IMO, your third point guard is Arroyo or House

campybatman · Post #1 » by **campybatman** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 5:34 pm

I don't understand why Ainge hasn't targeted Carlos Arroyo. He'll soon turn twenty-nine this month but he's probably the best option left for a veteran point guard who's a free agent. Unless, House is going to be resigned or Ainge will take a gamble on signing Livingston. I don't think you've another alternative if you're seeking veteran help in the back court. See, I feel you've to go in a different direction from this season and Livingston is another young point guard which you already have in Pruitt. So, the third point guard has to be a veteran. Preferably, one who can run an offense as your back up. Because I like what House gives you on the Celtics: Perimeter shooting and instant offense off the bench. However, you lose a lot when Rondo goes to the bench. Yeah, your lone play maker. The problem I've with House is when his shots aren't dropping. He doesn't give you much else like Posey would if he isn't making his shots. I say, take a chance on Arroyo. What do you've to lose. I mean how many teams are eying him. In other words, Arroyo should come cheap.

I don't know, to me I see this as a signing that makes sense. Carlos Arroyo is more of a play maker than House. I understand the idea about continuity and chemistry. However, I believe Ainge understands that a true point guard to back up Rondo is necessary. Cassell this season for the most part wasn't the answer and, again, I like what House gives you as an offensive threat. But, he's too much of a two guard than for what this team really needs and lacks in the back court.

Celtics_85 · Post #2 » by **Celtics_85** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 5:57 pm

I think if you look at the two of these guys the decision on who to sign would have to do with where Pruitt is at in his career to this point. If Pruitt deserves minutes this year then House should be the guy getting signed. If they aren't sure about Pruitt then maybe Arroyo should be signed. I think the only way Arroyo comes here is if he is going to be the backup from the start. Arroyo is the exact player on offense as Rondo is trying to become, not very good from 3, but can hit the midrange jumper and is good at driving to the basket. House is just the opposite, pretty much being a jump shooter, and very good at it. Pruitt has all three at his disposal offensively, so his cammand of his game will have an impact on which weay we go. At htis point we know that Ainge wants to resign him and Posey, and maybe Pruitt won't cut it and we sign two PGs, but don't count on that.

campybatman · Post #3 » by **campybatman** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 6:31 pm

I feel as if Pruitt will get some run this season but could be another one or two seasons away from contributing with serious minutes. I'll rather not put that pressure on Pruitt unless he shines next season which is a stretch. Arroyo is insurance. But, as you'd said, adding Arroyo won't make sense unless he's Rondo's back up from the start. I just don't think you can honestly know just by what Pruitt does during the summer if you're Ainge. I mean he doesn't have a lot of experience matching up against the rest of the starting (or back up) point guards around the league. He'll be a liability on defense.

In my opinion, signing Arroyo is a safe pick up. Still, I've this feeling that House is tied in with Posey with them having the same agent. Like they're a package deal. I don't like the thought of that. You cover your rear with Arroyo. Hopefully, Pruitt proves my skepticism wrong. But, I don't see it. You can't expect a young and inexperience player to suddenly make a dramatic jump in year two when he barely played real time games the previous season. Unless, you're a special talent, but if you're, you would've been playing more as a rookie.

cisco · Post #4 » by **cisco** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 7:27 pm

bonsaiflipflops wrote:I don't understand why Ainge hasn't targeted Carlos Arroyo. He'll soon turn twenty-nine this month but he's probably the best option left for a veteran point guard who's a free agent. Unless, House is going to be resigned or Ainge will take a gamble on signing Livingston. I don't think you've another alternative if you're seeking veteran help in the back court.

I believe Danny has targeted Arroyo.

The point guard is coming off a fine season with the Orlando Magic, but he is now weighing up whether or not to remain with the team or accept one of the offers he says are on the table from several other NBA teams.

Arroyo has a chance to sign with Boston, Denver, Miami, Cleveland or Golden State.

http://www.fiba.com/pages/eng/fc/news/l ... /arti.html

I don't see how Arroyo can choose between those teams unless those teams have made him an offer.

Rocky5000 · Post #5 » by **Rocky5000** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 7:44 pm

If Given the choice, I'd take House over Arroyo. The instant offense that House gives this team is very valuable. He's also made strides in markedly improving his defense last year. His ball handling still needs work, but it doesn't seem to bother the offense to have Ray or Paul bring the ball up court.

Al n' Perk No Layups! · Post #6 » by **Al n' Perk No Layups!** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 7:56 pm

Marc Spears said on NEST the other day that the Celtics were going to give Pruitt the reigns as the backup PG and it's his job to lose. I feel Pruitt will excell in this role and be a great backup PG next year. We should definately sign a vet to provide insurance though.

Truthiracy · Post #7 » by **Truthiracy** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 8:06 pm

Can Arroyo D up? I now officially hate all Euros (thanks to Vujacic's pathetic performance on Ray Allen) and players like Arroyo, since they cannot play 1 lick of defense. Sign House.

bceltic55 · Post #8 » by **bceltic55** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 8:17 pm

Arroyo is not a better defender than House. Given the choice stay with a player who knows the system.

P2 · Post #9 » by P2 » Sat Jul 12, 2008 8:37 pm

Al n' Perk No Layups! wrote:Marc Spears said on NEST the other day that the Celtics were going to give Pruitt the reigns as the backup PG and it's his job to lose. I feel Pruitt will excell in this role and be a great backup PG next year. We should definately sign a vet to provide insurance though.

Let's hope House is still going to sign.

Rocky5000 · Post #10 » by **Rocky5000** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 8:40 pm

Al n' Perk No Layups! wrote:Marc Spears said on NEST the other day that the Celtics were going to give Pruitt the reigns as the backup PG and it's his job to lose. I feel Pruitt will excell in this role and be a great backup PG next year. We should definately sign a vet to provide insurance though.

So Pruitt will be the first pg off the bench? I don't know how I feel about that. I guess it's good for the future but I don't think he'll give us the clutch shooting of E.House.

So our rotation according to who's on board, and what's been said by Danny, now is something like:

Rondo Pruitt
Allen Giddens
Pierce Walker (Not likely to stay)
Garnett Powe
Perkins O'Bryant (According to Danny he'll be the backup)

Other reserves
Davis
Scal

Now hopefully we can get at least one veteran wing, Posey if he doesn't demand too long of a deal, and TA on the cheap otherwise. Still that is an awful lot of inexperience in the 2nd line. Even if Davis is the backup center, he's not exactly a grizzled vet.

One of our strengths last year was that we had a lot of experienced players coming off the bench. The only young guys who saw any time were Rondo, Powe, and Davis (although not too much). This year we're planning on working in Giddens, O'Bryant, and Pruitt. Powe and Rondo can be called vets now, but they still needed veterans to step in for them last year at certain times. We have 3 roster spots left, let's hope we use them wisely and not on someone like Kirk Snyder.

dsorc · Post #11 » by **dsorc** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 8:49 pm

cisco wrote:
bonsaiflipflops wrote:I don't understand why Ainge hasn't targeted Carlos Arroyo. He'll soon turn twenty-nine this month but he's probably the best option left for a veteran point guard who's a free agent. Unless, House is going to be resigned or Ainge will take a gamble on signing Livingston. I don't think you've another alternative if you're seeking veteran help in the back court.

I believe Danny has targeted Arroyo.

The point guard is coming off a fine season with the Orlando Magic, but he is now weighing up whether or not to remain with the team or accept one of the offers he says are on the table from several other NBA teams.

Arroyo has a chance to sign with Boston, Denver, Miami, Cleveland or Golden State.

http://www.fiba.com/pages/eng/fc/news/l ... /arti.html

I don't see how Arroyo can choose between those teams unless those teams have made him an offer.

The papers in Puerto Rico has said that those team have contacted him/his agent but there are no contract offers yet. He's right now in Greece about to play in the last qualifier for the Olympics so he's not going to be able to be signed any time soon.

I don't know how well of a fit he'd be here. He plays a lot like Cassell. Heady player that loves to have the ball in his hands and is a good scorer but isn't that great of a defender. He has better PG skills than House and doesn't give up that much in 3pt shooting. But he may pound the ball too much at times instead of letting the offense flow naturally.

As to Lucerne's comment, not only is Arroyo not from Europe (Puerto Rico is an island in the carriben and a US territory) he actually played in the NCAA with FIU. So any comparison against Euros is completely unwarranted.

Al n' Perk No Layups! · Post #12 » by **Al n' Perk No Layups!** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 9:34 pm

Rocky5000 wrote:
Al n' Perk No Layups! wrote:Marc Spears said on NEST the other day that the Celtics were going to give Pruitt the reigns as the backup PG and it's his job to lose. I feel Pruitt will excell in this role and be a great backup PG next year. We should definately sign a vet to provide insurance though.

So Pruitt will be the first pg off the bench? I don't know how I feel about that. I guess it's good for the future but I don't think he'll give us the clutch shooting of E.House.

One thing Pruitt can do is shoot. He has a sweet jumper, and remember, Eddie wasn't really clutch untill this year either. Also his size allows Eddie to play SG as Pruitt can cover two guards on D.

the sea duck · Post #13 » by **the sea duck** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 9:50 pm

i've only been impressed with arroyo once... when he was matched up against dan dickau.

i'd prefer house back.

jono · Post #14 » by **jono** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 9:50 pm

Just thought I would pose the question to members of the board ... what kind of D does Pruitt play ??

I don't mind the idea of letting him be the backup but think we need a quality veteran for the position just in case Rondo is having an off-night... We also need someone with experience just to be a calming/steadying influence during the playoffs and I am not sure if Pruitt truly qualifies as a veteran... I think he probably has the talent to play the backup position but not sure if I would trust him during pressure situations especially if Rondo were hurt and we had to win a tough game on the road...

If he can play D and possesses a maturity beyond his years then I think we are in good shape but truthfully, I am not sure if any of really know if Pruitt has the goods to produce during crunch time when so many players in the past have been unable to step up their game...I think Ainge will still sign a veteran guard just in case as he may want to protect himself against injuries and inconsistency...

campybatman · Post #15 » by **campybatman** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 10:06 pm

Al n' Perk No Layups! wrote:Marc Spears said on NEST the other day that the Celtics were going to give Pruitt the reigns as the backup PG and it's his job to lose. I feel Pruitt will excell in this role and be a great backup PG next year. We should definately sign a vet to provide insurance though.

No offense to Pruitt, but hasn't Ainge learn anything from the Telfair experience? You don't guarantee minutes to a young player who's unproven on your team. In the case of Telfair, he got to start right off. Whether that decision was do to the trading of the sixth pick in exchange for him isn't as important as the experiment not working out.

s1ickd · Post #16 » by **s1ickd** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 5:14 am

the regular season in the nba is a long one. pruitt is basically a more fluid and athletic delonte west. i think he'll be totaly fine at the backup point. light years better than cassel was at least .

buckner1976 · Post #17 » by **buckner1976** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 5:14 am

bonsaiflipflops wrote:
Al n' Perk No Layups! wrote:Marc Spears said on NEST the other day that the Celtics were going to give Pruitt the reigns as the backup PG and it's his job to lose. I feel Pruitt will excell in this role and be a great backup PG next year. We should definately sign a vet to provide insurance though.

No offense to Pruitt, but hasn't Ainge learn anything from the Telfair experience? You don't guarantee minutes to a young player who's unproven on your team. In the case of Telfair, he got to start right off. Whether that decision was do to the trading of the sixth pick in exchange for him isn't as important as the experiment not working out.

rondo says hi

Celtics_85 · Post #18 » by **Celtics_85** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 5:24 am

The biggest two reasons Telfair was traded, OK, maybe three, the first two were his lack of wanting to pressure the ball like Doc wanted him to and the fact that he was better suited for a team like the Suns who push the pace the whole game. When Telfair got benched is when Doc said we were too young to play uptempo with injuries to guys like Pierce, and the young guys were to green to play like that. Rondo sure jumped the oppertunity when that happened. But the gun thing is what was the final straw with the ownership. If House does leave I'd take Telfair for our third PG before I would Arroyo.

MVP4LIFE · Post #19 » by **MVP4LIFE** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 9:18 am

The two things that come to my mind about Arroyo:
1. if you look at the Magic and their need for a back-up PG, why don't they want to resign him?
2. With all the injuries Nelson has had, why hasn't Arroyo been able to step up and show he is a good PG (much like Calderon, eventhough in another class, showed)

campybatman · Post #20 » by **campybatman** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 1:50 pm

buckner1976 wrote:
bonsaiflipflops wrote:
Al n' Perk No Layups! wrote:Marc Spears said on NEST the other day that the Celtics were going to give Pruitt the reigns as the backup PG and it's his job to lose. I feel Pruitt will excell in this role and be a great backup PG next year. We should definately sign a vet to provide insurance though.

No offense to Pruitt, but hasn't Ainge learn anything from the Telfair experience? You don't guarantee minutes to a young player who's unproven on your team. In the case of Telfair, he got to start right off. Whether that decision was do to the trading of the sixth pick in exchange for him isn't as important as the experiment not working out.

rondo says hi

Rondo wasn't the full time starter as a rookie. You aren't talking about the same thing, says hi. This season Ainge and Rivers trusted Rondo to be the full time starter because he'd proven himself as a rookie, improving in the second half of last season. What did Pruitt do last season to justify handing the back up role to him next season? Suddenly, it got quiet.

Why are people comparing Pruitt to Rondo when their situations aren't the same? Both cases are under different circumstances. The Celtics had nothing to lose last season and could afford to play Rondo more once it was determined that the goal was to get as high in the lottery as possible. Whereas this season, and heading into next season, the Celtics can't afford to have a drop-off at the back up point guard position. House filled in well for what he'd offered. But, you should still have a better option than Cassell. Hence, House got his opportunity to play significant minutes in the finals because neither Rondo nor Cassell were keeping the Lakers' defense honest by providing a consistent perimeter offense. Who's to say that Pruitt can be a play maker next season? If not, he's a younger House. So, you still haven't addressed the problem of having one true point guard and nothing but scoring guards behind him. There's a drop-off in the flow of the offense when Rondo sits. I believe Perkins was one Celtic to echo that point. The players need a back up they can trust to find them and get the the ball to each of them in the right places on the court and understand their tendencies and can read the defense. Rondo's the only point guard that can do this. Pruitt to me, right now, is West: A combo guard at best but not a true play maker. Why do the Celtics always try to force a square into the circle hole? Why not sign a true point guard instead.