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If Detroit were to trade Billups and Prince...

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campybatman
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If Detroit were to trade Billups and Prince... 

Post#1 » by campybatman » Wed Jul 23, 2008 10:26 pm

...How would this, if at all, affect the Celtics' position among the top in the eastern conference? Would it entrench Boston as the top team or would it depend on what the Pistons acquire in return from that team to honestly say that they'd helped or hurt themselves versus the rest of the competition in the east?



But even if Rose has a Rookie of the Year season the Bulls have no prayer of competing for the Eastern Conference title given the dominance of the Celtics and Pistons and the radical improvements in Philadelphia (Elton Brand), Toronto (Jermaine O'Neal), and perhaps even Miami and Cleveland before summer's end. The Bulls have changed coaches and - they hope - a corner in the rebuilding of their franchise, but instead of taking care of business with Luol Deng and Ben Gordon they're playing money games behind the scenes.

The Hawks aren't doing much better. Playing in that same strengthening Eastern Conference the Hawks are letting Josh Smith run around all over the place instead of letting him know that he's an important part of what was - just a couple of months ago - the up and coming team of the East. The Hawks kept head coach Mike Woodson in town to give his team a chance to grow together, yet they're playing silly games with their second-best player.


http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=9561



ESPN reports that Detroit has offered to trade Chauncey Billups and Tayshaun Prince twice this off season already. The first time was to try to pry Carmelo Anthony away from Denver. The second offer was to Houston for Tracy McGrady. Both offers were rejected. With the rumors that Detroit is considering making a bid for Artest they could be making a 3rd attempt to trade Billups and Prince. There seems to be some smoke here and there may be some fire behind it. It would be interesting to see the crowd react to Ron Ron being introduced to the Palace crowd for the first time as a Piston. Talk about mixed emotions. Personally I wouldn't want Artest for anything. The guy has been a cancer and a distraction everywhere he has gone.


http://celticsgreen.blogspot.com/2008/0 ... r-old.html
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Re: If Detroit were to trade Billups and Prince... 

Post#2 » by SonicYouth34 » Wed Jul 23, 2008 11:49 pm

Trading for Artest is just stupid for DET, Prince is just as good and isn't crazy. DET needs to keep Prince, he was the primary reason they didn't lose to Philly in the first round.
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Re: If Detroit were to trade Billups and Prince... 

Post#3 » by TheSheriff » Thu Jul 24, 2008 12:22 am

If they trade Billups and/or Prince for Artest they get worse. Prince for Artest is a push.
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Re: If Detroit were to trade Billups and Prince... 

Post#4 » by captain_cheapseats » Thu Jul 24, 2008 12:57 am

SonicYouth34 wrote:Trading for Artest is just stupid for DET, Prince is just as good and isn't crazy.

You certainly have a point about Prince not being crazy, which may make him a superior choice to Artest for the Pistons. But to say that Prince is as good a basketball player as Artest means that (1) you have never seen Artest play, (2) you have never seen Prince play, or (3) you are muddling Artest's off-the-court antics with his on-the-court talent. I'm guessing it's choice (3).....

EDIT: actually, it must be choice (3), because even if you'd never seen either guy play, just looking at the stats would let the non-biased observer know that Artest is the better player.
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Re: If Detroit were to trade Billups and Prince... 

Post#5 » by campybatman » Thu Jul 24, 2008 2:07 am

Artest would be an expiring contract for Detroit. While Prince could be a good addition to pair with K. Martin. But, the Kings seem to like Salmons who plays small forward as well. And they'd already signed Udrih to a longterm deal at point guard to not need Billups' large contract. I don't understand why Billups needs to be included if a Prince for Artest works straight-up. Because the way the writer implies that the Pistons will make a trade for Artest, it makes you believe that it'll involve both Billups and Prince instead of them being a part of two separate deals that would make more sense.
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Re: If Detroit were to trade Billups and Prince... 

Post#6 » by threrf23 » Thu Jul 24, 2008 5:57 am

I think Artest would certainly be an upgrade over Prince, and I think they are seeking to trade Chauncey before he declines at all due to age.

But I think trading Chauncey would be a mistake, especially if they wouldn't be getting a better upgrade elsewhere. Stuckey isn't that good just yet, Billups is their leader and is perenially one of the most efficient players in the league on the offensive end, and plays a position where that is most important. Billups should decline over the next season or two, but not enough to not make him one of the league's best PGs.

I would be trying to trade Rip. He seems to have as much trade value as anybody on the team, he plays a position where there is a lot of league wide depth, he's not the greatest defender, and his role on the offense is relatively simple if not easily replaceable.
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Re: If Detroit were to trade Billups and Prince... 

Post#7 » by LarryBrdismyDad » Thu Jul 24, 2008 6:14 am

Joe Dumars is so out to lunch IMO when it comes to trades. Just because he got Rasheed Wallace for nothing doesn't mean he can steal players left and right like he thinks he can. Those offers are jokes Billups and Prince for Melo or TMac HAHAHAHA. What Detroit really needs to do is totally rebuild. This is a team that stayed the same for too long like most GMs do. Instead of making the correct move which is to rebuild because your team can't win a title, the Pistons simply keep trotting out the same team every yr and lose in the ECF. Its just like in poker, when you don't have the cards to win you simply fold and rebuild your chip count. Detroit is a team in decline as most opf their starters are in theri 30's and are on the decline. Here is what Detroit should be doing:

1)Offer Billups and Hamilton for Iverson and a first round pick. The Nuggets are trying to dump Iverson for young players, expirings, and picks but I don't think they could pass on this deal. Billups and Hamilton are the two best players on Detroit and are both good scorers and defenders which is exactly what the Nuggets need as they are one of the worst defensive teams in the NBA. With Billups, Hamilton, and Melo the Nuggets would have 3 primary scorers on the perimeter and could atleast contend for a playoff spot in the West. If they hadn't traded Camby this deal would have made a lot more sense. Denver is stuck right now with Nene and Martin who nobody will ever trade for. They might as well try to contend while these 2 clowns are still on their payroll because they aren't going to be able to create major cap space anyways within the next few years (with J.R. Smith and Kleiza's expected extensions). For Detroit this creates major cap space next summer when Iverson and Wallace expire. They would be able to sign 2 guys to max extensions in the summer of 2009 or 2010.

2) Let Rasheed Wallace expire. Everyone says how underrated this guy is and how he is the most talented player on Detroit. I just don't see it. He continually folds when it matters like this yr in the ECF. He was absolutely horrible. I would let him expire and take the salary cap savings. He would rather hangout on the perimeter then play like a real big man on the block and he doesn't rebound well anymore either.

3) Rebuild around Stuckey, Prince, and Maxiell. Stuckey looks like he is going to be a very good player in this league. Prince is a good defender and is alright as a 4th or 5th option on offense. Maxiell is a great 6th man or starting 4 as he is very athletic and provides great energy.

Hey if you can't win it all REBUILD. This is what happens when you pass on Melo, Wade, and Bosh for DARKO!
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Re: If Detroit were to trade Billups and Prince... 

Post#8 » by campybatman » Thu Jul 24, 2008 6:25 am

Logically, you don't trade Billups but trade Hamilton instead. My belief is that you make the transition for Stuckey a gradual move by starting him in the back court with Billups as a shooting guard. When Detroit is ready to move on from Billups, then you slide Stuckey over to point guard like how Golden State did this season and are now attempting to go with Ellis as the point guard with Baron Davis now gone. I wouldn't trade R. Wallace just yet either. I would trade McDyess for a decent center to allow Rasheed to move back to the power forward. Or if you're content with Rasheed at center, trade McDyess for Wilcox.

4 - Wilcox or R. Wallace
3 - Artest
5 - R. Wallace or a center acquired via a trade
1 - Billups
2 - Stuckey
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Re: If Detroit were to trade Billups and Prince... 

Post#9 » by GuyClinch » Thu Jul 24, 2008 10:41 am

Artest matches up with Pierce a heck of alot better then Prince. As a bunch of us pointed out before the Detroit series Pierce can physically overpower Prince despite the fact that he supposedly is a "better defender" then Lebron..

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Re: If Detroit were to trade Billups and Prince... 

Post#10 » by GuyClinch » Thu Jul 24, 2008 10:43 am

Logically, you don't trade Billups but trade Hamilton instead. My belief is that you make the transition for Stuckey a gradual move by starting him in the back court with Billups as a shooting guard.


Only if your "logic" doesn't take into account the game of basketball. Dude - both Stuckey and Billups are ON THE BALL players. Hamiliton is an off the ball guy. Billups and Stuckey are bad fit.

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Re: If Detroit were to trade Billups and Prince... 

Post#11 » by bruno sundov » Thu Jul 24, 2008 10:52 am

If they are willing to trade Billups that means the backup, who lit us up in the playoffs, must be ready to take over. What was his name, Tucker? Big physical guard who could pass and shoot lights out.

RON RON is a bad idea for any team. I would love to see him to the Fakers. Him and KB24 are perfect for each other.
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Re: If Detroit were to trade Billups and Prince... 

Post#12 » by Truthiracy » Thu Jul 24, 2008 12:03 pm

Let's also not underrate the fact Ronny Artest is a Career Loser, so what if he made the ECF once and got his ass handed to him by the Pistons in 2004, that doesn't eliminate the fact he's a CL.. playoffs 4 of 9 years with 3 first round exits. I can only hope Detroit trades one of Chunky/Rip/Tay/"Sheed" for Ronald.
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Re: If Detroit were to trade Billups and Prince... 

Post#13 » by theman » Thu Jul 24, 2008 2:13 pm

It sounds like Sacremento in intent on packaging Shareef Abdur Rahim or Kenny Thomas in any Artest trade. Billups and Prince for Artest and Thomas makes no sense for the Pistons. I can see Denver balking at the Melo trade but I like the McGrady trade for Houston. Tmac is a heck of a player when healthy but that is not very often.

Houston should trade TMac for Prince and Billups then package Shane Battier and Rafer Alston for a mid-level Shoot Guard.
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Re: If Detroit were to trade Billups and Prince... 

Post#14 » by campybatman » Thu Jul 24, 2008 11:25 pm

theman wrote:It sounds like Sacremento in intent on packaging Shareef Abdur Rahim or Kenny Thomas in any Artest trade. Billups and Prince for Artest and Thomas makes no sense for the Pistons. I can see Denver balking at the Melo trade but I like the McGrady trade for Houston. Tmac is a heck of a player when healthy but that is not very often.

Houston should trade TMac for Prince and Billups then package Shane Battier and Rafer Alston for a mid-level Shoot Guard.



Don't forget, Abdur-Rahim will likely retire. I wonder if insurance covers most of his contract to which ever team acquires him.
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Re: If Detroit were to trade Billups and Prince... 

Post#15 » by meatball sub » Fri Jul 25, 2008 12:16 am

LOL @ Artest playing in Detroit.

And I really do hope that the Pistons somehow land T-Mac. They're better off just rebuilding than have McGrady try to lead an attempt at slaying the beast that IS the Boston Celtics. Not happening, one less threat for the ECF if that trade goes down. We already got an up and coming Philly team, MAYBE Toronto, and of course Lebron to worry about. Please, Joe Dumars, I'm begging you. Trade for Artest or McGrady and slip into mediocrity instead of rebuilding...

Nobody in Detroit will be able to keep Artest in line and the fans already hate him. McGrady isn't really that fond of defense to begin with and losing two great defenders in Tayshaun and Billups I think would do more bad than the superstar status of McGrady would do good...if that makes any sense.
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Re: If Detroit were to trade Billups and Prince... 

Post#16 » by campybatman » Fri Jul 25, 2008 9:11 pm

It's nice to have rivalries and Detroit and Boston could be a nice rivalry for the fans of those cities. But, if they foul things up... That's not good for the eastern conference. I mean just when the eastern conference is regaining respectability and becoming more deep. You've teams at the top of the chain regressing if the Pistons trade Billups at least. You've Prince under contract for a few more seasons. Leave well enough alone. Because you've to negotiate a contract extension with Artest and that could be difficult.
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Re: If Detroit were to trade Billups and Prince... 

Post#17 » by CelticFaninLBC » Fri Jul 25, 2008 10:42 pm

Can't imagine Artest coming to Detroit after the fight... I think Artest will end up in Miami. Can't imagine Sacramento dealing Artest to the Lakers. Sac and LA hate one another.

As for Detroit, there's not a lot of viable trade options. I think they'll stand pat and hope that Stuckey becomes a lot better...

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