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OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition

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OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#1 » by campybatman » Sat Nov 22, 2008 12:27 am

Not the name players themselves necessarily but the idea of a lot of them signing with new teams.

For the team that signs LeBron James, if the majority of payroll is tied up in James' contract. What will be left in additional free agents resigning and overall quality of teammates? James has to understand that his team won't be able to get that much better with the size of his new contract. I mean you think he's frustrated with his help in Cleveland. He hasn't seen anything yet. Take Boston now, with the addition of Ray Allen and then Garnett, Ainge got creative in putting together the rest of the roster in draft picks (young players) and resigning players to short term deals. In other words, his hands were tied as far as how much he can do to improve the roster beyond Pierce, Ray Allen and Garnett. That future team better or Cleveland better realize this point by then, in 2010. Can you say, improvise? Yup, that's what they'll have to do. And they'll have to draft well and/or sign a bunch of aging veterans off the scrap heap. Would you sign for a lesser salary to play with James?



The NBA's latest version of a long-running presidential election involves LeBron James and more than a dozen other high-profile candidates. The issue: Where will they land when they become free agents in 2010?

This promises to be the most provocative free-agent class of the post-Jordan world, with the Pistons, Nets and (launch Darth Vader intro music) Knicks among the dozen or more teams potentially lining up to recruit and sign one or more of the game's biggest names. But ... and a big but this is ... it's a story that won't be consummated until the summer after next. Indeed, nothing may come of all the speculation, should LeBron and his fellow stars decide to re-sign with their current teams, as they very well may do.

"I find it sort of strange,'' said Henry Thomas, agent to potential 2010 free agents Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh. "The reality is it's two years away. I don't know why there's so much talk about it.''

It's because this is the NBA's Next Big Thing. The previous Next Big Things were the impending divorce of Shaquille O'Neal and Kobe Bryant (which was realized), followed by the imminent departure of Kevin Garnett from Minnesota, which was anticipated for two excruciating years (and which happened), which begot the issue of Kobe's on-and-off desires to leave the Lakers (which is now off). That leaves us looking past the next two seasons to a summer of free-agent movement that may never come to be.

Adding relevance to the conjecture is the possibility of LeBron's moving to New York, enabling the NBA to seize its biggest market and instigating an N.Y.-L.A. rivalry of LeBron vs. Kobe that could dwarf the Celtics-Lakers wars of the 1980s.


http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/w ... index.html



2010 NBA Free Agents

http://www.sportscity.com/nba/2010-nba-free-agents
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Re: OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#2 » by aboubata » Sat Nov 22, 2008 2:11 am

Why would any of these guys want to sign with any BAD team.Cleveland and toronto are and will be better than NY.
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Re: OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#3 » by mrautobahn » Sat Nov 22, 2008 2:19 am

I think you are completely missing the point here... LB wants to go to a big market... where he can get "Tiger Wood" money in endorsement deals...

Quite frankly, I wouldn't be surprised he gets a long term deal between 15-20 mil per year and make much more in endorsements...

And if he brings back a championship... the sky is the limit... and we will see his picture in the next Forbes billionaire list...
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Re: OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#4 » by canman1971 » Sat Nov 22, 2008 2:23 am

IMO, it is so moronic to even talk about 2010. 2 years. A lot can happen in two years.
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Re: OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#5 » by BakersDozen » Sat Nov 22, 2008 2:42 am

im hoping they all re sign with their respective teams.... unless of course they want to come here.
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Re: OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#6 » by campybatman » Sat Nov 22, 2008 3:08 am

mrautobahn wrote:I think you are completely missing the point here... LB wants to go to a big market... where he can get "Tiger Wood" money in endorsement deals...



That statement (or rather your opinion) is as much overrated as the word overrated used in the thread's title. Talk about restating what's implied or presumed by the national media. Because I've never read or listen to James proclaim that New York or a major market is his desired team to be as oppose to remaining with Cleveland.

Below is a good read if anyone cares... Bill Livingston makes a good point. While this poster I've quoted, is in fact the one who has "missed the point."



Big news: LeBron James likes N.Y., (Cleveland, L.A., Florida and Jupiter, too!)

Except James has a pattern of pledging his allegiance to various teams and various places --- at various times.

He convinced a Sports Illustrated reporter that he was an Ohio State fan in early 2003. James and his Akron high school teammates were playing on ESPN the night after the collegiate football championship game. The story depicted an ebullient James in his Los Angeles hotel room, celebrating the Buckeyes' double-overtime victory.

Or was he made happier than anything by the loss of the Miami Hurricanes in the game?

By Olympic training camp in Jacksonville, Fla., in 2004, James was presenting himself as a fan of Florida State. "I've always been a Seminole," he said, despite going directly from high school in Akron to the NBA.

Over the years, he has said how fond he is of Southern Cal (when in Los Angeles), of Oregon (when in Portland), of North Carolina (in Charlotte), and of Michigan State (in Detroit.) If he had had to go to college, he would have needed a closet full of freshman beanies.

When young, he followed the pro teams that were powers in the 1990s -- the Dallas Cowboys, Chicago Bulls and the Yankees. The Yankees seem to be the only one that has stuck, at least in ballcap controversies. Even at that, cameras caught him in an Indians cap when the 2008 Olympic team gathered for early meetings recently.

What is important is that James' favorite team really is the Cavs. He likes his teammates and coach and is well-liked by them. He wants his supporting cast to get better. Considering how much he has done for the team and city, he is entitled to say that.

Certainly when he was younger, James told people what they wanted to hear. He has not entirely gotten over that inclination.

His comments about various cities also might be nothing more than a way of attracting the spotlight in times when the news is slow. But they seem to indicate a tug of war between the crossover appeal of the acting and music opportunities in New York and the ties of family and friends he has to Northeast Ohio.


http://blog.cleveland.com/sports/2008/0 ... es_ny.html
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Re: OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#7 » by Celtics_Champs » Sat Nov 22, 2008 2:18 pm

Ugh, it is the most over-talked about thing. I mean GM's should always keep an eye out, but I don't see the need for ESPN to bring it up over and over again.
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Re: OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#8 » by Red2 » Sat Nov 22, 2008 2:40 pm

regardless of whether lebron goes to the knicks or not they made a great move in trading those guys. they were going nowhere and they knew it. They will get a few more high draft picks and then go after lebron, carmelo, bosh and wade and see who they can land. Their guard situation is a mess since they're not playing marbury but even without the cap space I like the trades for them . all of the players they got can play in an uptempo style like D'Antoni so these moves might even help them in the short term. if you're a knicks fan you have to like these moves. and frankly having a strong team in New York is good for the nba just like having a strong team inboston and LA. LeBron will go to the knicks because it's the biggest market in the world and he can make the most money there. As for us if I were danny I'd be targeting dwayne wade to replace ray allen in 2 years.
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Post#9 » by cfan79 » Sat Nov 22, 2008 3:14 pm

aboubata wrote:Why would any of these guys want to sign with any BAD team.Cleveland and toronto are and will be better than NY.


New York won't be a bad team if they sign Lebron and Bosh/Dwade. We can't underestimate their chances of getting vastly better. Danny has to keep an eye on the Knicks in 2 years. Because they are such a big market Lebron will want to go there and others will follow for cheap money. Much like they did for the Celtics. They'll be able to get veterans for peanuts if they have Lebron and Bosh.
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Re: OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#10 » by Celtsfan1980 » Sat Nov 22, 2008 4:33 pm

It depends. The Knicks got lucky that another team wanted Zach Randolph, so that means they'll have all kinds of money to spend. If Lebron signs for $15 million the first year with big raises afterwards, they should be able to afford another good free agent. It really only effects the first year. That is when they have to be under. The Knicks have rich ownership, so they'd likely be willing to go into the $100 million range if Lebron wants the salary that I think he'd ask for.
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Re: OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#11 » by ParticleMan » Sat Nov 22, 2008 4:56 pm

I think it's pretty overrated. There's always big talk about FA classes a couple of years ahead of time, and then when the time actually comes, most of them have re-signed or been traded before being re-signed.

Do you really think that if Cleveland knows LBJ is going to leave, or even THINKS they will leave, they aren't going to trade him midseason and get some amazing package in return? Why hold a losing hand to the bitter end when they can get something awesome in return?

That's why Ainge's strategy is MUCH better. Stockpile quality youth, picks, and some big expiring contracts. Then you can trade for Bosh, Wade, LBJ, etc, whoever happens to be available. Of course you still, have to re-sign them, but the fact is the team that owns the player can offer more years and money than anyone. And in the NBA, money talks. And presumably you wouldn't trade for someone without assurances of a new contract.

I'd happily bring in any of those guys and pay them the max. But my feeling is that all of them will either be re-signed by their home teams or traded before they hit the FA market. History shows that to be the case. So the idea is not to have capspace to sign those guys, but rather to have the necessary trade bait. Capspace is the most overrated quantity in the CBA era, all it gets you is the chance to sign the Larry Hugheses of the world.
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Re: OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#12 » by campybatman » Sat Nov 22, 2008 10:09 pm

A comment was made on that site after the article (Bill Livingston's article) by someone who made a valid point. LeBron could possibly earn more in outside endorsements that the decision between remaining with Cleveland or going to play for New York isn't as obviously clear cut.

As American TV viewers saw during this year's Olympics, Kobe's immensely popular among Chinese NBA fans. Probably, more so than he's in his own country where the divide of NBA fans who like and those who dislike him is more plausible. So, when the writer writes, "...LeBron must be universally loved." I believe he means internationally speaking. Because the problem you had with Shaquille O'Neal then and you've with players such as Kobe and LeBron now are that they're disliked as much as they aren't in their own backyard. Enough to where it has been hard to duplicate another Michael Jordan as far as his mass appeal on and off the court to both white and black and other consumers.



If the Cavs assemble the makings of a championship team around James, then how can he explain a decision to leave? Cleveland is, as he reminds us constantly, his hometown (he is from nearby Akron). It is not going to reflect well on LeBron if he were to abandon his valued home in order to go for the glitz of New York.

The Knicks would need to create a highly talented roster around him, in which case LeBron could make the criticism vanish by winning, much as Shaq made everyone forget the nastiness of his departure from Orlando by earning three titles in L.A. There is no doubt that winning multiple rings in New York (which won the last of its two championships in 1973) would be a bigger achievement than if he won on any other platform.

But it would also be a heartwarming story if he were to maintain loyalty to his hometown while turning the small-market Cavs into the capital of the basketball world. It would, as marketing people like to say, brand him as no other star has ever been branded, because it would give his mission the appearance of being about something more important than money. It would be a story of investing himself in his hometown.

To become the equal to (or eclipse) Jordan, LeBron must be universally loved. People would love him for staying in Cleveland.

Plus, there are billions of people in China who won't view LeBron any differently whether he's in New York or Cleveland. Most of his potential consumers around the world won't know the difference. They'll want to buy his jersey and shoes regardless of the colors.


http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/w ... index.html
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Re: OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#13 » by GuyClinch » Sun Nov 23, 2008 12:02 am

I'd be surprised if Lebron doesn't go to NY. Come on Cleveland's nickname is the mistake by the lake.. Shaq moved to the Lakers. Lebron will probably move to NY. Most people want to upgrade their lives - if your loaded NYC is actually a nice place to live.

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Re: OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#14 » by campybatman » Sun Nov 23, 2008 6:34 pm

Isn't Stern a Knicks fan, he was born in New York. He's probably hoping that LeBron goes to New York. And the NBA league office is located in New York.
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Re: OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#15 » by magnumt » Sun Nov 23, 2008 7:01 pm

2010 is a big Year, but people are also forgetting that 2011 can also be a big Year with guys like Chris Paul or Dwight Howard that could potentially come into play.
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Re: OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#16 » by Hendrix » Sun Nov 23, 2008 7:09 pm

mrautobahn wrote:I think you are completely missing the point here... LB wants to go to a big market... where he can get "Tiger Wood" money in endorsement deals...

Quite frankly, I wouldn't be surprised he gets a long term deal between 15-20 mil per year and make much more in endorsements...

And if he brings back a championship... the sky is the limit... and we will see his picture in the next Forbes billionaire list...



He's already all over TV, Magazines, etc.. and has worldwide endorsments. How much more could he get?.

But someone said why would they want to go to a bad team. It's a long ways away, but I odn't think you can say they will be going to a bad team. NY has a high draft pick, who could turn into a solid player. Then LBJ, and Bosh.... Pretty much just do what Boston did, get the big 3, then worry about the rest of the roster later. They'de probably have enough peices in Curry's expiring, and Lee to get some decent complimentary players.
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Re: OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#17 » by magnumt » Sun Nov 23, 2008 7:33 pm

Hendrix wrote:
mrautobahn wrote:I think you are completely missing the point here... LB wants to go to a big market... where he can get "Tiger Wood" money in endorsement deals...

Quite frankly, I wouldn't be surprised he gets a long term deal between 15-20 mil per year and make much more in endorsements...

And if he brings back a championship... the sky is the limit... and we will see his picture in the next Forbes billionaire list...



He's already all over TV, Magazines, etc.. and has worldwide endorsments. How much more could he get?.

But someone said why would they want to go to a bad team. It's a long ways away, but I odn't think you can say they will be going to a bad team. NY has a high draft pick, who could turn into a solid player. Then LBJ, and Bosh.... Pretty much just do what Boston did, get the big 3, then worry about the rest of the roster later. They'de probably have enough peices in Curry's expiring, and Lee to get some decent complimentary players.


Well he is close friends with Buffet, so who knows. :wink: :lol:

Anyway, you pretty much nailed it. Even if one of the big markets don't get Lebron in 2010, they still have the options to get another VERY good Free Agent due to the depth that Free Agency Class (and the Year after too in 2011), will have.
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PF: Kevin Love (36) / Frye (12) / Ellenson
C: Pau Gasol (32) / Noah (16) / Felicio


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Re: OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#18 » by campybatman » Sun Nov 23, 2008 9:31 pm

magnumt wrote:2010 is a big Year, but people are also forgetting that 2011 can also be a big Year with guys like Chris Paul or Dwight Howard that could potentially come into play.



Howard's player option isn't until 2012-2013.
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Re: OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#19 » by MyInsatiableOne » Mon Nov 24, 2008 5:11 pm

canman1971 wrote:IMO, it is so moronic to even talk about 2010. 2 years. A lot can happen in two years.


Agreed. And the thing is, why would LeBron necessarily want to go to NY? The team overall still stinks...he can't do it alone in CLE, why would he be able to in NY? Unless he's more about making $$ and branding himself globally over winning, which actually seems to be the case...
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Re: OT: Is talk of 2010 FAs overrated? LJ edition 

Post#20 » by sully00 » Mon Nov 24, 2008 7:10 pm

The belief is the Knicks will be in a position to sign both Lebron and Bosh. That said the real leap of faith in all of this is that either of these two guys would be willing to again give up guaranteed years and money to do this. The whole point in signing the deals they did was that this would be the best possible time to sign a 6 year extension. They will have to not only take less money per season to go FA as well as losing that 6th year we are talking about leaving 30 million on the table between annual avg salalry and the 6th year that is a lot for even Nike to make up. But beyond all of that the economic crunch that has hit the whole friggin world is likely to materialize in the NBA right now the actual max salary is cruising way above what the CBA mandates which is 11 million bucks for a player with less than 10 years in the league. So if times remain tough there is no way these guys opt of 17 mil dollar options to go FA, especially if they can maintain salary levels with an extension.

While teams in a bad situation, may elect to move even a top 5 star, in an attempt to rebuild, I don't think that CLE will trade James in 2 years. There is just no way to replace what he means to that franchise, if he leaves so be it but they can't help him go.

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