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Our road back to the top

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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#101 » by Ernest » Mon Apr 5, 2021 4:45 pm

Don't loke now, but we are on a 2 game win streak! 2 blow outs where we looked really good. Good thing the losers didn't get their way and fire everyone huh?

Thinking long term though Jokic Embiid and Gainis are the 3 best bigs right? (and AD too) what are the odds they all stay on their current teams for their primes? Someone will get moved for some reason eventually. WE just need to keep imporving the team while finding developing and managing assets to be in a good spot to make a top offer when someone who can put us over the top hits the block. That has got to be the plan right?
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#102 » by Curmudgeon » Mon Apr 5, 2021 4:49 pm

LOL, 2-game streak against two bad/undermanned teams. Let's see how it goes tomorrow against the Sixers. Embiid vs the seven dwarves.
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#103 » by LarryBirdsFingr » Mon Apr 5, 2021 4:58 pm

Ernest wrote:Don't loke now, but we are on a 2 game win streak! 2 blow outs where we looked really good. Good thing the losers didn't get their way and fire everyone huh?

Thinking long term though Jokic Embiid and Gainis are the 3 best bigs right? (and AD too) what are the odds they all stay on their current teams for their primes? Someone will get moved for some reason eventually. WE just need to keep imporving the team while finding developing and managing assets to be in a good spot to make a top offer when someone who can put us over the top hits the block. That has got to be the plan right?

Two blow out wins to a depleted LOL CATS, and the 6'5 and under league team who snuck into the NBA.

Let's see how they do against real NBA teams.
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#104 » by Hal14 » Mon Apr 5, 2021 9:27 pm

2023-2024 could be our year. If not, then definitely 2024-2025.

We're not going to be able to trade Kemba with his overpriced contract. But, he is due to make $38 mil in 2022-2023, which is the last year of his contract. That's $38 mil that will come off the books in the 2023 offseason. So in the 2023 offseason we can sign an all-star free agent and use up most (if not all) of that $38 mil. Think about it. There's only 7 players in the entire NBA right now making more than $38 mil a year. Now I'm not saying we'll be able to sign a top 7 player in the NBA, but I definitely think it's realistic that we could sign a top 15-20 player in the NBA. What, you don't think any big name free agent will want to come to Boston? Why not? 2 years from now Tatum will be 25 and Brown will be 26. Both guys will be about to enter their absolute peak (most players peak around age 26-28). Especially considering how old guys like Lebron/Durant/Harden will be 2 years from now, Boston will be the premier destination for an all-star free agent in 2023. The possibility of teaming up with Tatum and Brown to form the best big 3 in the league would be pretty appealing. The Celtics would have 3 of the top 20 players in the league.

Hell, with the way Time Lord is developing we could have ourselves 4 all-stars on the same team in 2024. After all, Time Lord is currently 1st on the Celtics in every one of the following categories:

-Offensive Rating
-Defensive Rating
-Win Shares
-Offensive Win Shares
-Defensive Win Shares (tied with Tatum)
-BPM (Box Score Plus Minus)
-PER
-TS% (True Shooting %)
-Rebounding % (tied with Thompson)
-Blocks %
-Blocks per game
-FG%
-Steal %

Now let's see where he ranks among all players in the entire NBA:
-1st in Offensive Rating
-1st in blocks %
-2nd in TS%
-2nd in FG%
-3rd in Win Shares Per 48 Minutes
-5th in rebounding %
-5th in PER
-8th in Defensive Rating
-8th in BPM (above Kawhi Leonard and James Harden)
-13th in Steal %

With Kemba gone, Pritchard takes over the starting PG spot in the 2023-2024 season. We groom him to take over the starting role between now and then. We all know Pritchard has shown good tenacity, toughness, grittiness, and shooting ability. Where he's struggled a little bit are defense and play making. I feel like his defense has gotten a lot better last couple weeks. And he did average 5.5 assists per game his last year in college so we know that he can find his teammates. I think he can average even more assists than that too since in college he was relied upon to be a big scorer. On this Celtics team he's more of a spot up shooter, pass-first and only shoot if the defense forgets about him. So I think as he develops over the next couple years he'll learn that balance better of when to pass, when to shoot and he'll be a really solid starting PG.

Then, you keep either Fournier or Smart on as a 6th man. So you're 2023-2024 roster:

C - Time Lord
F - Tatum
G/F - Brown
G/F - all-star free agent we sign using the $ that becomes available once Kemba's $38 mil contract comes off the books
PG - Pritchard

6th man - Smart/Fournier

Then filling out the rotation you have either Nesmith or Langford as the 7th man, giving you some good scoring, defense and energy off the bench. For a backup big man you can either keep developing Kornet/Wagner or sign a veteran

In the 2023-2024 season you're looking at Tatum/Brown both could possibly be top 10 players in the league. The guy you sign asa free agent with the Kemba money could definitely be a top 15-20 player in the league. By that time Time Lord is a top 20-25 player in the league. Pritchard is a solid PG and Fournier/Smart could be one of the league's best 6th men.

By that time guys like Lebron, Durant, Harden, Paul and Curry are older and either really in decline or retired altogether.

You win the title in 2024, or 2025 at the latest.

The 2023 free agent class is absolutely loaded, here's the full list of free agents in 2023 which includes Embiid, Harden, Lebron, Beal, Porzingis, Jimmy Butler, Kyrie Irving, Ja Morant, Zion Williamson, Jokic, Middleton, D'Angelo Russell, Vucevic, Jerami Grant, Wall, Westbrook, Durant, VanVleet, Malcolm Brogdon, Draymond Green, etc.

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/free-agents/2023/

I'm thinking Beal is the guy we sign. Obviously there's been a lot of rumors about us trading for him because him and Tatum are buddies and went to the same high school. Imagine a starting 5 of Tatum/Brown/Beal/Time Lord/Pritchard with Smart/Fournier as 6th man in 2023-2024?
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#105 » by grindtime22 » Mon Apr 5, 2021 10:10 pm

Hal14 wrote:2023-2024 could be our year. If not, then definitely 2024-2025.

We're not going to be able to trade Kemba with his overpriced contract. But, he is due to make $38 mil in 2022-2023, which is the last year of his contract. That's $38 mil that will come off the books in the 2023 offseason. So in the 2023 offseason we can sign an all-star free agent and use up most (if not all) of that $38 mil. Think about it. There's only 7 players in the entire NBA right now making more than $38 mil a year.


That isn't exactly how it works. Kemba coming off the books doesn't mean we just get to easily use his money on somebody else. Tatum and Brown will be around 62 and that number could be closer to 68 if Tatum squeaks out all-nba this year. Hopefully, Nesmith and Pritchard will make about 10 combined. Are we resigning Fournier? He probably makes close to 20 if so. You are at 90-100 already. Are we going to lock in Timelord? 15? 20? What is it going to be? Does Romeo play well enough to still be here and get a 2nd contract. You have Smart in your depth chart, that is probably close to another 20.

Just because Kemba's money comes off the books, doesn't mean we get to use that money. We would have to get below the salary cap and that isn't likely if we have Pritchard, Smart, Fournier, Timelord, Tatum, and Brown.

The cap is 109 right now. It is supposedly going to be 112 next year. It will be higher in 23/24, but probably not enough to make that kind of difference. New TV money probably won't kick in by that point. The current deal runs through 24/25.
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#106 » by Hal14 » Mon Apr 5, 2021 10:21 pm

grindtime22 wrote:
Hal14 wrote:2023-2024 could be our year. If not, then definitely 2024-2025.

We're not going to be able to trade Kemba with his overpriced contract. But, he is due to make $38 mil in 2022-2023, which is the last year of his contract. That's $38 mil that will come off the books in the 2023 offseason. So in the 2023 offseason we can sign an all-star free agent and use up most (if not all) of that $38 mil. Think about it. There's only 7 players in the entire NBA right now making more than $38 mil a year.


That isn't exactly how it works. Kemba coming off the books doesn't mean we just get to easily use his money on somebody else. Tatum and Brown will be around 62 and that number could be closer to 68 if Tatum squeaks out all-nba this year. Hopefully, Nesmith and Pritchard will make about 10 combined. Are we resigning Fournier? He probably makes close to 20 if so. You are at 90-100 already. Are we going to lock in Timelord? 15? 20? What is it going to be? Does Romeo play well enough to still be here and get a 2nd contract. You have Smart in your depth chart, that is probably close to another 20.

Just because Kemba's money comes off the books, doesn't mean we get to use that money. We would have to get below the salary cap and that isn't likely if we have Pritchard, Smart, Fournier, Timelord, Tatum, and Brown.

The cap is 109 right now. It is supposedly going to be 112 next year. It will be higher in 23/24, but probably not enough to make that kind of difference. New TV money probably won't kick in by that point. The current deal runs through 24/25.

I see what you're getting at. But the fact is, we need to be under the cap when the 2022-2023 season ends. And we're paying Kemba $38 mil in 2022-2023. So theoretically, a good portion of that $38 mil should be available to spend in the 2023 offseason if we let Kemba walk as a free agent. If Ainge plays his cards right, there should be enough $ to sign an all-star.

Also, I'm saying that between Fournier/Smart, we're only keeping 1 of them into the 2023-2024 season.
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#107 » by grindtime22 » Mon Apr 5, 2021 10:48 pm

Hal14 wrote:
grindtime22 wrote:
Hal14 wrote:2023-2024 could be our year. If not, then definitely 2024-2025.

We're not going to be able to trade Kemba with his overpriced contract. But, he is due to make $38 mil in 2022-2023, which is the last year of his contract. That's $38 mil that will come off the books in the 2023 offseason. So in the 2023 offseason we can sign an all-star free agent and use up most (if not all) of that $38 mil. Think about it. There's only 7 players in the entire NBA right now making more than $38 mil a year.


That isn't exactly how it works. Kemba coming off the books doesn't mean we just get to easily use his money on somebody else. Tatum and Brown will be around 62 and that number could be closer to 68 if Tatum squeaks out all-nba this year. Hopefully, Nesmith and Pritchard will make about 10 combined. Are we resigning Fournier? He probably makes close to 20 if so. You are at 90-100 already. Are we going to lock in Timelord? 15? 20? What is it going to be? Does Romeo play well enough to still be here and get a 2nd contract. You have Smart in your depth chart, that is probably close to another 20.

Just because Kemba's money comes off the books, doesn't mean we get to use that money. We would have to get below the salary cap and that isn't likely if we have Pritchard, Smart, Fournier, Timelord, Tatum, and Brown.

The cap is 109 right now. It is supposedly going to be 112 next year. It will be higher in 23/24, but probably not enough to make that kind of difference. New TV money probably won't kick in by that point. The current deal runs through 24/25.

I see what you're getting at. But the fact is, we need to be under the cap when the 2022-2023 season ends. And we're paying Kemba $38 mil in 2022-2023. So theoretically, a good portion of that $38 mil should be available to spend in the 2023 offseason if we let Kemba walk as a free agent. If Ainge plays his cards right, there should be enough $ to sign an all-star.


There would have to be other MAJOR moves for that to happen though.

If Tatum, Brown, Timelord, Pritchard, and one of Smart/Founier are on the books..... there isn't all star money available. We would have to completely clear the decks for something like that to happen. Tatum, Brown, and Timelord alone might not even give you the space you would need to sign an all star.

The current projection for the salary cap is 119.2 in 23/24. For a 7-9 max, you are starting at 35.76. So, the rest of the roster would have to get to 83.44 to clear enough space for an all star.

Brown is 29.06
Tatum will either be 32.6 or 39.12
Timelord is going to be at least 15 right? I don't know what the number is but that is probably the floor right?
Pritchard is on the books for 4

Add it up. That is 4 players totaling 80.66 or 87.18

That is before you even start talking about Smart or Fournier, or Nesmith (hopefully 5.6), or Romeo
At the very least, you have the empty roster spot charges that are close to a million a piece.


Kemba straight dropping off the books probably isn't going to do much for us in free agency unless we are doing something like moving Brown. There are other routes to adding another star and moving on from Kemba, but his money falling off the books at the end of his deal isn't it.
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#108 » by zoyathedestroya » Mon Apr 5, 2021 10:58 pm

We're only players in the FA market via S&T in the foreseeable future. Forget about cap space.
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#109 » by Hal14 » Mon Apr 5, 2021 11:24 pm

grindtime22 wrote:
Hal14 wrote:
grindtime22 wrote:
That isn't exactly how it works. Kemba coming off the books doesn't mean we just get to easily use his money on somebody else. Tatum and Brown will be around 62 and that number could be closer to 68 if Tatum squeaks out all-nba this year. Hopefully, Nesmith and Pritchard will make about 10 combined. Are we resigning Fournier? He probably makes close to 20 if so. You are at 90-100 already. Are we going to lock in Timelord? 15? 20? What is it going to be? Does Romeo play well enough to still be here and get a 2nd contract. You have Smart in your depth chart, that is probably close to another 20.

Just because Kemba's money comes off the books, doesn't mean we get to use that money. We would have to get below the salary cap and that isn't likely if we have Pritchard, Smart, Fournier, Timelord, Tatum, and Brown.

The cap is 109 right now. It is supposedly going to be 112 next year. It will be higher in 23/24, but probably not enough to make that kind of difference. New TV money probably won't kick in by that point. The current deal runs through 24/25.

I see what you're getting at. But the fact is, we need to be under the cap when the 2022-2023 season ends. And we're paying Kemba $38 mil in 2022-2023. So theoretically, a good portion of that $38 mil should be available to spend in the 2023 offseason if we let Kemba walk as a free agent. If Ainge plays his cards right, there should be enough $ to sign an all-star.


There would have to be other MAJOR moves for that to happen though.

If Tatum, Brown, Timelord, Pritchard, and one of Smart/Founier are on the books..... there isn't all star money available. We would have to completely clear the decks for something like that to happen. Tatum, Brown, and Timelord alone might not even give you the space you would need to sign an all star.

The current projection for the salary cap is 119.2 in 23/24. For a 7-9 max, you are starting at 35.76. So, the rest of the roster would have to get to 83.44 to clear enough space for an all star.

Brown is 29.06
Tatum will either be 32.6 or 39.12
Timelord is going to be at least 15 right? I don't know what the number is but that is probably the floor right?
Pritchard is on the books for 4

Add it up. That is 4 players totaling 80.66 or 87.18

That is before you even start talking about Smart or Fournier, or Nesmith (hopefully 5.6), or Romeo
At the very least, you have the empty roster spot charges that are close to a million a piece.


Kemba straight dropping off the books probably isn't going to do much for us in free agency unless we are doing something like moving Brown. There are other routes to adding another star and moving on from Kemba, but his money falling off the books at the end of his deal isn't it.

Bottom line:

a) we need to be under the cap when the 2022-2023 season ends
b) Kemba will still be on the team and is due to make $38 mil in 2022-2023
c) we let him walk as a free agent in 2023 offseason

Tatum and Brown will both make $2 mil more in 2023-2024 then they do the year before. So that's $4 mil that needs to be accounted for. We might have to pay other guys like Langford/Pritchard/Time Lord more by that time, but we're also saving cap space since by that time Thompson is gone (clears up $9 mil) and either Fournier or Smart is gone (clears either $13 mil or $17 mil).

I still don't see why it's completely out of the realm of possibility that if Ainge plays his cards right he could drop $24-$28 mil on a free agent in 2023, which could definitely be an all-star caliber player.
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#110 » by grindtime22 » Mon Apr 5, 2021 11:44 pm

Hal14 wrote:
grindtime22 wrote:
Hal14 wrote:I see what you're getting at. But the fact is, we need to be under the cap when the 2022-2023 season ends. And we're paying Kemba $38 mil in 2022-2023. So theoretically, a good portion of that $38 mil should be available to spend in the 2023 offseason if we let Kemba walk as a free agent. If Ainge plays his cards right, there should be enough $ to sign an all-star.


There would have to be other MAJOR moves for that to happen though.

If Tatum, Brown, Timelord, Pritchard, and one of Smart/Founier are on the books..... there isn't all star money available. We would have to completely clear the decks for something like that to happen. Tatum, Brown, and Timelord alone might not even give you the space you would need to sign an all star.

The current projection for the salary cap is 119.2 in 23/24. For a 7-9 max, you are starting at 35.76. So, the rest of the roster would have to get to 83.44 to clear enough space for an all star.

Brown is 29.06
Tatum will either be 32.6 or 39.12
Timelord is going to be at least 15 right? I don't know what the number is but that is probably the floor right?
Pritchard is on the books for 4

Add it up. That is 4 players totaling 80.66 or 87.18

That is before you even start talking about Smart or Fournier, or Nesmith (hopefully 5.6), or Romeo
At the very least, you have the empty roster spot charges that are close to a million a piece.


Kemba straight dropping off the books probably isn't going to do much for us in free agency unless we are doing something like moving Brown. There are other routes to adding another star and moving on from Kemba, but his money falling off the books at the end of his deal isn't it.

Bottom line:

a) we need to be under the cap when the 2022-2023 season ends
b) Kemba will still be on the team and is due to make $38 mil in 2022-2023
c) we let him walk as a free agent in 2023 offseason

Tatum and Brown will both make $2 mil more in 2023-2024 then they do the year before. So that's $4 mil that needs to be accounted for. We might have to pay other guys like Langford/Pritchard/Time Lord more by that time, but we're also saving cap space since by that time Thompson is gone (clears up $9 mil) and either Fournier or Smart is gone (clears either $13 mil or $17 mil).

I still don't see why it's completely out of the realm of possibility that if Ainge plays his cards right he could drop $24-$28 mil on a free agent in 2023, which could definitely be an all-star caliber player.


Not how it works

I don't even know where to start
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#111 » by 31to6 » Tue Apr 6, 2021 2:15 pm

Hal14 wrote:2023-2024 could be our year. If not, then definitely 2024-2025.

We're not going to be able to trade Kemba with his overpriced contract. But, he is due to make $38 mil in 2022-2023, which is the last year of his contract. That's $38 mil that will come off the books in the 2023 offseason. So in the 2023 offseason we can sign an all-star free agent and use up most (if not all) of that $38 mil. Think about it. There's only 7 players in the entire NBA right now making more than $38 mil a year. Now I'm not saying we'll be able to sign a top 7 player in the NBA, but I definitely think it's realistic that we could sign a top 15-20 player in the NBA. What, you don't think any big name free agent will want to come to Boston? Why not? 2 years from now Tatum will be 25 and Brown will be 26. Both guys will be about to enter their absolute peak (most players peak around age 26-28). Especially considering how old guys like Lebron/Durant/Harden will be 2 years from now, Boston will be the premier destination for an all-star free agent in 2023. The possibility of teaming up with Tatum and Brown to form the best big 3 in the league would be pretty appealing. The Celtics would have 3 of the top 20 players in the league.

Hell, with the way Time Lord is developing we could have ourselves 4 all-stars on the same team in 2024. After all, Time Lord is currently 1st on the Celtics in every one of the following categories:

-Offensive Rating
-Defensive Rating
-Win Shares
-Offensive Win Shares
-Defensive Win Shares (tied with Tatum)
-BPM (Box Score Plus Minus)
-PER
-TS% (True Shooting %)
-Rebounding % (tied with Thompson)
-Blocks %
-Blocks per game
-FG%
-Steal %

Now let's see where he ranks among all players in the entire NBA:
-1st in Offensive Rating
-1st in blocks %
-2nd in TS%
-2nd in FG%
-3rd in Win Shares Per 48 Minutes
-5th in rebounding %
-5th in PER
-8th in Defensive Rating
-8th in BPM (above Kawhi Leonard and James Harden)
-13th in Steal %

With Kemba gone, Pritchard takes over the starting PG spot in the 2023-2024 season. We groom him to take over the starting role between now and then. We all know Pritchard has shown good tenacity, toughness, grittiness, and shooting ability. Where he's struggled a little bit are defense and play making. I feel like his defense has gotten a lot better last couple weeks. And he did average 5.5 assists per game his last year in college so we know that he can find his teammates. I think he can average even more assists than that too since in college he was relied upon to be a big scorer. On this Celtics team he's more of a spot up shooter, pass-first and only shoot if the defense forgets about him. So I think as he develops over the next couple years he'll learn that balance better of when to pass, when to shoot and he'll be a really solid starting PG.

Then, you keep either Fournier or Smart on as a 6th man. So you're 2023-2024 roster:

C - Time Lord
F - Tatum
G/F - Brown
G/F - all-star free agent we sign using the $ that becomes available once Kemba's $38 mil contract comes off the books
PG - Pritchard

6th man - Smart/Fournier

Then filling out the rotation you have either Nesmith or Langford as the 7th man, giving you some good scoring, defense and energy off the bench. For a backup big man you can either keep developing Kornet/Wagner or sign a veteran

In the 2023-2024 season you're looking at Tatum/Brown both could possibly be top 10 players in the league. The guy you sign asa free agent with the Kemba money could definitely be a top 15-20 player in the league. By that time Time Lord is a top 20-25 player in the league. Pritchard is a solid PG and Fournier/Smart could be one of the league's best 6th men.

By that time guys like Lebron, Durant, Harden, Paul and Curry are older and either really in decline or retired altogether.

You win the title in 2024, or 2025 at the latest.

The 2023 free agent class is absolutely loaded, here's the full list of free agents in 2023 which includes Embiid, Harden, Lebron, Beal, Porzingis, Jimmy Butler, Kyrie Irving, Ja Morant, Zion Williamson, Jokic, Middleton, D'Angelo Russell, Vucevic, Jerami Grant, Wall, Westbrook, Durant, VanVleet, Malcolm Brogdon, Draymond Green, etc.

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/free-agents/2023/

I'm thinking Beal is the guy we sign. Obviously there's been a lot of rumors about us trading for him because him and Tatum are buddies and went to the same high school. Imagine a starting 5 of Tatum/Brown/Beal/Time Lord/Pritchard with Smart/Fournier as 6th man in 2023-2024?


I’m going to “like” this post — even though Hal’s completely wrong about the cap — just because it’s one of the most thoroughly positive/cheerful things I’ve ever seen on this board. Way to debut, Hal!
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#112 » by LoquaciousLarry » Wed Apr 7, 2021 1:15 am

Celtics aren't going to have adequate cap to be major players in FA nor do I think they'll be a premier destination based on how many stars have been leaving. The Culture needs to improve. There hasn't been a very unified feel to this team the last few seasons. They play for themselves and not for each other.

Ainge has had a very difficult time moving off of "his guys" but at some point they need to consolidate the roster.

Not enough balance, so many undersized guards and no bigs that are capable ball handlers. Poor rebounding and perimeter defense, not enough ball movement and too much standing around, iso ball and 3's. Really need a guard that can ignite the offense, is fearless in the paint and is constantly penetrating while providing toughness on defense. Pritchards going to be an excellent bench PG in this role.

Play Tacko Fall before you play Wagner or Kornet the rest of this season. Play Romeo and Nesmith over Semi. Find out what pieces are worth keeping and what their value is because its evident from afar that guys like Carsen Edwards (39% shooter his last year in college), Smart, and to an extent Kemba Walker are all low efficiency shooters that aren't very good passers either. Smarts the teams best passer which shows how poor of a passing team the Celtics are right now.

Grant and Semi are nice guys but look more like G League talent in my opinion. Rid the roster of inefficient, awful players like Edwards, Ojeleye, Grant Williams, Wagner, and Kornet and bring in adequate talent.

They're not very far away because they have some wonderful pieces, they just need to find the right role players to compliment what they're building with JB and JT. Surrounding two wing players with awful shooters that can't create for themselves or for others isn't a great recipe for success and leads to hero ball for the frustrated young stars. Get out and run, find a pass first point guard that enables basketball to be fun again rather than like pulling teeth. None of these guys look like they enjoy playing ball this year.
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#113 » by Red2 » Wed Apr 7, 2021 8:25 pm

Step one: get into the lottery this year
Step two- fire Austin Ainge and find someone who knows how to evaluate players
Step three- trade Kemba. Whatever you have to do he needs to go
Step four- sit down with Tatum and tell him he has to be better. He can’t come back next year playing selfish, disinterested basketball
Step four- trade smart for a big or a young PG. He’s injury prone and is only going to miss more games plus his mental mistakes lately have been mounting. He’s also lost a step defensively no matter what he may say.
Step five- play Nesmith .Romeo and Carsten a lot to see if they are worth keeping. I think Romeo is and I hold out hope for Aaron and Carsten but we need to find out if they are players we want to keep
Give Brad one more year. If he can’t get this team going in the right direction then fire him .
It’s going to take a couple of years to rebuild so lets be patient and do it the right way. We may be back in the lottery next year.
Get taller and bigger. We need some players with size and also toughness. We have a roster full of undersized finesse players. That has to end. We need to get tougher across the board.
Say goodbye to grant Williams, Tacko, Tristan and waters. They bring nothing and are just chewing up roster spots. Obviously look to get something back for them but we need to move on from those guys;
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#114 » by GoGreen » Wed Apr 7, 2021 9:12 pm

Besides everything else this team needs to do, Tatum needs to stop being a whiny child on the court. Sick of it. No fire, no passion, just entitled, me-me-me ball.
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#115 » by Ernest » Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:14 pm

How about Jokic as a long term trade target. I'd be surprised to see the Nuggets ever reach the WCF in the next 2 or 3 years. He's only 26. Ainge had KG on his radar for years. I wonder if Jokic is on his radar now.
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#116 » by Bleeding Green » Wed Apr 14, 2021 12:07 am

If the Nuggets trade Jokic they should be removed from the NBA.
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#117 » by Fencer reregistered » Wed Apr 14, 2021 12:42 am

The Celtics have NEVER, I'm pretty sure, won a championship without having at least 4 All-Star level players on their roster. Some of them were before or after their prime when they got their rings, but there always was that breadth of talent:

Cooz/Sharman/Heinsohn/Russell
Jones/Havlicek/Howell/Russell
White/Havlicek/Silas/Cowens
Archibald/Ainge/Bird/McHale/Parish
Rondo/Allen/Pierce/Garnett
Etc.

Teams Ainge was on personally that went to the Finals (including in Phoenix) had at least 5 such guys, including him.

That's not the only way to win; Laker champions have often been top-heavier than that. But it may still be the base Celtics model.
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#118 » by 31to6 » Wed Apr 14, 2021 1:12 am

Bleeding Green wrote:If the Nuggets trade Jokic they should be removed from the NBA.


Yeah I hope he's a lifetime Nugget. Could be the Greatest Nugget -- the other former ABA teams have Duncan (SAS), Reggie (IND), Dirk (DAL), No One (BRK). The league is due for someone to go wire-to-wire again.

I would like him here in the abstract, but rather he stays there and maybe wins a title maybe doesn't.
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#119 » by Ernest » Wed Apr 14, 2021 3:08 am

Bleeding Green wrote:If the Nuggets trade Jokic they should be removed from the NBA.


That's how it looks now. But give it 2 years. What do they do when they have only a year left and maybe the team is looking worse not better? Obviously it's a who knows kind of thing. But imo Ainge's plan A has got to be to keep developing everyone and at some point down the line have some combination of the young players be good enough to trade for a vet big like The greek freak or Embiid or Jokic or AD or someone like that. To make something like that work we need big steps in development out of the young guys and we probably need to keep some bigger contract around to trade. It will be an incite into Ainge's plan when we see what he does with Kemba. I'm assuming a trade, but what kind of contracts come back. Ainge was a master or "rolling over" expiring contracts in the past. Think Theo-Raef-Wally so that whenever the oppertunity to get a KG and Ray came around he could jump on it. He's got to do that again but still work within the repeater cap rules. Very tricky. My guess is Smart gets a big contract and along with the Jays are the core which is basically off the table. Fournier gets a deal and becomes a guy you can trade to match salary. The question then is can we afford to take back someone in a Kemba deal that will help a bit but really be there to eventually be an expiring contract to pair with guys still on rookie contracts and draft picks to bring in a max player in a trade?
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Re: Our road back to the top 

Post#120 » by Bleeding Green » Wed Apr 14, 2021 3:12 am

Ernest wrote:
Bleeding Green wrote:If the Nuggets trade Jokic they should be removed from the NBA.


That's how it looks now. But give it 2 years. What do they do when they have only a year left and maybe the team is looking worse not better? Obviously it's a who knows kind of thing. But imo Ainge's plan A has got to be to keep developing everyone and at some point down the line have some combination of the young players be good enough to trade for a vet big like The greek freak or Embiid or Jokic or AD or someone like that. To make something like that work we need big steps in development out of the young guys and we probably need to keep some bigger contract around to trade. It will be an incite into Ainge's plan when we see what he does with Kemba. I'm assuming a trade, but what kind of contracts come back. Ainge was a master or "rolling over" expiring contracts in the past. Think Theo-Raef-Wally so that whenever the oppertunity to get a KG and Ray came around he could jump on it. He's got to do that again but still work within the repeater cap rules. Very tricky. My guess is Smart gets a big contract and along with the Jays are the core which is basically off the table. Fournier gets a deal and becomes a guy you can trade to match salary. The question then is can we afford to take back someone in a Kemba deal that will help a bit but really be there to eventually be an expiring contract to pair with guys still on rookie contracts and draft picks to bring in a max player in a trade?

Why would they look worse? They have the best GM in basketball. Jokic is 26 and the best player in basketball, he gets better every year. Denver adds talent to its roster in ways that Ainge doesn't even consider. Jokic is the best playoff performer in the NBA. He is so easy to build around too. The Celtics would have to trade Tatum, Brown, Smart and ten first round picks to get Jokic. Denver would be absolutely insane to trade Jokic and he would be absolutely insane to want to leave Denver.
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