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Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2

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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#981 » by claycarver » Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:31 pm

floyd wrote:But the more people infected the harder it’s going to be to keep those vulnerable protected. And even in less vulnerable age groups, huge infection rates will add up to a lot of death. So deaths may not rise as rapidly as before but we may wind up in the same place ... or worse.


Half the deaths in the first wave were nursing home patients. There is no excuse for those people being in contact with untested family members or staff. So if we end up in the same place or worse, people should go to jail.
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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#982 » by floyd » Wed Jun 24, 2020 10:05 pm

claycarver wrote:
floyd wrote:But the more people infected the harder it’s going to be to keep those vulnerable protected. And even in less vulnerable age groups, huge infection rates will add up to a lot of death. So deaths may not rise as rapidly as before but we may wind up in the same place ... or worse.


Half the deaths in the first wave were nursing home patients. There is no excuse for those people being in contact with untested family members or staff. So if we end up in the same place or worse, people should go to jail.


Half is still a lot of dead people. And since locking things down is not too likely there is a big risk prevalence is even higher and in a more populated part of the country. If there are more infections that’s even more dead.

I also am dubious protecting the vulnerable is going to be very practical with wide contagion. I work at a place where we have large vivariums of rodents used in medical research (including COVID). They can’t be infected with many common agents or it could invalidate research. Some are even kept in plastic bubbles. We have all kinds of procedures to ensure biosecurity.

Even with all that breaks still happen sometimes. People make mistakes. We can’t hermetically seal off nursing homes.
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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#983 » by theman » Thu Jun 25, 2020 8:40 pm

There is evidence that the virus is getting weaker.

https://whdh.com/news/coronavirus-is-getting-weaker-could-disappear-without-vaccine-doctor-suggests/

I am sure people will say "I don't believe it". I am just throwing it out there.
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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#984 » by jmr07019 » Thu Jun 25, 2020 8:56 pm

Visual reminder of how safe it is for young people.

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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#985 » by Floody100 » Thu Jun 25, 2020 11:04 pm

jmr07019 wrote:Visual reminder of how safe it is for young people.

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I’ve been saying this for a while now but the focus for politicians, doctors etc should be solely on the Elderly & keeping them safe.
Its basically like the common cold for anyone under the age of 70.
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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#986 » by floyd » Thu Jun 25, 2020 11:12 pm

I don’t find any of these arguments here for optimism very persuasive. However I thought IHMEs latest model was somewhat encouraging.
https://covid19.healthdata.org/united-states-of-america

They project daily deaths still declining a bit over the summer before picking up with the second wave this fall. But looking at states it’s super uneven with a huge portions of deaths in Florida and Texas offset by other parts of the country doing quite well.

They also have some different scenarios and they seem to think universal mask wearing would make a massive difference.
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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#987 » by ConstableGeneva » Fri Jun 26, 2020 11:56 am

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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#988 » by bobbutts » Fri Jun 26, 2020 1:35 pm

Floody100 wrote:
jmr07019 wrote:Visual reminder of how safe it is for young people.

Image


I’ve been saying this for a while now but the focus for politicians, doctors etc should be solely on the Elderly & keeping them safe.
Its basically like the common cold for anyone under the age of 70.

Except spreading the common cold doesn't overwhelm hospitals and kill 100's of thousands of people.
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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#989 » by threrf23 » Sat Jun 27, 2020 2:21 am

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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#990 » by jmr07019 » Sat Jun 27, 2020 9:56 pm

There has been so little talk about taking care of yourself during this pandemic. The CDC with the help of facebook and youtube are actively censoring anyone who dares talk about... vitamin D (the horror! :roll: ). You could be in perfect health, have bad luck and die of the corona virus anyways but it doesn't hurt to eat a healthy diet, exercise regularly, take some vitamin supplements and get quality sleep each night. These things add up. They will help you in a fight against the virus. I'm far from perfect but I at least try to do those 4 things. So many Americans don't even try. The media doesn't talk about it. Our government doesn't talk about it. It's sad. Here's the beginning of an article about the American diet.

In Italy, the average age of death due to COVID-19 was 81, according to a Lancet study. But the data already show that age alone is not the sole indicator of COVID susceptibility. In fact, what we’re seeing in each new study that comes out is just how much of this virus is about weakened metabolic systems.

On average, people dying from coronavirus have 3.7 chronic conditions, including type 2 diabetes, high blood pressure, and heart disease, according to a recently published NIH study. Similarly, a study in the UK found that 73% of COVID ICU admissions were overweight, a condition linked to those conditions just listed.

While age (particularly, those over 80 years) is the number one precursor for severe COVID complications, weight is almost (if not equally) as important. In the US today, more than 4 in 10 Americans are obese. That statistic does not account for those who are overweight, which now accounts for a majority of the American population. By 2030, it’s estimated that half the US population will be obese.

Perhaps the most dire of any statistic is this: only 12% of Americans are metabolically healthy. Only 1 in every 8 people in the US today lives with optimal levels of blood glucose, triglycerides, high-density lipoprotein cholesterol, blood pressure and waist circumference, without any need for medications.

The situation is dire.

And yet, none of this should be surprising, considering over half of the US diet consists of ultra-processed food. Herein lies the COVID-19 problem: it’s our collective diet (of processed foods) that’s killing us.


https://onedrop.today/blogs/blog/obesity-western-diet-processed-foods-and-covid-19-coronavirus?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=processed-covid&fbclid=IwAR2SOBArvWJRI43OK-Jzhti4U4lzhG7WDWUnE0KuEqhvSolM8SwFM9AZ9e4
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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#991 » by SuperDeluxe » Sat Jun 27, 2020 11:54 pm

threrf23 wrote:
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This comedy show is just missing the laughter track. Scary, scary ****.

The other thing I was thinking... Once a vaccine is available, are we also going to have to listen to the anti-vaccine movement?
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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#992 » by fallguy » Sat Jun 27, 2020 11:56 pm

jmr07019 wrote:There has been so little talk about taking care of yourself during this pandemic. The CDC with the help of facebook and youtube are actively censoring anyone who dares talk about... vitamin D (the horror! :roll: ). You could be in perfect health, have bad luck and die of the corona virus anyways but it doesn't hurt to eat a healthy diet, exercise regularly, take some vitamin supplements and get quality sleep each night. These things add up. They will help you in a fight against the virus. I'm far from perfect but I at least try to do those 4 things. So many Americans don't even try. The media doesn't talk about it. Our government doesn't talk about it. It's sad. Here's the beginning of an article about the American diet.

In Italy, the average age of death due to COVID-19 was 81, according to a Lancet study. But the data already show that age alone is not the sole indicator of COVID susceptibility. In fact, what we’re seeing in each new study that comes out is just how much of this virus is about weakened metabolic systems.

On average, people dying from coronavirus have 3.7 chronic conditions, including type 2 diabetes, high blood pressure, and heart disease, according to a recently published NIH study. Similarly, a study in the UK found that 73% of COVID ICU admissions were overweight, a condition linked to those conditions just listed.

While age (particularly, those over 80 years) is the number one precursor for severe COVID complications, weight is almost (if not equally) as important. In the US today, more than 4 in 10 Americans are obese. That statistic does not account for those who are overweight, which now accounts for a majority of the American population. By 2030, it’s estimated that half the US population will be obese.

Perhaps the most dire of any statistic is this: only 12% of Americans are metabolically healthy. Only 1 in every 8 people in the US today lives with optimal levels of blood glucose, triglycerides, high-density lipoprotein cholesterol, blood pressure and waist circumference, without any need for medications.

The situation is dire.

And yet, none of this should be surprising, considering over half of the US diet consists of ultra-processed food. Herein lies the COVID-19 problem: it’s our collective diet (of processed foods) that’s killing us.


https://onedrop.today/blogs/blog/obesity-western-diet-processed-foods-and-covid-19-coronavirus?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=processed-covid&fbclid=IwAR2SOBArvWJRI43OK-Jzhti4U4lzhG7WDWUnE0KuEqhvSolM8SwFM9AZ9e4


Vegetarian/vegan. That's the way to go.
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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#993 » by Bad-Thoma » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:05 am

SuperDeluxe wrote:
threrf23 wrote:
Read on Twitter

This comedy show is just missing the laughter track. Scary, scary ****.

The other thing I was thinking... Once a vaccine is available, are we also going to have to listen to the anti-vaccine movement?


They're already out there spreading stupid. Maybe we can get a vaccine for stupid? That'd be a coup.
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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#994 » by ConstableGeneva » Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:35 am

Reverend practicing good sense saved lives. What might initially appear to be early, "extreme" action/overreaction prevented an outbreak that was rampant in other nursing homes.
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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#995 » by claycarver » Sun Jun 28, 2020 10:23 am

UGH! These state governments playing with the data is so frustrating. I noticed the number of cumulative nursing home deaths in Maryland were dropping which didn't make sense to me. In Baltimore County, for instance, 80% of covid deaths were from nursing homes at one point but that's dropped to about 50%. Made no sense, so I hunted around and found this:

https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:YDbefRtRtv8J:https://www.baltimoresun.com/coronavirus/bs-md-nursing-home-data-missing-20200610-5ejskowscvh5hdgiw7s5lf76uy-story.html+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

The latest data from the state [of Maryland] suggests nursing homes and related facilities have accounted for about half of all coronavirus deaths in the state, but the proportion actually appears to approach two thirds.

Maryland officials previously said the counts of nursing home cases and deaths posted on a state website are cumulative, but acknowledged Wednesday that figures are removed from the totals when facilities haven’t reported any positive tests or deaths within the past two weeks.

One patient advocate said that discrepancy could cloud decisions on how best to curtail the pandemic.

“How are we really going to address this problem if we don’t know the extent of it?” said Anna Palmisano, director of Marylanders for Patient Rights.


So the official data chart is a lie. They are REMOVING people from the "total nursing home deaths" category and putting those deaths back into the "total non-nursing home deaths" category without any explanation. It gives the impression that nursing homes aren't as deadly as they are and that the non-nursing home world is more dangerous than it is.

This makes me so angry. They played games with this crap in New York too. Who knows which states are fudging the data to mask the extent nursing home deaths. We can't trust what our state governments are telling us when they play these games.
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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#996 » by Bad-Thoma » Sun Jun 28, 2020 11:14 am

jmr07019 wrote:Visual reminder of how safe it is for young people.

Image


It would be lovely if it were that simple. Aside from the exceedingly obvious fact that the more widespread it is among young people the more widespread it will become among older people it's also not just a matter of you either dying or having "a common cold" or less.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-effects/scientists-just-beginning-to-understand-the-many-health-problems-caused-by-covid-19-idUSKBN23X1BZ

The youngest and healthiest do on average get off lucky with minimal problems but there is a full spectrum of age, health, and complications between them and the unfortunates that have died in and out of nursing homes.

Take it seriously. Where a mask where needed. Social distance. Be a little overcautious so we don't end up having to lock down the country again. That's all anyone is asking, not to be afraid of it, not to wrap yourself in plastic and bury yourself in your yard with some granola bars.
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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#997 » by Bad-Thoma » Sun Jun 28, 2020 11:17 am

claycarver wrote:UGH! These state governments playing with the data is so frustrating. I noticed the number of cumulative nursing home deaths in Maryland were dropping which didn't make sense to me. In Baltimore County, for instance, 80% of covid deaths were from nursing homes at one point but that's dropped to about 50%. Made no sense, so I hunted around and found this:

https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:YDbefRtRtv8J:https://www.baltimoresun.com/coronavirus/bs-md-nursing-home-data-missing-20200610-5ejskowscvh5hdgiw7s5lf76uy-story.html+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

The latest data from the state [of Maryland] suggests nursing homes and related facilities have accounted for about half of all coronavirus deaths in the state, but the proportion actually appears to approach two thirds.

Maryland officials previously said the counts of nursing home cases and deaths posted on a state website are cumulative, but acknowledged Wednesday that figures are removed from the totals when facilities haven’t reported any positive tests or deaths within the past two weeks.

One patient advocate said that discrepancy could cloud decisions on how best to curtail the pandemic.

“How are we really going to address this problem if we don’t know the extent of it?” said Anna Palmisano, director of Marylanders for Patient Rights.


So the official data chart is a lie. They are REMOVING people from the "total nursing home deaths" category and putting those deaths back into the "total non-nursing home deaths" category without any explanation. It gives the impression that nursing homes aren't as deadly as they are and that the non-nursing home world is more dangerous than it is.

This makes me so angry. They played games with this crap in New York too. Who knows which states are fudging the data to mask the extent nursing home deaths. We can't trust what our state governments are telling us when they play these games.


Any state fudging the numbers in any manner is contributing to the problem. I'll never understand it. Accurate data is completely necessary to forming a response that minimizes health and economic impact, short and long term.
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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#998 » by threrf23 » Mon Jun 29, 2020 4:46 pm

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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#999 » by Disinformation » Mon Jun 29, 2020 5:40 pm

So glad even a pandemic won't stop the gouging of consumers and the enrichment of those in a position of advantage.
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Re: Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 2 

Post#1000 » by jmr07019 » Mon Jun 29, 2020 9:13 pm

Bad-Thoma wrote:
jmr07019 wrote:Visual reminder of how safe it is for young people.

Image


It would be lovely if it were that simple. Aside from the exceedingly obvious fact that the more widespread it is among young people the more widespread it will become among older people it's also not just a matter of you either dying or having "a common cold" or less.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-effects/scientists-just-beginning-to-understand-the-many-health-problems-caused-by-covid-19-idUSKBN23X1BZ

The youngest and healthiest do on average get off lucky with minimal problems but there is a full spectrum of age, health, and complications between them and the unfortunates that have died in and out of nursing homes.


Of course there's a spectrum of outcomes. It's why I posted about starting to take care of yourself now. Something the CDC and main stream media refuses to discuss for whatever reason. There have been 905 hospitalizations in MA of people under 40 out of 37,166 reported cases. And we know actual cases are much, much greater than reported cases. So even if someone under 40 were to contract the virus you are looking at a very small chance of having to go to the hospital because of it.

Take it seriously. Where a mask where needed. Social distance. Be a little overcautious so we don't end up having to lock down the country again. That's all anyone is asking, not to be afraid of it, not to wrap yourself in plastic and bury yourself in your yard with some granola bars.


I'm not advocating not to wear a mask. Never have. I never said not to social distance. I never said not to take it seriously. My point is that many young people are terrified of this when they shouldn't be. I know many millennials who are afraid to leave the house or interact with people who don't live in their apartment. Why? Constable posted a tweet showing how low the infection rate was among protesters (a predominately young group of people). This should be good news. Thousands of people were closely gathered together outside while wearing masks and the virus barely spread. Given that why do beaches, where there is significantly more social distance than a protest, need to be closed?

I guess our disagreement is on the bolded. From my perspective there is very much a message of fear being spread. There almost always is. It's the go to for just about every media outlet.
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