OT:the NBA needs it's own Hall of Fame...

MaxwellSmart · Post #1 » by **MaxwellSmart** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 5:03 am

This "Basketball Hall of Fame" is a joke--they let anybody in from any league that ever existed...but they keep out deserving NBA players--Screw them,Stern should start our own HOF.

wigglestrue · Post #2 » by **wigglestrue** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 6:11 am

MaxwellSmart wrote:This "Basketball Hall of Fame" is a joke--they let anybody in from any league that ever existed...but they keep out deserving NBA players--Screw them,Stern should start our own HOF.

Specify.

What is it exactly that you object to? Letting in all-time great women? Letting in pre-NBA pioneers of the game? All-time great international players? Do you realize how rarely they induct a non-NBA player?

RoyHobbs · Post #3 » by **RoyHobbs** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 10:58 am

The biggest problem I see with the HOF is that there are 134 players enshrined, and 80 coaches. That's absurd.

wigglestrue · Post #4 » by **wigglestrue** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 1:59 pm

RoyHobbs wrote:The biggest problem I see with the HOF is that there are 134 players enshrined, and 80 coaches. That's absurd.

Not really absurd. College players are limited to careers of four years max, and can only make the HOF if they have HOF-worthy NBA careers. A college coach can have a HOF-worthy college career that spans decades. So you wind up with a pool of players limited to the NBA, but a pool of coaches that includes the NBA and the NCAA.

EJay33 · Post #5 » by **EJay33** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 2:03 pm

I was pretty surprised when I realized that Dantly was not in the Hall of Fame. Then I looked at inductees over the years to see if he got snubbed and I saw Cheryl Miller?

We let people into the HOF because of outstanding amateur careers now? Yeah, 3-time Naismith winner is impressive, but still, if we have a few down years are Ron Mercer and Christian Laettner going to get in, too?

CeltsfanSinceBirth · Post #6 » by **CeltsfanSinceBirth** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 2:36 pm

Dick Vitale made it in. :roll:

Over Dennis Johnson? :nonono:

Dick Vitale made it in.

Dick Vitale. :nonono:

Over DJ?

MyInsatiableOne · Post #7 » by **MyInsatiableOne** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 3:22 pm

I echo the sentiments that the Hall of Fame should be NBA only. Does anyone really care about great women players, college coaches, college players, "pioneers" or "contributors" to the game? Not me!!

tombattor · Post #8 » by **tombattor** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 3:23 pm

I agree with wigglestrue here. I see nothing wrong with letting women, broadcasters, etc. in the basketball hall of fame. It's for all those who's made their marks on basketball, not exclusive to players.

Do you not agree that Red Auerbach has done more for the game than about half the players in the HOF?

And Cheryl Miller was arguably the best female basketball player of all time. She deserves to be in there ahead of most NBA players in the hall.

As for Vitale, he may not have been a great player or a coach, but the amount of publicity and work he's done for college basketball can't be ignored. You can argue that he has been the face of college basketball broadcast over the past 20 years. He absolutely deserves to be there.

What the f*** has DJ done, that's anywhere close to what Dicky V did? He was an allstar a few times, but was he ever considered one of the best players in the league? Not really. And I grew up loving DJ.

wigglestrue · Post #9 » by **wigglestrue** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 3:28 pm

Godmoney wrote:I was pretty surprised when I realized that Dantly was not in the Hall of Fame. Then I looked at inductees over the years to see if he got snubbed and I saw Cheryl Miller?

Cheryl Miller is maybe the greatest female player ever.
If you object to their treating women's basketball seriously, say it.

We let people into the HOF because of outstanding amateur careers now? Yeah, 3-time Naismith winner is impressive, but still, if we have a few down years are Ron Mercer and Christian Laettner going to get in, too?

No, absolutely never.

CeltsfanSinceBirth wrote:Dick Vitale made it in. Over Dennis Johnson?

Dick Vitale made it in.

Dick Vitale.

Over DJ?

"Bob Uecker made it in. :roll:

Over Bert Blyleven?"

I'm pretty sure Walter Brown sucked as a player, too.
Dude, it's a completely different category. Contributor. Not player.
Dick Vitale didn't make it in "over" ANY player.

Muzzleshot · Post #10 » by **Muzzleshot** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 3:30 pm

CeltsfanSinceBirth wrote:Dick Vitale made it in. Over Dennis Johnson?

Vitale made it in as a contributor, DJ would make it in as a player.
What does one have to do with the other? Vitale's induction has nothing to do with preventing DJ from getting in.

There's basically an NBA HOF within the Basketball HOF.
The only advantage of having a separate HOF for the NBA would be to help people understand that Cheryl Milller hasn't achieved the same accomplishments of a Bill Russell or Magic Johnson. If people need help understanding that, they need more help than they'll ever know.
The basketball HOF really isn't difficutl to figure out.

greenbeans · Post #11 » by **greenbeans** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 3:47 pm

people werent this pissed when Gammons made it into the baseball HOF

MyInsatiableOne · Post #12 » by **MyInsatiableOne** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 4:45 pm

I have no problem with coaches and broadcasters being in...as long as they're all from the NBA!!!

tombattor · Post #13 » by **tombattor** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 4:48 pm

MyInsatiableOne wrote:I have no problem with coaches and broadcasters being in...as long as they're all from the NBA!!!

Why? It's called basketball HOF, not the NBA HOF. Same with baseball, it's called baseball HOF, which is why they let negro league players in, among others.

MyInsatiableOne · Post #14 » by **MyInsatiableOne** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 5:21 pm

It wouldn't be a problem if not for the fact that when NBA players who are considered "borderline" are compared against those who never played in the NBA (European leaguers, women, college players) they lose out if they have inferior numbers.

They should either have an HOF *just* for the NBA or judge the players only against those in their respective leagues.

I dunno, just an idea! :dontknow:

wigglestrue · Post #15 » by **wigglestrue** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 5:30 pm

MyInsatiableOne wrote:It wouldn't be a problem if not for the fact that when NBA players who are considered "borderline" are compared against those who never played in the NBA (European leaguers, women, college players) they lose out if they have inferior numbers.

But that never, ever happens. NBA players are compared to NBA players. Women are compared to women. International players are measured by their impact on the game in their world, and their stats are not compared to NBA players. There've only been 4 male international players inducted in the last 15 years, and with the possible exception of Drazen Petrovic (although he was a pioneer of sorts, too) all of the inducted international players pre-date the NBA/world merger. There has never been a male player inducted based on his college career. Just an NBA legend or two like Walton or Maravich whose NBA candidacies were boosted by being among the greatest college players of all time. There are a lot of misconceptions about the Basketball HOF floating around.

MyInsatiableOne · Post #16 » by **MyInsatiableOne** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 6:09 pm

Apparently I have some of these misconceptions, which is weird as I've been to the HOF twice (although not the new one...I've been to the old one)

CeltsfanSinceBirth · Post #17 » by **CeltsfanSinceBirth** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 6:42 pm

My mistake everyone. Thank you for correcting me. Dick Vitale, whom I find very annoying, definitely deserves to be there as a contributor.

tombattor wrote:
What the f*** has DJ done, that's anywhere close to what Dicky V did? He was an allstar a few times, but was he ever considered one of the best players in the league? Not really. And I grew up loving DJ.

If Joe Dumars was elected into the Hall, I personally think DJ should be in there as well.

- 1979 Finals MVP
- 3 NBA championships
- 5 time All-Star
- 9 straight All NBA 1st or 2nd Defensive teams
- at the time of his retirement, was only the 11th player to score more than 15,000 points and dish out 5,000 assists

MyInsatiableOne · Post #18 » by **MyInsatiableOne** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 6:44 pm

Definitely DJ should be in if Dumars is. Dumars was a nice player, a very good player, but DJ was better.

And how is Don Nelson not in as a coach? 2nd most wins all time!!

tombattor · Post #19 » by **tombattor** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 7:07 pm

CeltsfanSinceBirth wrote:My mistake everyone. Thank you for correcting me. Dick Vitale, whom I find very annoying, definitely deserves to be there as a contributor.

-= original quote snipped =-

If Joe Dumars was elected into the Hall, I personally think DJ should be in there as well.

- 1979 Finals MVP
- 3 NBA championships
- 5 time All-Star
- 9 straight All NBA 1st or 2nd Defensive teams
- at the time of his retirement, was only the 11th player to score more than 15,000 points and dish out 5,000 assists

I'm not saying that DJ doesn't deserve to be in there. I was just trying to show that he hasn't done nearly as much as Vitale has in their respective capacities.

As a big DJ fan, I'd love to see DJ in the HOF, but I don't think it's an outrage. He was a good player, but never was considered one of the best players of his time. And HOF is meant for players like that, not just very good players. Does someone like JO belong in the HOF? He could end up there, but I wouldn't be shocked if he didn't make it either. That's how I feel about DJ.

MyInsatiableOne · Post #20 » by **MyInsatiableOne** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 7:51 pm

tombattor, I agree with that logic, but then why is Joe Dumars in the HOF? Or Lenny Wilkens as a coach, who is also the losingest coach in the league and has the most wins due more to longevity than to the fact he coached great teams?