Lebron a better passer than Larry???!!!!

Bruiser · Post #1 » by **Bruiser** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 9:35 am

Hey yo!

Check this out:
http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/9074 ... excellence

I agree with Rosen most of the times but this seems to me to be plain WRONG.

When I consider a passer I think of two skills: efficiency and the "Wow! factor".

It's obvious that James is a great passer but I can't recall any pass that would make me think: "Wow!"

Larry is in my opinion the best passer ever in the game, an inch above Magic and a yard above Stockton, and LeBron, even if he is a great passer, is way way behind Larry.

In fact I think LeBron is not even the best passer nowadays because he is behind Nash, Kidd and Manu.

Any thoughts? Kind regards.

MaxwellSmart · Post #2 » by **MaxwellSmart** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 10:38 am

Bird=Best passing forward EVER!!

Joekickass2008 · Post #3 » by **Joekickass2008** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 11:19 am

Lebron is amazing....no doubt. But he gotta do a whole lot more to even be compared to Larry in any dept yet (sept maybe rich musical mates and style).

No MVP, No Chip.....get them and its a start. A heap of really amazing players have crashed and burned for some reason early in there carrer.....e.g. Grant Hill

vct33 · Post #4 » by **vct33** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 12:09 pm

They should both be 10's in passing. Bird was one of the greatest passers ever and LeBron is every bit as good. I agree with Rosen's scores in most other categories. However, he is selling LeBron short on Man-to-Man Defense by giving him a 7. He is probably the best on the ball defender in the league right now. Also, I know it's nit-picky, but a 9 for finishing? Who finishes better than LeBron?

That Nicka · Post #5 » by **That Nicka** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 1:16 pm

lebron is not a better passer than bird

Bruiser · Post #6 » by **Bruiser** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 1:32 pm

I agree LeBron is clearly the best physical specimen to ever play the game by far. He is superior to Jordan, Shaq, Kemp just to name a few. I must admit I didn't watch Russ, Wilt or Big O.

But skillwise I can't think a better overall player than Larry. In his prime he was an elite shooter, rebounder, passer and defender. He was clearly the total package. But most of all, he was a winner and all-brains!!!

James is a great player, better than Larry in some aspects but clearly worse as shooter, passer, defender and rebounder.

Who's better? It is up to you.
For me, it's crystal clear. This is basketball not track and fields....

Post #7 » by **canman1971** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 1:39 pm

LeBron is not even in the same school as Larry as a passer, never mind the same class.

Dave_From_NB · Post #8 » by **Dave_From_NB** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 2:05 pm

Its a bizarre comparison at this point. If my math is correct, Lebron is currently the same age as Bird was in his second season in the league. The comparison needs to be, is Lebron a better passer than Bird was in his early years in the league.

Lebron is going to get better. Remember his improvement in defense from last year to this one? Scary. Redo the comparison in 4 years when Lebron is in his prime.

PPAW4Life · Post #9 » by **PPAW4Life** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 3:52 pm

Bird's passes are "wow" because you don't expect a Power Forward to make those passes that a guard might have trouble making.

Lebron's passes are right on the money and doesn't need to be "wow". Afterall, Lebron is passing to Anderson Varejoaue not Robert Parrish. (Ben Wallace and not Kevin McHale)

Bruiser · Post #10 » by **Bruiser** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 4:39 pm

PPAW4Life wrote:Bird's passes are "wow" because you don't expect a Power Forward to make those passes that a guard might have trouble making.

Lebron's passes are right on the money and doesn't need to be "wow". Afterall, Lebron is passing to Anderson Varejoaue not Robert Parrish. (Ben Wallace and not Kevin McHale)

Check this out:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o0PfO5lD ... F&index=33

Bird's passes are "Wow" because they are unbelievable.

Fencer reregistered · Post #11 » by **Fencer reregistered** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 8:41 pm

The most amazing thing about that video is that it contained three separate plays in which McHale made a pass.

chakdaddy · Post #12 » by **chakdaddy** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 9:00 pm

That is a very, very, strange and flawed scoring system they have, in that it includes physical attributes like strength, speed, quickness, and elevation, AS WELL AS the in-game skills that those attributes contribute to, such as fgs, defense, and finishing.

In essence the athletic qualities get counted twice - for instance, they have the same score for finishing, but LeBron essentially gets a bonus because he achieves the same efficiency in finishing but does it with more elevation, speed, and strength.

Overall they come to the conclusion that with regard to basketball skill and competence, Bird is better, but because LeBron achieves his level of competence with more athleticism, that somehow boosts him into a tie!

Post #13 » by **ParticleMan** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 9:08 pm

LMAO. There's no way Lebron is abetter passer than Bird. Rosen is just getting senile, he doesn't remember watching Larry play. I've never thought of Bron as a great passer anyways. How he could be better than Bird is beyond me. LBJ is WAY more athletic than Bird, though, so he doesn't need to be as good a passer because he can just about ALWAYS get his shot up. Lebron may be the best player in the league right now, but he's not in LB's class. LB and Magic, and later Hakeem, were so much better than everyone back then it's hard to even compare. I think Rosen underrates Bird in a lot of categories, actually. Most importantly, WINNING.

Post #14 » by **UGA Hayes** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 10:50 pm

Anyone have a statistical comparison? I'm not sure why everyone is acting like its that craziest suggestion in the world. LeBron is clearly the best passing SF in the NBA today, so why not do a comparison to see if he holds up to Larry.

Post #15 » by **canman1971** » Sun Jan 18, 2009 1:53 am

UGA Hayes wrote:Anyone have a statistical comparison? I'm not sure why everyone is acting like its that craziest suggestion in the world. LeBron is clearly the best passing SF in the NBA today, so why not do a comparison to see if he holds up to Larry.

I don't need stats. I have seen them both play. James is not even close. End of story.

Wade3Iverson · Post #16 » by **Wade3Iverson** » Sun Jan 18, 2009 3:48 am

I would give James the edge in passing, by a hair

His ability to penetrate (combined with his physical ability) put him in positions to be a (slightly) more effective passer.

Cyclical · Post #17 » by **Cyclical** » Sun Jan 18, 2009 6:37 am

Wade3Iverson wrote:I would give James the edge in passing, by a hair

His ability to penetrate (combined with his physical ability) put him in positions to be a (slightly) more effective passer.

No offense but it's most likely an age thing. Anyone who's old enough to actually waych games in the 80's should understand how incredible Larry's passing was. It's was what made him so incredible special. DOn't get me wrong - when it's all said and done I thing Bron is going to be considered the better player and the greatest SF ever but Larry's passing? Better.

Cyclical · Post #18 » by **Cyclical** » Sun Jan 18, 2009 6:55 am

Cyclical wrote:
Wade3Iverson wrote:I would give James the edge in passing, by a hair

His ability to penetrate (combined with his physical ability) put him in positions to be a (slightly) more effective passer.

No offense but it's most likely an age thing. Almost anyone who's old enough to have actually watched games in the 80's should understand how incredible Larry's passing was. It's was what made him so incredible special. Don't get me wrong - when it's all said and done I thing Bron is going to be considered the better player and the greatest SF ever but Larry's passing? Better.

bballcool34 · Post #19 » by **bballcool34** » Mon Jan 19, 2009 5:41 am

There are certain comparisons in which if you've seen both players play, you know the answer to.

One of them was on the PC board recently with Webber vs. Garnett and their respective passing abilities- having seen a lot of them both, I'm sure that Webber is the better pass- despite the stats.

The same thing applies with Bird and Lebron. The degree of difficulty, the regularity in which Bird executed these passes, and the wow factor in the passes far surpass any of Lebron's passes. Pretty sure Bird never handled the ball as much as Lebron tends to either (since he wasn't nearly as athletic or a slasher) so that could have an effect on their assists.

Mahoney_jr · Post #20 » by **Mahoney_jr** » Mon Jan 19, 2009 11:50 am

After all is said and one James will surpass Larry as the best SF ever. But Bird had a better passing game hands down. Court awareness and passing skill can't be matched by LeBron, as good as he is.