Powe Davis O'Bryant

LongTimeFan · Post #1 » by **LongTimeFan** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 1:23 pm

I think this is going to be interesting. The long shot is O'Bryant, imo. But Davis does seem to have the jack of all trades issue. I pretty much think Powe has the backup PF position. Any guesses on how this will play out.

Name_______Height______Wingspan_______Stand R.______Reb/40_________Age

O'Bryant_____7' 0"_________7' 6"___________9' 5"__________14.0____________21
Davis________6' 9"______________________________________10.6____________21
Powe________6' 8"________7' 4"____________9' 2"__________13.5____________23

Baby is such an interesting player. I don't think he has the length of the vertical reach the other two. But his passing and lateral foot work are just so disruptive. I can't see us keeping all three of these over the long term.

It is almost unfair. We are the champions and yet we are a developing team. All three are developing, POwe from a fairly high level.

cloverleaf · Post #2 » by **cloverleaf** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 1:33 pm

I think Baby's gonna have to work his butt off this year.

Clifford Ray is going to do some masterful sculpting of the O'Bryant clay, and O'Bryant has the much-needed length for backing up the one position with the most backup minutes to fill.

Powe really proved himself last year and isn't going to let up. I think he's the first big off the bench all season.

mrautobahn · Post #3 » by **mrautobahn** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 1:42 pm

I might be wrong here... but if BBD is an unrestricted free agent after this season. And he will be out of the Celtics price range... I wouldn't be surprised if BBD was traded during the season while DA still has chips to play...

GuyClinch · Post #4 » by **GuyClinch** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 2:05 pm

Don't we have a team option for a 3rd year or something like that? Danny usually signs guys to three year deals. That being said Davis is just okay. I don't think his lateral footwork is that 'disruptive" - that's for sure. What's disruptive for US is that he can't finish around the rim and can't hit a jumper either.

He need to lose weight to help him get more lift and improve his shooting.. It's not hopeless but Powe is the brighter prospect.

Pete

LongTimeFan · Post #5 » by **LongTimeFan** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 2:19 pm

We have Powe's full Bird rights and Davis and O'Bryant's Little Bird rights. I believe the latter let's us outbid MLE offers by giving the player better raises. I can't believe he's going to get more than the MLE. Perk didn't get a full MLE. Perk is making 12.5 mil over the next three years.

Let's be reasonable here. DA got the contracts under control.

Powe I believe is the most valuable trading chip. He is very close to becoming a starting level NBA PF. He's been putting up Big Al type numbers on a per 48 min basis. He's got a Brand like reach. A 15' jump shot would be huge. If he has a break-out year. I don't think we can afford to sign him.

armageddon · Post #6 » by **armageddon** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 2:44 pm

Powe isn't a trading chip until he signs a larger contract or becomes available for a sign and trade. But why would we trade him when bigs are the most difficult asset to acquire. Powe's probably going to get the money he deserves next year but will Boston be willing to go 5-years? If not, then he may be involved with a sign and trade.

RickyDizzle · Post #7 » by **RickyDizzle** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 3:14 pm

GuyClinch wrote:Don't we have a team option for a 3rd year or something like that? Danny usually signs guys to three year deals. That being said Davis is just okay. I don't think his lateral footwork is that 'disruptive" - that's for sure. What's disruptive for US is that he can't finish around the rim and can't hit a jumper either.

He need to lose weight to help him get more lift and improve his shooting.. It's not hopeless but Powe is the brighter prospect.

Pete

Pete, I've said this in another thread a couple months ago, but you are the biggest big baby hater on the board. I usually think you are a voice of reason on the board and I tend to agree with you, but your hate on baby seems unjustified.

He is obviously still finding his game at the NBA level, but I dont know how you cant find his unique skill set intriqueing. He is huge and can push people around but he has ballerina feet. Also I agree that he doesnt go straight up with it to finish, but his small stature for a big guy has taught him to be more creative with his finishes. Is it ideal for a guy to have to be 'creative' around the rim? No, but at least he knows how he has the best chance of putting the ball in the hoop.

Also he did have a jumper in college, so that should come with mroe NBA reps and consistent rotational playing time.

He's not an excellent pro now, but I dont think its a stretch at all for him to be a solid contributor on a playoff team after gaining some more experience.

Dizzy

Post #8 » by **I love heinsohn** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 5:39 pm

Pretty sure BBD as a player with less than 3 years experience will be a RFA next year. Can anybody confirm?

Pogue Mahone · Post #9 » by **Pogue Mahone** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 5:39 pm

RickyDizzle wrote:Pete, I've said this in another thread a couple months ago, but you are the biggest big baby hater on the board.
Dizzy

Hey, don't give him all the credit. He isn't even in the top-5 of biggest Big Baby haters. The unfortunate thing is there are more Big Baby 'Bators out there and they attempt to drown out anyone who disagrees with them.

I recognize that Davis matured with his defensive rotations as the year went along. Good on him. That being said, his offense got progressively worse and to be honest, he had basically hit a wall by mid-December. He appeared to get heavier as the season wore on and that forced a continued downward spiral, imo. He stopped passing and he stopped boxing out on the defensive glass. Really, if you take away Big Baby's offensive rebounding, you are left with a gravity-bound, turnover prone, ball-hogging big body, with a penchant for theatrics and fake hustle.

No thank you. Trade him while you can still get value, imo.
----------------------------

Also, Powe is the more valuable player and has been for quite a while. If you were to hypothetically trade Powe, you would do so in combination with the soon to expiring contracts that are scattered all over the roster. There is no need to try to make a splash in FA when you can acquire those players beforehand on the cheap (acquisition costs, at least.) Danny is going to make a big trade, imo, and I would expect it as soon as the trading deadline (depending on how things develop.)

humblebum · Post #10 » by **humblebum** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 6:12 pm

Glen Davis is going to prove quite a few people wrong this season. Not saying he is better than Powe but he's definitely a lot better than people are making him out to be. When he comes in to the season in proper shape, he's going to earn minutes because: he knows the rotations much, much better than Leon, he's more capable of defending 5's than Leon (which allows KG to defend the 4), and offensively he's going to develop into a solid all-around player. Leon Powe might be the better player (he definitely is right now) but he really needs to sharpen up his understanding of the defense. In a lot of ways I think that they complement each other and should be used in tandem off the bench. But it's going to be very funny to see people's responses when Glen Davis is producing next season. 8-)

eris · Post #11 » by **eris** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 6:26 pm

LongTimeFan wrote:I think this is going to be interesting. The long shot is O'Bryant, imo. But Davis does seem to have the jack of all trades issue. I pretty much think Powe has the backup PF position. Any guesses on how this will play out.

Name____Height___Wingspan____Stand R.___Reb/40____Age
O'Bryant__7' 0"__ ____7' 6"________9' 5"______14.0_______21
Davis_____6' 9"___________________________10.6_______21
Powe_____6' 8"______7' 4"________9' 2"______13.5_______23

Baby is such an interesting player. I don't think he has the length of the vertical reach the other two. But his passing and lateral foot work are just so disruptive. I can't see us keeping all three of these over the long term.

It is almost unfair. We are the champions and yet we are a developing team. All three are developing, POwe from a fairly high level.

I think you're being generous with Big Baby and Powe's heights. Knock an inch (or two) off both. Not really a problem for Powe with his very long arms, but Davis has, at best, average length arms (I think I saw that he had a St. Re. of something like 8'10"). To compound that, Davis has shown very little leaping abiity.

I honestly think Powe has the inside track to backup 4 (if he can figure out the defensive rotations, finally). Davis has an outside chance to overtake him there. If Davis *really* gets in shape this summer and develops a *consistent* 18-20 foot jumper he could move ahead of Leon. So, in my view those two are fighting for the 16 mpg KG is resting.

Davis is probably backup 5 right now (short arms and nil vertical and all), but O'Bryant has the ability to overtake Glen there...and to do it this year. These two are fighting for the 18-20 mpg that Perk is on the bench

There is room for all three, for now, however I don't think Davis will be able to catch Powe at 4 and I think POB will move past Davis at 5. So, frankly, I think Glen Davis is going to get squeezed out of the rotation.

We'll have to wait and see how these two competitions play out.

LongTimeFan · Post #12 » by **LongTimeFan** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 7:16 pm

Well I'm going by best available numbers. Davis and Powe are listed on the Celtics' roster at those heights. I've got two sources on Powe's wingspan and I listed the shorter one.

Anyways, Powe plays like he's got a 9' 2" reach. He handled Oden pretty well.

Truthiracy · Post #13 » by **Truthiracy** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 7:19 pm

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/boston.htm

BBD a FA after this season, so trade him at the deadline because we aren't resigning him.

buckner1976 · Post #14 » by **buckner1976** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 8:47 pm

LucerneStDoggz wrote:http://hoopshype.com/salaries/boston.htm

BBD a FA after this season, so trade him at the deadline because we aren't resigning him.

trade him for what exactly?? you assume he has value around the league right now. count me among the posters that recognizes babys skill set as unique but like many on this roster save for the starting 5 eddie house, powe and scal he is more of an unknown. now i should hope powe should be better than him, hes been here a year longer and were not talking about 2 all-world talents here. the interesting thing to note is that powe's biggest issue- defensive rotation is something that davis is better at right now due to his quick feet but obviously yes davis did hit a wall last year(not surprising for a rookie. hes playing over twice as many games in a season now). to his credit, so far davis is saying the right things this offseason and beginning to act like a player trying to mature. he seems to be taking his workouts seriously.

he has no value around the league so we might as well hold onto him and see how he progresses at training camp. fact is in davis, pruitt, tony, o'bryant, pruitt, and even tony we have a number of uncertaintys that wont be clear until the season begins. onr could even argue that puts scal in the running for more minutes again. you know he can play defense and he rotates well, he knows his limitations and he can shoot the ball.

eris · Post #15 » by **eris** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 8:49 pm

LongTimeFan wrote:Well I'm going by best available numbers. Davis and Powe are listed on the Celtics' roster at those heights. I've got two sources on Powe's wingspan and I listed the shorter one.

Yes, I know, but think both are an inch (or two in Powe's case) shorter than their listed height. Height *is* a factor when it comes to guarding really long players, and Powe does struggle a bit there, but his long arms and grit make up for a lot of it.

Anyways, Powe plays like he's got a 9' 2" reach. He handled Oden pretty well.

Powe *does* have that reach, it's Davis that doesn't have the long arms. Davis is, IIRC, 8'10" or 11" which isn't bad, just not exceptional.

I think all three, Powe, Davis and O'Bryant are going to be improved by training camp and I'm looking forward to a big three way fight for the backup 4 and 5 out of them.

As for as trades are concerned, I think it's too early for that. Danny's MO is to build up his assets and trade them at high value levels. At this point, I don't think any of these three have high enough value to gather much in a deal. Realize, I'm not saying they aren't now good, nor will later be better, just that other GM's aren't going to put a high value on any of them at this point.

SonicYouth34 · Post #16 » by **SonicYouth34** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 8:51 pm

LongTimeFan wrote:Name_______Height______Wingspan_______Stand R.______Reb/40_________Age

O'Bryant_____7' 0"_________7' 6"___________9' 5"__________14.0____________21
Powe________6' 8"________7' 4"____________9' 2"__________13.5____________23

Powe's measurements are beastly, he's 4 inches shorter than POB but he has nearly identical reach and wingspan. I can't wait to see what Powe can do over the course of a whole NBA season

LongTimeFan · Post #17 » by **LongTimeFan** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 9:45 pm

I think 7' 2" might be better number. I have that from SI

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/basket ... 33887.html

The 7' 4" comes from a previous coach, so he may be hyping him a bit. His reach of 9' 2" comes from a couple of sources.

http://lexnihilnovi.blogspot.com/2008/0 ... -powe.html

This guy went with 7' 2", too.

celticfan42487 · Post #18 » by **celticfan42487** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 10:05 pm

how does Powe have 9'2" standing reach and isn't an excellent man defender for the PF spot? Perk pretty much has that and doesn't have a laterall advantage or athletic advantage and manages to get quite a few very impressive blocks. So what is it, slow lateral movement or is his mass not enough as to where he gets pushed around? Honestly I don't know with measurements like that.

I don't think it's help rotations, Powe gets beat by his man but is known to step in front of penetrating guards and even his own man.

Honestly, I don't get where the bad defense comes from for this man. At this point the only thing I can think of is a lack of mass and inconsistent rotational defense. Maybe inability to move laterally with the SF/PFs.

kmgarnett21 · Post #19 » by **kmgarnett21** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 10:26 pm

leon powe is by far the best out of the 3 & danny should do all he can to keep powe. he would fill in nicely for KG when KG retires. sure, powe will want a nice contract, but he deserves it. why not give deserving players contracts that they earned while with us?

i love powe too!!! wanna get a powe jersey but i dont wanna fork out the money for one year of him on our team

billfromBoston · Post #20 » by **billfromBoston** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 10:33 pm

celticfan42487 wrote:how does Powe have 9'2" standing reach and isn't an excellent man defender for the PF spot? Perk pretty much has that and doesn't have a laterall advantage or athletic advantage and manages to get quite a few very impressive blocks. So what is it, slow lateral movement or is his mass not enough as to where he gets pushed around? Honestly I don't know with measurements like that.

I don't think it's help rotations, Powe gets beat by his man but is known to step in front of penetrating guards and even his own man.

Honestly, I don't get where the bad defense comes from for this man. At this point the only thing I can think of is a lack of mass and inconsistent rotational defense. Maybe inability to move laterally with the SF/PFs.

...uh, Powe is considered a strong man defender by scouts...its his recovery on perimeter help that gets him in team defensive sets...

....however, it is funny to see all the people who point to Powe's "massive" defensive short-comingson rotations when it was Powe who got increasingly more and more minutes as the season went on and was averaging nearly 20mpg over the last two months...

Face reality folks...Powe's defensive rotations were hardly enough of a concern to keep him from becoming one of the key reserves off the bench...and the rest of his game clearly gives him the advantage over Davis..

People on this board act like Davis is the only one working on his game this off-season...Powe is living at Healthpoint all off-season as well...if Powe comes into camp with a 15 foot jumper, Davis is never going to un-seat him...

...whether or not the C's pay to keep Powe remains to be seen, but for 4 million a year, i'd think they'd do it...he was one of the most statistically productive 4's in the league per-minute last year...he had a rare year...

Davis is charismatic and funny-that gives him way too much credit on this board...I think he'll be very good if he ever gets in real athlete shape, but he is not close to the player that Powe is on most nights...and that played itself out on the court last year...