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OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF

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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#121 » by snowman » Tue Aug 31, 2021 8:21 pm

Tatum is our PF, guys. If Tatum is moved to SF, he will be guarded by guys that are as quick as he is, and just as big. Keeping him at the 4 matches him up against guys that may be taller , but usually have slower foot speed and lateral quickness. This is where Tatum has the advantage, in getting that first step and leaving his defender reaching, and also making the rest of the defense slide over for help.

The next step in Tatum's (and Brown's) progression is not finding the open man. They can both do this easily enough already. It's in trusting the open man will hit the shot. Now that the surrounding cast around he and Brown have been upgraded, it's time for the surrounding cast to prove this. If they are able to hit open shots, then Tatum and Brown's assist numbers will rise and the passing game will become contagious.
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#122 » by snowman » Tue Aug 31, 2021 8:40 pm

As far as back up PF goes:

Some say that Fernando is mainly a 5. How do we know that. He has played a total of 89 games and 938.6 minutes in 2 years total. Nesmith has played 668.7 in 1 year. Grant Williams has played 2181 in 2 years. Pritchard has played 1267 in 1 year. Timelord 1655 with as much time as he missed. Even Langford has played 652 minutes with all his injuries.

I'm willing to give him AT LEAST as many minutes as Grant, say 1800 -2000, before I give up on him. He also gets to work with Horford for a season. I would much rather have him as Tatum's and Timelord's backup than Grant Williams. So he can't hit the 3 ball. He can be our enforcer off the bench. At 6'9 240, compared to Grant at 6'6. Yeah, I'll take him as back up everyday.
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#123 » by playa-hater » Tue Aug 31, 2021 9:55 pm

31to6 wrote:
playa-hater wrote:
The Comedian wrote:Here’s our PF.

Read on Twitter
?s=20


This has been said, But I need to say it again. If/when Tatum attacks "down hill" on a regular basis (draws fouls) he will be unstoppable. Double teams and shot selection (too many fadeaways) is the only thing that can stop him.

I bet he finishes top 3 MVP this year and wins one in the next 3 years.


I've said JT needs to get into the MVP conversation -- meaning, I guess, top 7? Top 3 this year would be insanely good.
Giannis isn't likely to go anywhere. - will be top 3 for the next few years easy.
LeBron's going to be 'due', again. - could be right but could play older as well.
Jokic, Embiid, and Curry were the top three finishers last year. Jokic no, Embiid maybe, Definitely Curry
But I like it.
Tatum MVP! Celtics in 6!


my reply in GREEN


Tatum , Doncic in the mix as well. Maybe Dame. I know the field is tight. Probably not much separates top 3 from 6.

But 2 things Tatum will need to be a true candidate, 1- Great individual numbers and 2- very good team record. I am very confident both can/will be attained.
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#124 » by playa-hater » Tue Aug 31, 2021 10:08 pm

LuckyLeprechaun wrote:
Hal14 wrote:
ParticleMan wrote:
Not sure why we need one if Tatum is going to play there for well over 30 minutes. Grant/Horford/Parker/Bruno can handle the rest.
You're not going to get a PF that is better than those options for the scraps we have to offer.

I'm not saying I agree with it 100% but the reason why people say we need a PF is because:

a) people think tatum is better suited to play the 3 and that we'd have a bigger lineup with him at the 4..and one of the reasons we've struggled last few years is having an undersized lineup. while teams like the 2020 lakers and 2021 bucks had big lineups and won titles

b) horford can't play the 4 anymore. the sixers double big lineup in 2019 of horford and embiid was a disaster

c) bruno can't play the 4, he's more of a 5

d) parker is the worst defender on the team and also can't shoot from 3

e) grant is too short and too slow


When Brad dropped his 2 big lineup and moved Tatum back to PF, Tatum went on to play his best ball of the season. People can think Tatum is better suited as a 3 but that doesn't make it so.


I have no problem calling Tatum a 4. But someone else said it first and I agree, I would rather have some one bigger than Brown as a 3, let Brown be a 2 with a legit 6'8 or bigger 3 man. All interchangeable of course. Someone like Rui Hachimura or Sed Bey :o :-?

PS I love Nesmith (might be the number 1 fan) But I do wonder how S Bey would have fit with us.
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#125 » by moonie_mcgee » Wed Sep 1, 2021 3:48 am

playa-hater wrote:
31to6 wrote:
playa-hater wrote:
This has been said, But I need to say it again. If/when Tatum attacks "down hill" on a regular basis (draws fouls) he will be unstoppable. Double teams and shot selection (too many fadeaways) is the only thing that can stop him.

I bet he finishes top 3 MVP this year and wins one in the next 3 years.


I've said JT needs to get into the MVP conversation -- meaning, I guess, top 7? Top 3 this year would be insanely good.
Giannis isn't likely to go anywhere. - will be top 3 for the next few years easy.
LeBron's going to be 'due', again. - could be right but could play older as well.
Jokic, Embiid, and Curry were the top three finishers last year. Jokic no, Embiid maybe, Definitely Curry
But I like it.
Tatum MVP! Celtics in 6!


my reply in GREEN


Tatum , Doncic in the mix as well. Maybe Dame. I know the field is tight. Probably not much separates top 3 from 6.

But 2 things Tatum will need to be a true candidate, 1- Great individual numbers and 2- very good team record. I am very confident both can/will be attained.


Tatum will have the biggest green light in Boston since Bird. When on the floor he should amd will demand and take all the open shots given to him. Also, I want him on thevfloorcwith Brown as much as possible. That's how you crush teams. Stop with the spacing their minutes apart. If they're to be a great combo they gotta playvtogether and often.
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#126 » by ParticleMan » Wed Sep 1, 2021 10:36 am

playa-hater wrote:
LuckyLeprechaun wrote:
Hal14 wrote:I'm not saying I agree with it 100% but the reason why people say we need a PF is because:

a) people think tatum is better suited to play the 3 and that we'd have a bigger lineup with him at the 4..and one of the reasons we've struggled last few years is having an undersized lineup. while teams like the 2020 lakers and 2021 bucks had big lineups and won titles

b) horford can't play the 4 anymore. the sixers double big lineup in 2019 of horford and embiid was a disaster

c) bruno can't play the 4, he's more of a 5

d) parker is the worst defender on the team and also can't shoot from 3

e) grant is too short and too slow


When Brad dropped his 2 big lineup and moved Tatum back to PF, Tatum went on to play his best ball of the season. People can think Tatum is better suited as a 3 but that doesn't make it so.


I have no problem calling Tatum a 4. But someone else said it first and I agree, I would rather have some one bigger than Brown as a 3, let Brown be a 2 with a legit 6'8 or bigger 3 man. All interchangeable of course. Someone like Rui Hachimura or Sed Bey :o :-?

PS I love Nesmith (might be the number 1 fan) But I do wonder how S Bey would have fit with us.


size is always good, but more important for me is quickness and being able to stay in front of your man. someone like fournier is 6-7 but a disaster because he can't stay in front of anyone, and this breaks down your whole D scheme. also if they can stick with their man thru picks they can even disrupt taller shooters.

we've got richardson, nesmith, romeo, brown, and even smart at 6-5 to 6-7, all of which are switchable and mostly plus defenders (nesmith is actually the worst of the lot, but still good). i think they can handle the 2/3 spots defensively.
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#127 » by playa-hater » Wed Sep 1, 2021 5:41 pm

ParticleMan wrote:
playa-hater wrote:
LuckyLeprechaun wrote:
When Brad dropped his 2 big lineup and moved Tatum back to PF, Tatum went on to play his best ball of the season. People can think Tatum is better suited as a 3 but that doesn't make it so.


I have no problem calling Tatum a 4. But someone else said it first and I agree, I would rather have some one bigger than Brown as a 3, let Brown be a 2 with a legit 6'8 or bigger 3 man. All interchangeable of course. Someone like Rui Hachimura or Sed Bey :o :-?

PS I love Nesmith (might be the number 1 fan) But I do wonder how S Bey would have fit with us.


size is always good, but more important for me is quickness and being able to stay in front of your man. someone like fournier is 6-7 but a disaster because he can't stay in front of anyone, and this breaks down your whole D scheme. also if they can stick with their man thru picks they can even disrupt taller shooters.

we've got richardson, nesmith, romeo, brown, and even smart at 6-5 to 6-7, all of which are switchable and mostly plus defenders (nesmith is actually the worst of the lot, but still good). i think they can handle the 2/3 spots defensively.


Agree with bold, but size comes in handy when being forced to switch on bigger opponents
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#128 » by Hal14 » Wed Sep 1, 2021 5:48 pm

playa-hater wrote:
ParticleMan wrote:
playa-hater wrote:
I have no problem calling Tatum a 4. But someone else said it first and I agree, I would rather have some one bigger than Brown as a 3, let Brown be a 2 with a legit 6'8 or bigger 3 man. All interchangeable of course. Someone like Rui Hachimura or Sed Bey :o :-?

PS I love Nesmith (might be the number 1 fan) But I do wonder how S Bey would have fit with us.


size is always good, but more important for me is quickness and being able to stay in front of your man. someone like fournier is 6-7 but a disaster because he can't stay in front of anyone, and this breaks down your whole D scheme. also if they can stick with their man thru picks they can even disrupt taller shooters.

we've got richardson, nesmith, romeo, brown, and even smart at 6-5 to 6-7, all of which are switchable and mostly plus defenders (nesmith is actually the worst of the lot, but still good). i think they can handle the 2/3 spots defensively.


Agree with bold, but size comes in handy when being forced to switch on bigger opponents

Yeah, ideally you're not having to make a choice between speed or size - ideally you're finding the best mix of both, while having flexibility to go with bigger or faster lineups, depending on matchups.
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#129 » by zoyathedestroya » Thu Sep 2, 2021 8:51 pm

Read on Twitter
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#130 » by djFan71 » Fri Sep 3, 2021 12:32 am

zoyathedestroya wrote:
Read on Twitter

Why can't we draft guys like this? Fire Danny!

Tho, we are still paying him at least.
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#131 » by Scoonie » Fri Sep 3, 2021 5:27 pm

Yabusele was horrible, not an NBA player. Would probably be a great football player, though.
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#132 » by NuckyPowell » Fri Sep 3, 2021 6:32 pm

zoyathedestroya wrote:
Read on Twitter

Looks like he's slimmed down a fair bit. Still not an NBA player.
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#133 » by Bohemian » Fri Sep 3, 2021 6:34 pm

Hernangomez will fill the backup PF. Brad is doing a great job.
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#134 » by 31to6 » Fri Sep 3, 2021 8:43 pm

I was wrong -- I said multiple times we were done and just going to settle with rolling into camp with what we had, and damned if Brad wasn't like WATCH THIS I'MMA MAKE ALLLLLLLL THE TRADES HOMES

Kudos to whoever (Hal?) kept this dream alive, we now have an average backup PF.
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#135 » by Hal14 » Sat Sep 4, 2021 4:12 am

I'm on the bandwagon. People here wanted Nance, people wanted Millsap.

They might have more playoff experience, but this guy might be just as good, if not better. 6'9", he's skilled. Strong finisher at the rim, can rebound, hit the 3, seems tough. Not sure about his defense..



Reminds me of a Saric / Korkmaz type guy, or a poor man's Gallinari. Guess what? Korkmaz was the 8th or 9th man on the 1 seed in the east least year, Sixers. and Sarix was the 8th or 9th man on the team that made the nba finals, suns. So if Hernangomez can be the 8th or 9th guy on a damn good celtics team that makes a deep run, that's a pretty good pickup. He's played some of his best basketball in the past 2 yrs and is still just 25 so could be getting better.

Let's see what he can do. I think he could be a solid contributor off the bench for us.
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#136 » by RickyDizzle » Sat Sep 4, 2021 4:15 pm

Hal14 wrote:I'm on the bandwagon. People here wanted Nance, people wanted Millsap.

They might have more playoff experience, but this guy might be just as good, if not better. 6'9", he's skilled. Strong finisher at the rim, can rebound, hit the 3, seems tough. Not sure about his defense..



Reminds me of a Saric / Korkmaz type guy, or a poor man's Gallinari. Guess what? Korkmaz was the 8th or 9th man on the 1 seed in the east least year, Sixers. and Sarix was the 8th or 9th man on the team that made the nba finals, suns. So if Hernangomez can be the 8th or 9th guy on a damn good celtics team that makes a deep run, that's a pretty good pickup. He's played some of his best basketball in the past 2 yrs and is still just 25 so could be getting better.

Let's see what he can do. I think he could be a solid contributor off the bench for us.


I think Dunns D, his calling card, is elite. I think hernandez offense, his calling card, is essentially average. That said, Dunn had no path to playing time. And an average bench PF fills a need plus we unloaded Edwards, so I'm bored. His biggest value may be that he is a single player making 7 mil that is non guaranteed next year, great salary to aggregate with others for the big fish at the deadline.

Horford and him are what 34.5 or so of salary matching at the deadline that are only guaranteed 14.5 mill next year? Put some picks and young players there and we have everything a rebuilding team covets...
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#137 » by bucknersrevenge » Sat Sep 4, 2021 7:33 pm

Hal14 wrote:I'm on the bandwagon. People here wanted Nance, people wanted Millsap.

They might have more playoff experience, but this guy might be just as good, if not better. 6'9", he's skilled. Strong finisher at the rim, can rebound, hit the 3, seems tough. Not sure about his defense..



Reminds me of a Saric / Korkmaz type guy, or a poor man's Gallinari. Guess what? Korkmaz was the 8th or 9th man on the 1 seed in the east least year, Sixers. and Sarix was the 8th or 9th man on the team that made the nba finals, suns. So if Hernangomez can be the 8th or 9th guy on a damn good celtics team that makes a deep run, that's a pretty good pickup. He's played some of his best basketball in the past 2 yrs and is still just 25 so could be getting better.

Let's see what he can do. I think he could be a solid contributor off the bench for us.


When I look at Juancho's skillset, what I envision with him and Big Al is an extremely versatile "inside-out" combination where either guy will be able to either roll or flare back out to the 3 off high screen actions. Both guys can and will crash the offensive boards and will punish a mismatch in the post off switches. Juancho looks to be a solid fundamental passer as well who would hit guys off the short roll or kick out to open shooters upon drawing a double from one of those mismatches. Add in Dennis the Menace's quickness off said actions with one of the rooks helping to space and you have the makings of a really dynamic 2nd unit.

The hallmark of an unselfish team is willing, unselfish bigs. With JT, Rob, Al, Juancho, and even Grant and Enes Kanter if you want to add them in. We have bigs that are all extremely willing to move the basketball and not hold it. Guys who can make the interior pass when needed. Guys who will finish down low but also very willing to look for the open shooter on the perimeter which bodes really well for all of our perimeter scoring options. Brad has given Udoka everything he could possibly need to turn this bunch into a Spurs-ian unselfish passing and movement offense.
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#138 » by moonie_mcgee » Sun Sep 5, 2021 2:01 am

Well Stevens delivered that final need. Good work guys :nod: I like the combo of HGomez Bruno and Grant as backup frontcourt forwards. Each has a different strength and Ime can play them all as needed. If Parker comes to camp pissing fire that's another chip too. All the while we'll have Horford Timelord and Kanter as options. You know who's must be happy? Tatum. Againt the Nets he was the 2nd biggest Celt on the floor now he's got alot of running mates to match and exceed his physical stature.
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#139 » by captain green » Sun Sep 5, 2021 11:53 pm

Pf is no longer our biggest need. Now it's sg lol
We always talk about there’s A-to-Z… really, there’s A-to-G or -E,’” Ainge told Celtics.com of a team’s typical offseason agenda. “This year, there’s definitely A-to-Z.” : danny ainge
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Re: OUR BIGGEST NEED - PF 

Post#140 » by Hal14 » Mon Sep 6, 2021 2:47 am

moonie_mcgee wrote:Well Stevens delivered that final need. Good work guys :nod:

haha yeah it's almost like Brad saw this thread.

And also saw that the other thread that was 100 pages long about potential trades had a title that implied Dunn might get traded..

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