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Why I still believe thread!

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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#21 » by darrendaye » Thu Feb 25, 2021 1:01 pm

cl2117 wrote:I still believe in this team. I'm not confident, but I believe in them.

Tatum and Brown are legit. There is no doubt about it. They both are still incredibly young and there is a learning curve to becoming superstars. They've nailed how to get their own and now they need to add in the ability to elevate others consistently. They're getting caught up in focusing purely on scoring and when the focus of the defense and in particular the double teams come, they become far far less effective. These guys are cornerstones and two have 2 of them immediately puts us in a position to have a puncher's chance against most teams.

Kemba is healthy. Unfortunately, so much of our season relies on Kemba because of how important having a legit scoring option outside of the Jays' is to giving them breathing room. His skillset is scoring, he's not going to deliver on the defensive end, he's not going to be the facilitator that can afford not to put the ball in the basket. His being healthy is half the battle when it comes to him being that legit 3rd scoring option for us. If he doesn't at least become consistently above average, we're probably sunk, but at least there is the potential for that.

The kids are WAY more promising than they looked at the start of the year. Nesmith is coming on both defensively and on the boards, when his primary skillset should be as a scorer. Pritchard looks like a low-ceiling, but high floor bench piece. Timelord is otherworldly, but just needs to be able to play 25+ minutes. Langford hasn't even gotten a shot, but his skillset is eating at the rim and we desperately need that.

Smart is going to come in and fill a LOT of holes. Defensively he's the heart and soul. Offensively he's a shockingly good facilitator (especially when he's not looking for his own shot). For such a young team, his leadership will go a LONG way.

And there is still 4 weeks until the trade deadline and Ainge has a huge chip with this TPE to be able to potentially add an impact player as well as a reasonable sized one via the Kanter TPE to add a more more moderate impact player and save the big move for the summer.

It's obviously been really ugly the last several weeks. There aren't enough excuses to explain away all the bad we've seen. But we are also incredibly lucky. The East has been brutal all year. We're 2 losses behind the 4th seed and 4 behind the 3rd seed. Despite being without guys for extended periods we haven't had any season ending injuries.

We've got plenty of potential, just need to put it all together. Not saying it will happen, but it's not a foregone conclusion that it won't. I believe C's can turn it around this season and make noise in the playoffs.


Hit on many of the relevant points. With Kemba coming back from injury and the abundance of young players on the team, it should have been expected to be a somewhat uneven start of the year with the idea of peaking late. Right now, to me, the most important aspect is for Stevens to continue to tell the Jays to trust their teammates.

Consider the Jays and Kemba likely expect to account for 70 points per game. Smart, Nesmith, Timelord, and possibly Pritchard should find enough shots to each average double digit ppg. As you allude, Langford's ability to slither into the paint and ability he showed in college to finish at the rim is a skill in short supply on the team. Tatum continues to be rather pedestrian in this regard. Romeo should be given a long rope to see how far he can develop.

Whether or not they add someone this year, if the locker-room doesn't meltdown, I believe the arrow will point back up later in the year with more speedbumps in the short term. Personally, I don't believe they need another scorer.
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#22 » by Taget » Thu Feb 25, 2021 1:31 pm

The reason we are in free fall is the extended absence of Marcus Smart. He sets the tone on defense. He's the true team captain who keeps players in line and accountable. When he comes back we'll rebound. That said the place we were before his injury was not where we expected or wanted to be given where we were in past seasons (going to the ECF). But like it or not when and whether or not his play was always pretty he WAS our defensive identity. He was what we referred to around the league as Boston's "culture."

Other parts like the thinning of our bench which I do find inexplicable (weak benches tend to be after major trades not us bringing back what we know to be duds). He usually is better at finding a few journeymen to round out the roster and separating the team quickly from mistakes. This year he'll get a mulligan. Next year will not be so forgiving. It does also make me worry about our trade exception.

Danny is less likely to gamble on it if it puts the team in tax territory. Owners are less forgiving when you cost them money.
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#23 » by Fierce1 » Thu Feb 25, 2021 1:58 pm

The Corey's wrote:
Your the one who decided to perpetrate the mthy that we only lost 1 core member and didn't lose him for nothing.

We lost 3 all star players and none of them willingly. It adds up.


It's true the Celts only lost one core member from last season's team that made it to the east finals?

Who are the other core players that the Celts lost?
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#24 » by The Corey's » Thu Feb 25, 2021 3:56 pm

Fierce1 wrote:
The Corey's wrote:
Your the one who decided to perpetrate the mthy that we only lost 1 core member and didn't lose him for nothing.

We lost 3 all star players and none of them willingly. It adds up.


It's true the Celts only lost one core member from last season's team that made it to the east finals?

Who are the other core players that the Celts lost?


I never said that and you know it.
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#25 » by Fierce1 » Thu Feb 25, 2021 3:58 pm

The Corey's wrote:
RB34 wrote:
The Corey's wrote:Owner literally said in radio yesterday that this tram isn't a championship team.

So the next step is to watch them to see the young talent develop. Except we can't even do that because so much terrible awful basketball is being displayed that these bad traits are either coming from awful coaching or young talent that simply can not grasp the idea of team ball.

Either way, neither of those things are going anywhere.


I missed radio show but it’s hard to understand their thinking.

I mean, we’ve been on the verge of the finals multiple times in the last few years and now we’re back to developing the young guys?

I understand developing our young stars but we need a gritty, experienced bench to help us when the season gets down to business.


This is what happens when you lose core members of your team for absolutely nothing and then replace them with incompetent players that don't even belong in the league.


This is what you posted earlier.
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#26 » by The Corey's » Thu Feb 25, 2021 4:06 pm

Fierce1 wrote:
The Corey's wrote:
RB34 wrote:
I missed radio show but it’s hard to understand their thinking.

I mean, we’ve been on the verge of the finals multiple times in the last few years and now we’re back to developing the young guys?

I understand developing our young stars but we need a gritty, experienced bench to help us when the season gets down to business.


This is what happens when you lose core members of your team for absolutely nothing and then replace them with incompetent players that don't even belong in the league.


This is what you posted earlier.


I know what I said. It's you that doesn't know what I said.
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#27 » by Fierce1 » Thu Feb 25, 2021 4:07 pm

The Corey's wrote:I know what I said. It's you that doesn't know what I said.


So what are you referring to?
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#28 » by The Corey's » Thu Feb 25, 2021 4:16 pm

Fierce1 wrote:
The Corey's wrote:I know what I said. It's you that doesn't know what I said.


So what are you referring to?


You inferred my sentence as strictly from last year's team to this year's team. Both even though I never said that and even after I said that that's not what I meant.

Following replies made it clear who I was talking about and I meant but you disagree. You think it's fine that losing horford and irving for nothing and that they aren't core members.

I disagree. I disagree and believe that two all stars replaced for nothing is a colossal waste and mismanagement of assets that a GM could possibly do. These are players danny brought in with both cap and assets that were never replaced and thus sources were wasted that he hasn't been able to manuever and rectify.

Hayward is the only one he was able get SOMETHING for and still the jury is out on wether or not he salavged that or if it's just another all star who wanted out and was replaced with nothing.

It's not an opinion. These are facts and anyone who wants to cherry coat it aren't living in reality.
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#29 » by Fierce1 » Thu Feb 25, 2021 4:28 pm

The Corey's wrote:You inferred my sentence as strictly from last year's team to this year's team. Both even though I never said that and even after I said that that's not what I meant.

Following replies made it clear who I was talking about and I meant but you disagree. You think it's fine that losing horford and irving for nothing and that they aren't core members.

I disagree. I disagree and believe that two all stars replaced for nothing is a colossal waste and mismanagement of assets that a GM could possibly do. These are players danny brought in with both cap and assets that were never replaced and thus sources were wasted that he hasn't been able to manuever and rectify.

Hayward is the only one he was able get SOMETHING for and still the jury is out on wether or not he salavged that or if it's just another all star who wanted out and was replaced with nothing.

It's not an opinion. These are facts and anyone who wants to cherry coat it aren't living in reality.


Kyrie was replaced by Kemba.

Horford was replaced by Theis.

With Kyrie and Horford, the Celts exited in the 2nd round against the Bucks.

The following season with Kemba and Theis, the Celts reached the east finals.

Celts got nothing in return for Kyrie, true.
But Kyrie leaving opened the door for Ainge to sign Kemba.
So Kemba replaced Kyrie.

Horford left and the Celts got nothing in return, also true.
But the Celts never missed Al Horford at all last season.

It's only when Hayward left that the Celts took a turn for the worse.
Celts were 3rd in the east last season and now they're not even in the playoffs.

If it's true that Kyrie and Horford leaving made the Celts a bad team then it should have happened last season.
But the Celts got better last season.
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#30 » by 2Mas » Thu Feb 25, 2021 4:30 pm

I cannot believe all of this meltdown nonsense.

I had us a 4 seed this year. We're 1 game out. This isn't a championship roster. Let be real last year playoffs was fun, but we weren't world beaters. & we lost talent. We're 15-17 & our full team has played 1 game together.

We got our 2 studs locked up long term. I trust Brad & Danny enough of the nonsense with firing them. PP, & Rob look good. I'd assume we'll pay Smart. Nesmith has looked like a player now. Kemba looks bad but he only needs to be a good 3rd option. That's more than possible.

Sure this hasn't been fun, but we are so damn dramatic it's wild.
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#31 » by Fierce1 » Thu Feb 25, 2021 4:34 pm

2Mas wrote:I cannot believe all of this meltdown nonsense.

I had us a 4 seed this year. We're 1 game out. This isn't a championship roster. Let be real last year playoffs was fun, but we weren't world beaters. & we lost talent. We're 15-17 & our full team has played 1 game together.

We got our 2 studs locked up long term. I trust Brad & Danny enough of the nonsense with firing them. PP, & Rob look good. I'd assume we'll pay Smart. Nesmith has looked like a player now. Kemba looks bad but he only needs to be a good 3rd option. That's more than possible.

Sure this hasn't been fun, but we are so damn dramatic it's wild.


Totally agree.

It really is wild the last 2 weeks. :lol:
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#32 » by The Corey's » Thu Feb 25, 2021 4:41 pm

Fierce1 wrote:
The Corey's wrote:You inferred my sentence as strictly from last year's team to this year's team. Both even though I never said that and even after I said that that's not what I meant.

Following replies made it clear who I was talking about and I meant but you disagree. You think it's fine that losing horford and irving for nothing and that they aren't core members.

I disagree. I disagree and believe that two all stars replaced for nothing is a colossal waste and mismanagement of assets that a GM could possibly do. These are players danny brought in with both cap and assets that were never replaced and thus sources were wasted that he hasn't been able to manuever and rectify.

Hayward is the only one he was able get SOMETHING for and still the jury is out on wether or not he salavged that or if it's just another all star who wanted out and was replaced with nothing.

It's not an opinion. These are facts and anyone who wants to cherry coat it aren't living in reality.


Kyrie was replaced by Kemba.

Horford was replaced by Theis.

With Kyrie and Horford, the Celts exited in the 2nd round against the Bucks.

The following season with Kemba and Theis, the Celts reached the east finals.

Celts got nothing in return for Kyrie, true.
But Kyrie leaving opened the door for Ainge to sign Kemba.
So Kemba replaced Kyrie.

Horford left and the Celts got nothing in return, also true.
But the Celts never missed Al Horford at all last season.

It's only when Hayward left that the Celts took a turn for the worse.
Celts were 3rd in the east last season and now they're not even in the playoffs.

If it's true that Kyrie and Horford leaving made the Celts a bad team then it should have happened last season.
But the Celts got better last season.


Heat made the finals last year. Last year's result mean crap.

You're not ready to accept that losing two all stars for NOTHING that JUST TWO years prior were sold to the fanbase as game changing acquisitions.

I disagree with your entire paragraph entirely. None of it's true.
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#33 » by canman1971 » Thu Feb 25, 2021 4:45 pm

I still believe too. That this team isn't going anywhere this season.
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#34 » by Fierce1 » Thu Feb 25, 2021 4:49 pm

The Corey's wrote:Heat made the finals last year. Last year's result mean crap.

You're not ready to accept that losing two all stars for NOTHING that JUST TWO years prior were sold to the fanbase as game changing acquisitions.

I disagree with your entire paragraph entirely. None of it's true.


Hindsight is always 20-20.

Kyrie was toxic and getting rid of him was the right move.

There was no indication that Horford would leave at the end of the season.
Everybody was expecting Horford to opt in.
Even Ainge was blindsided by what Horford did.

Just because you disagree with me, it doesn't mean what happened isn't true.
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#35 » by The Corey's » Thu Feb 25, 2021 4:55 pm

Fierce1 wrote:
The Corey's wrote:Heat made the finals last year. Last year's result mean crap.

You're not ready to accept that losing two all stars for NOTHING that JUST TWO years prior were sold to the fanbase as game changing acquisitions.

I disagree with your entire paragraph entirely. None of it's true.


Hindsight is always 20-20.

Kyrie was toxic and getting rid of him was the right move.

There was no indication that Horford would leave at the end of the season.
Everybody was expecting Horford to opt in.
Even Ainge was blindsided by what Horford did.

Just because you disagree with me, it doesn't mean what happened isn't true.


Right, but Irving was part of the plans. They didn't just let him go and replace him with Kemba. Irving is toxic and I wanted him gone months before it happened. I didn't however want him gone for nothing. Danny did as best as he could in that situation but Kemba is really not that good and his positive attitude doesn't make up the rather large difference in skill between him and Irving.

Being blindsided by Horford is literally the problem I'm talking about. You and me being blindsided is fine, but Ainge cant just play ignorant and say he was blindsided and everything is just fine. Its his job to know these thing and make sure they do not happen.

Irving
Horford
Hayward

=

Kemba?

Yea, that simply does not work for me.
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#36 » by Fierce1 » Thu Feb 25, 2021 5:04 pm

The Corey's wrote:
Right, but Irving was part of the plans. They didn't just let him go and replace him with Kemba. Irving is toxic and I wanted him gone months before it happened. I didn't however want him gone for nothing. Danny did as best as he could in that situation but Kemba is really not that good and his positive attitude doesn't make up the rather large difference in skill between him and Irving.

Being blindsided by Horford is literally the problem I'm talking about. You and me being blindsided is fine, but Ainge cant just play ignorant and say he was blindsided and everything is just fine. Its his job to know these thing and make sure they do not happen.

Irving
Horford
Hayward

=

Kemba?

Yea, that simply does not work for me.


That's fair.

But from Ainge's track record, he's never been perfect.
He also screwed up when he thought Ricky Davis was going to become a star.

When Ainge was on the hot seat, he got KG and Ray and the Celts ended up winning a championship.

After Pierce and KG got old, he traded them for picks that turned out be Jaylen Brown and Jayson Tatum.

Right now Ainge just has to do his job and make the Celtics great again. :lol:
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#37 » by Fencer reregistered » Thu Feb 25, 2021 5:10 pm

The Corey's wrote:
Fierce1 wrote:
The Corey's wrote:
This is what happens when you lose core members of your team for absolutely nothing and then replace them with incompetent players that don't even belong in the league.


Hayward is the only one lost from the core last season.

And the Celts did not get absolutely nothing because the Celts got that 28.5m TPE from the Hayward sign and trade.

Using the TPE to replace Hayward is another story.

If Celts use the TPE to get Harrison Barnes for example, it will be like trading Hayward for Barnes.


Wrong.

Be real nice if we stopped giving the Celtics a pass for losing 3 max contract all stars in 3 straight seasons.

The hoops some jump through to act like that's both normal and ACCEPTABLE


2 of those 3 guys you're complaining about are former all-stars who the Celtics got for free in the first place.
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#38 » by The Corey's » Thu Feb 25, 2021 5:18 pm

Fencer reregistered wrote:
The Corey's wrote:
Fierce1 wrote:
Hayward is the only one lost from the core last season.

And the Celts did not get absolutely nothing because the Celts got that 28.5m TPE from the Hayward sign and trade.

Using the TPE to replace Hayward is another story.

If Celts use the TPE to get Harrison Barnes for example, it will be like trading Hayward for Barnes.


Wrong.

Be real nice if we stopped giving the Celtics a pass for losing 3 max contract all stars in 3 straight seasons.

The hoops some jump through to act like that's both normal and ACCEPTABLE


2 of those 3 guys you're complaining about are former all-stars who the Celtics got for free in the first place.


Its not free when you lose a 30 million dollar a year CAP HOLD.

Its like yall dont wanna win a ship.

I dont want Horford, I wanted his cap hold that allows this team to maneuver the monies that allow you to add legitimate talent but why bring that up? It doesn't fit the narrative.
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#39 » by playa-hater » Sat Feb 27, 2021 4:12 am

I am gonna beat these Drums into existence.

But we can win and Go far, if these 4 GOALs are met.

Extend RW's minutes.

Get Smart Back healthy

Continue to play/develop Nesmith

and 1 Key pickup.

we see what can happen when Rob finishes a game. Now let's get the other 3!
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Re: Why I still believe thread! 

Post#40 » by return2glory » Sat Feb 27, 2021 3:39 pm

Jammer wrote:There was a reason I pushed SO HARD for Kemba to be traded before the DRAFT last fall.

Now you all understand why. But not enough saw it then.

Ainge should have taken whatever his best deal was AT THAT TIME. Whatever. Because his value is even lower now.


And that shows how wrong you are. I’ve been saying for a month now to give Kemba until end of February/early March and he will be back to his all-star form. And over the last 7 games he is averaging 22 a game on improved shooting. Last night he had 30 and 6 assists and was our best player.

Some of you have lost any logic you have. The guy came back from an injury where he hardly touched the ball for 4 months. It was going to take time for him to gain confidence mentally and physically and also get back into game shape.

This is a league where the top players work of shooting every day and he wasn’t able to do that for months. A lot of people here got impatient with him.

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