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I am proud of the improvements Perkins has made this year. He is doing better at rebounding, blocking shots, and even scoring.

Perkins ranks # 28 in the league in rebounding at 8.1 per game. Of all the top 30 rebounders in the league, only one player averages less minutes that Perkins (Dalember at 26.0 minutes). Perkins is only playing 27.5 minutes per game. So if Perkins played about 34 minutes per game, he would probably crack the top 10-15 in rebounding.

It's great to see Perkins and Rondo improve. I hope they can keep it up and get better.

Yeah he is really turning into a bigger Ben Wallace, another year or two and he could be in the running for defensive player of the year.

He's 18th in rebound-rate. 10th among centers, so he's slightly above average.

hiphop1 wrote:Yeah he is really turning into a bigger Ben Wallace, another year or two and he could be in the running for defensive player of the year.

I notice this too, except he has an offensive game where as Big Ben has none.

Ben was, and maybe still is, much more athletic than Perkins.

The way Perkins gets his rebounds is extremely impressive though, especially on the offensive end. He times it perfectly and gets his long arms above a crowd of 2 or 3 guys without een jumping sometimes .

He is nothing like Ben Wallace. Wallace was an undersized athlete - who was a demon on the boards but had no offensive game. Perkins is a well rounded NBA center sized player who is average on the boards (as was pointed out on this thread). He can hit a jumper and back a guy in for a low post score.

This is such a random comparison. Wallace and Perkins. Why not compare Perkins with Chris Kaman? It's a more intelligent comparison by the numbers.

Perk is a poor man's Tim Duncan.

I always got a Tree Rollins vibe from Perkins. Of course, Tree was taller and blocked more shots, at least early going. Perkules will be a better overall scorer, passer and rebounder. I am certain, provided decent health, that after all is said and done, Perkins will have had the better career.

In Perk's first couple of seasons, his per-48 rebounding numbers were at the top of the league. So were Chris Mihm's, so it's a limited statistic - but it's important to remember that the context in which a player gets his numbers matters. Perk and Garnett could both average more boards per night if they wanted to.

Perk reminds me of a less athletic Alonzo Mourning - bull strong, tough, under 7', not a fluid or natural offensive player but a solid one, and tough on defense - but a bit slower in speed and reaction times than Mourning was.

The kid is good and still getting better. He is still just and above avergae rebounder.

Perk's numbers are also hurt a bit by having three players in the starting lineup who are very good rebounders for their position in KG, Paul, and Rondo. Over his career, KG's consistently been a top five rebounder in the league.

As for the comparisons being given to him so far, I'd call him a poor man's, less athletic Emeka Okafor at this point. A strong, slightly undersized center with a long wingspan and a good defensive anchor on defense (neither are earth shattering on that end, but both are solid anchors). Offensively, both are challenged, both have tried to form some post moves and neither can do anything spectacular consistently. Emeka probably has the biggest edge on offense, due to being more athletic.

GuyClinch wrote:Perkins is a well rounded NBA center sized player who is average on the boards (as was pointed out on this thread).

Actually, I think it's pretty well established in this thread that he's better than average, at least statistically. The only real disagreement so far has been on how much better than average. If as was estimated earlier he's statistically 18th overall and 10th among centers for rebounding, then I would argue that actually puts him pretty significantly above average, although not necessarily elite. Consider that, assuming one starter per position, there are 60 starting big men in the league. 18th in rebounding out of those 60 looks pretty good to me. And those are the ones who are good enough to start. Perkins is hanging with Garnett on the glass, and Garnett has long been considered one of the best rebounders in the NBA, so I have to consider Perkins above average at the very least.

The team as a whole does a stifling job on the defensive boards. In fact, we seem to be doing a better job rebounding on both ends of the floor this year than we did last year.

Consider that, assuming one starter per position, there are 60 starting big men in the league. 18th in rebounding out of those 60 looks pretty good to me.

He is up there alright but I'd consider the mark of a great rebounder a 20% rebound rate. Guys like Ben Wallace hovered around that in their heyday. Any serious discussion of rebounding needs to be built around rebound rate..and we should consider career numbers as well I think.

Perkins total career rebound rate 16.1%. That's good but not great in the world of NBA bigs.

SonicYouth34 wrote:

hiphop1 wrote:Yeah he is really turning into a bigger Ben Wallace, another year or two and he could be in the running for defensive player of the year.

I notice this too, except he has an offensive game where as Big Ben has none.

I still find myself screaming the same things at Perk I did 2 years ago, and Tommy points them out, too, so I know I'm not crazy...he still has some HORRID habits on offense. Like going down and dribbling when he gets a pass at the letters, getting himself UNDER the hoop before he goes up (really, he has a poor time knowing where the basket is), and he rarely throws up fakes...he did once last night and it worked out well for him. Also, as soon as he dribbles under the hoop after receiving said pass, he always either gets stripped, blocked, or loses it out of bounds. And he refuses to try and put it off the glass, rather he always goes for the dunk which usually either gets blocked or doesn't go in, forcing him into 2 FTs (and we saw how well that worked out last night...)...

I know it seems like I pick on the guy, but NONE of these things have improved as markedly as you'd expect after 2+ seasons!!

MyInsatiableOne wrote:

SonicYouth34 wrote:

hiphop1 wrote:Yeah he is really turning into a bigger Ben Wallace, another year or two and he could be in the running for defensive player of the year.

I notice this too, except he has an offensive game where as Big Ben has none.

I still find myself screaming the same things at Perk I did 2 years ago, and Tommy points them out, too, so I know I'm not crazy...he still has some HORRID habits on offense. Like going down and dribbling when he gets a pass at the letters, getting himself UNDER the hoop before he goes up (really, he has a poor time knowing where the basket is), and he rarely throws up fakes...he did once last night and it worked out well for him. Also, as soon as he dribbles under the hoop after receiving said pass, he always either gets stripped, blocked, or loses it out of bounds. And he refuses to try and put it off the glass, rather he always goes for the dunk which usually either gets blocked or doesn't go in, forcing him into 2 FTs (and we saw how well that worked out last night...)...

I know it seems like I pick on the guy, but NONE of these things have improved as markedly as you'd expect after 2+ seasons!!

As usual you are way over the top in your critisicm's of Perk, ALWAYS gets stripped, ALWAYS brings the ball down, ALWAYS tries to dunk, NO improvement, etc. Perk's offense has come a long way, he still scores at a better than 50% rate, he HAS improved his game year to year, and is still 23 (24?). Not everyone on the team can be an all-star, but he is till the starting center on a team that is the defending champ and has the best start to the season of ANY Celtic's team, is on the best streak since 86, and pretty much **** rocks. What is your agenda against Perk? I just don't get how some people can't see what he brings to the floor over all, he is a damned good defensive enforcer and rebounder who seldom steps outside his role and converts better than 50% of his attempts. If we could have Yao instead that'd be nice, but considering our cap situation, the team's success, and Perk's production vs. cost, well, Perk is the man. Hate on him all you want, he'll be starting in this league a long time and deservedly so.

Bleeding Green wrote:He's 18th in rebound-rate. 10th among centers, so he's slightly above average.

Well, there are 60 starting Centers and PF's combined, so 18th in league rebound rate is well above average if you assume that 95% of the top 60 will be comprised of C/PF starters...if a couple of backup bigs make the list, he's even more accomplished...10th amongst centers puts him in the top 3rd, so that is definitely better than slightly above average - it may only be 5 players away from average, but with only 30 starters, the relative gap is more profound..

None of this takes into account the other players on Perkins' team...Boston has above average rebounders by position at ever starting spot accept SG - AND the team shoots extremely well and plays at a very slow pace, so the available rebounds are less and the pace of the game - even if adjusted for - doesn't create the type of rebounding atmosphere a faster paced game does...