RealGM

I have been hearing and seeing a lot of crap on this forum and on the internet about how we are going to trade Ray Allen this offseason. I know Ray has struggled in the playoffs and has taken a step back but he still had a solid regular season and shot the ball well in the 2nd half of the season. I have a feeling he is going to have a big game eventually in the playoffs which will quiet the doubters. Ray is fine as a #3 and sometimes #4 option when Rondo is hot. But honestly can we really upgrade our roster by trading Ray in the offeason? He has 2 yrs left on his deal at big money about 17 to 18 mil a season. Let's see:

Atlantic
New York- not a match (No, we aren't trading Ray for Starbury's expiring)
Philadelphia- not a match
Toronto- not a match
New Jersey- I'd trade him for Richard Jefferson. They would offer Vince Carter and I would think about it but I don't know. Carter is soft and is nothing but a jump shooter as well and not as good as Ray at shootng. Carter could also cause chemistry problems and is also creeping up in age as he is 30 now and is losing his athleticism and doesn't drive to the hoop as much. It would probably be best to stick with Ray here.

Central
Detroit- not a match
Indiana- They could offer Murphy and Dunleavy but I think Murphy is a bum at this point and is overpaid longterm as well. Dunleavy bounced back this yr but part of it had to do with being in a great system for him. He also put up meaningless stats on a bad team. Neither of these guys can defend either I don't want them.
Chicago- Id trade them Ray if we could rape them and sign and trade Allen for Deng and Gordon. That is a unrealistic scenario probably though.Why would they want Allen too when they are rebuilding? If they offered Gooden and one of these two Id have to think about it as well but thats probably unlikely as well.
Cleveland- not a match.
Milwaukee- not a a match.

Southeast
Orlando- not a match
Atlanta- not a match
Washington- not a match
Charlotte- not a match
Miami- not a match

Southwest
Dallas- not a match
Houston- not a match
Memphis- not a match
New Orleans- not a match
San Antonio- not a match

Northwest
Seattle- not a match
Minnesota- not a match
Denver- not a match
Portland- not a match
Utah- not a match

Pacific
Lakers- not a match
Kings - I would love to get Artest and B.Miller but this seems unrealistic. Miller has 2 yrs left on his deal which is the same as Allen so why would they do this? They also give up their franchise player Artest for nothing but a guy who expires in a few years. Ray Allen also plays SG which is where Kevin Martin their future star plays. Sacramento also needs to rebuild an not bring in older players.
Golden State- not a match
Clippers- not a match
Phoenix - Diaw, Barbosa, and pick 15? This is a trade I think we would have to do but why would the suns do it? Allen is getting older and worse yet these two are coming into their prime. This would also hurt the suns already weak bench depth and doesn't really upgrade them as Barbosa might be better then Allen next season.

Summary: Everyone can forget about these miracle deals they think will happen. I predict Ray Allen won't be traded this offseason or the next and will simply expire and maybe be resigned at a huge discount to come off the bench and be our scorer. Two teams in the 2009 offseason who could be future matches are Charlotte and Milwaukee but even this is pretty slim. These two teams are going nowhere unless they win the lotto and they probably should dump their top salary guys and get cap space and go young. If we could get Michael Redd and Gadzuric in the summer of 2009 for Allen and Scalabrine's expirings wed have to do that. Also, if Charlotte thinks they are going nowhere and wants to shed cap space for Lebron, Wade, Bosh I wouldn't mind taking Jason Richardson and a salary for Ray Allen. Thoughts?

You never what other deals for Ray could creep up later. For example Houston may be interested in a deal centering around T-Mac for Allen...other pieces may be needed. The Bulls would do Hughes, Gooden, and 9th pick for Allen. Phoenix may deal us Shaq for him.

Can fans be traded?

eitanr wrote:You never what other deals for Ray could creep up later. For example Houston may be interested in a deal centering around T-Mac for Allen...other pieces may be needed. The Bulls would do Hughes, Gooden, and 9th pick for Allen. Phoenix may deal us Shaq for him.

HAHAHA TMAC for Allen? Are you kidding me? Why would they do this at all when Tmac's contract is the same length. That is an awful deal. Phoenix won't deal us Shaq for him as Shaq makes them more moeny in jersey sales, merchandise, tickets, and both their contracts expire at the same time. That Bulls deal looks unrealistic too. We trade Allen a productive player for 2 guys who can't play really. Gooden is decent I guess but Hughes sucks. Also, Gooden expires next yr and Hughes expires when Allen does so they gain no financial flexibility and give up a huge asset a lottery pick for a 33 yr old SG. Not a good move and Chicago won't do it.

I think Ainge will listen to offers, but I also think Ray has a lot of value (gulp) defensively. It's not something I expected, but Ray has really done a very nice job defensively for the most part. And his outside shooting certainly spreads the floor and gives Pierce and KG room to operate.

OTOH shooting guard is about the easiest position to replace in the NBA. Ray will have some value as a one-year-from-expiring deal, like Wally did. If the Bulls were really interested in Hughes, Gooden + #9 for Ray I'd have to give it some pretty serious thought. Maybe we could land someone like Russell Westbrook, who is a plus defender and a great athlete to run with Rondo.

LarryBrdismyDad wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



HAHAHA TMAC for Allen? Are you kidding me? Why would they do this at all when Tmac's contract is the same length. That is an awful deal. Phoenix won't deal us Shaq for him as Shaq makes them more moeny in jersey sales, merchandise, tickets, and both their contracts expire at the same time. That Bulls deal looks unrealistic too. We trade Allen a productive player for 2 guys who can't play really. Gooden is decent I guess but Hughes sucks. Also, Gooden expires next yr and Hughes expires when Allen does so they gain no financial flexibility and give up a huge asset a lottery pick for a 33 yr old SG. Not a good move and Chicago won't do it.

A lottery pick is an HUGE ASSET and an all-star is OLD... Nice mentality, maybe this year NBA title will be won from Chicago, Charlotte, Atlanta, Portland, LAClippers, Sacramento, Golden State... Hey, wait a minute, all this team S**K, how did it happen? They got multiple lottery pick in the past few years....

your quick to say no match to a lot of teams, you know something we dont??
im not of the mind we should be shopping him, but if theres somebody out there who wants to roll the dice on them ankles and offers us something we cant refuse i wont be pi$$ed, thats for sure

Well if his value is high I hope we trade him. He is struggling to blow by Illgaukas nowadays. I wouldn't be surprised if after the playoffs ended he all the sudden has some surgey for an undisclosed injury that he has been playing with..

History of the pick #9

1995
Ed O'Bannon

1996
Samaki Walker

1997
Tracy McGrady(out of HS he took 4 years to become a great player, in another team)

1998
Dirk Nowitzki

1999
Shawn Marion

2000
Joel Przybilla

2001
Rodney White

2002
Amare Stoudemire(out of HS)

2003
Mike Sweetney

2004
Andre Iguodala

2005
Ike Diogu

2006
Patrick OBryant

2007
Joakim Noah

Of all theese players only 3 are better that Ray, Amare(HSSr) was a bet, Nowitzki(european) too and Tmac was both a bet and blossomed with another team...

His value is pretty low right now. I'd say he's more likely to be traded the following summer when he's actually an expiring contract. However, I could also see Danny letting his contract expire so we can make a play in free agency.

UGA Hayes wrote:Well if his value is high I hope we trade him. He is struggling to blow by Illgaukas nowadays. I wouldn't be surprised if after the playoffs ended he all the sudden has some surgey for an undisclosed injury that he has been playing with..

Did you notice that he can blow Wally at WILL and then is doubled? He is the most doubled player of the Celts, maybe it means something.

It's true that the #9 pick has a spotty history overall, but remember we've got the Danny Ainge factor. I have confidence he will get an Amare or an Igoudala, not a Patrick OBryant.

Yes, we could easily trade Ray and get serious value for him. You claimed a lot of teams aren't good matches, which is flat out false. For instance Denver would love to have him as they are a team with no outside shooting, we could move him for Nene and Atkins plus filler.


That said, despite my current dislike of him and my constant calling for a trade, it's probably best that we keep him considering he will be expiring in the 2010 offseason, giving us room to go after guys like Wade or Joe Johnson.

I am not worried about his shooting. It will come back around. But One of two things is going on:

He either can't get his shot off anymore

Or

He needs to have more plays called for him

I think its more of the latter. I think he is still very valuable because he spaces the floor and requires constant attention because of his deadly shot. But as a defender your job is a lot easier if you know he can't get by you. As far as a trade goes, I would be interested in what was out there. But I'm guessing Ray would be more valuable to us that what we got in return.

Al n' Perk No Layups! wrote:Yes, we could easily trade Ray and get serious value for him. You claimed a lot of teams aren't good matches, which is flat out false. For instance Denver would love to have him as they are a team with no outside shooting, we could move him for Nene and Atkins plus filler.


That said, despite my current dislike of him and my constant calling for a trade, it's probably best that we keep him considering he will be expiring in the 2010 offseason, giving us room to go after guys like Wade or Joe Johnson.

exactlllyyyy

Why/how would letting him expire give us cap room???

Can't see the Bulls trading for Ray at all.

chakdaddy wrote:Why/how would letting him expire give us cap room???

Ray expires the same year as Scal. House, Cassell, Pollard, and PJ are all gone by then. TA is also probably gone. Posey may or may not be with the team, if he's here he'll make something around the MLE. Rondo will be here, probably making significant money. Powe will probably make Perkish money, maybe Baby and Pruitt too. We should have some money available.

There is no friggin way we get cap room anytime soon.
Even after Ray expires, we will have $45mil tied up in 4 players... and that's assuming the QO for Rondo, whereas we'll probably lock him up to a long-term deal. Unless you think we're dumping Pierce or KG, we aren't going to have cap room.

Not only that, Ainge has NEVER employed a strategy to get cap room. This is because big FA signings are rarely worth the money.

ermocrate wrote:-= original quote snipped =-


A lottery pick is an HUGE ASSET and an all-star is OLD... Nice mentality, maybe this year NBA title will be won from Chicago, Charlotte, Atlanta, Portland, LAClippers, Sacramento, Golden State... Hey, wait a minute, all this team S**K, how did it happen? They got multiple lottery pick in the past few years....

Ray Allen is done in a few years though and I would say right now that the #9 pick is worth more then Allen.