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While watching a video of interview of Darius Miles (and rooting for him to comeback physically and not do anything stupid),

I noticed in the interview (on nba.com/celtics or boston.com)

his statement to a reporter "I always used to be the 1rst or second option, and now I'm just ..."

and pondered his stays in Clipperland, Cleveland and Portland; and thought that something wasn't right.

2006 Portland (His last healthy year) - 2nd Option to Zach Randolph

2005 Portland 4th Option behind Zach Randolph, Shareef Abdur Rahiem, Damon Stoudamire

2004 Portland Tied for 5th Option with Bonzi Wells & Jeff McInnis,
BEHIND Zach Randolph, Rasheed Wallace, Derek Anderson and Damon Stoudamire

2004 Cleveland 7th in Points Per Game, 5th in Shots Per Game

2003 Cleveland 6th in Points Per Game, 3rd in Shots Per Game
(Leading Scorers Ricky Davis, Zydrunas IIgauskas, Dajuan Wagner, Carlos Boozer, Jumaine Jones)

2002 LA Clippers 7th in Points Per Game, 5th in Shots Per Game
(Leading Scorers Elton Brand, Jeff McInnis, Quentin Richardson, Lamar Odom, Corey Maggette, Olowokandi)

2001 LA Clippers 5th in Points Per Game and Shots Per Game
(Behind Lamar Odom, Jeff McInnis, Eric Piatowski, Maggette/Olowokandi)

So, it would seem that he was a second option for 40 games of the season that he got injured, and was a 4th option the season before that, and never better than 5th any other year, except 2003 in Cleveland, when he had the ignominious dishonor of being 3rd in shots per game but 6th in points per game).

I think I now understand where the reputation for being a "knucklehead" and/or bad teammate possibly comes from.

I think a better stat for this would be usage percentage. Not that I want to look it up, but just going by points per game or attempts might be misleading because he might be playing largely in a reserve role where he is the main guy on the floor.

Maybe I will look it up.

2006: Second option behind Randolph (or third behind Juan Dixon). But he didn't start, so he was probably the #1 option when he was on the court.
2005: Second option behind Randolph. Ditto above.
2004 POR: Third option behind Randolph and Wallace. Started here so he actually was the third option.
2004 CLE: Third option? Hard to tell without looking at gamelogs. Highest usage of guys who didn't start, though. So probably first option when he was on the court.

When he was initiailly required by Portland, Wallace had been traded or was about to be traded. So Wallace wouldn't count there...

I like players come in and think that the big three don't have to score all by themselves. It can create more defensive problems for opponents. I love the way the Lakers went after Pierce and Garnett and left Ray wide open. We need more offensive-minded baits.

Bleeding Green wrote:I think a better stat for this would be usage percentage. Not that I want to look it up, but just going by points per game or attempts might be misleading because he might be playing largely in a reserve role where he is the main guy on the floor.

Maybe I will look it up.

2006: Second option behind Randolph (or third behind Juan Dixon). But he didn't start, so he was probably the #1 option when he was on the court.
2005: Second option behind Randolph. Ditto above.
2004 POR: Third option behind Randolph and Wallace. Started here so he actually was the third option.
2004 CLE: Third option? Hard to tell without looking at gamelogs. Highest usage of guys who didn't start, though. So probably first option when he was on the court.

Interesting stat, Bleeding Green.

And stated in a voice like coach/commentator Tommy Heinsohn.

I did think about the situation of what if he was the first or second option of the second unit , but since he started for a good amount of his career, I can't accept the argument, even based on usage, that he was the first or second option for anything more than a half season.

His point per game and shot per game totals, relative to his teammates, are just too low for most seasons.

Jammer, Miles has always been a 1st/2nd option type player since he has come into the league. That is not always reflected in the raw shooting attempts but he has played the role of facilitator and penetrator. Which is fine and good but it was a role he was ill-suited for because he was attempting to set-up teammates who couldn't finish with efficiency.

Personally, I think Miles and Boris Diaw share a lot of similarities. Neither can shoulder the offensive workload of a team and should never be asked to do so. That being said, surround them with finishers and you will bring out the best qualities of each player's game. I think if people are looking for a potential level of impact from a healthy Miles, look to what a healthy Diaw has done since his arrival in Phoenix.

Pogue Mahone wrote:Jammer, Miles has always been a 1st/2nd option type player since he has come into the league. That is not always reflected in the raw shooting attempts but he has played the role of facilitator and penetrator. Which is fine and good but it was a role he was ill-suited for because he was attempting to set-up teammates who couldn't finish with efficiency.

Personally, I think Miles and Boris Diaw share a lot of similarities. Neither can shoulder the offensive workload of a team and should never be asked to do so. That being said, surround them with finishers and you will bring out the best qualities of each player's game. I think if people are looking for a potential level of impact from a healthy Miles, look to what a healthy Diaw has done since his arrival in Phoenix.

The Celtics are going to be absolutely deadly off the bench if Miles can fill a similar role to that of Diaw in Phoenix. It will be interesting to see how Doc varies our offense given some of the new offensive players we have and how they contrast with the likes of Posey and PJ Brown. The Celtics have a lot of room for improvement on the offensive end IMO and if Miles can become the offensive leader and facilitator on the second unit than this team will be able to come at opponents in waves of offensive production off the bench.

2nd or 3rd option would be more appropriate. You have to look at games played as well per game attmepts, some of the guys you listed played 20-40 games and even at that weren't on the team when Miles was on the team.

I think what Miles said should be viewed in terms of his involvement in the offense, not just his scoring or shot attempts. If you look at his career (especially in Portland) he was definitely in the top 2 in regards to his importance to the team's offense when you consider his responsibilities as as setup guy in the half court and also on the fast break. Add that to his scoring in both of these phases of the game and you come away with a guy who was the 1st or 2nd most important offensive cog on his team.

If Miles is healthy we have ourselves an outstanding player who is ideally suited as a 6th man/Energy guy off the bench for a Championship level team. The only question is will his health hold up.

Pogue Mahone wrote:Jammer, Miles has always been a 1st/2nd option type player since he has come into the league. That is not always reflected in the raw shooting attempts but he has played the role of facilitator and penetrator. Which is fine and good but it was a role he was ill-suited for because he was attempting to set-up teammates who couldn't finish with efficiency.

Personally, I think Miles and Boris Diaw share a lot of similarities. Neither can shoulder the offensive workload of a team and should never be asked to do so. That being said, surround them with finishers and you will bring out the best qualities of each player's game. I think if people are looking for a potential level of impact from a healthy Miles, look to what a healthy Diaw has done since his arrival in Phoenix.

Well, there have been enough knowledgeable, intelligent posters supporting Darius Miles that I must be mistaken.

So, if that be the case, I apologize (to Mr. Darius Miles, that is).

Moving to a new topic, Darius presence is extremely intriguing as a low post threat.

After Kevin Garnett, and maybe Paul Pierce,
I think it's pretty clear Miles is the closest thing that the Celtics have to a LOW POST SCORER.

So, although they cannot spread the floor with 5 shooters like when Eddie, Ray, Paul, Kevin & Posey were on the floor together;

the following lineup would be extremely interesting:

Kevin Garnett in the high post, Ray and Paul on the wings, Eddie spotting up in a corner, and Darius Miles ISOLATED ON THE BLOCK. It would a a ONE ON ONE situation for him, with no opportunity for a double team, and anyone covering Darius in the low post would also have to be quick enough to handle situations where Darius could be the FINISHER on a FAST BREAK.

So, there is more than a glimmer of optimism.

And I generally respect those who come to someone else's defense more than those who attack.

I would like to see Miles make the team. But I think He is likely to be cut, Unless we make a trade. I wish we didn't resign Sam.

GregB wrote:I would like to see Miles make the team. But I think He is likely to be cut, Unless we make a trade. I wish we didn't sign Sam.

fixed. Miles is an idoit on the court who got injured for a long time. He never reformed his playing style like Ricky Davis did.

Honestly I have very little expectation of him to 1) recover enough and 2) change himself. In order to be a good fit for this team.

Last year we had an abundance of shooters. And although it was really taxing for our drivers [I think just Pierce essentially] we were really deadly in the playoffs because we could out-shoot anyone.

Miles is an okay fit with House as our backup PG to counterbalance. But unless Miles fully recovers and makes up for himself defensively he's not so great a fit with a Rondo. And I think even Tony Allen can fit better in the offensive flow because at least he will pass the ball off after penetrating.

I'd almost rather take a chance and see what Giddens can do since he is suppose to have some range on his shot.

Miles reminds me of Reggie Lewis. He is a poor shooter but can do many things to score. He doesn't look like a first or second option but his regular box scores would tell you he scored 20 one game and 7 another game.

Jammer wrote:
2004 Portland Tied for 5th Option with Bonzi Wells & Jeff McInnis,
BEHIND Zach Randolph, Rasheed Wallace, Derek Anderson and Damon Stoudamire

I think I now understand where the reputation for being a "knucklehead" and/or bad teammate possibly comes from.

Ha, Bonzi was gone at the beginning of the year and Mcinnis was traded for him, and Andeson sat out the last half of the year (when Darius was here). He was most definetely the third option when here.

But he was definitely a knuckle-head.

For Portland, Darius started out as a sixth man (backing up Randolph and SAR) but when he was healthy during his last two years in Portland he was the second option behind Randolph. The only time he really took advantage of it was the half a season before he got hurt. That year the other starting options on Portland, to pair up with Zach and Miles, were Telfair, Juan Dixon, and Ratliff or Przybilla. That team was awful.