RealGM

I know the game is tonight and all my attetion should be on it, but I found this on the trade board and was wondering what everyone thinks?

Boston Incoming
Shaquille O'Neal
#15 pick

Phx Incoming
Ray Allen
Brian Scalabrine
#30 pick

the next 3 rounds(hopefully) will determine Ray's future in Boston

greenbeans wrote:the next 3 rounds(hopefully) will determine Ray's future in Boston

I hear you.

Eh, I think I'd pass. I wouldn't be adverse to trading Ray for a Center in the offseason, and moving up 15 spots in the draft would be good, but Shaq is old and I'm not sure you want to break up the big three for that. It's not horrible, but there should be better options.

Al n' Perk No Layups! wrote:Eh, I think I'd pass. I wouldn't be adverse to trading Ray for a Center in the offseason, and moving up 15 spots in the draft would be good, but Shaq is old and I'm not sure you want to break up the big three for that. It's not horrible, but there should be better options.

I at first I would do it in a heartbeat, but when you look at the whole picture you make some sense.

I do agree that the next 3 rounds determine Ray and also Doc's future in Boston.

Lets play hypotheticals and say G-d forbid that Boston does not come out of the East (that's not being sarcastic).

I think you'd have to look at possible destinations for Ray Ray. Allen to the Suns with Scal for Shaq and the pick swap makes sense.

-The C's would not need him to play more than 20 mpg a night in the regular season and can really then save him for the playoffs.
-Also KG is not a low post player, but a high post guy. This deal would give Garnett even more space exploiting others in the high post.
-C's need a closer. With 2 minutes left in a playoff game, Boston needs someone who can be aggressive going towards the hoop.
-C's automatically improve their perimeter D by swapping Allen for Posey in the starting 5.
-Shaq actually has Championship winning experience.
-Without Ray, Boston still has the best record in the East.
-Don't underrate the 15th pick. Boston needs more prospects and could get a nice one, particularly from the wing position, in Chase Budinger.
-No more Scal. Enough said.

Man, Ray is criminally underrated on this board.

Our weakest bench position right now is probably backup shooting guard. Who do you propose steps into the starting lineup if we trade our all-star, who is one of the most efficient shooters in the league, and who stretches the floor better than any available option? Is it that important to bring in an over-the-hill center, who is most effective when he's constantly fed the ball in the post (which would adversely affect the offense of KG, Pierce, and Rondo)?

A big thumbs down to this trade. Ray Allen is coming off the 4th best eFG% of his career. Why would we trade him?

RoyHobbs wrote:Man, Ray is criminally underrated on this board.

Our weakest bench position right now is probably backup shooting guard. Who do you propose steps into the starting lineup if we trade our all-star, who is one of the most efficient shooters in the league, and who stretches the floor better than any available option? Is it that important to bring in an over-the-hill center, who is most effective when he's constantly fed the ball in the post (which would adversely affect the offense of KG, Pierce, and Rondo)?

A big thumbs down to this trade. Ray Allen is coming off the 4th best eFG% of his career. Why would we trade him?

my sentiment exactly, and after the Cavs series people will be procaliming him the MVP on this board. They have no answer for the jesus.

I dont think I'd like this. I'd love to add Shaq to the team, but I dont think giving up Ray is worth it at this point in Shaq's career. Backup SG is sort of a weakness for us if you want to say that we have much of a weakness, but that is a position that isn't incredibly tough to fill. Anyway, the trade gets a thumbs down from me. I love me some Ray Ray.

You only do a deal likew this if you have someone else coming in as a free agent. It would have to be someone big like Jamison to warrant this kind of trade.

You really only do this deal if the current team fails to win the East. Major Issues then to be re-addressed since the team's championship window would be closing.

When people try comparing the importance of Ray vs. that of Shaq you can not throw numbers into the equation. Most of Ray's attempts are one and done shots, so there is usually little chance of an offensive rebound or even possible foul call when he is in pusuit of scoring.

As for who steps up in the role of wing player. Posey steps up into the starting lineup and you then improve your perimeter D. With the 15th pick you solve the "weak link" and draft a prospect 2-guard, I suggest Chase Budinger.

The C's need someone they can give the ball to in the post with 2 minutes left in the game. Pierce can use the extra spacing during crunch time. KG is simply not an aggressive enough player offensivley.

Boston can sure blow out teams, it's just scary when they are in a tight game down the stretch. I am not too confident in those situations.

Ray Allen is severely under-appreciated here. Also, Shaq isn't going to play anywhere that isn't a warm-climate area.

eitanr wrote:You really only do this deal if the current team fails to win the East. Major Issues then to be re-addressed since the team's championship window would be closing.

When people try comparing the importance of Ray vs. that of Shaq you can not throw numbers into the equation. Most of Ray's attempts are one and done shots, so there is usually little chance of an offensive rebound or even possible foul call when he is in pusuit of scoring.

As for who steps up in the role of wing player. Posey steps up into the starting lineup and you then improve your perimeter D. With the 15th pick you solve the "weak link" and draft a prospect 2-guard, I suggest Chase Budinger.

The C's need someone they can give the ball to in the post with 2 minutes left in the game. Pierce can use the extra spacing during crunch time. KG is simply not an aggressive enough player offensivley.

Boston can sure blow out teams, it's just scary when they are in a tight game down the stretch. I am not too confident in those situations.

1) Shaq needs the ball to be effective. He's a grind-it-out, give-it-to-him-in-the-post player. Our entire team offense isn't set up to accommodate a player like that.

2) Adding Posey to the starting lineup, but moving Pierce to the 2, is if anything a wash in terms of defense, and it weakens our bench. The idea of Pierce chasing around shooting guards does not fill me with glee.

3) Shaq is a terrible free throw shooter, making him a liability in late game situations.

4) Lately, there have been reports that Shaq is divisive in the locker room, and he's only motivated to play well occasionally.

I don't see how this trade really helps us. Last year, there were suggestions that Shaq had one of the most untradeable contracts in the NBA. Shaq will be 37 by the time next year's playoffs get here, and he's visibly breaking down.

I'd rather continue to give Perk minutes, and bring in somebody like Jeff Foster in free agency, should he opt out. Ray is a perfect fit in our offense, and has been our most clutch player this year. It makes little sense to shake things up, simply because of the perception that Ray had a poor series.

i would not do this trade at all

First of all...Doc has used Ray incorrectly all year---he even admitted they never ran plays for him--it was basically dump it to Ray for a 3 to bail out the team....didn't see many picks/curl plays this year---which is really Ray's bread and butter...Shaq is as finished as Jason Kidd.

I'd rather do that proposed Ray/Perk for Yao that someone brought up a couple of months ago.

MaxwellSmart wrote:First of all...Doc has used Ray incorrectly all year---he even admitted they never ran plays for him--it was basically dump it to Ray for a 3 to bail out the team....didn't see many picks/curl plays this year---which is really Ray's bread and butter...Shaq is as finished as Jason Kidd.

I'd rather do that proposed Ray/Perk for Yao that someone brought up a couple of months ago.

Yao, wow that would be crazy.

if were goin the sell your soul route, heres another. Ray for Crawford and Curry

As an aside, why is this "off topic"? This is a Celtics board, you've made a post about the Celtics, what is off topic about that?

greenbeans wrote:if were goin the sell your soul route, heres another. Ray for Crawford and Curry

Call me crazy but that does not sound that bad. I think KG would bring Curry's game to a new level. KG would cover up Curry's bad D. And Crawford will be just like having Ray.

and perk would be off the bench where he(unfortunately after 5 years im finally realizing this) belongs.