’s just not being in some of these spots for the first time
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Re: Rookieville – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko; (Green, Poirier) 

Post#480 » by Fencer reregistered » Mon Feb 24, 2020 8:03 am

bucknersrevenge wrote:
zoyathedestroya wrote:


I'm noting the increased agility in the lane. I'm noting the increased conditioning and rim running; the decisiveness in the post. He has come a long way in just one year. No question in my mind that he makes the team next year. Would love to see him continue to work on his strength and conditioning this offseason. But all positive stuff right here. When he starts consistently playing with some real aggression (and he's doing it now occasionally) and throwing his weight around, it's gonna be real interesting.


Looking good! Certainly he's covering a lot more ground, somewhat fluidly, than he did before.

But if he played that well -- why was his team so far behind? :)

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