OT - Jason Kidd suspension or no suspension?

threrf23 · Post #1 » by **threrf23** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 9:08 am

What do you guys think? My first reaction was yes, he clearly grabbed Pargo by the neck threw him down. Second thoughts, he is supposed to go for a hard foul to prevent Pargo from scoring, and a hard foul was going to be hard to avoid regardless of whether he grabbed Pargo's shoulder or neck. Tough to avoid throwing him down. But then you have to question whether the foul was really necessary from a wanting to win standpoint.

On a side note, life must not be great as a Mavs fan right now. To have so much going for you....and then suddenly the future doesn't look so bright in the near or long term. Mark Cuban - who I generally like - has been humbled. I guess I've been humbled as well in a sense as I expected the Mavs to beat the Hornets, at least.

spf211 · Post #2 » by **spf211** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 12:13 pm

If a hard foul means you have to grab someone by the head and use that leverage to toss him to the ground then that warrants an ejection and a suspension.

It's pretty much irrelevant though -- Kidd is washed up and won't help the Mavs win, regardless -- I'd wager to say they'll play better without him.

GoGoCeltics · Post #3 » by **GoGoCeltics** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 12:17 pm

He grabbed Pargo by the neck and almost flipped him headfirst into the ground... of course he should be suspended.

Post #4 » by **UGA Hayes** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 12:38 pm

That Jason Kidd trade is going to be looked back as a franchise killer for the Mavs. People forget that Harris was hurt during a poor stretch for the MAvs this year. That they gave up him a servicable center and draft pick for someone who has CLEARLY been done for about a year now is a bit amazing. This is why you never ever appease stars. They aren't paying attention to the rest of the league the way diehards do.

Post #5 » by **Celtics_Champs** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 2:11 pm

That Jason Kidd trade is going to be looked back as a franchise killer for the Mavs.

Yeah, it sucks. I mean, the suns move marion for shaq was not a good one either, but it will not come back to haunt them as much as this one. I really like devin harris, and think he will be a very good pg.

And Yes. He should and will get suspended.

EvadedHavoc · Post #6 » by **EvadedHavoc** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 2:19 pm

Mavs are gonna be eliminated anyways so i dont see the problem of suspending him.

MyInsatiableOne · Post #7 » by **MyInsatiableOne** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 2:31 pm

UGA Hayes wrote:That Jason Kidd trade is going to be looked back as a franchise killer for the Mavs. People forget that Harris was hurt during a poor stretch for the MAvs this year. That they gave up him a servicable center and draft pick for someone who has CLEARLY been done for about a year now is a bit amazing. This is why you never ever appease stars. They aren't paying attention to the rest of the league the way diehards do.

What little championship window they had slammed shut and was locked with 4 padlocks as soon as they pulled the trigger for Kidd.

tombattor · Post #8 » by **tombattor** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 3:23 pm

Kidd is done. I'm glad he's playing like crap for all to see. I thought Rod Thorn was a genius for getting Diop and Harris, but now I'm beginning to think just getting Diop would have been a great trade for the Nets.

Datruth345 · Post #9 » by **Datruth345** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 3:41 pm

im going to say no

s1ickd · Post #10 » by **s1ickd** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 3:50 pm

maybe he deserves a suspension, but i can see wy he was pissed.

Dirk and Terry were the only ones trying to win that game with him. Nobody else was playing playoff basketball.

Dallas is the more talented team. Dirk>West, Howard>Peja, Terry>insert player.... yes Chris Paul is nasty, but Dallas is better and deeper.

tombattor · Post #11 » by **tombattor** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 3:52 pm

s1ickd wrote:maybe he deserves a suspension, but i can see wy he was pissed.

Dirk and Terry were the only ones trying to win that game with him. Nobody else was playing playoff basketball.

Dallas is the more talented team. Dirk>West, Howard>Peja, Terry>insert player.... yes Chris Paul is nasty, but Dallas is better and deeper.

Yeah, but the difference between CP3 and Kidd more than makes up for any advantage the Mavs have.

Collinto · Post #12 » by **Collinto** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 4:18 pm

In Kidd's defense, Pargo sort of looks like Kidd's ex-wife, so getting frustrated and throwing Pargo around was an easy mistake to make. Old habits die hard. I say let him play, but send him to counceling...

Post #13 » by **Celtics_Champs** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 4:41 pm

Collinto wrote:In Kidd's defense, Pargo sort of looks like Kidd's ex-wife, so getting frustrated and throwing Pargo around was an easy mistake to make. Old habits die hard. I say let him play, but send him to counceling...

I never understand it when players throw a player to the ground, then be like "What, what" when 5 players come after him. If I were to commit a hard foul, and kidd knew it was a hard foul, I would wonder if he was hurt, and try to help him. But I guess that is why I am not in the NBA. That and not being able to get the ball in the hoop.

MyInsatiableOne · Post #14 » by **MyInsatiableOne** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 4:52 pm

tombattor wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Yeah, but the difference between CP3 and Kidd more than makes up for any advantage the Mavs have.

Absolutely :nod:

Kidd hasn't been the same since the Nets' second trip to the Finals. Maybe it's his surgically repaired knee or what, but he's washed up. Dallas killed their future with that trade...unless they get unbelievably lucky late in the draft or with a free agent signing (I don't even know who it could be) Dirk is either going to waste his career in Dallas or demand a trade eventually

threrf23 · Post #15 » by **threrf23** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 5:30 pm

lol Collinto

anyways, my only concern if I'm the commiosh is, Pargo went up towards the hoop with a lot of force, perhaps even if Kidd puts his hand out across Pargo's chest perhaps he falls to the ground flat on his back which is just as dangerous. In the heat of the moment, if Kidd is trying to prevent a layup, its tough to avoid a foul that might look worse than it was. That said I agree that you don't grab a guy by the beck and expect no consequence

Anyways, per this link,

http://www.countthebasket.com/blog/2008 ... -rankings/

the league's second best offensive line-up last season was:

Erick Dampier, Dirk Nowitzki, Josh Howard, Jason Terry, and none other than Devin Harris (who is also known as a very good defender.

Overall, Kidd might or might not be the better offensive player, but he's obviously not the better shooter, and may not be the best fit for the Mavs offense. Besides, the lineup mentioned above had the opportunity to develop such great chemistry over a period of 2+ years.

And the Mavs key FA signings this year: Trenton Hassell, Juwan Howard, and Tyronn Lue.

Compare that to our signings.

campybatman · Post #16 » by **campybatman** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 12:37 am

threrf23 wrote:What do you guys think?

Kidd's take down of Pargo is alike to Nowitzki's take down of Kirilenko. I would say, in both cases, it's grounds for a fine and suspension or a suspension of games. Sometimes, an ejection and fine isn't enough punishment. Whether or not it's deem a flagrant one or two foul is up to personal interpretation. A lot of times, referees, NBA officials and fans react to a foul differently depending on how violent it looks (i.e. Cassell fouling Rondo as a player for the Clippers). Not everyone will look at it objectively. But, the severity of the punishment has to deter future incidents such as this from happening. Because players are so intent on preventing an easy layup or score that they're willing to go beyond what is likely necessary to commit a personal foul. You've to wonder if some of these players have a personal agenda: frustration toward that player or embarrassment. Rarely, is it simply a matter of accident.

Nowitzki received a flagrant-1 when he hit Kirilenko midway through the first quarter of a 116-110 loss to Utah on Monday. After the game, however, NBA officials reviewed the play and decided to upgrade it to a flagrant-2, and handed down the suspension.

http://www.pegasusnews.com/news/2008/ma ... one-game-/