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Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green

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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#701 » by SmartWentCrazy » Sat Dec 26, 2020 4:05 pm

jfs1000d wrote:This is getting ridiculous. You can’t draft players and then they give u nothing.

Langford, Nesmith, edwards, semi, grant do not give us enough.

Tacko and Waters are 2 ways. I can’t complaint. But Edwards shouldn’t be on roster.


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Our returns from the last two drafts have been pathetic. 2 lotto picks, 3 other FRPs and not one guaranteed long term rotation piece. Thats quite poor.
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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#702 » by Celts17Pride » Sat Dec 26, 2020 4:11 pm

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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#703 » by 24istheLAW » Sat Dec 26, 2020 4:37 pm

Grant's NBA career will go as far as his ability to knock down open 3s. I'd like to wait a bit longer before deciding his shot is still broke.

Romeo's got NBA talent. But he's also had bad luck with injuries. It takes staying healthy to get better. Romeo hasn't stayed healthy, so he's missed opportunity to get better. He needs to shoot a LOT to improve.

I think the ship has sailed on Romeo approaching his ceiling anytime soon. He's practically missed a year worth of reps he needs to fix his shot. He's also missed a year of accumulating experience as a ballhandler, learning how to run the P&R and initiate offense at a pro level, etc. He's got a ton of work to do, to be more than just a defensive change-of-pace guy.

Edwards, Waters, Fall, and Javonte Green are just not NBA players. Waters has a nice floor game but he hasn't demonstrated the ability to score efficiently on low volume in the G League or in his cameos, which is an absolute must for a guy like him to succeed.
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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#704 » by Fencer reregistered » Sun Dec 27, 2020 2:25 pm

Celts17Pride wrote:
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That's a bit harsh.

Who would be surprising if he played well in the next game?
-- The guys who are currently hurt (duh).
-- The two-way players.
-- Edwards.

Who else?
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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#705 » by themoneyteam2 » Thu Dec 31, 2020 6:32 am

On Grant Williams, I hate how they’re using him as just a spot up shooter. That’s not his strength and wasn’t why he was a 2x SEC POY and 1st team all american. Need to get him the ball operating DHO or in short roll or in the post to create good looks. Saw it tonight where he got an easy layup when they fed him in the post.

I mean the staff obviously knows more than me but the usage of Grant seems really weird. Really thought they’d go more to the Horford-lite role for him this year but he’s still just a spot up shooter on offense.
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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#706 » by zoyathedestroya » Thu Dec 31, 2020 6:49 am

themoneyteam2 wrote:On Grant Williams, I hate how they’re using him as just a spot up shooter. That’s not his strength and wasn’t why he was a 2x SEC POY and 1st team all american. Need to get him the ball operating DHO or in short roll or in the post to create good looks. Saw it tonight where he got an easy layup when they fed him in the post.

I mean the staff obviously knows more than me but the usage of Grant seems really weird. Really thought they’d go more to the Horford-lite role for him this year but he’s still just a spot up shooter on offense.

So much this. He's been misused. Last year was understandable with better options on the floor. Still early this season so I'm hoping they recognize he can be more effective operating from the mid-post instead of making him a pick-and-pop or stand-in-the-corner guy.
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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#707 » by TheMartian » Fri Jan 1, 2021 2:13 am

GWill might also be hitting that sophomore slump that both Tatum and Brown had in their 2nd year.
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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#708 » by hugepatsfan » Fri Jan 1, 2021 5:22 pm

Stevens is going to run plays to win games vs develop guys.

Maybe Grant runs best with the ball in his hands from the high post. But is that a better play than a Tatum/Brown/Smart P&R? Probably not. A team that is trying to win is not going to feature their 4th or 5th best possible playcall.

That's the challenge in playing young guys on a competing team. You're not going to run plays for the sake of their development. They have to primarily play off the star players because those are the best options. Their own strengths are always going to be used sparingly as a change of pace.

Players like Grant and Romeo are going to have to learn the corner 3. That's how they're going to compliment Brown and Tatum. Grant out of the high post and Langford being a P&R ball handler himself can be secondary options for Stevens to call sporadically to keep defenses honest.
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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#709 » by hugepatsfan » Fri Jan 1, 2021 5:24 pm

Oh and one more note on Grant...

He's currently shooting 3 of 10 from 3. That's 30% which is bad.

If one of his misses went in and he was 4 of 10 at 40% (very good), I feel like people would be gushing about how he's developed as a floor spacer lol

Point being... let's see how things progress over a larger sample size.
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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#710 » by Patsfan1081 » Fri Jan 1, 2021 7:05 pm

SmartWentCrazy wrote:
jfs1000d wrote:This is getting ridiculous. You can’t draft players and then they give u nothing.

Langford, Nesmith, edwards, semi, grant do not give us enough.

Tacko and Waters are 2 ways. I can’t complaint. But Edwards shouldn’t be on roster.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Our returns from the last two drafts have been pathetic. 2 lotto picks, 3 other FRPs and not one guaranteed long term rotation piece. Thats quite poor.


The fact that they wouldn’t decline Semi’s option or move on from one of those guys to take a flyer on Bane is what frustrates me. At this point if Nesmith can even make a contribution like he does for Memphis by the end of the year I will consider it a win. Doesn’t seem like Danny can figure out his depth issue and is just praying someone makes a leap.
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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#711 » by dlamb8888888 » Fri Jan 1, 2021 8:14 pm

FlatearthZorro wrote:Edwards and Grant seem like wasted picks to me. Danny should've consolidated if he could.

Langford and Nesmith sho uld have a chance to be something, hopefully.



Agreed. He actually did the opposite and traded down from 20 to 22 to acquire these players. Terrible picks. Unjustifiable. Brandon Clarke was taken at 21. There were 4-5 players available at pick 20 who would've been better picks than Grant Williams. This isn't revisionist history. I was shaking my head, draft experts were shaking their heads, most fans were probably shaking their heads. Grant Williams was a terrible pick the moment the pick was made and he still is. He is the classic great college player who does not have the skill set to play in the NBA. He will be out of the league within five years. Book it. For all of the great moves AInge has made over the years, it's hard to have faith in a guy who would miss so, so terribly on so many draft picks. Using first rounders on guys NOBODY else had rated in the first round. There are a lot of examples.
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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#712 » by FlatearthZorro » Fri Jan 1, 2021 8:25 pm

dlamb8888888 wrote:
FlatearthZorro wrote:Edwards and Grant seem like wasted picks to me. Danny should've consolidated if he could.

Langford and Nesmith sho uld have a chance to be something, hopefully.



Agreed. He actually did the opposite and traded down from 20 to 22 to acquire these players. Terrible picks. Unjustifiable. Brandon Clarke was taken at 21. There were 4-5 players available at pick 20 who would've been better picks than Grant Williams. This isn't revisionist history. I was shaking my head, draft experts were shaking their heads, most fans were probably shaking their heads. Grant Williams was a terrible pick the moment the pick was made and he still is. He is the classic great college player who does not have the skill set to play in the NBA. He will be out of the league within five years. Book it. For all of the great moves AInge has made over the years, it's hard to have faith in a guy who would miss so, so terribly on so many draft picks. Using first rounders on guys NOBODY else had rated in the first round. There are a lot of examples.


Grant has the understanding of the game, but he doesn't have the physical attribuites, dude is 6'5-6'6 PF with 6'10 wingspan. Jarret Allen was literally snatching board over Grant's head, cause Grant is just too short. He gives up like 5 inches and probably 6-7 inches in the standing reach, wingspan department.

Edwards is a tweener, actually more of SG and he's again too short, he's 5'11 probably. Not tall enough to be a SG. Hopefully, both Grant and Edwards work out at the end of the day, but to me these are picks with very low ceiling and low floor, I don't understand it. Imo, neither of Grant or Edwards will ever be a star or even has the chance to be a star. Hope I'm wrong.
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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#713 » by dlamb8888888 » Fri Jan 1, 2021 8:37 pm

Grant Williams' next impactful NBA game will be his first impactful NBA game. I challenge anyone to give me one example of a game in which you can definitively say, "The Celtics would not have won that game had it not been for Grant Williams." You can't do it. Even Pritchard has such a game under his belt 5 games into the season. Grant Williams is a non-factor every time he plays. He's averaging under 4ppg in 17mpg. Do you realize how horrible that is? His career averages are worse. Can't rebound, can't shoot, can't create, can't pass, can't defend. That's right, he can't defend. He is too slow to guard 3's and stretch 4's and he is too small too guard bigs. He is not athletic enough to compensate for this. Can't shoot 3's. What does he do well?
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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#714 » by bucknersrevenge » Fri Jan 1, 2021 10:02 pm

Patsfan1081 wrote:
SmartWentCrazy wrote:
jfs1000d wrote:This is getting ridiculous. You can’t draft players and then they give u nothing.

Langford, Nesmith, edwards, semi, grant do not give us enough.

Tacko and Waters are 2 ways. I can’t complaint. But Edwards shouldn’t be on roster.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Our returns from the last two drafts have been pathetic. 2 lotto picks, 3 other FRPs and not one guaranteed long term rotation piece. Thats quite poor.


The fact that they wouldn’t decline Semi’s option or move on from one of those guys to take a flyer on Bane is what frustrates me. At this point if Nesmith can even make a contribution like he does for Memphis by the end of the year I will consider it a win. Doesn’t seem like Danny can figure out his depth issue and is just praying someone makes a leap.


With respect, I think you're being a bit unfair in dismissing the circumstances. To be clear, you're mad at Ainge for not taking the guy you wanted at pick 30. Not 14...30. And you're glossing over the fact that they had just finished a season like 2 months ago. No Summer League for rookies. No regular training camp. They didn't want to get overwhelmed with having to learn up so many rookies. Nesmith is already trying to get himself together. As for depth. They are missing Kemba, and Langford, 2 players who projected to be a part of that depth this year. They still have the TPE. Don't forget that. They can still add veteran depth at the deadline for the stretch run (when having the veterans really matters). Now if Danny doesn't make a move at the deadline, I take this all back and you will be right. But until then, just wait a second and see what happens.
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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#715 » by RodyTur10 » Fri Jan 1, 2021 11:39 pm

dlamb8888888 wrote:Grant Williams' next impactful NBA game will be his first impactful NBA game. I challenge anyone to give me one example of a game in which you can definitively say, "The Celtics would not have won that game had it not been for Grant Williams." You can't do it. Even Pritchard has such a game under his belt 5 games into the season. Grant Williams is a non-factor every time he plays. He's averaging under 4ppg in 17mpg. Do you realize how horrible that is? His career averages are worse. Can't rebound, can't shoot, can't create, can't pass, can't defend. That's right, he can't defend. He is too slow to guard 3's and stretch 4's and he is too small too guard bigs. He is not athletic enough to compensate for this. Can't shoot 3's. What does he do well?


Exactly this. The youngsters you should keep an eye on are the ones who make spectacular plays, but lack consistency and may lose you a game here and there. They are the players who have a high ceiling. Not the youngsters who play timid, make few mistakes, but in the end don't really provide much either.

I've seen enough from Grant Williams to know that his ceiling is an end of rotation player at best. He's likeable, he's smart and has a great mentality, but he's just way too short for his skillset. It's unfortunate for him.

Robert Williams on the other hand has had many times when he impacted the game (in a good way). The center position is a tough position to learn, so I'm taking those 'rookie' mistakes and put my full confidence in him. Timelord has a varied skillset and if he can be injuryfree and get the minutes to develop his game then I believe he easily can become a starting center on the Celtics.
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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#716 » by MrClass » Sat Jan 2, 2021 5:23 pm

man, grant is so bad.
the **** pump fake in the corner and slowmo first step gave me an heart attack every single time.
i dont know. i think he isnt nba material. yeah he is funny and genuine good guy. but the physical limitation are huge.

same for carsen, tacko, semi, waters.
almost half roster sucks.
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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#717 » by bucknersrevenge » Sat Jan 2, 2021 5:47 pm

MrClass wrote:man, grant is so bad.
the **** pump fake in the corner and slowmo first step gave me an heart attack every single time.
i dont know. i think he isnt nba material. yeah he is funny and genuine good guy. but the physical limitation are huge.

same for carsen, tacko, semi, waters.
almost half roster sucks.


He's trying to do something that's not his game to fit this offense. Stevens needs to tell him to short roll more but I suspect it's by Stevens' design that Grant camp out at the arc supposedly to provide more spacing for Tatum and Brown except that it doesn't work.
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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#718 » by Patsfan1081 » Sat Jan 2, 2021 9:10 pm

bucknersrevenge wrote:
Patsfan1081 wrote:
SmartWentCrazy wrote:
Our returns from the last two drafts have been pathetic. 2 lotto picks, 3 other FRPs and not one guaranteed long term rotation piece. Thats quite poor.


The fact that they wouldn’t decline Semi’s option or move on from one of those guys to take a flyer on Bane is what frustrates me. At this point if Nesmith can even make a contribution like he does for Memphis by the end of the year I will consider it a win. Doesn’t seem like Danny can figure out his depth issue and is just praying someone makes a leap.


With respect, I think you're being a bit unfair in dismissing the circumstances. To be clear, you're mad at Ainge for not taking the guy you wanted at pick 30. Not 14...30. And you're glossing over the fact that they had just finished a season like 2 months ago. No Summer League for rookies. No regular training camp. They didn't want to get overwhelmed with having to learn up so many rookies. Nesmith is already trying to get himself together. As for depth. They are missing Kemba, and Langford, 2 players who projected to be a part of that depth this year. They still have the TPE. Don't forget that. They can still add veteran depth at the deadline for the stretch run (when having the veterans really matters). Now if Danny doesn't make a move at the deadline, I take this all back and you will be right. But until then, just wait a second and see what happens.


I’m just disappointed in how he addressed the bench in a whole this offseason, it’s not really just that one move though I think it would have helped as Bane is someone who could have helped right away. The bench needed to be addressed at the deadline last season. Ainge still didn’t address it this offseason. Adding another project at 14 when you took one last season does nothing for the short term, we still have no clue what Langford is. All the reasons you listed are why Ainge should have brought in a vet wing. Now we are depending on a tpe where we don’t have young players making strides to attach to it nd you don’t really want to give your pick in a supposed very deep draft. I think he just mismanaged the roster.
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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#719 » by Patsfan1081 » Sat Jan 2, 2021 9:16 pm

bucknersrevenge wrote:
MrClass wrote:man, grant is so bad.
the **** pump fake in the corner and slowmo first step gave me an heart attack every single time.
i dont know. i think he isnt nba material. yeah he is funny and genuine good guy. but the physical limitation are huge.

same for carsen, tacko, semi, waters.
almost half roster sucks.


He's trying to do something that's not his game to fit this offense. Stevens needs to tell him to short roll more but I suspect it's by Stevens' design that Grant camp out at the arc supposedly to provide more spacing for Tatum and Brown except that it doesn't work.


True, Stevens scheme doesn’t seem to fit Ainge’s drafting. Stevens play calling revolves around players being able to knock down shots, especially on close outs. Outside of Brown, Tatum, Kemba, lil PP, and Nesmith(who isn’t playing) I can’t remember anyone else being a efficient outside shooter in their developement. Even Edwards wasn’t the most efficient, he was more so just volume. It also hurts that Tatum isn’t attacking as much, he draws multiple defenders when he does.
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Re: Sophmores, 2020-21 – Langford, G. Williams, Edwards, Waters, Tacko, Green 

Post#720 » by 31to6 » Sat Jan 2, 2021 9:23 pm

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Lol
And this is AFTER we got rid of Poirier. Who actually (and unfortunately) seemed as useful as any of these guys.
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