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Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go

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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#41 » by xxSnEaKyPxx » Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:30 pm

flintsky21 wrote:I personally believe Charlotte's 120 mil deal is a last minute offer and wasn't on the table when the Indy discussions were going on. Otherwise, there would've been leaks of that offer and Gordo would've definitely taken that offer outright because he knows with his age and injury history, a contract like that is hitting a jackpot.

Indiana offered Turnet and McBuckets, but Ainge, knowing that Hayward wanted to go Indiana and not wanting to go to a non-playoff team, felt that he had all the leverage to squeeze every bit he can get from Indiana, thus reports he wanted picks.

I believe the Hayward for Turner and McBuckets could've been done yesterday, when Charlotte's offer wasn't on the table yet.

So yeah, this is on Ainge. The defending champs added Schroder and Harrell, and Boston's biggest move might probably be adding Baynes.

I'd be shocked if Charlotte's offer wasn't on the table yesterday.

Teams don't just wake up and change all of their plans. It was probably offered the second FA opened.
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#42 » by celtics543 » Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:31 pm

canman1971 wrote:Look at all the crappy teams and poorly run organizations around the league. I don't get WTF people really expect in the real world.



I just want one year where our bench is a capable group that doesn’t blow games. Just once. 2010 was the last time the bench didn’t suck.
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#43 » by Bleeding Green » Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:31 pm

I still don't get the point. Should the Celtics have signed Horford and Irving and Hayward to these deals? Would Hayward have signed here for 120? Would Irving? You want to trade all these players leading into the playoffs?
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#44 » by Green89 » Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:36 pm

We still don't know the details of why Hayward and the team agreed on two more days. Was Hayward willing to opt-in and be traded to Indiana, but Ainge convinced him to wait out for a S&T after opting out to better help his team in some way? Then, Ainge got cute and couldn't give in to Indiana's offer? Hayward willing to go there on the discount, but then Danny balking and extending it further may have caused him to go with Charlotte? Lots of unknown here, but let's face it, I do believe Ainge had some ability here to get an Indiana deal done and it didn't happen.
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#45 » by Tai » Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:37 pm

flintsky21 wrote:I personally believe Charlotte's 120 mil deal is a last minute offer and wasn't on the table when the Indy discussions were going on. Otherwise, there would've been leaks of that offer and Gordo would've definitely taken that offer outright because he knows with his age and injury history, a contract like that is hitting a jackpot.

Indiana offered Turnet and McBuckets, but Ainge, knowing that Hayward wanted to go Indiana and not wanting to go to a non-playoff team, felt that he had all the leverage to squeeze every bit he can get from Indiana, thus reports he wanted picks.

I believe the Hayward for Turner and McBuckets could've been done yesterday, when Charlotte's offer wasn't on the table yet.

So yeah, this is on Ainge. The defending champs added Schroder and Harrell, and Boston's biggest move might probably be adding Baynes.


I'll give my take on Hayward by actually quoting you, cause this is the part I don't get. On the bolded, how do we know Charlotte wasn't always offering? Why can't I just say it wasn't leaked? IIRC, Kemba to Boston wasn't heavily leaked before the deal was all but agreed to.

That's a lotta money for Charlotte to give only to be willing to do it Day 2. I'm not saying I know any better, but it's too dubious an assumption without an actual report. We only have Turner/McDermott from Washburn, who while I see as a good reporter, I'm assuming he only got that from Danny. Which brings me to the Pacers side:

Read on Twitter


Agness won't even say specifically what Danny was asking for; if it was Turner + McDermott vs Turner + Dipo/Warren (as Washburn reported), what the hell does "never got anywhere" mean? What does Agness mean by "coulda left on his own" if Charlotte wasn't on the table until today? The Hawks and Knicks weren't offering what the Pacers were, and even if it was close why would Hayward not just pick the Pacers? That's the thing that smells.

Look, Danny doesn't look good either way with this. The reality is, Hayward's basically saying he'd rather take $30M from a non-Indiana team as opposed to $20-$25M from Boston to start (I'm assuming is the range), even if it wasn't as the 1st option. But there's too much gray area for me to assume he coulda taken Turner/McDermott and just got greedy.
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#46 » by Green89 » Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:38 pm

xxSnEaKyPxx wrote:
flintsky21 wrote:I personally believe Charlotte's 120 mil deal is a last minute offer and wasn't on the table when the Indy discussions were going on. Otherwise, there would've been leaks of that offer and Gordo would've definitely taken that offer outright because he knows with his age and injury history, a contract like that is hitting a jackpot.

Indiana offered Turnet and McBuckets, but Ainge, knowing that Hayward wanted to go Indiana and not wanting to go to a non-playoff team, felt that he had all the leverage to squeeze every bit he can get from Indiana, thus reports he wanted picks.

I believe the Hayward for Turner and McBuckets could've been done yesterday, when Charlotte's offer wasn't on the table yet.

So yeah, this is on Ainge. The defending champs added Schroder and Harrell, and Boston's biggest move might probably be adding Baynes.

I'd be shocked if Charlotte's offer wasn't on the table yesterday.

Teams don't just wake up and change all of their plans. It was probably offered the second FA opened.


What we're forgetting here if Hayward is traded on draft night, we don't get to the start of FA and technically, unless there's tampering, Hayward doesn't even field Charlotte's offer.
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#47 » by Spin Move » Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:39 pm

Green89 wrote:
xxSnEaKyPxx wrote:
flintsky21 wrote:I personally believe Charlotte's 120 mil deal is a last minute offer and wasn't on the table when the Indy discussions were going on. Otherwise, there would've been leaks of that offer and Gordo would've definitely taken that offer outright because he knows with his age and injury history, a contract like that is hitting a jackpot.

Indiana offered Turnet and McBuckets, but Ainge, knowing that Hayward wanted to go Indiana and not wanting to go to a non-playoff team, felt that he had all the leverage to squeeze every bit he can get from Indiana, thus reports he wanted picks.

I believe the Hayward for Turner and McBuckets could've been done yesterday, when Charlotte's offer wasn't on the table yet.

So yeah, this is on Ainge. The defending champs added Schroder and Harrell, and Boston's biggest move might probably be adding Baynes.

I'd be shocked if Charlotte's offer wasn't on the table yesterday.

Teams don't just wake up and change all of their plans. It was probably offered the second FA opened.


What we're forgetting here if Hayward is traded on draft night, we don't get to the start of FA and technically, unless there's tampering, Hayward doesn't even field Charlotte's offer.


Hayward had not opted in on draft night he could not be traded.
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#48 » by Writebloc » Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:40 pm

CWitch wrote:GMs can't let this happen. Kyrie, Al and Gordon all gone with nothing in return.


They are all totally different situations though, you can't lump them all together.

I don't see the Kyrie and Horford situations the same as this one at all.

If Charlotte's offer didn't exist before and Ainge had the Indy thing in his back pocket than he should have taken the Indy offer after exploring all possibilities. Ainge failed to read the room in this situation and it cost the team dearly.
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#49 » by chrisab123 » Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:40 pm

GoCeltics123 wrote:I'm not there yet...but his margin for error is zero now. He blew it, plain and simple.


Margin for error doesn't exist with him and Brad. It would take a 20 year Ernie Grundfeld run of incompetence to get rid of him.
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#50 » by Green89 » Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:42 pm

Spin Move wrote:
Green89 wrote:
xxSnEaKyPxx wrote:I'd be shocked if Charlotte's offer wasn't on the table yesterday.

Teams don't just wake up and change all of their plans. It was probably offered the second FA opened.


What we're forgetting here if Hayward is traded on draft night, we don't get to the start of FA and technically, unless there's tampering, Hayward doesn't even field Charlotte's offer.


Hayward had not opted in on draft night he could not be traded.


I know that. See my post a few before that. I said it was unknown why the team and Ainge extended things past draft night when Hayward could have opted in the day before and already been traded prior to free agency on Friday.

If Gordon extended it from Tuesday to Thursday, fine. But, if Ainge asked him to and he was going to opt-in, that was a huge gamble by Ainge that failed miserably,
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#51 » by Spin Move » Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:44 pm

We did not have Horford for the first 2 rounds of the last offseason. All Hordord ever did for us was win some reguler season games last year. I agree getting nothing for his is not good assset managment but it was not tottaly in our control, Charlette offered more money then Indy.

You can fairly critzice his failing to land our type of center. However Hayward is not worth what he got paid. I am not paying 30 million for 34 year old hayward that is a bad contract. It makes the team weaker but not that much weaker. Hopefully Nesmith and Langford and call the wing minutes he vacates. We still have a hole up front, but this is the exact team that made the ECF, Hayward was not there in the playoffs. I would have liked to get Turner for him, but it didnt happen and we don't know for sure it was even possible.
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#52 » by Spin Move » Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:46 pm

Green89 wrote:
Spin Move wrote:
Green89 wrote:
What we're forgetting here if Hayward is traded on draft night, we don't get to the start of FA and technically, unless there's tampering, Hayward doesn't even field Charlotte's offer.


Hayward had not opted in on draft night he could not be traded.


I know that. See my post a few before that. I said it was unknown why the team and Ainge extended things past draft night when Hayward could have opted in the day before and already been traded prior to free agency on Friday.

If Gordon extended it from Tuesday to Thursday, fine. But, if Ainge asked him to and he was going to opt-in, that was a huge gamble by Ainge that failed miserably,


Or he just opts out soooner
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#53 » by Tai » Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:47 pm

Green89 wrote:We still don't know the details of why Hayward and the team agreed on two more days. Was Hayward willing to opt-in and be traded to Indiana, but Ainge convinced him to wait out for a S&T after opting out to better help his team in some way? Then, Ainge got cute and couldn't give in to Indiana's offer? Hayward willing to go there on the discount, but then Danny balking and extending it further may have caused him to go with Charlotte? Lots of unknown here, but let's face it, I do believe Ainge had some ability here to get an Indiana deal done and it didn't happen.


Just to clarify on this, Hayward opting out helped the Celtics because then the Pacers were able to potentially get Hayward on their own terms (such as 4/$100M that was rumored) as opposed to 1 yr/34.1M. The Pacers were much more likely to give a good package if they got Hayward long-term on a lower price as opposed to as a higher priced rental.
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#54 » by Green89 » Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:47 pm

Spin Move wrote:
Green89 wrote:
Spin Move wrote:
Hayward had not opted in on draft night he could not be traded.


I know that. See my post a few before that. I said it was unknown why the team and Ainge extended things past draft night when Hayward could have opted in the day before and already been traded prior to free agency on Friday.

If Gordon extended it from Tuesday to Thursday, fine. But, if Ainge asked him to and he was going to opt-in, that was a huge gamble by Ainge that failed miserably,


Or he just opts out soooner


Yah, this week's events are all puzzling unknowns. No Bulpett article in the morning to clear anything up, either.
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#55 » by big-shot-ROB » Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:49 pm

I don't care what happened with Hayward.

You had a team just make the ECF with a horrible bench and you replaced Hayward, Kanter, Wannamaker with 2 rookies.

Get this dumbass out of town. What a freaking waste of assets.

We are on treadmill territory until Kemba leaves.

**** you Ainge
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#56 » by CeltsfaninDC » Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:50 pm

lets not overreact
MJ just paid Gordon $40,000,000 a year for a guy that hasn't even played a full season for the past 3 years. Its a MASSIVE overpay and will look horrible in a years time and will be a joke in the final two years when he is limping around.
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#57 » by Green89 » Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:50 pm

Tai wrote:
Green89 wrote:We still don't know the details of why Hayward and the team agreed on two more days. Was Hayward willing to opt-in and be traded to Indiana, but Ainge convinced him to wait out for a S&T after opting out to better help his team in some way? Then, Ainge got cute and couldn't give in to Indiana's offer? Hayward willing to go there on the discount, but then Danny balking and extending it further may have caused him to go with Charlotte? Lots of unknown here, but let's face it, I do believe Ainge had some ability here to get an Indiana deal done and it didn't happen.


Just to clarify on this, Hayward opting out helped the Celtics because then the Pacers were able to potentially get Hayward on their own terms (such as 4/$100M that was rumored) as opposed to 1 yr/34.1M. The Pacers were much more likely to give a good package if they got Hayward long-term on a lower price as opposed to as a higher priced rental.


Right, which is why this sucks if he was going to opt in otherwise, and just be traded elsewhere on draft night. He tried to help out us and the Pacers, and it's a gamble that didn't pay off for us.

I don't think anyone can argue that Ainge's ultimate goal was to get something for him.
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#58 » by captain green » Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:52 pm

I ain't for firing ainge but waiting for him to get a bigger offer from out the blue doesn't put him in a Good light. But no way I'm paying Hayward 120 mil. Onwards it's over time to move on from Hayward let Danny do his job and and see what he can salvage.
We always talk about there’s A-to-Z… really, there’s A-to-G or -E,’” Ainge told Celtics.com of a team’s typical offseason agenda. “This year, there’s definitely A-to-Z.” : danny ainge
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#59 » by reload141 » Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:00 pm

CeltsfaninDC wrote:lets not overreact
MJ just paid Gordon $40,000,000 a year for a guy that hasn't even played a full season for the past 3 years. Its a MASSIVE overpay and will look horrible in a years time and will be a joke in the final two years when he is limping around.


Knowing our luck, he will play the next 4 seasons fully and won't be injured.
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Re: Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go 

Post#60 » by BostonCouchGM » Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:02 pm

2013
Year 1 of the rebuild after losing the Big Three. Takes Olynyk over Giannis or Gobert
2014
takes James Young over Bogdan, Jokic, Grant, Capela and Dinwiddie
2016
fake roster crunch so he drafts and stashes Yabusele and Zizic instead of drafting Dejounte, LeVert, Siakam or Brogdon
2017
trades for disgruntled head case Kyrie rental that costs us the #8 pick in the 2018 draft (SGA or MPJ)
2019
signs Kemba lmao
takes Langford over Sekou, Samanic
trades out of #20 instead of taking Clarke
takes Grant Williams over Bazley
takes Carsen Edwards over Bol, Roby, Paschall
2020
trades #30 pick instead of taking Robert Woodard II or Tyler Bey who would be Hayward replacement

Ainge has BEEN bad. Imagine if he didn't get a clueless Russian owner to hand him that Nets haul? There'd have been no Jaylen and no Tatum. He's not good folks. Of course he needs to go. He's always been a disastrous drafter but now even his trades have fallen off. We're a treadmill team that might very well lose Tatum because of his ineptitude. But as long as he has fans defending him and an owner happy to fill sits and not delve into the luxury tax he's seemingly here for life.

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