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bucknersrevenge wrote:

Hal14 wrote:I'm on the bandwagon. People here wanted Nance, people wanted Millsap.

They might have more playoff experience, but this guy might be just as good, if not better. 6'9", he's skilled. Strong finisher at the rim, can rebound, hit the 3, seems tough. Not sure about his defense..

Watch on YouTube

Reminds me of a Saric / Korkmaz type guy, or a poor man's Gallinari. Guess what? Korkmaz was the 8th or 9th man on the 1 seed in the east least year, Sixers. and Sarix was the 8th or 9th man on the team that made the nba finals, suns. So if Hernangomez can be the 8th or 9th guy on a damn good celtics team that makes a deep run, that's a pretty good pickup. He's played some of his best basketball in the past 2 yrs and is still just 25 so could be getting better.

Let's see what he can do. I think he could be a solid contributor off the bench for us.

When I look at Juancho's skillset, what I envision with him and Big Al is an extremely versatile "inside-out" combination where either guy will be able to either roll or flare back out to the 3 off high screen actions. Both guys can and will crash the offensive boards and will punish a mismatch in the post off switches. Juancho looks to be a solid fundamental passer as well who would hit guys off the short roll or kick out to open shooters upon drawing a double from one of those mismatches. Add in Dennis the Menace's quickness off said actions with one of the rooks helping to space and you have the makings of a really dynamic 2nd unit.

The hallmark of an unselfish team is willing, unselfish bigs. With JT, Rob, Al, Juancho, and even Grant and Enes Kanter if you want to add them in. We have bigs that are all extremely willing to move the basketball and not hold it. Guys who can make the interior pass when needed. Guys who will finish down low but also very willing to look for the open shooter on the perimeter which bodes really well for all of our perimeter scoring options. Brad has given Udoka everything he could possibly need to turn this bunch into a Spurs-ian unselfish passing and movement offense.

I like the way you think. Juancho and Al could be a solid combo at the 4-5 spots. Both of them have size, can shoot the ball, pass and put it on the floor.

Juancho clearly is not a starter. But from the stats and footage I've seen and the fact that he's still just 25 so could still have some room to develop more, I like his upside a solid 3rd/4th dude off the bench who could get us some size, toughness and possibly 10 PPG off the bench while not hurting us on D.

I fee like with the moves we made (both player and coaching changes) and our young guys (Tatum, brown, rob, pritchard, grant, nesmith, langford) all being a year older, we are going to be a good team that's fun to watch.

Hal14 wrote:

bucknersrevenge wrote:

Hal14 wrote:I'm on the bandwagon. People here wanted Nance, people wanted Millsap.

They might have more playoff experience, but this guy might be just as good, if not better. 6'9", he's skilled. Strong finisher at the rim, can rebound, hit the 3, seems tough. Not sure about his defense..

Watch on YouTube

Reminds me of a Saric / Korkmaz type guy, or a poor man's Gallinari. Guess what? Korkmaz was the 8th or 9th man on the 1 seed in the east least year, Sixers. and Sarix was the 8th or 9th man on the team that made the nba finals, suns. So if Hernangomez can be the 8th or 9th guy on a damn good celtics team that makes a deep run, that's a pretty good pickup. He's played some of his best basketball in the past 2 yrs and is still just 25 so could be getting better.

Let's see what he can do. I think he could be a solid contributor off the bench for us.

When I look at Juancho's skillset, what I envision with him and Big Al is an extremely versatile "inside-out" combination where either guy will be able to either roll or flare back out to the 3 off high screen actions. Both guys can and will crash the offensive boards and will punish a mismatch in the post off switches. Juancho looks to be a solid fundamental passer as well who would hit guys off the short roll or kick out to open shooters upon drawing a double from one of those mismatches. Add in Dennis the Menace's quickness off said actions with one of the rooks helping to space and you have the makings of a really dynamic 2nd unit.

The hallmark of an unselfish team is willing, unselfish bigs. With JT, Rob, Al, Juancho, and even Grant and Enes Kanter if you want to add them in. We have bigs that are all extremely willing to move the basketball and not hold it. Guys who can make the interior pass when needed. Guys who will finish down low but also very willing to look for the open shooter on the perimeter which bodes really well for all of our perimeter scoring options. Brad has given Udoka everything he could possibly need to turn this bunch into a Spurs-ian unselfish passing and movement offense.

I like the way you think. Juancho and Al could be a solid combo at the 4-5 spots. Both of them have size, can shoot the ball, pass and put it on the floor.

Juancho clearly is not a starter. But from the stats and footage I've seen and the fact that he's still just 25 so could still have some room to develop more, I like his upside a solid 3rd/4th dude off the bench who could get us some size, toughness and possibly 10 PPG off the bench while not hurting us on D.

I fee like with the moves we made (both player and coaching changes) and our young guys (Tatum, brown, rob, pritchard, grant, nesmith, langford) all being a year older, we are going to be a good team that's fun to watch.

I'd temper those expectations for Juancho a good bit. His defense is absolutely brutal at times, which I think could mean he struggles to stay on the floor. I agree he can be a solid stretch 4 with us and be able to provide some bench scoring, but he can be a turnstyle on the other end of the court so it's questionable how much of a net positive he'll be.

Udoka seems geared up for a defense first approach, so I can either see that meaning Juancho is the odd man out or alternatively maybe it gives them the tools to be able to hide him better and play towards his strengths.

I absolutely love this move from a roster balance point of view, but I'm trying to hold off on expecting too much from Hernangomez because the fit is better but he's still a guy with some pretty big holes in his game. His most useful attribute might simply be his contract for matching purposes (still better than Dunn/Edwards though).

cl2117 wrote:

Hal14 wrote:

bucknersrevenge wrote:
When I look at Juancho's skillset, what I envision with him and Big Al is an extremely versatile "inside-out" combination where either guy will be able to either roll or flare back out to the 3 off high screen actions. Both guys can and will crash the offensive boards and will punish a mismatch in the post off switches. Juancho looks to be a solid fundamental passer as well who would hit guys off the short roll or kick out to open shooters upon drawing a double from one of those mismatches. Add in Dennis the Menace's quickness off said actions with one of the rooks helping to space and you have the makings of a really dynamic 2nd unit.

The hallmark of an unselfish team is willing, unselfish bigs. With JT, Rob, Al, Juancho, and even Grant and Enes Kanter if you want to add them in. We have bigs that are all extremely willing to move the basketball and not hold it. Guys who can make the interior pass when needed. Guys who will finish down low but also very willing to look for the open shooter on the perimeter which bodes really well for all of our perimeter scoring options. Brad has given Udoka everything he could possibly need to turn this bunch into a Spurs-ian unselfish passing and movement offense.

I like the way you think. Juancho and Al could be a solid combo at the 4-5 spots. Both of them have size, can shoot the ball, pass and put it on the floor.

Juancho clearly is not a starter. But from the stats and footage I've seen and the fact that he's still just 25 so could still have some room to develop more, I like his upside a solid 3rd/4th dude off the bench who could get us some size, toughness and possibly 10 PPG off the bench while not hurting us on D.

I fee like with the moves we made (both player and coaching changes) and our young guys (Tatum, brown, rob, pritchard, grant, nesmith, langford) all being a year older, we are going to be a good team that's fun to watch.

I'd temper those expectations for Juancho a good bit. His defense is absolutely brutal at times, which I think could mean he struggles to stay on the floor. I agree he can be a solid stretch 4 with us and be able to provide some bench scoring, but he can be a turnstyle on the other end of the court so it's questionable how much of a net positive he'll be.

Udoka seems geared up for a defense first approach, so I can either see that meaning Juancho is the odd man out or alternatively maybe it gives them the tools to be able to hide him better and play towards his strengths.

I absolutely love this move from a roster balance point of view, but I'm trying to hold off on expecting too much from Hernangomez because the fit is better but he's still a guy with some pretty big holes in his game. His most useful attribute might simply be his contract for matching purposes (still better than Dunn/Edwards though).

1) the keyword in my post was "upside". As in his "upside" or ceiling is being a solid 3rd/4th guy off the bench giving you possibly 10 PPG off the bench.

I said that is his upside, not what I am saying with 100% certainty that he'll do.

2) I get that his defense isn't the best part of his game, but I'm not sure he's as bad defensively as you indicate. Do you have any videos that show him being really bad defensively? This was from the 2018 playoffs so kind of outdated but his D at least looks decent..

Hal14 wrote:1) the keyword in my post was "upside". As in his "upside" or ceiling is being a solid 3rd/4th guy off the bench giving you possibly 10 PPG off the bench.

I said that is his upside, not what I am saying with 100% certainty that he'll do.

2) I get that his defense isn't the best part of his game, but I'm not sure he's as bad defensively as you indicate. Do you have any videos that show him being really bad defensively? This was from the 2018 playoffs so kind of outdated but his D at least looks decent..

Watch on YouTube

I agree with you on the upside definitely. Think he's got that type of potential especially in the right lineup. Just think it's also important to note he might not even beat out Grant for minutes depending on how Udoka plans to run his rotations.

I'm just going off his stats, what I've read and a bit of the eye test for the defense comment. It might not be that bad, but it's been the consistent knock on his game and I don't think there is any reason to expect it to drastically improve. One thing that stuck out to me when I was looking into him was that his individual defense was praised, but he got knocked for not being the best team defender. I'd be a bit more confident if that were flipped since missing rotations is more likely to get you benched than if you get blown by, which other guys can help out with. But that's also something that might get better with age so maybe there is room there for improvement.

Hal14 wrote:

cl2117 wrote:

Hal14 wrote:I like the way you think. Juancho and Al could be a solid combo at the 4-5 spots. Both of them have size, can shoot the ball, pass and put it on the floor.

Juancho clearly is not a starter. But from the stats and footage I've seen and the fact that he's still just 25 so could still have some room to develop more, I like his upside a solid 3rd/4th dude off the bench who could get us some size, toughness and possibly 10 PPG off the bench while not hurting us on D.

I fee like with the moves we made (both player and coaching changes) and our young guys (Tatum, brown, rob, pritchard, grant, nesmith, langford) all being a year older, we are going to be a good team that's fun to watch.

I'd temper those expectations for Juancho a good bit. His defense is absolutely brutal at times, which I think could mean he struggles to stay on the floor. I agree he can be a solid stretch 4 with us and be able to provide some bench scoring, but he can be a turnstyle on the other end of the court so it's questionable how much of a net positive he'll be.

Udoka seems geared up for a defense first approach, so I can either see that meaning Juancho is the odd man out or alternatively maybe it gives them the tools to be able to hide him better and play towards his strengths.

I absolutely love this move from a roster balance point of view, but I'm trying to hold off on expecting too much from Hernangomez because the fit is better but he's still a guy with some pretty big holes in his game. His most useful attribute might simply be his contract for matching purposes (still better than Dunn/Edwards though).

1) the keyword in my post was "upside". As in his "upside" or ceiling is being a solid 3rd/4th guy off the bench giving you possibly 10 PPG off the bench.

I said that is his upside, not what I am saying with 100% certainty that he'll do.

2) I get that his defense isn't the best part of his game, but I'm not sure he's as bad defensively as you indicate. Do you have any videos that show him being really bad defensively? This was from the 2018 playoffs so kind of outdated but his D at least looks decent..

Watch on YouTube

Count me as not being overly worried about his defense for a couple of reasons:

1. He's going to be playing with the most experienced and most talented team he's ever played on in the NBA; especially on the defensive side of the ball. He'll be in lineups with veteran guys that know how to play and know how to defend. Guys like Al and Dennis, maybe Smart or Richardson on the overlap, one of the Jays.

2. He's gonna be in for maybe 8 minutes a half, that's it. He doesn't even have to be outstanding. Just passable and rebound your position. That's it. If he can make shots at a passable level, his offense should offset.

Look, I don't expect him to start games, nor close them. He just has to be passable for the middle part of halves and either he'll do that (I think there's a good chance he can) or he'll suck and maybe that opens the door for Grant. Hell, if Grant beats him out, that wouldn't even be the worst thing either.

The Celtics had a top 3 defense starting guys like Isaiah Thomas, Jared Sullinger and Kelly Olynyk. I think we can survive Juancho not being a world beater on that end. It's about team defense more than anything. Guys like Juan just have to play hard and smart, which he does. The whole team is either going to buy in or not. (I vote they will haha.)

All three guys Hernangomez, G Williams and Parker will be fighting hard for minutes. Best possible scenario for the Celtics team.

Celts17Pride wrote:All three guys Hernangomez, G Williams and Parker will be fighting hard for minutes. Best possible scenario for the Celtics team.

Yup.

The competition will be a good thing. It will bring out the best in these guys. If a guy crumbles under the pressure of the competition for minutes then fine, you know they can't play anything other than garbage time. But I feel confident that at least 1 of the 3 will rise to the challenge of the competition and it'll fuel them, motivate them, make them better and as a result at least 1 of them will turn out to be a very solid backup PF option.

I'm guessing Juancho gets the most minutes at the backup 4. Followed by Grant, but only out of necessity as I really think he's better suited to be a small 5. I have a bad feeling Parker might be left behind. Even Al might get more min than Parker at the 4. Jabari really needs to improve defensively.

GoGreen wrote:I'm guessing Juancho gets the most minutes at the backup 4. Followed by Grant, but only out of necessity as I really think he's better suited to be a small 5. I have a bad feeling Parker might be left behind. Even Al might get more min than Parker at the 4. Jabari really needs to improve defensively.

I’m expecting a very nice year from Grant Williams, so many sleeping on him

shooting is ….should always be our greatest need !

SLCceltic wrote:shooting is ….should always be our greatest need !

Hauser says hello !

Hal14 wrote:

bucknersrevenge wrote:

Hal14 wrote:I'm on the bandwagon. People here wanted Nance, people wanted Millsap.

They might have more playoff experience, but this guy might be just as good, if not better. 6'9", he's skilled. Strong finisher at the rim, can rebound, hit the 3, seems tough. Not sure about his defense..

Watch on YouTube

Reminds me of a Saric / Korkmaz type guy, or a poor man's Gallinari. Guess what? Korkmaz was the 8th or 9th man on the 1 seed in the east least year, Sixers. and Sarix was the 8th or 9th man on the team that made the nba finals, suns. So if Hernangomez can be the 8th or 9th guy on a damn good celtics team that makes a deep run, that's a pretty good pickup. He's played some of his best basketball in the past 2 yrs and is still just 25 so could be getting better.

Let's see what he can do. I think he could be a solid contributor off the bench for us.

When I look at Juancho's skillset, what I envision with him and Big Al is an extremely versatile "inside-out" combination where either guy will be able to either roll or flare back out to the 3 off high screen actions. Both guys can and will crash the offensive boards and will punish a mismatch in the post off switches. Juancho looks to be a solid fundamental passer as well who would hit guys off the short roll or kick out to open shooters upon drawing a double from one of those mismatches. Add in Dennis the Menace's quickness off said actions with one of the rooks helping to space and you have the makings of a really dynamic 2nd unit.

The hallmark of an unselfish team is willing, unselfish bigs. With JT, Rob, Al, Juancho, and even Grant and Enes Kanter if you want to add them in. We have bigs that are all extremely willing to move the basketball and not hold it. Guys who can make the interior pass when needed. Guys who will finish down low but also very willing to look for the open shooter on the perimeter which bodes really well for all of our perimeter scoring options. Brad has given Udoka everything he could possibly need to turn this bunch into a Spurs-ian unselfish passing and movement offense.

I like the way you think. Juancho and Al could be a solid combo at the 4-5 spots. Both of them have size, can shoot the ball, pass and put it on the floor.

Juancho clearly is not a starter. But from the stats and footage I've seen and the fact that he's still just 25 so could still have some room to develop more, I like his upside a solid 3rd/4th dude off the bench who could get us some size, toughness and possibly 10 PPG off the bench while not hurting us on D.

I fee like with the moves we made (both player and coaching changes) and our young guys (Tatum, brown, rob, pritchard, grant, nesmith, langford) all being a year older, we are going to be a good team that's fun to watch.

I'd wait and see. HGomez may impress in camp and if he does then that's a great opportunity to move JB and JT down the lineup. Smart Brown Tatum Hernangomez Horford lineup could be really good. The bench would be talented and dynamic to say the least. We'll see soon enough.

playa-hater wrote:

SLCceltic wrote:shooting is ….should always be our greatest need !

Hauser says hello !

was hoping for someone like Heurter to say hello ha !
or Robinson

any position shooting 38+ maximizes Jays
Jays need solid rebounding SHOOTING
…and an alpha lead ball handler

So we all know Tatum is getting anywhere from 30 -33 minutes a game at PF. I don't think Horford, Timelord or Kanter will play a singles minute there unless in an emergency, but they will get all 48 minutes at the C spot.
So that leaves:
Hernangomez 6'9 214
Morgan 6'8 241
Fernando 6'9 240
Parker 6'8 245
Kornet 7'1 250
G. Will 6'6 236
all fighting for the, at most, 18 minutes divided between 2 players at the 2nd team PF and the 3rd team PF. G. Will is the better 3 point shooter, (37 %) but Hernangomez is also over 32 %, and Morgan is at 30 %. Kornet shot 25% and Fernando and Parker don't shoot them at all. I would like to see Hernangomez take the 2nd team PF spot and get most of the minutes there, with Kornet getting the 3rd team PF /4th team C spot. I would also like it if Morgan got the 2nd 2 -way spot. That would mean Parker is released or traded and Grant and Fernando is moved, although I really like the energy that Fernando brings and would love to find a way to keep him.
Would it be possible to cut Fernando, then resign him as a 2 -way player ? I don't think you can, or if he even would.


I think Morgan is the only one on the list that could be a 2 -way player, all other have over 3 years of service or are under contract.
A player is ineligible to sign a Two-Way contract if he will have more than three years of NBA service at any point in the contract. A player cannot play under Two-Way contracts for the same team for more than three years total1.

snowman wrote:So we all know Tatum is getting anywhere from 30 -33 minutes a game at PF. I don't think Horford, Timelord or Kanter will play a singles minute there unless in an emergency, but they will get all 48 minutes at the C spot.
So that leaves:
Hernangomez 6'9 214
Morgan 6'8 241
Fernando 6'9 240
Parker 6'8 245
Kornet 7'1 250
G. Will 6'6 236
all fighting for the, at most, 18 minutes divided between 2 players at the 2nd team PF and the 3rd team PF. G. Will is the better 3 point shooter, (37 %) but Hernangomez is also over 32 %, and Morgan is at 30 %. Kornet shot 25% and Fernando and Parker don't shoot them at all. I would like to see Hernangomez take the 2nd team PF spot and get most of the minutes there, with Kornet getting the 3rd team PF /4th team C spot. I would also like it if Morgan got the 2nd 2 -way spot. That would mean Parker is released or traded and Grant and Fernando is moved, although I really like the energy that Fernando brings and would love to find a way to keep him.
Would it be possible to cut Fernando, then resign him as a 2 -way player ? I don't think you can, or if he even would.


I think Morgan is the only one on the list that could be a 2 -way player, all other have over 3 years of service or are under contract.
A player is ineligible to sign a Two-Way contract if he will have more than three years of NBA service at any point in the contract. A player cannot play under Two-Way contracts for the same team for more than three years total1.

I think they'll experiment a little bit with double big lineup with Horford at the 4 but I'm not expecting to see it too much. Same thing with Bruno - I'm not. sure if he can play the 4 but they might try it out.

For the most part what I see is Tatum starting at the 4 and a training camp battle between Grant/Parker/Juancho/Morgan to see who is better than who.

I just don't see Kornet getting a roster spot. He's our 5th best center. Makes no sense to carry centers and I don't think he can play the 4.

From the limited footage I've seen of Morgan, he seems like a good "glue guy" who is just a solid role player off the bench, plays his role, does the little things well, grabs boards, makes the extra pass, can hit the 3, still only 24. Seemed like a did well as a role player for the Jazz, who had the best record in the entire NBA last year. And he got some valuable mins and played well when he got the chance to play in the 2020 playoffs. That could turn out to be a decent signing. I feel like it's Morgan vs Parker battling for the 15th roster spot. Let the best man win!

Hal14 wrote:

snowman wrote:So we all know Tatum is getting anywhere from 30 -33 minutes a game at PF. I don't think Horford, Timelord or Kanter will play a singles minute there unless in an emergency, but they will get all 48 minutes at the C spot.
So that leaves:
Hernangomez 6'9 214
Morgan 6'8 241
Fernando 6'9 240
Parker 6'8 245
Kornet 7'1 250
G. Will 6'6 236
all fighting for the, at most, 18 minutes divided between 2 players at the 2nd team PF and the 3rd team PF. G. Will is the better 3 point shooter, (37 %) but Hernangomez is also over 32 %, and Morgan is at 30 %. Kornet shot 25% and Fernando and Parker don't shoot them at all. I would like to see Hernangomez take the 2nd team PF spot and get most of the minutes there, with Kornet getting the 3rd team PF /4th team C spot. I would also like it if Morgan got the 2nd 2 -way spot. That would mean Parker is released or traded and Grant and Fernando is moved, although I really like the energy that Fernando brings and would love to find a way to keep him.
Would it be possible to cut Fernando, then resign him as a 2 -way player ? I don't think you can, or if he even would.


I think Morgan is the only one on the list that could be a 2 -way player, all other have over 3 years of service or are under contract.
A player is ineligible to sign a Two-Way contract if he will have more than three years of NBA service at any point in the contract. A player cannot play under Two-Way contracts for the same team for more than three years total1.

I think they'll experiment a little bit with double big lineup with Horford at the 4 but I'm not expecting to see it too much. Same thing with Bruno - I'm not. sure if he can play the 4 but they might try it out.

For the most part what I see is Tatum starting at the 4 and a training camp battle between Grant/Parker/Juancho/Morgan to see who is better than who.

I just don't see Kornet getting a roster spot. He's our 5th best center. Makes no sense to carry centers and I don't think he can play the 4.

From the limited footage I've seen of Morgan, he seems like a good "glue guy" who is just a solid role player off the bench, plays his role, does the little things well, grabs boards, makes the extra pass, can hit the 3, still only 24. Seemed like a did well as a role player for the Jazz, who had the best record in the entire NBA last year. And he got some valuable mins and played well when he got the chance to play in the 2020 playoffs. That could turn out to be a decent signing. I feel like it's Morgan vs Parker battling for the 15th roster spot. Let the best man win!

Yeah, Morgan is the only one that can take a Two-Way slot.
I doubt that Kornet makes this team. And I doubt that he goes to Maine, either.

Parker is the only one really on the fence, so to speak.
He can still be cut, before the first day of the season.

I'm wondering, if situationally, Hernangómez can start at the 4 at times.
Tatum and others, I don't see playing more than 30 mins per, for 82 games.

SLCceltic wrote:

GoGreen wrote:I'm guessing Juancho gets the most minutes at the backup 4. Followed by Grant, but only out of necessity as I really think he's better suited to be a small 5. I have a bad feeling Parker might be left behind. Even Al might get more min than Parker at the 4. Jabari really needs to improve defensively.

I’m expecting a very nice year from Grant Williams, so many sleeping on him

Sleeping on him? what's he gonna do grow taller ? Not go for every fake known to man? Get faster? get angrier? I'm legit asking what's he gonna do to unsleep us?

When it matters, Tatum is gonna be our PF. Don't want him playing there 36 minutes a night for 82 games, but like Anthony Davis sliding to C when it matters for the Lakers, the same will be the case for Tatum for us. I suspect when it really comes down to it, our "closing" lineup is going to be Schroder, Smart, Brown, Tatum and Rob (or Al). No weak links on D, 4 ballhandlers, as good spacing as we are going to get on this roster.