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Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8)

Moderators: djFan71, sully00, Froob, snowman, ParticleMan, canman1971, The Comedian, Parliament10

Who smokes it tonight?

Tatum
54
71%
Dennis
2
3%
Smart
16
21%
Horford
1
1%
Grant
0
No votes
Richardson
0
No votes
Romeo
0
No votes
Kanter
0
No votes
Other (team)
3
4%
 
Total votes: 76

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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#101 » by Hal14 » Sat Nov 20, 2021 4:28 pm

The Comedian wrote:Arbitrary cutoff and all that, I know. But over the last 7 games, Tatum is averaging 28/9/4 on 44/40 splits, and has a +9.3 net rating. After the last two games, seems like he may be back to himself.

Defense has been consistently very good since the few few games, as well.

yeah it seems like his slump is over, thankfully.

We started the season off with Tatum in a shooting slump, Brown was inconsistent coming back from COVID, both of them had challenges at times knowing when to score and when to pass.

Then Brown got hurt.

Now Tatum is back to his old self.

Next? Hopefully we get Brown and Rob back healthy and started kicking everyone's a%% in the league!
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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#102 » by Jaqua92 » Sat Nov 20, 2021 4:43 pm

The Comedian wrote:
Jaqua92 wrote:Why isn't this 100% Tatum?

Best game of his career for multiple reasons.

The team follows the lead of it's best player.

The 37/11/2 isn't his best statline. But it don't matter.

He moved the ball. He DROVE over and over. His body language was great. He was getting pumped, smiling, etc.

THIS is the Tatum that will win us Championships. His entire attitude was different.

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Because Smart was EXCELLENT, too. And it was Smart/J-Rich that got us back into the game when Tatum was sitting with foul trouble.
It was a rhetorical statement lol

My point was Tatum played with decision making, energy and atittude we have rarely seen from him on a consistent basis since is rookie year.

I'm not saying he's flipped the switch, but to me, that's a really big deal.

Regardless of if his shot falls, if THIS is the Tatum we see consistently, we finish a top 4 seed.

Huge for Tatum last night.

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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#103 » by Jaqua92 » Sat Nov 20, 2021 4:43 pm

The Comedian wrote:Arbitrary cutoff and all that, I know. But over the last 7 games, Tatum is averaging 28/9/4 on 44/40 splits, and has a +9.3 net rating. After the last two games, seems like he may be back to himself.

Defense has been consistently very good since the few few games, as well.
Would like that 44 to get back up to about 46-47

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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#104 » by The Comedian » Sat Nov 20, 2021 4:46 pm

Jaqua92 wrote:
The Comedian wrote:Arbitrary cutoff and all that, I know. But over the last 7 games, Tatum is averaging 28/9/4 on 44/40 splits, and has a +9.3 net rating. After the last two games, seems like he may be back to himself.

Defense has been consistently very good since the few few games, as well.
Would like that 44 to get back up to about 46-47

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Oh definitely, I see no reason why he won’t finish the year in that 45-47 range.
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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#105 » by The Comedian » Sat Nov 20, 2021 4:53 pm

Read on Twitter
?s=20

He actually drove less last night than his season average, but the shots were just falling, finally. And he was going up stronger, at least it seemed that way.
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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#106 » by zoyathedestroya » Sat Nov 20, 2021 5:27 pm

Read on Twitter

Need more of these types of actions where Jays esp Tatum are catching on the move instead of catching in the post with his back to the basket or at the top of the key where he just sometimes opts for iso.
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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#107 » by return2glory » Sat Nov 20, 2021 5:41 pm

playa-hater wrote:
Triple7 wrote:Gave the VC to Smart! He played great and in control. Still a brick machine, but he played to his strengths this game. JT was awesome. He didn’t settle and attack constantly, while making most open shots. Horford was great. Dennis was good attacking and dishing. Jrich was great as well. Would have been better if he makes those mid range shots to fall. I have to hand it to IME. He did good on this one. Plus he gave my boy Enes some minutes, can’t complain really! Good overall win against the Fakers minus JB and Rob.


I like Enes so much more than watching Grant at center..


I feel the same. That's one of the main reasons I was down on Ime early, because he wasn't playing Kanter. But then again, he is only playing Kanter now because Rob is out. When Rob comes back, Ime needs to find Kanter about 20 minutes a game. That's not hard to do because Al and Rob start the game off together.
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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#108 » by Celts17Pride » Sat Nov 20, 2021 6:04 pm

The Comedian wrote:Tatum went full alpha, on both ends.

Smart was brilliant.

Schroder way more good than bad, especially the last three quarters.

J Rich is my new binky.

That pretty much sums it up. The only thing I would add is that Big Al was solid as usual.
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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#109 » by Celts17Pride » Sat Nov 20, 2021 6:08 pm

playa-hater wrote:
Shak_Celts wrote:
The Comedian wrote:Single game +/- doesn’t mean anything really, but J Rich being +27 just feels right.

He’s been really good for us, brilliant defensively.


this is why other guys aren't getting minutes! it's not all about their poor shooting. jrich is doing things on both ends even though his stats may not stand out every game.


I get what you are saying.. and yes he has played well. But coach giving him extreme confidence while Not giving any to others is huge to producing better.

It’s definitely at Catch 22. Eventually Celtics going to have to pick a lane
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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#110 » by Celts17Pride » Sat Nov 20, 2021 6:13 pm

Drax wrote:By the way can i say that i really like our top eight currently. If Ime can get these eight (Smart, Schröder, Richardson, Romeo, JB, JT, Horford, Rob) to buy into four key elements we're very very dangerous. Three point shooting, ball movement, attacking the rim and defense.

Celtics getting ready to go on a run. Team starting to round into shape
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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#111 » by Celts17Pride » Sat Nov 20, 2021 6:16 pm

The Comedian wrote:Arbitrary cutoff and all that, I know. But over the last 7 games, Tatum is averaging 28/9/4 on 44/40 splits, and has a +9.3 net rating. After the last two games, seems like he may be back to himself.

Defense has been consistently very good since the few few games, as well.

Was never worried about Tatum, just like I never worry about Brown and Smart for totally different reasons. Tatum is still growing into a complete alpha and he is doing an excellent job
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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#112 » by Half-Full » Sat Nov 20, 2021 6:42 pm

Drax wrote:By the way can i say that i really like our top eight currently. If Ime can get these eight (Smart, Schröder, Richardson, Romeo, JB, JT, Horford, Rob) to buy into four key elements we're very very dangerous. Three point shooting, ball movement, attacking the rim and defense.


I'm with you. I would like to see Pritchard and Nesmith get more time, but the way these guys are going, it just doesn't make sense. JRich has been a great addition to the team. He is delivering on both ends of the court. What expectations for a role player hasn't he met? We are still having a problem with turnovers, and I would like to see those numbers go down. Other than that, I'm very pleased with how the team has been playing. Looking forward to getting JB and Timelord back on the court. May I also throw in a good word for Grant Williams? He has played well, and his 3-point shooting has been dropping at a 40% clip. Enes has also shown that he can fill in when the need is there.
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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#113 » by Hal14 » Sat Nov 20, 2021 7:18 pm

Celts17Pride wrote:
Drax wrote:By the way can i say that i really like our top eight currently. If Ime can get these eight (Smart, Schröder, Richardson, Romeo, JB, JT, Horford, Rob) to buy into four key elements we're very very dangerous. Three point shooting, ball movement, attacking the rim and defense.

Celtics getting ready to go on a run. Team starting to round into shape

I feel it too. team really starting to gel, Tatum back to his old self. Schroder, smart and J-rich all playing solid last few games. Especially with thunder and rockets for our next 2 games. rob and brown coming back soon. last night's game could be the start of a run where we go 8-2 or even 9-1 or something..
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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#114 » by Fencer reregistered » Sat Nov 20, 2021 7:38 pm

Weird stats of the game:

12 offensive rebounds, but only 1 by the centers, and 0 by Enes even though he played 16 minutes.

IIRC, it was 1 each by 6 different guys, and 3 each by the starting guards.
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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#115 » by jmr07019 » Sat Nov 20, 2021 7:38 pm

Just watching the second half. Early 3rd Tatum lowers his shoulder into LeBron and finishes at the rim through contact. Tatum would have had no chance at doing that 2 years ago. Gotta love gains
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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#116 » by zoyathedestroya » Sat Nov 20, 2021 7:56 pm

Fencer reregistered wrote:Weird stats of the game:

12 offensive rebounds, but only 1 by the centers, and 0 by Enes even though he played 16 minutes.

IIRC, it was 1 each by 6 different guys, and 3 each by the starting guards.

Inverted offense. Tatum and Horford working the perimeter pulling opposing bigs with them.
Lakers switching and Cs making their defense rotate/scramble. Opportunity for our guards to slip in there and grab boards.

Dunno what happened with Kanter. He rarely leaves the paint area. I think he got fouled a couple of times though trying to offensive rebound.
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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#117 » by 1st banana » Sat Nov 20, 2021 8:13 pm

It’s so weird to me that Tatum always like clockwork starts slow whether it’s the game or the season. I wonder if him and Celtics brass or whoever the **** have talked about it and tried to fix it.

And same with Jaylen but the opposite he starts games and seasons on burners then cools down and isn’t as aggressive.

If Tatum can play consistently how he has the last like 5 games and Jaylen/rob can reintegrate then we’re back baby.
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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#118 » by 1st banana » Sat Nov 20, 2021 8:15 pm

The Comedian wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=20

He actually drove less last night than his season average, but the shots were just falling, finally. And he was going up stronger, at least it seemed that way.

Not a single gross fadeaway two either wow that’s amazing loving this.
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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#119 » by Shak_Celts » Sat Nov 20, 2021 8:41 pm

playa-hater wrote:
Shak_Celts wrote:
playa-hater wrote:
But this is just it.. it's not just How many shots they can get.. but in theory, with better shooters, you can get better spacing.. when it all comes down to it, the better teams, will definitely try to crowd and trap Tatum and JB. Especially in crunch time. So what oston will need is perhaps one or two more KEY 3 pointers made, to make teams hesitate when deciding to trap the Js.. If not, we may still see what we have seen too numerous times in the past. Not just this season, but years before. And that is Tatum passes it out (when trapped) shots not made, then he tries to do it all on himself.

There is no way, after a small sample size of just a few games, will I believe this current lineup of scrappy tough defenders, who may not shot well, Is the long term answer.

Let's go back to this conversation when better defenses, do as I predict and attempt to smother Tatum and his teammates DO NOT Hit shots.. That is the time to prove or dis-prove my theory of having a true knock down shooter and the benefits or Not of that.


People aren't going to think they are good shooters without proof. They will need shots to prove it. Where are they coming from? Which one of them are you calling a knockdown shooter? Pritch shot it very well last season, the whole season, but he also didn’t have to defend, our d was TRASH. So, not only will they have to find shots and prove they are shooters, they have to defend! The best shooters aren't defenders unless they are the top guys (not even then really). You cant expect ime to let them find their shots while also not being able to defend when the guys ahead are proving they can. Right now, ne nor pritch have proven to ime they can do anything positive in real games! You could see ime really thought pritch especially would give something (early), smart and schroo are eating all the minutes and doing it well, even without shooting great. Nesmith is really the only guy who could fight for a spot from romeo or jrich but romeo is shooting 41% from 3 and jrich has been shooting much better lately, but excellent defensively! (I was wrong on the total shots, its more like 11)

Defense was missing last season, pritch could play, we didnt have good players to fight for minutes ahead of him anyway. I dont know how long i want to see him or nesmith play when not only not shooting well, but looking lost out there. I dont know whats wrong with pritch but from the look of it, shooting is the least of his worries! Poor guy cant drive by anyone when hes been out there. How long do we force them until they find their way? Again, we are winning games now. Im not willing to trust JT/JBs happiness because ne and pritch may become useful if we force them ahead of guys who are. If we were still losing, fine, but we aren’t.

Ime said the shooting is getting to guys, you want to let guys who have been worse take over, just incase by game 50 one will be shooting 40% like romeo (who also defends)? Pritchard got 6 shots last season, yes 6! We’re talking about 6 shots only, on a team where kemba missed a lot of games (or was turrible) and smart was the only other player! Romeo was Injured (I could've shot better). Jb, injured. We had NO ONE, he still only took 6 shots! Shot 41% like romeo is shooting now.


There is so much to digest. not sure where to begin or if I want to.. Every truly competitive team in this Era has solid shooters. Ime decided to put all his eggs in the basket with his "defenders" in Smart, Schro and J Rich.. He put Nesmith from day one behind the 8 ball.(PP had a Broken nose so was set back regardless) Having invested in "Day One" you might be seeing a totally different Nesmith. Many/most was expecting Nesmith to actually be a starter. Most understood the need of Nesmith to play off the ball and allow the Js to do their thing, while in Theory knockin down the open shots the Js left them.

It may all be hypothetical and can not be proven, but my gut says put anyone in Nesmith's current role all season long, whether it be Smart, J Rich, Romeo and give them scant minutes. Sprinkle in some DNPs and watch how horrific their numbers would be. All while "in theory" Nesmith's confidence may have been sky high in their shoes, right now and results showing.

You bring up last years defense, but as a team they were far worse overall. playing TT and Theis together was perhaps the biggest culprit, Let's not forget how bad Kemba was. Throw in some of the small lineups Stevens would throw out here with Teague/Edwards/T.Waters and it was a recipe for disaster. Nesmith however showed a high energy, sometimes reckless ability in a good way to be a good defender. Certainly enough to make me believe if Nesmith was fully involved with THIS YEAR'S ROSTER vs last years roster, we could "in theory" be just as good defensively.

"In theory" is something every coach must do before a single regular season game is played. His theories on system, players to be used etc, will shape our season. The theory that Coach Spo used in starting a skinny white kid who never played a single minute in the NBA over a better more talented player in Herro, was all Spo had to go on.. But his "theory" payed huge dividends. I'd imagine if under Coach Ime, In theory, he would have said Duncan Robinson was not a good enough defender, relegated him to occasional spot duty, and today we might not even know who D Robinson was.

Before this season ends, the lack of shooting will come back to haunt us. assuming we want more than some middle of the pack finish.


If Robinson was shooting like Nesmith, he'd have been back on the bench too. We like these guys so we're going to look at the best case scenario guys around the league and say, that should be them. It doesn't work that way.

Maybe Nesmith isn't ready yet. It takes some people time to get it. I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't find his way by mid season (again). People gloss over the fact that Stevens didn't play him either, he only played him when he played better, when he earned more time! I wanted him out there last season because we had no one, looks like he has to EARN his way like he did last season.

Of course the lack of shooting will bite us, but you're also assuming that Nesmith and Pritch will eventually shoot well again to save us.
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Re: Victory Cigar!!! BOS 130, LAL 108 (8-8) 

Post#120 » by Shak_Celts » Sat Nov 20, 2021 9:21 pm

The Comedian wrote:
Jaqua92 wrote:
The Comedian wrote:Arbitrary cutoff and all that, I know. But over the last 7 games, Tatum is averaging 28/9/4 on 44/40 splits, and has a +9.3 net rating. After the last two games, seems like he may be back to himself.

Defense has been consistently very good since the few few games, as well.
Would like that 44 to get back up to about 46-47

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Oh definitely, I see no reason why he won’t finish the year in that 45-47 range.


Shh don't put a limit! :D
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