Celtics Future (Next 5 years)

[themoneyteam2]

I think Brad can't be worse on draft night so we should improve dramatically there. Also, teams around the league won't be so reticent to trade with us like with Danny because Brad will be reasonable. Whether Brad thinks micro or macro remains to be seen. Just going by rumors I have a feeling our drafts will look much different. Also, Brad's fast Kemba trade which gave away our #16 might mean he will have a short leash with malcontents and he's confident in his ability to find talent later in drafts unlike Danny. We'll soon find out whether Brad deserves any blame for the disastrous drafting around here.

I think better coaching and a different system could unlock some additional production out of Jaylen. The guy has a pretty remarkable blend of speed, power and skill provided he doesn't need to dribble too much or be asked to make plays for think for that matter. He should be taking advantage of those things by being moved around, sideline to sideline, running around screens coming off curls instead of parked behind the three point line. He should be utilized like Reggie Miller and JJ Reddick with the added bonus that unlike them he can finish strong at the rim. Since his defense has fallen so much, him getting tired from all the movement won't affect what used to be above average defense. A better coach might keep Tatum and Smart from jacking up ill-advised shots. Tatum in particular shouldn't have to work so hard for shots nor be taking shots that are so contested or vs double-teams. Smart shouldn't shoot unless he's wide open and the shot clock is below 5 seconds...ever. A good coach who isn't a beta would be able to put an end to that b.s. we've seen the past few seasons.

As far as the roster, we do have a nice blend of youth and veterans and a strong offseason (draft and FA) could right all the Ainge wrongs that led to having one of the worst benches in the league. We really shouldn't sign Fournier and we should get rid of all the bigs except Williams, choosing instead, to draft long, athletic players with the requisite size for their positions. No more 6'9" centers, 6'6" PF and 6' PGs. If we re-sign Fournier, essentially blowing the TPE on him, and run it back, don't expect a different result no matter how good a coach he is. So many other teams around the league also dealt with injuries and have improved and will improve dramatically so standing pat signals being a treadmill team and we'll lose Tatum. I think part of the reason Ainge left was he knew he couldn't dig the team out of the hole he created, was going to lose Tatum, and didn't want the ensuing disaster on his executive record. I think he is likely to be a G.M. somewhere else provided his health allows it.

Jaylen Brown utilized like JJ Redick? Did I read that right?

[Parliament10]

Well, with the Smart and TimeLord Extensions, things are getting a bit clearer.
If Smart finishes his next contract here, he will have been here for 12 years.

[zoyathedestroya]

Read on Twitter

Things can change quickly in the NBA as we all know though.

[Parliament10]

Read on Twitter

Things can change quickly in the NBA as we all know though.

Yes. Fantastic!!!

[hugepatsfan]

Been thinking a lot about how Stevens might approach next offseason and what his plan is. I think a 3rd star is in play, but they've left themselves means to pivot to a 2 star model if they have to...

In order to SIGN a major player next free agency BOS would need to absolutely gut their roster down to Tatum/Brown and probably just Pritchard/Nesmith. They can waive Horford and stretch the guarantee and I think you could probably find teams that would take Smart and Williams into cap space/TPEs, but anytime you dump money you pay a premium so it likely costs you future picks even if the deals are fine. It's not the most improbable scenario in the world for BOS to be able to make those moves, but what IS improbable to me is that Beal/Lavine/etc. would want to SIGN into that scenario if the cupboard around the "Big 3" it forms is so bempty.

The ONLY scenario that makes sense for BOS to add a max player would be the type of SIGN-AND-TRADE deal that MIA did with TOR this past year. MIA could have made room under the cap for Lowry but it would have forced them to renounce guys they wanted to keep and shut them off from using their full mid level exception. So instead, they picked up the option on the negative value Dragic deal and worked out a S&T. Because they were sending TOR back bad salary, they had to part with a REAL asset of substance in Precious. TOR went along with it because they felt they were better off taking on Dragic's one year deal for Precious.

BOS will have the same scenario in play next year with Horford's contract. They can pick up the option for the full amount and use it as salary matching in a S&T. Add in rookie scale players and it's enough outgoing for BOS to get all the way up to the 35% max that it would take for Beal.

IF a player like Beal or Lavine make it to free agency next year and IF they decide that BOS is where they want to be, BOS is in great position to offer a deal like this. Does BOS have an overwhelming treasure chest of assets to trade for any under contract star in the league? Not at all. But do they have enough where they can make it worth a team's while to pay Al Horford for a year vs lose a star for nothing? Yes, for sure. It's jsut a different scale of value when you talk about a guy that makes it to free agency and is doing a S&T. So IF a star makes it to free agency and wants to be in BOS I'm pretty confident that it would go down like this. And because they've avoided all other future commitments, they will be able to fit the Smart and Williams extensions under the hard cap they would invoke with the S&T deal. Signing them now vs letting them get to the open market is risky in some sense, but they probably get more if they make it to free agency with other teams to bid. Leaving as much room under the hard cap as possible is key.

Fans on here will argue that "wHy WoUlDnT tHe OtHeR tEaM pLaY hArDbAlL". It's true, the other team could force BOS to make all the tough moves to dump guys. But we've just seen over and over again that the league doesn't work like that. If a guy makes it to free agency and has a place he'd rather be, if the S&T deal leaves them better off then they just do it. No one holds guys hostage like spiteful fans on sites like this want to. They just don't.

In the end, I think Lavine will stay "the man" in CHI and I think Beal would respectfully let the Wiz know he wants out if he does decide that and he would be traded somewhere it'd be worth him re-signing with. So I don't think BOS will get a max player. But I do think if a guy makes it to free agency they have a great recruiting pitch in this Horford S&T scenario where Beal or Lavine would be signing to play with the two J's and then Smart/Williams as nice players rounding out the starting 5.

If BOS isn't able to land a max player. They're in great position to just stack the roster around Jayson and Jalen. You already have Smart/RWIII locked in. Next year you figure they will be back to multi year deals so they should be able to get someone good with their MLE (full or tax payers depending on other moves). They'll have the $9.7M Thompson TPE. They'll have the $17.1M Fournier TPE. They can decline Horford's option but trade him as essentially a $14.5M expiring contract to some team for salary matching to add someone else. We'll have bird rights on JRich to either keep him or maybe sign-and-trade him somewhere else for a TPE or player. Since we're not going the cap space route we can pick up the options on Langford and Grant and even if they both continue to flop. that's over $10M of expiring salary to use in trades.

BOS is going to be a major player next year in the role player market if they don't land a third star. I know that's not as flashy and exciting but they're going to be able to put together a much better rotation next year. I think this year they've kind of cobbled together as much as they could. It isn't ideal-fitting but there's solid talent. Next year you're going to really be able to aggressively target guys you want and extend yourselves for better fits vs playing catch with what falls to you.

[FrodoFraggins]

Hopefully the plan is to change the culture, play a lot less iso and develop, and build the trade value, of the young players. We will need another big piece to get to the finals and preferably by keeping Brown. There are no core players after the Jays, the rest are expendable unless RW can start most games.

They should at least be a fun team to watch.

[Parliament10]

Well we're off and running. Brad in the Front Office, seems to be doing pretty well.
Ime Udoka has a stellar Staff around him.

I believe that we need to go with our 2 Stars, and our up and coming Drafted picks.
I'd prefer no 3rd Star. Just shore up any holes, with Mid-level talent.

I think that we can contend with this.

Spot on. Look at the Bucks. They had an MVP caliber guy and an allstar. Did they go fishing for a 3rd star? no. They brought in complementary guys, tried a few, finally hit on a combo that worked. They stayed patient and let the team build chemistry. Then they got a bit lucky, but every champion does to some extent.

I think we might very well have one or more of those complementary guys already on our roster. Besides Smart, Nesmith, RWill, and Pritchard are both looking like legit NBA players. This year will hopefully sort out more clarity.

Yes. I think that we have much more Depth, and a much stronger Bench.
Many of the Super-Teams, were hurt significantly when one of the Key guys went down.

As, they had no Competent Backups. Especially, after they decimated their teams, going for that 3rd Star.
Celtics are in a different Boat. Most of our talent has been grown in-house. And we have some Competent Mid-level Guys.

[Red2]

I hated some of danny’s recent drafts especially the yabusele draft and the grant williams draft

[Fencer reregistered]

I think the big difference is Wyc now backing off from trades. When the Perk deal didn't lead to victory (the key piece coming back fell to injury), Wyc publicly vowed that he'd be the backstop on any Trader Danny deals--and indeed Danny did seem to have a heavy foot from Wyc on the brake for his deals after that.

By contrast, Brad's dump-Kemba deal didn't have Bigfoot Wyc's footprints on it at all.

Good news -- Wyc being a known interferer in trades helped us get more picks coming back in the Nets trade than would otherwise have been the case.

Bad news -- the extra pick was probably exactly the one used in the Kyrie trade.

[chrisab123]

The next 2 years will determine the next 5. If they are in the same place today 2 years from now then the next logical play is to trade Brown and Tatum before they force a deal or you lose them for nothing.

[jmr07019]

The next 2 years will determine the next 5. If they are in the same place today 2 years from now then the next logical play is to trade Brown and Tatum before they force a deal or you lose them for nothing.

Imagine if Milwaukee traded Giannis a year or two ago. You keep Tatum and only trade Brown for a better player

[chrisab123]

The next 2 years will determine the next 5. If they are in the same place today 2 years from now then the next logical play is to trade Brown and Tatum before they force a deal or you lose them for nothing.

Imagine if Milwaukee traded Giannis a year or two ago. You keep Tatum and only trade Brown for a better player

In a vacuum yes. Giannis is a different player though. His mindset is just different than anyone else in the NBA. 95% of the stars are looking to team up. If it can't happen in Boston it will happen in a big market. Better to get something than nothing at all if it gets to that point.

[Parliament10]

The next 2 years will determine the next 5. If they are in the same place today 2 years from now then the next logical play is to trade Brown and Tatum before they force a deal or you lose them for nothing.

Imagine if Milwaukee traded Giannis a year or two ago. You keep Tatum and only trade Brown for a better player

I htink that we Keep our Core for awhile longer.: Brown, Tatum, Smart, & Rob Williams.
Surround them with good up and coming younger players.: Pritchard, Langford, Nesmith, Grant Williams.

Continue building from there. -- You still have to have near 15 players, or pay the empty spot fee.
I also like our 2 x Two-Ways.: Sam Hauser & Brodric Thomas.

[jmr07019]

I am with you Parl.

Smart, Brown, Tatum and Rob on the court together have put up an offensive rating of 110 (good), defensive rating of 98 (excellent) and a net rating of +12.3 (excellent) over 14 games and 256 minutes this year. The results when they are healthy are great. The problem has been keeping them out there. I wouldn't be so eager to break up that 4 some.

I don't agree with the trade Jaylen group. He is far from the biggest problem.

The lack of shooting, scoring and spacing has unfortunately been as bad or worse than expected. I don't think you can afford more than 1 perimeter player who can't shoot league average from 3. Smart's got that position on lock so the other guys need to be able to shoot.

I'm not a fan of the double bigs either. Horford + the core 4 has put up a net rating of +20.6 over 8 games and 87 minutes. Great stuff. However look at just the Horford and Rob pairing regardless of the other 3 guys on the court and the numbers are a net rating of -4.2 over 20 games and 235 minutes. Since we are doing unsustainably good for 87 of the 235 minutes the remaining 148 minutes those 2 have shared the court has been a disaster.

[BostonCouchGM]

I think Brad can't be worse on draft night so we should improve dramatically there. Also, teams around the league won't be so reticent to trade with us like with Danny because Brad will be reasonable. Whether Brad thinks micro or macro remains to be seen. Just going by rumors I have a feeling our drafts will look much different. Also, Brad's fast Kemba trade which gave away our #16 might mean he will have a short leash with malcontents and he's confident in his ability to find talent later in drafts unlike Danny. We'll soon find out whether Brad deserves any blame for the disastrous drafting around here.

I think better coaching and a different system could unlock some additional production out of Jaylen. The guy has a pretty remarkable blend of speed, power and skill provided he doesn't need to dribble too much or be asked to make plays for think for that matter. He should be taking advantage of those things by being moved around, sideline to sideline, running around screens coming off curls instead of parked behind the three point line. He should be utilized like Reggie Miller and JJ Reddick with the added bonus that unlike them he can finish strong at the rim. Since his defense has fallen so much, him getting tired from all the movement won't affect what used to be above average defense. A better coach might keep Tatum and Smart from jacking up ill-advised shots. Tatum in particular shouldn't have to work so hard for shots nor be taking shots that are so contested or vs double-teams. Smart shouldn't shoot unless he's wide open and the shot clock is below 5 seconds...ever. A good coach who isn't a beta would be able to put an end to that b.s. we've seen the past few seasons.

As far as the roster, we do have a nice blend of youth and veterans and a strong offseason (draft and FA) could right all the Ainge wrongs that led to having one of the worst benches in the league. We really shouldn't sign Fournier and we should get rid of all the bigs except Williams, choosing instead, to draft long, athletic players with the requisite size for their positions. No more 6'9" centers, 6'6" PF and 6' PGs. If we re-sign Fournier, essentially blowing the TPE on him, and run it back, don't expect a different result no matter how good a coach he is. So many other teams around the league also dealt with injuries and have improved and will improve dramatically so standing pat signals being a treadmill team and we'll lose Tatum. I think part of the reason Ainge left was he knew he couldn't dig the team out of the hole he created, was going to lose Tatum, and didn't want the ensuing disaster on his executive record. I think he is likely to be a G.M. somewhere else provided his health allows it.

Jaylen Brown utilized like JJ Redick? Did I read that right?

you CAN read? Yep. Move Jaylen around like JJ, Klay, Ray Allen, and Reggie Miller. That's exactly how you help him reach his potential. Crazy right? It's the best way to force mismatches. No team can defend his blend of speed/power if he's got defenders fighting through traffic leaving him with clear lanes to the hoop or wide open C & S threes. It also lets him be instinctual which hides his abysmal BBIQ and minimizes his dribbling which isn't his strong suit. It also lets him do what he does best which is score.

Imagine being so triggered by me that you feel obliged to argue against and mock common sense. Too funny

[themoneyteam2]

I think Brad can't be worse on draft night so we should improve dramatically there. Also, teams around the league won't be so reticent to trade with us like with Danny because Brad will be reasonable. Whether Brad thinks micro or macro remains to be seen. Just going by rumors I have a feeling our drafts will look much different. Also, Brad's fast Kemba trade which gave away our #16 might mean he will have a short leash with malcontents and he's confident in his ability to find talent later in drafts unlike Danny. We'll soon find out whether Brad deserves any blame for the disastrous drafting around here.

I think better coaching and a different system could unlock some additional production out of Jaylen. The guy has a pretty remarkable blend of speed, power and skill provided he doesn't need to dribble too much or be asked to make plays for think for that matter. He should be taking advantage of those things by being moved around, sideline to sideline, running around screens coming off curls instead of parked behind the three point line. He should be utilized like Reggie Miller and JJ Reddick with the added bonus that unlike them he can finish strong at the rim. Since his defense has fallen so much, him getting tired from all the movement won't affect what used to be above average defense. A better coach might keep Tatum and Smart from jacking up ill-advised shots. Tatum in particular shouldn't have to work so hard for shots nor be taking shots that are so contested or vs double-teams. Smart shouldn't shoot unless he's wide open and the shot clock is below 5 seconds...ever. A good coach who isn't a beta would be able to put an end to that b.s. we've seen the past few seasons.

As far as the roster, we do have a nice blend of youth and veterans and a strong offseason (draft and FA) could right all the Ainge wrongs that led to having one of the worst benches in the league. We really shouldn't sign Fournier and we should get rid of all the bigs except Williams, choosing instead, to draft long, athletic players with the requisite size for their positions. No more 6'9" centers, 6'6" PF and 6' PGs. If we re-sign Fournier, essentially blowing the TPE on him, and run it back, don't expect a different result no matter how good a coach he is. So many other teams around the league also dealt with injuries and have improved and will improve dramatically so standing pat signals being a treadmill team and we'll lose Tatum. I think part of the reason Ainge left was he knew he couldn't dig the team out of the hole he created, was going to lose Tatum, and didn't want the ensuing disaster on his executive record. I think he is likely to be a G.M. somewhere else provided his health allows it.

Jaylen Brown utilized like JJ Redick? Did I read that right?

you CAN read? Yep. Move Jaylen around like JJ, Klay, Ray Allen, and Reggie Miller. That's exactly how you help him reach his potential. Crazy right? It's the best way to force mismatches. No team can defend his blend of speed/power if he's got defenders fighting through traffic leaving him with clear lanes to the hoop or wide open C & S threes. It also lets him be instinctual which hides his abysmal BBIQ and minimizes his dribbling which isn't his strong suit. It also lets him do what he does best which is score.

Imagine being so triggered by me that you feel obliged to argue against and mock common sense. Too funny

Thanks for the laugh little buddy!

[BostonCouchGM]

Jaylen Brown utilized like JJ Redick? Did I read that right?

you CAN read? Yep. Move Jaylen around like JJ, Klay, Ray Allen, and Reggie Miller. That's exactly how you help him reach his potential. Crazy right? It's the best way to force mismatches. No team can defend his blend of speed/power if he's got defenders fighting through traffic leaving him with clear lanes to the hoop or wide open C & S threes. It also lets him be instinctual which hides his abysmal BBIQ and minimizes his dribbling which isn't his strong suit. It also lets him do what he does best which is score.

Imagine being so triggered by me that you feel obliged to argue against and mock common sense. Too funny

Thanks for the laugh little buddy!

You’re welcome ma’am. Always happy to put you in your place. It NEVER grows old.

[dans1230]

I think Brad can't be worse on draft night so we should improve dramatically there. Also, teams around the league won't be so reticent to trade with us like with Danny because Brad will be reasonable. Whether Brad thinks micro or macro remains to be seen. Just going by rumors I have a feeling our drafts will look much different. Also, Brad's fast Kemba trade which gave away our #16 might mean he will have a short leash with malcontents and he's confident in his ability to find talent later in drafts unlike Danny. We'll soon find out whether Brad deserves any blame for the disastrous drafting around here.

I think better coaching and a different system could unlock some additional production out of Jaylen. The guy has a pretty remarkable blend of speed, power and skill provided he doesn't need to dribble too much or be asked to make plays for think for that matter. He should be taking advantage of those things by being moved around, sideline to sideline, running around screens coming off curls instead of parked behind the three point line. He should be utilized like Reggie Miller and JJ Reddick with the added bonus that unlike them he can finish strong at the rim. Since his defense has fallen so much, him getting tired from all the movement won't affect what used to be above average defense. A better coach might keep Tatum and Smart from jacking up ill-advised shots. Tatum in particular shouldn't have to work so hard for shots nor be taking shots that are so contested or vs double-teams. Smart shouldn't shoot unless he's wide open and the shot clock is below 5 seconds...ever. A good coach who isn't a beta would be able to put an end to that b.s. we've seen the past few seasons.

As far as the roster, we do have a nice blend of youth and veterans and a strong offseason (draft and FA) could right all the Ainge wrongs that led to having one of the worst benches in the league. We really shouldn't sign Fournier and we should get rid of all the bigs except Williams, choosing instead, to draft long, athletic players with the requisite size for their positions. No more 6'9" centers, 6'6" PF and 6' PGs. If we re-sign Fournier, essentially blowing the TPE on him, and run it back, don't expect a different result no matter how good a coach he is. So many other teams around the league also dealt with injuries and have improved and will improve dramatically so standing pat signals being a treadmill team and we'll lose Tatum. I think part of the reason Ainge left was he knew he couldn't dig the team out of the hole he created, was going to lose Tatum, and didn't want the ensuing disaster on his executive record. I think he is likely to be a G.M. somewhere else provided his health allows it.

Jaylen Brown utilized like JJ Redick? Did I read that right?

you CAN read? Yep. Move Jaylen around like JJ, Klay, Ray Allen, and Reggie Miller. That's exactly how you help him reach his potential. Crazy right? It's the best way to force mismatches. No team can defend his blend of speed/power if he's got defenders fighting through traffic leaving him with clear lanes to the hoop or wide open C & S threes. It also lets him be instinctual which hides his abysmal BBIQ and minimizes his dribbling which isn't his strong suit. It also lets him do what he does best which is score.

Imagine being so triggered by me that you feel obliged to argue against and mock common sense. Too funny

I dont totally disagree with you , maybe the Redick comp was a bit underwhelming. Brown and Tatum are not on the same level as players, Tatum is clearly better overall. He makes better decisions and although he isnt great at it yet, is better at driving the ball to the rim. Brown has to learn to play of Tatum instead of playing alongside Tatum. Tatum should have the ball at the top of the key, and Brown should be moving constantly.

[Parliament10]

I am with you Parl.

Smart, Brown, Tatum and Rob on the court together have put up an offensive rating of 110 (good), defensive rating of 98 (excellent) and a net rating of +12.3 (excellent) over 14 games and 256 minutes this year. The results when they are healthy are great. The problem has been keeping them out there. I wouldn't be so eager to break up that 4 some.

I don't agree with the trade Jaylen group. He is far from the biggest problem.

The lack of shooting, scoring and spacing has unfortunately been as bad or worse than expected. I don't think you can afford more than 1 perimeter player who can't shoot league average from 3. Smart's got that position on lock so the other guys need to be able to shoot.

I'm not a fan of the double bigs either. Horford + the core 4 has put up a net rating of +20.6 over 8 games and 87 minutes. Great stuff. However look at just the Horford and Rob pairing regardless of the other 3 guys on the court and the numbers are a net rating of -4.2 over 20 games and 235 minutes. Since we are doing unsustainably good for 87 of the 235 minutes the remaining 148 minutes those 2 have shared the court has been a disaster.

I'd like to see Grant Williams, as the Starting PF.
At the very least, put Derrick White in with the Starters.

Partial Rotation, 2nd Half of 2021-22:
Starters: Smart - Brown - Tatum - Grant - R. Williams
Rotation: XXXX - White - Nesmith - Theis - Horford
Reserves: Pritchard - XXXX - Hauser - XXXX - Kornet
Two-Ways: Thomas - XXXX

[Larry_Russell]

I am with you Parl.

Smart, Brown, Tatum and Rob on the court together have put up an offensive rating of 110 (good), defensive rating of 98 (excellent) and a net rating of +12.3 (excellent) over 14 games and 256 minutes this year. The results when they are healthy are great. The problem has been keeping them out there. I wouldn't be so eager to break up that 4 some.

I don't agree with the trade Jaylen group. He is far from the biggest problem.

The lack of shooting, scoring and spacing has unfortunately been as bad or worse than expected. I don't think you can afford more than 1 perimeter player who can't shoot league average from 3. Smart's got that position on lock so the other guys need to be able to shoot.

I'm not a fan of the double bigs either. Horford + the core 4 has put up a net rating of +20.6 over 8 games and 87 minutes. Great stuff. However look at just the Horford and Rob pairing regardless of the other 3 guys on the court and the numbers are a net rating of -4.2 over 20 games and 235 minutes. Since we are doing unsustainably good for 87 of the 235 minutes the remaining 148 minutes those 2 have shared the court has been a disaster.

I'd like to see Grant Williams, as the Starting PF.
At the very least, put Derrick White in with the Starters.

Partial Rotation, 2nd Half of 2021-22:
Starters: Smart - Brown - Tatum - Grant - R. Williams
Rotation: XXXX - White - Nesmith - Theis - Horford
Reserves: Pritchard - XXXX - Hauser - XXXX - Kornet
Two-Ways: Thomas - XXXX

I am with you on the double big lineup. and on the option to replace Horford as a starter.

But I think, for me at least, it boils down to who we sign to finish out the season.

If we can nab a sg/sf who can score and shoot, a real traditional 6th man type of guy, then I start White. (I prefer Grant in exactly the role he has)

But if we dont get that guy mentioned above, then Grant should start so that White can be the 6th man change of pace guy.