Please, No More Championship Talk

return2glory · Post #1 » by **return2glory** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 10:09 am

This team is not good enough to win a championship. Please don't get your hopes up.

There is no main reason why this team won't win a championship. That reason is Doc Rivers.

Going into the start of the season, I predicted that we would go about 18-12 after 30 wins. I was wrong and suprised that we were playing so well. But with Doc as coach, we won't get close to a championship.

We lost back to back games against Washington without Arenas. We lost this game when we were up by 14, at home in the 4th quarter. Doc kept playing Posey, who is an average player. We were starting to get killed on the boards, and Doc kept Perkins on the bench until about 1:30 to go.

We blew an 18 point lead at home to Houston without T-Mac, and hung on to win. We barely beat Memphis at home. We lost to Charlotte at home.

More back news, KG is no MVP. His best days are behind him. His best game was the 1st game of the season. There will be no more 30 and 15 games for KG. Ray Allen's best days are also behind him.

I'm a Dallas Cowboys fan. As everyone knows, they lost at home with better players. They have 12 players going to the Pro Bowl but have 1 bad coach that has never one a playoff game. Much like Doc Rivers, Wade Phillips got out coached and the better team lost.

This isn't a reactionary post. And no, the sky isn't falling. We just can't and won't win anything important with Doc as our coach. He is a good coach, but not a very good one. So, please don't get your hopes up and stop with any championship talk unless you are a Patroit's fan.

tanat-0s · Post #2 » by **tanat-0s** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 11:05 am

return2glory wrote:I'm a Dallas Maverics fan.

Indeed you are, crumbling under pressure just like your team last year.

Kefa461 · Post #3 » by **Kefa461** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 11:12 am

return2glory wrote:This team is not good enough to win a championship. Please don't get your hopes up.

There is no main reason why this team won't win a championship. That reason is Doc Rivers.

Going into the start of the season, I predicted that we would go about 18-12 after 30 wins. I was wrong and suprised that we were playing so well. But with Doc as coach, we won't get close to a championship.

We lost back to back games against Washington without Arenas. We lost this game when we were up by 14, at home in the 4th quarter. Doc kept playing Posey, who is an average player. We were starting to get killed on the boards, and Doc kept Perkins on the bench until about 1:30 to go.

We blew an 18 point lead at home to Houston without T-Mac, and hung on to win. We barely beat Memphis at home. We lost to Charlotte at home.

More back news, KG is no MVP. His best days are behind him. His best game was the 1st game of the season. There will be no more 30 and 15 games for KG. Ray Allen's best days are also behind him.

I'm a Dallas Cowboys fan. As everyone knows, they lost at home with better players. They have 12 players going to the Pro Bowl but have 1 bad coach that has never one a playoff game. Much like Doc Rivers, Wade Phillips got out coached and the better team lost.

This isn't a reactionary post. And no, the sky isn't falling. We just can't and won't win anything important with Doc as our coach. He is a good coach, but not a very good one. So, please don't get your hopes up and stop with any championship talk unless you are a Patroit's fan.

psssssssssssssss....get the nets..... :crazy:

Kids Are Alright · Post #4 » by **Kids Are Alright** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 11:51 am

yeah and the pistons are done and the spurs are toast etc.

we don't match younger, more athletic frontcourts for obvious reasons.

in Q2, Tony came in and changed the game. Doc put PP back in. Was that a reaction to a change on the Wiz or just a bad decision?

Post #5 » by **canman1971** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 11:58 am

Does this team have some weaknesses? Yes

Do all teams go through mini slumps? Yes

Did this team just come of a 4-0 road trip? Yes

Did this team just beat the #2 team in the league on their home court? Yes

Did the #2 team just get waxed by one of the worst teams in the league? Yes

Does this team have the best record in the league? Yes

Guys, freaking relax. Washington is a pretty good team. Are they contenders? Maybe not at this moment, but last I checked the championship is in June, not January.

Post #6 » by **darrendaye** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 12:28 pm

Ah, comforting to know that some things never change. It really gets to the point where some posters become white noise.

JJHondo17 · Post #7 » by **JJHondo17** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 12:41 pm

Naaahhh.........there's absolutely nothing reactionary about this post. :crazy:

Tricky Ricky · Post #8 » by **Tricky Ricky** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 1:22 pm

I hate Doc just about as much as anyone but I still think we can win a championship this season.

P2 · Post #9 » by P2 » Tue Jan 15, 2008 1:22 pm

I agree 100% with the original post!

Post #10 » by **darrendaye** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 1:28 pm

P2 wrote:I agree 100% with the original post!

Really?

cisco · Post #11 » by **cisco** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 1:31 pm

P2 wrote:I agree 100% with the original post!

Me too, but Doc still has a chance. He has to somehow realize (while the games are going on and not until there are only seconds left in the game) to realize what/who is and isn't working and fix the problem immediately to get the team back on track. He is slow to react and often times when he does react, he reacts way too late or makes the wrong decisions. (last night's game against the Wiz is a perfect example of him not realizing until too late what was working earlier in the game). I give him credit for FINALLY figuring it out and inserting Tony and Perk (should have been Baby though, imo) back into the game, but the game was already lost by then --- way too late.

Post #12 » by **darrendaye** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 1:43 pm

Had this thread been framed as "no more best team in the NBA talk," I would have fully supported it's premise. But, as it's fashionable to do, some people like to make judgments on concepts that they have little to no expertise or qualifications to make. Not only can you not project what would occur if you were to build a case around an "if the Finals were held today with the Celts playing so-and-so" scenario, even remedial logic should tell you that there is still nearly half of the season to play and EVERY team's season includes peaks and valleys and few conclusions can be drawn conclusively at the halfway point.

P2 · Post #13 » by P2 » Tue Jan 15, 2008 1:56 pm

darrendaye wrote:Really?

Yes.

GoGoCeltics · Post #14 » by **GoGoCeltics** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 2:10 pm

return2glory wrote:[There is no main reason why this team won't win a championship. That reason is Doc Rivers.

Holy ****, give it up.

Every time we lose, Doc is the scapegoat. That's bull. Our players were outperformed, showed no desire to win, took poor shots, and failed to execute down the stretch. Saying Doc is the only reason this team won't win a championship is just being ridiculous. When we win it's never Doc's doing, is it? We have the best record in the league for a reason. You can't win them all.

Post #15 » by **ParticleMan** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 4:16 pm

oh yay, the Hate Doc bandwagon is in full force. and all it took is dipping below an 85% winning percentage!

i guess when we were 29-3, it was all the players. Doc had nothing to do with that. But now that we've lost 3 of 4, it's all Doc's fault. the players are robots, chess pieces, if put in the right place every game they will perform exactly identically without any variation [ps yes, this sarcasm for you terminally dumb... which seems to include many people on the Hate Doc bandwagon].

somehow Doc has forgotten how to coach. he knew how to coach for 32 games, but for the last 4 he's forgotten. therefore he is an idiot and will never win anything.

seriously, where do these people come from? oh right, they come from the Hate Francona bandwagon. I guess this is their offseason job.

Tricky Ricky · Post #16 » by **Tricky Ricky** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 4:32 pm

ParticleMan wrote:oh yay, the Hate Doc bandwagon is in full force. and all it took is dipping below an 85% winning percentage!

i guess when we were 29-3, it was all the players. Doc had nothing to do with that. But now that we've lost 3 of 4, it's all Doc's fault. the players are robots, chess pieces, if put in the right place every game they will perform exactly identically without any variation [ps yes, this sarcasm for you terminally dumb... which seems to include many people on the Hate Doc bandwagon].

somehow Doc has forgotten how to coach. he knew how to coach for 32 games, but for the last 4 he's forgotten. therefore he is an idiot and will never win anything.

seriously, where do these people come from? oh right, they come from the Hate Francona bandwagon. I guess this is their offseason job.

Nope he didnt know how to coach for those 32 games either, he sucks every game he coaches

If you think Francona is a good coach you are an absolute idiot, he has to be one of the worst coaches ever and his moves make absolutly no sense. I like him because we won 2 world series but lets not forget they were 2 of the largest payroll teams to ever win the world series

edit:on a side note I do like Belichick

Post #17 » by **ParticleMan** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 5:29 pm

Tricky Ricky wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
If you think Francona is a good coach you are an absolute idiot, he has to be one of the worst coaches ever and his moves make absolutly no sense. I like him because we won 2 world series but lets not forget they were 2 of the largest payroll teams to ever win the world series

edit:on a side note I do like Belichick

LOL, ok, yes, I do think Francona is a good coach. Not every move has to make sense to your infinite monday-morning-quarterbacking wisdom. The question is, do those moves pay off in the end? When a guy wins 2 championships in 4 years, I'd say the answer is pretty clearly yes.

As for payroll, it's true the Sox had the second highest payroll most of those years, but there is a team with a significantly higher payroll that didn't even make the World Series for any of the past 4 years! If Francona is one of the worst coaches ever, what does that make Torre? Moreover, there are typically 5-6 teams every year with payrolls exceeding $100mil, and in the past 4 years only 1 has even made it to the Series (the White Sox won it in 05). So payroll, while it helps, certainly isn't everything.

I think there are actually a lot of similarities between Doc and Terry. Both are good at developing a great clubhouse atmosphere, for getting their guys to play hard, and for being good with the media. Neither are master tacticians. Both are constantly second-guessed and despised by many fans who only see the on-field/court moves during game day, and seem to be completely oblivious to the fact that the on-field/court stuff is only a very small part of coaching professional athletes. It's all the stuff behind the scenes that mainly makes a team successful or not. Master tacticians are fine and all, but in the end I don't think they win championships as much as coaches who get their guys to play hard and understand their team's dynamic.

I'd say Belichick is the perfect storm, a guy who sets up a great clubhouse and who is a master tactician. Those are pretty rare. Maybe Pop is the basketball equivalent. So maybe Doc isn't as good as Pop. Oh well. But to say he's a bad coach is absolutely nuts. No bad coach, no matter how good his players, goes 30-6, particularly not with a brand new team that has never played together.

return2glory · Post #18 » by **return2glory** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 5:55 pm

tanat-0s wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Indeed you are, crumbling under pressure just like your team last year.

I wrote I'm a Dallas Cowboys fan. Don't edit what I wrote.

jcappy · Post #19 » by **jcappy** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 5:59 pm

I prefer Coach Rivers to MANAGER Terry Francona, but yeah BB is like the equivalent to some elite Russian Ballet company---no match.

You know, the novelty of the season might be starting to wear a bit thin---a brand new team, all excited about the coming together of 3 stars---and then it working out so well---the toast of the town--a relatively easy schedule, other top teams with key injuries, and so forth. Also the incredible good luck of being injury-free ourselves. Now we get a few nicks and bruises, more fatigue.... the new isn't so new anymore... and what do you know we begn to lose a few, and begin to look that we are one of several top teams and not so damn unique.

return2glory · Post #20 » by **return2glory** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 6:04 pm

I know the truth is hard to except for most people. I love this team just as much as anyone. And when we were winning, I was giving Doc some credit.

Don't get me wrong, Doc is a good coach. He does enough not to get fired. He is a very likeable guy. But he isn't a great coach and has a hard time adjusting. In a 7 game series, he will get outcoached.

We scored 6 points in the final 6 minutes and got outscored by 19 points in that time. The players make the plays, but it's the coach who determines which players get on the floor to make the plays.