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Trade Brown for who Poll?

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Trade Brown for :

Bradley Beal
30
15%
Dame Lillard
50
25%
A Sabonis
10
5%
K.A.T
30
15%
Donovan Mitchell
14
7%
No keep Brown
61
30%
*Other - explain
9
4%
 
Total votes: 204

djFan71
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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#161 » by djFan71 » Thu Jun 10, 2021 4:11 pm

cloverleaf wrote:
Ill News wrote:
djFan71 wrote:It was a cherry-picked, hyperbolic example, but I also think the availability/health is at least a mild concern with Jaylen.

He relies on athleticism to go from good to elite. Beginning of the year he was healthy and cruised to the All-Star team. Then nagging injuries robbed of just a little bit and he was good from there out, but only elite in bursts. He missed this year's playoffs, had a hamstring injury that had him miss other playoff games in previous seasons. His knee issue sounded like something he'll deal with for a while/rest of his career occasionally.

None of it seems like an extreme issue, but it's definitely something to be consider.

I think what contributed to Jaylen's body deteriorating this season was fatigue from playing heavy minutes, coupled with the extremely short rest the team had after the bubble. Jaylen's style of play is pretty breakneck since he constantly drives to the rim or runs out in transition, so I won't be surprised if his body just broke down. Hopefully the extended rest he and the rest of the team will get this offseason does him good and excises those nagging injuries he had this year.


Tendonitis in the knees at JB's age is IMO worrisome for a player so dependent on his athleticism. And I agree, I hope the wrist issue will be a blessing in disguise, as it gives him more rest in general.

I agree with both of you. I'm not worried worried yet or anything, and bubble definitely wore him down. But, it's definitely something to watch.
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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#162 » by Theocy » Thu Jun 10, 2021 4:20 pm

I would just run it back for another year if medical team believes Kemba can recoup some of his health to a point he is a net possitive.

Nets are destroying the Bucks who were heavily touted as the big dogs we lost missing 2 of our 3 star players. We just didn’t have the depth. Take 2 stars away from any good team and they become borderline 1st round exit.
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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#163 » by ddb » Thu Jun 10, 2021 4:50 pm

Theocy wrote:I would just run it back for another year if medical team believes Kemba can recoup some of his health to a point he is a net possitive.

Nets are destroying the Bucks who were heavily touted as the big dogs we lost missing 2 of our 3 star players. We just didn’t have the depth. Take 2 stars away from any good team and they become borderline 1st round exit.


Running it back is another lost season of Jayson Tatum and one year closer of him getting fed up.

Need to shake things up bigtime.
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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#164 » by MagicBagley18 » Thu Jun 10, 2021 6:14 pm

ddb wrote:I love Jaylen Brown. He seems like a really good guy, he's incredibly talented, he works hard, and continues to improve each season. But with that said, Jayson Tatum is the franchise. The Celtics need to do whatever they can to build a Championship contender while also keeping Jayson engaged/happy.
As we all know the NBA is a business. Difficult decisions need to be made. I just feel like one of the difficult decisions that Brad ought to make is moving Jaylen Brown in a deal that lands Boston Bradley Beal. Then from there he has a lot more work to do. Beal is the more natural scorer VS Jaylen. Beal has the really close relationship with Tatum. Beal/Tatum will push each other, be marketable, and have enough star power to recruit other players to join them in Boston.
Beal/Tatum will play off each other much better. For as good as Tatum/Brown are, they really don't play that well off each other. Beal is a natural guard. Jaylen is a Forward playing Guard. Beal is the much better ball handler. Beal has the better mid-range game. Beal gets to the basket easier.

I just think we all overthink this. It's not everyday you have a special player like Tatum. And it's not everyday you have a wonderful asset like Jaylen Brown who's value is strong enough to help you land another superstar. And make no mistake about it, Jaylen Brown is NOT a superstar. He's a very good player. He may be a 4-5X all-Star. But he is not Tatum or Beal. He is not Dame.

I'm telling everyone right now. File this post for a date down the line. If the Celtics hang on to Jaylen Brown instead of trading him for a superstar, it could get ugly in the years to come. It'll be VERY difficult to build up this roster to contender status without moving Brown. He's the ticket to go out and really make a bold move. And if Boston stays a middle of the pack playoff team for next few years then Tatum will be gone right as he's hitting his prime years. He'll go elsewhere to win. Don't for a second think he wouldn't leave. These kids these days just want to win and be happy. This isn't the 90's anymore.

Get Beal and figure out how to build around them.


110% scream it from the mountain tops! Put it on the front page in bold italic letters! Couldn’t be more right about everything you said!
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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#165 » by ZeroTolerance » Thu Jun 10, 2021 8:14 pm

If Brown is swapped....I hope its for Dame Lillard.....but I would prefer keeping Brown because he is younger....we have to look no further than the Kemba Walker swap to see how a players age erodes his ability to play....And Lillard, even though he is at the top of his game, is getting old in NBA terms.....Trust me when I say if you can help it, never get old....If you can help it...
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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#166 » by LoquaciousLarry » Thu Jun 10, 2021 11:14 pm

Keep Brown and Tatum, deal the rest. It might not be a quick ring here as the Nets are stacked for at least a few years and will be tough to knock off.

If you didn't deal Brown for Harden, you have made your bed and should hold on to him. The Celtics need a third star to add to the Brown/Tatum tandem and if they play their cards right they'll get a star in the future that wants to be a part of this team. Kemba didn't work out but if you work a sign and trade eventually of Marcus Smart and prospects when Beal speaks of his intentions to explore FA to Washingtons brass, you might be able to get the third star on the cheap.

Dealing Brown is a lateral move and wouldn't put the team over the Nets
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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#167 » by Whole Truth » Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:18 am

Would there be any interest in Ingram ?
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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#168 » by Stan34 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:22 am

So Bradley Beal became a superstar just because he is a Tatum's friend. Interesting

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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#169 » by LuckyLeprechaun » Fri Jun 11, 2021 1:01 pm

BK_2020 wrote:
LuckyLeprechaun wrote:
Celticfan_N_FL wrote:
340 for Kemba
337 for Jaylen

3 whole games...wow :roll:


The real answer here is that Charlotte played Kemba into the ground and now his body is breaking down. They knew they had which is why they decided to let him walk instead of paying him. Saying Jaylen played less RS games than Kemba over the past x years is a great example of "lies, damned lies, and statistics"

Charlotte actually offered him 5/160, $20 mil. more than Boston did. Kemba's the one who chose to leave Charlotte. Saying Charlotte decided to let him walk instead of paying him is highly counterfactual.


Had Kemba Walker received the supermax extension that he was eligible for, valued at nearly $221 million over five years, there’s a near certainty that he would have took the deal and returned to the team that selected him with the ninth overall pick in the 2011 NBA Draft: the Charlotte Hornets.


However, the Hornets only offered Walker a five-year, $160 million to return.

Sure, Walker did say that he would accept a slight paycut in order to help Charlotte build a bonafide playoff-contender. But the Hornets’ offer was perceived as a slap to the face of a player who had given his blood, sweat and tears to the organization; who was undeniably their best player

Speaking to Rick Bonnell of The Charlotte Observer, Hornets general manager Mitch Kupchak discussed Charlotte’s decision to let Kemba — a three-time All-Star — walk in the offseason rather than increase their offer.

In short, not only were the Hornets’ unprepared for Walker to be named to the All-NBA team — which made him supermax-eligible — but Walker underwhelmed with his inability to consistently lead Charlotte to the playoffs.


https://celticswire.usatoday.com/2019/09/13/kemba-walkers-former-gm-reveals-why-he-let-kemba-walk-in-free-agency/

Read on Twitter
?s=20

Not counterfactual at all and is established history. Yes he took less than Charlotte's offer but that's after he was disappointed in their lowball offer. Charlotte 100% could have kept him if they'd come anywhere close to the max they could have offered him and Kemba himself said so and Charlotte also said it was their decision to let him walk.
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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#170 » by ddb » Fri Jun 11, 2021 2:39 pm

Stan34 wrote:So Bradley Beal became a superstar just because he is a Tatum's friend. Interesting

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31.3

REB
4.7

AST
4.4

PER
22.81
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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#171 » by Stan34 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 2:47 pm

ddb wrote:
Stan34 wrote:So Bradley Beal became a superstar just because he is a Tatum's friend. Interesting

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31.3

REB
4.7

AST
4.4

PER
22.81
Stats? Playing with Westbrook in Washington. A team that play no defense where the average scoring is 130 points. He is a great player but dont make teammats better. He is a scorer. Stop. The infatuation for Beal is because he is a Tatum friend.

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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#172 » by Celts17Pride » Fri Jun 11, 2021 2:51 pm

ddb wrote:
Stan34 wrote:So Bradley Beal became a superstar just because he is a Tatum's friend. Interesting

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31.3

REB
4.7

AST
4.4

PER
22.81

I mean just to play devil's advocate:

Beal 31.3 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 4.4 apg, 23.0 FGA, .485 FG, .349 3PT, 22.81 PER, 27 years old, $33,724,200
Brown 24.7 ppg, 6.0 rpg, 3.4 apg, 19.2 FGA, .484 FG, .397 3PT, 19.95 PER, 24 years old, $25,312,500

Really isn't a huge upgrade here in my opinion. I personally don't think it moves the needle much and the Celtics have all the same problems and less money and assets to solve them. The only reason I would even consider a trade like this is if Jayson Tatum requested it.
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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#173 » by The Comedian » Fri Jun 11, 2021 3:18 pm

Celts17Pride wrote:
ddb wrote:
Stan34 wrote:So Bradley Beal became a superstar just because he is a Tatum's friend. Interesting

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31.3

REB
4.7

AST
4.4

PER
22.81

I mean just to play devil's advocate:

Beal 31.3 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 4.4 apg, 23.0 FGA, .485 FG, .349 3PT, 22.81 PER, 27 years old, $33,724,200
Brown 24.7 ppg, 6.0 rpg, 3.4 apg, 19.2 FGA, .484 FG, .397 3PT, 19.95 PER, 24 years old, $25,312,500

Really isn't a huge upgrade here in my opinion. I personally don't think it moves the needle much and the Celtics have all the same problems and less money and assets to solve them. The only reason I would even consider a trade like this is if Jayson Tatum requested it.


Something that has to be taken into account when comparing numbers, Beal did that while being the primary focus of the other teams defense, which just isn’t the case with Jaylen. What would Beal’s numbers look like in that scenario? Similar points, way higher efficiency I’d guess.
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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#174 » by Stan34 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 3:25 pm

The Comedian wrote:
Celts17Pride wrote:
ddb wrote:
31.3

REB
4.7

AST
4.4

PER
22.81

I mean just to play devil's advocate:

Beal 31.3 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 4.4 apg, 23.0 FGA, .485 FG, .349 3PT, 22.81 PER, 27 years old, $33,724,200
Brown 24.7 ppg, 6.0 rpg, 3.4 apg, 19.2 FGA, .484 FG, .397 3PT, 19.95 PER, 24 years old, $25,312,500

Really isn't a huge upgrade here in my opinion. I personally don't think it moves the needle much and the Celtics have all the same problems and less money and assets to solve them. The only reason I would even consider a trade like this is if Jayson Tatum requested it.


Something that has to be taken into account when comparing numbers, Beal did that while being the primary focus of the other teams defense, which just isn’t the case with Jaylen. What would Beal’s numbers look like in that scenario? Similar points, way higher efficiency I’d guess.
Oh man. Jaylen scored twice 40 points in game with no Tatum (one with Philly and one with Memphis)

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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#175 » by BK_2020 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 3:39 pm

Celts17Pride wrote:
ddb wrote:
Stan34 wrote:So Bradley Beal became a superstar just because he is a Tatum's friend. Interesting

Inviato dal mio moto g(7) plus utilizzando Tapatalk


31.3

REB
4.7

AST
4.4

PER
22.81

I mean just to play devil's advocate:

Beal 31.3 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 4.4 apg, 23.0 FGA, .485 FG, .349 3PT, 22.81 PER, 27 years old, $33,724,200
Brown 24.7 ppg, 6.0 rpg, 3.4 apg, 19.2 FGA, .484 FG, .397 3PT, 19.95 PER, 24 years old, $25,312,500

Really isn't a huge upgrade here in my opinion. I personally don't think it moves the needle much and the Celtics have all the same problems and less money and assets to solve them. The only reason I would even consider a trade like this is if Jayson Tatum requested it.


Are we really arguing that 7 points per game is not an upgrade?
Also difficulty and increase in ppg do not scale linearly. It is much harder to go from 7 ppg to 14 ppg, than it is to go from 24.7 ppg to 31.3 ppg.
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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#176 » by The Comedian » Fri Jun 11, 2021 3:44 pm

Stan34 wrote:
The Comedian wrote:
Celts17Pride wrote:I mean just to play devil's advocate:

Beal 31.3 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 4.4 apg, 23.0 FGA, .485 FG, .349 3PT, 22.81 PER, 27 years old, $33,724,200
Brown 24.7 ppg, 6.0 rpg, 3.4 apg, 19.2 FGA, .484 FG, .397 3PT, 19.95 PER, 24 years old, $25,312,500

Really isn't a huge upgrade here in my opinion. I personally don't think it moves the needle much and the Celtics have all the same problems and less money and assets to solve them. The only reason I would even consider a trade like this is if Jayson Tatum requested it.


Something that has to be taken into account when comparing numbers, Beal did that while being the primary focus of the other teams defense, which just isn’t the case with Jaylen. What would Beal’s numbers look like in that scenario? Similar points, way higher efficiency I’d guess.
Oh man. Jaylen scored twice 40 points in game with no Tatum (one with Philly and one with Memphis)

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Over the course of the whole season, was Jaylen the primary focus of other teams defenses, like Beal was?

Because a two game sample means nothing.
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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#177 » by Celts17Pride » Fri Jun 11, 2021 3:59 pm

BK_2020 wrote:
Celts17Pride wrote:
ddb wrote:
31.3

REB
4.7

AST
4.4

PER
22.81

I mean just to play devil's advocate:

Beal 31.3 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 4.4 apg, 23.0 FGA, .485 FG, .349 3PT, 22.81 PER, 27 years old, $33,724,200
Brown 24.7 ppg, 6.0 rpg, 3.4 apg, 19.2 FGA, .484 FG, .397 3PT, 19.95 PER, 24 years old, $25,312,500

Really isn't a huge upgrade here in my opinion. I personally don't think it moves the needle much and the Celtics have all the same problems and less money and assets to solve them. The only reason I would even consider a trade like this is if Jayson Tatum requested it.


Are we really arguing that 7 points per game is not an upgrade?
Also difficulty and increase in ppg do not scale linearly. It is much harder to go from 7 ppg to 14 ppg, than it is to go from 24.7 ppg to 31.3 ppg.

Don't forget the usage and FGA
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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#178 » by BK_2020 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:03 pm

Celts17Pride wrote:
BK_2020 wrote:
Celts17Pride wrote:I mean just to play devil's advocate:

Beal 31.3 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 4.4 apg, 23.0 FGA, .485 FG, .349 3PT, 22.81 PER, 27 years old, $33,724,200
Brown 24.7 ppg, 6.0 rpg, 3.4 apg, 19.2 FGA, .484 FG, .397 3PT, 19.95 PER, 24 years old, $25,312,500

Really isn't a huge upgrade here in my opinion. I personally don't think it moves the needle much and the Celtics have all the same problems and less money and assets to solve them. The only reason I would even consider a trade like this is if Jayson Tatum requested it.


Are we really arguing that 7 points per game is not an upgrade?
Also difficulty and increase in ppg do not scale linearly. It is much harder to go from 7 ppg to 14 ppg, than it is to go from 24.7 ppg to 31.3 ppg.

Don't forget the usage and FGA

Usage and FGA don't scale linearly. Semi is a 4.6 ppg scorer on 3.9 FGA per game. That doesn't mean he will become a 23 ppg scorer if you give him 20 FGA per game. He will be taking harder shots.
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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#179 » by Celts17Pride » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:04 pm

The Comedian wrote:
Celts17Pride wrote:
ddb wrote:
31.3

REB
4.7

AST
4.4

PER
22.81

I mean just to play devil's advocate:

Beal 31.3 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 4.4 apg, 23.0 FGA, .485 FG, .349 3PT, 22.81 PER, 27 years old, $33,724,200
Brown 24.7 ppg, 6.0 rpg, 3.4 apg, 19.2 FGA, .484 FG, .397 3PT, 19.95 PER, 24 years old, $25,312,500

Really isn't a huge upgrade here in my opinion. I personally don't think it moves the needle much and the Celtics have all the same problems and less money and assets to solve them. The only reason I would even consider a trade like this is if Jayson Tatum requested it.


Something that has to be taken into account when comparing numbers, Beal did that while being the primary focus of the other teams defense, which just isn’t the case with Jaylen. What would Beal’s numbers look like in that scenario? Similar points, way higher efficiency I’d guess.

I'm not saying Brown is better than Beal. I'm just saying for the additional assets that you have to give up with Brown to get Beal it's just not that much of an upgrade. Celtics have glaring needs all over the place and replacing Brown with Beal you still would have all the same problems but less money and assets to have at your fingertips to address those needs. It isn't worth it to me. Just my opinion.
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Re: Trade Brown for who Poll? 

Post#180 » by Stan34 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:04 pm

BK_2020 wrote:
Celts17Pride wrote:
ddb wrote:
31.3

REB
4.7

AST
4.4

PER
22.81

I mean just to play devil's advocate:

Beal 31.3 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 4.4 apg, 23.0 FGA, .485 FG, .349 3PT, 22.81 PER, 27 years old, $33,724,200
Brown 24.7 ppg, 6.0 rpg, 3.4 apg, 19.2 FGA, .484 FG, .397 3PT, 19.95 PER, 24 years old, $25,312,500

Really isn't a huge upgrade here in my opinion. I personally don't think it moves the needle much and the Celtics have all the same problems and less money and assets to solve them. The only reason I would even consider a trade like this is if Jayson Tatum requested it.


Are we really arguing that 7 points per game is not an upgrade?
Also difficulty and increase in ppg do not scale linearly. It is much harder to go from 7 ppg to 14 ppg, than it is to go from 24.7 ppg to 31.3 ppg.
Jaylen went from 20 to 25 without loosing a bit

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