Woj/Shams: Celtics Trade Avery Bradley + 2019 2nd to Pistons for Marcus Morris

[Rapcity_11]

Ha Boston. Terrible trade

How is that a terrible trade? Bradley is an overrated defender and they couldn’t afford him next summer. They picked up a rotation player making like $5M for 2 seasons.

Bradley is not an overrated defender, not to mention he averaged more points on higher efficiency, better rebounding, & nearly identical everything else. Not to mention a lineup of Bradley/Hayward/Crowder is a lot more promising than Hayward/Crowder/Morris.

I just don't get what Morris accomplished other than saving money. & they gave up a pick?!

There's literally zero metrics that support Bradley as an elite defender.

Saving money is incredibly important. They can now actually sign Hayward AND don’t have to pay Bradley next year.

Can't be short-sighted and just look at next year.

[Local_NG_Idiot]

He’s great on the ball, but he’s limited to PG’s and small 2’s. Pretty much anyone can shoot over him. He can’t switch on to bigger players and isn’t that great a team defender.

Smart actually is a better defender against the bigger 2s and small 3s than Bradley with his combination of upper body strength and quick hands, but to think he can step in and do the job on the speedy 1s and quick and crafty 2s of the league the way Bradley did to hide IT isn't going to work nearly as well. Throw in the shooting gap between the two players and it becomes quite obvious who is the better fit on that Celtics roster with Hayward on board.

Smart does a great job on PG’s not sure what you’re talking about. He might be the hardest player to screen in the entire league.

His defensive stats in guarding opposing PGs aren't anything to write home about. A little better than league average, but not at the level of defense you saw out of him when he guarded bigger 2s and small 3s. That is where his defense really makes an impact for the Celts, and with sooooo much redundancy at those positions now, I doubt you see Smart see any time at the SF position next season unless the Celts make some more moves that involve trading away a bunch of the forwards they currently have.

Better fit for one year? Sure. But you gotta look further than that.

Psst: Smart's an RFA next summer so they'll have to pay either way. So if the argument is one of those 2 (Bradley / Smart) are in the long term plans of the Celts, which is better Smart@15+ per season or Bradley @20+ per season?

[Rapcity_11]

Smart actually is a better defender against the bigger 2s and small 3s than Bradley with his combination of upper body strength and quick hands, but to think he can step in and do the job on the speedy 1s and quick and crafty 2s of the league the way Bradley did to hide IT isn't going to work nearly as well. Throw in the shooting gap between the two players and it becomes quite obvious who is the better fit on that Celtics roster with Hayward on board.

Smart does a great job on PG’s not sure what you’re talking about. He might be the hardest player to screen in the entire league.

His defensive stats in guarding opposing PGs aren't anything to write home about. A little better than league average, but not at the level of defense you saw out of him when he guarded bigger 2s and small 3s. That is where his defense really makes an impact for the Celts, and with sooooo much redundancy at those positions now, I doubt you see Smart see any time at the SF position next season unless the Celts make some more moves that involve trading away a bunch of the forwards they currently have.

Better fit for one year? Sure. But you gotta look further than that.

Psst: Smart's an RFA next summer so they'll have to pay either way. So if the argument is one of those 2 (Bradley / Smart) are in the long term plans of the Celts, which is better Smart@15+ per season or Bradley @20+ per season?

How do they compare with Bradley's stats guarding PG's?

Smart can still have that impact by switching onto bigger guys.

You really think Smart is getting $15M+. I don't see it. Bet he comes much, much cheaper than Bradley.

[YogurtProducer]

How is that a terrible trade? Bradley is an overrated defender and they couldn’t afford him next summer. They picked up a rotation player making like $5M for 2 seasons.

Bradley is not an overrated defender, not to mention he averaged more points on higher efficiency, better rebounding, & nearly identical everything else. Not to mention a lineup of Bradley/Hayward/Crowder is a lot more promising than Hayward/Crowder/Morris.

I just don't get what Morris accomplished other than saving money. & they gave up a pick?!

There's literally zero metrics that support Bradley as an elite defender.

Saving money is incredibly important. They can now actually sign Hayward AND don’t have to pay Bradley next year.

Can't be short-sighted and just look at next year.

But then they'll just have to pay Morris two years from now?

There is zero metrics that suggest Morris is a better defender than Bradley as well. I'm not a fan of saying this, but just watch the two play. It's night and day who is the superior defender. Also, a superior 3 point shooter. In a lineup of Hayward IT and Horford what do you want at 2 and 4? 3 point shooting and defense. Welcome Bradley and Crowder. Now what? Morris and Crowder at the 3/4? Just seems backwards imo

[bape_lovers]

complete OT but this funny from DET board

We fu**ed their green asses. Whoa.

[Rapcity_11]

Bradley is not an overrated defender, not to mention he averaged more points on higher efficiency, better rebounding, & nearly identical everything else. Not to mention a lineup of Bradley/Hayward/Crowder is a lot more promising than Hayward/Crowder/Morris.

I just don't get what Morris accomplished other than saving money. & they gave up a pick?!

There's literally zero metrics that support Bradley as an elite defender.

Saving money is incredibly important. They can now actually sign Hayward AND don’t have to pay Bradley next year.

Can't be short-sighted and just look at next year.

But then they'll just have to pay Morris two years from now?

There is zero metrics that suggest Morris is a better defender than Bradley as well. I'm not a fan of saying this, but just watch the two play. It's night and day who is the superior defender. Also, a superior 3 point shooter. In a lineup of Hayward IT and Horford what do you want at 2 and 4? 3 point shooting and defense. Welcome Bradley and Crowder. Now what? Morris and Crowder at the 3/4? Just seems backwards imo

Morris isn’t really a guy who’s going to command a big salary. It doesn’t matter anyway since Boston acquired him to be a cheap rotation guy for 2 years, not to be a long term piece.

If Bradley was this elite defender he’s claimed to be, it would show up somwhere. It does for everyone else. I watch Bradley plenty. He can’t switch onto bigger players. Everybody shoots over him. He gets backed down easily. He’s an average at best team defender. He doesn’t generate a lot of blocks and steals. People always overrate the crap out of players who get into guys defensively and move their feet.

IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford…what’s the issue again?

[Local_NG_Idiot]

Smart does a great job on PG’s not sure what you’re talking about. He might be the hardest player to screen in the entire league.

His defensive stats in guarding opposing PGs aren't anything to write home about. A little better than league average, but not at the level of defense you saw out of him when he guarded bigger 2s and small 3s. That is where his defense really makes an impact for the Celts, and with sooooo much redundancy at those positions now, I doubt you see Smart see any time at the SF position next season unless the Celts make some more moves that involve trading away a bunch of the forwards they currently have.

Better fit for one year? Sure. But you gotta look further than that.

Psst: Smart's an RFA next summer so they'll have to pay either way. So if the argument is one of those 2 (Bradley / Smart) are in the long term plans of the Celts, which is better Smart@15+ per season or Bradley @20+ per season?

How do they compare with Bradley's stats guarding PG's?

Smart can still have that impact by switching onto bigger guys.

You really think Smart is getting $15M+. I don't see it. Bet he comes much, much cheaper than Bradley.

For this season coming off of an injury plagued season? He was average at best. Come playoff time though, who did Stevens primarily use to defend Irving?....it was Bradley and the sole reason is because he is a better defender against smaller speedy guards and he is better at containing and directing those speedy guards into ICE on screen rolls.

15mil / season on a 115mil projected cap is 9-10mil on the old 70-80 cap. So yea, don't be surprised to see Smart get 15 especially when you go and look at the PG/SG 2018 RFAs.

[YogurtProducer]

There's literally zero metrics that support Bradley as an elite defender.

Saving money is incredibly important. They can now actually sign Hayward AND don’t have to pay Bradley next year.

Can't be short-sighted and just look at next year.

But then they'll just have to pay Morris two years from now?

There is zero metrics that suggest Morris is a better defender than Bradley as well. I'm not a fan of saying this, but just watch the two play. It's night and day who is the superior defender. Also, a superior 3 point shooter. In a lineup of Hayward IT and Horford what do you want at 2 and 4? 3 point shooting and defense. Welcome Bradley and Crowder. Now what? Morris and Crowder at the 3/4? Just seems backwards imo

Morris isn’t really a guy who’s going to command a big salary. It doesn’t matter anyway since Boston acquired him to be a cheap rotation guy for 2 years, not to be a long term piece.

If Bradley was this elite defender he’s claimed to be, it would show up somwhere. It does for everyone else. I watch Bradley plenty. He can’t switch onto bigger players. Everybody shoots over him. He gets backed down easily. He’s an average at best team defender. He doesn’t generate a lot of blocks and steals. People always overrate the crap out of players who get into guys defensively and move their feet.

IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford…what’s the issue again?

Smart is an atrocious offensive player. The gap between him and Bradley is huge

[Rapcity_11]

His defensive stats in guarding opposing PGs aren't anything to write home about. A little better than league average, but not at the level of defense you saw out of him when he guarded bigger 2s and small 3s. That is where his defense really makes an impact for the Celts, and with sooooo much redundancy at those positions now, I doubt you see Smart see any time at the SF position next season unless the Celts make some more moves that involve trading away a bunch of the forwards they currently have.



Psst: Smart's an RFA next summer so they'll have to pay either way. So if the argument is one of those 2 (Bradley / Smart) are in the long term plans of the Celts, which is better Smart@15+ per season or Bradley @20+ per season?

How do they compare with Bradley's stats guarding PG's?

Smart can still have that impact by switching onto bigger guys.

You really think Smart is getting $15M+. I don't see it. Bet he comes much, much cheaper than Bradley.

For this season coming off of an injury plagued season? He was average at best. Come playoff time though, who did Stevens primarily use to defend Irving?....it was Bradley and the sole reason is because he is a better defender against smaller speedy guards and he is better at containing and directing those speedy guards into ICE on screen rolls.

15mil / season on a 115mil projected cap is 9-10mil on the old 70-80 cap. So yea, don't be surprised to see Smart get 15 especially when you go and look at the PG/SG 2018 RFAs.

It’s cuts both ways. Bradley takes those guys because he can’t defend bigger players. Guys who can switch and defend multiple positions are far more valuable these days than 1 or 2 position defenders.

I don’t see it. We’ve seen a lot more conservative deals this off-season (other than Hardaway…lol). And money is going to be even tighter next year. And teams will know that Boston will probably match anything. Who knows though, I suppose.

[Rapcity_11]

But then they'll just have to pay Morris two years from now?

There is zero metrics that suggest Morris is a better defender than Bradley as well. I'm not a fan of saying this, but just watch the two play. It's night and day who is the superior defender. Also, a superior 3 point shooter. In a lineup of Hayward IT and Horford what do you want at 2 and 4? 3 point shooting and defense. Welcome Bradley and Crowder. Now what? Morris and Crowder at the 3/4? Just seems backwards imo

Morris isn’t really a guy who’s going to command a big salary. It doesn’t matter anyway since Boston acquired him to be a cheap rotation guy for 2 years, not to be a long term piece.

If Bradley was this elite defender he’s claimed to be, it would show up somwhere. It does for everyone else. I watch Bradley plenty. He can’t switch onto bigger players. Everybody shoots over him. He gets backed down easily. He’s an average at best team defender. He doesn’t generate a lot of blocks and steals. People always overrate the crap out of players who get into guys defensively and move their feet.

IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford…what’s the issue again?

Smart is an atrocious offensive player. The gap between him and Bradley is huge

OK? How is that a response to anything I've said?

[Kurtz]

IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford…what’s the issue again?

Rebounding, for one.

[SFour]

Bad trade for the Celtics..and they gave up a 2nd round draft pick. To anyone who thinks that Bradley isn't a good player, there's a reason why he's going to get paid a lot soon.

[Rapcity_11]

IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford…what’s the issue again?

Rebounding, for one.

Yes, they are going to be murdered on the glass.

[navyblue]

IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford…what’s the issue again?

Rebounding, for one.

their whole future depends on tatum/brown and lucking out on thier picks going forward.
there is a alternative scenario where trades/signings would have made them contenders and the leftovers of brown/tatum(fultz)/picks would have been gravy.

they are slightly better than last season, but they havent taken a huge step forward like many of us expected this offseason

lost amir/olynick/bradley/zeller/few other young players (ainge has really not drafted well)
got gordon/morris/zizic/ yaboshele/tatum

the timeline for the roster is all over the place.

i just feel ainge over thought this whole process, and is lurching from one move to another, not a master plan.

[reggielewis]

As a Celtics fan AB will be missed but it was going to happen now or next season when he left for free. He is going to get paid- Marcus will come at a far cheaper cost. You lose shooting with AB but you gain it back with Hayward. Marcus at this point, is a far better defender because he can guard 1-4. This move open up time for Brown at the 2, which he is better at and also Rozier who took big leaps in the playoffs last year. Again, AB will be missed but not as much as everyone wants to believe. Our defensive identity believe it or not starts with Marcus as many of the players will also say. He still has so much room for offensive growth and if he develops like AB did, he will be fine. AB was a terrible offensive player up until 2 years ago- when he was resigned for his 8 mill per yr contract, everyone said it was the worst contract of the summer because he was still very unpolished. This trade was necessary for nothing else than to add more versatility offensively and to hang onto Crowder's bargain deal. They made the right call.

[Local_NG_Idiot]

It’s cuts both ways. Bradley takes those guys because he can’t defend bigger players. Guys who can switch and defend multiple positions are far more valuable these days than 1 or 2 position defenders.

But it's also about team fit and they have 5 other guys on the roster who should be able to switch the 2-4 position but now take Smart out of that switching and put him on an island where he must defend PGs in P&R while they hide Thomas on the off guard.

Again, I'm not saying Bradley is a better defender overall, just that he's a better overall fit for the Celts current roster than Smart, especially when you consider the other side of the ball as well.

I don’t see it. We’ve seen a lot more conservative deals this off-season (other than Hardaway…lol). And money is going to be even tighter next year. And teams will know that Boston will probably match anything. Who knows though, I suppose.

What conservative RFA deals have you seen this offseason?

[Rapcity_11]

IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford…what’s the issue again?

Rebounding, for one.

their whole future depends on tatum/brown and lucking out on thier picks going forward.
there is a alternative scenario where trades/signings would have made them contenders and the leftovers of brown/tatum(fultz)/picks would have been gravy.

they are slightly better than last season, but they havent taken a huge step forward like many of us expected this offseason

lost amir/olynick/bradley/zeller/few other young players (ainge has really not drafted well)
got gordon/morris/zizic/ yaboshele/tatum

the timeline for the roster is all over the place.

i just feel ainge over thought this whole process, and is lurching from one move to another, not a master plan.

Being as good as possible now without trading away significant assets in a period where you can’t beat the Warriors anyway seems like a plan to me. Good team now, chance to be great in the future…what’s so bad about that?

Having one master plan without flexibility is a bad idea anyway.

[GooniesNeverDie]

wasn't Bradley injured for a long time last season and the Celtics continued being a pretty 'elite' team without him? I think he was a luxury but not necessarily someone they needed.. instead they don't lose him for nothing and marcus can help a little bit too

[Saciid11]

IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford…what’s the issue again?

Rebounding, for one.

Exactly .. They just added a max player they didn't need while neglecting the most important weakness they had .. rim protection and rebounding .

Why draft Tatum and Jaylen last year when you are going to spend max on player who plays indentical position .., Celtic where better off pursuing Griffin or even trading for Cousins if they wanted to elite team .

[YogurtProducer]

Morris isn’t really a guy who’s going to command a big salary. It doesn’t matter anyway since Boston acquired him to be a cheap rotation guy for 2 years, not to be a long term piece.


If Bradley was this elite defender he’s claimed to be, it would show up somwhere. It does for everyone else. I watch Bradley plenty. He can’t switch onto bigger players. Everybody shoots over him. He gets backed down easily. He’s an average at best team defender. He doesn’t generate a lot of blocks and steals. People always overrate the crap out of players who get into guys defensively and move their feet.

IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford…what’s the issue again?

Smart is an atrocious offensive player. The gap between him and Bradley is huge

OK? How is that a response to anything I've said?

You asked what the issue is. I responded.

If Boston wants to compete why are they trading away pieces like Bradley? Sure they will have to pay him but they should deal with it, pay the tax. Honestly, they should have kept Bradley and trading IT. They are going to be paying the max (or a big contract at least) to IT not to mention Al Horford as well. Bradley would have been a better keep than IT. I think with Hayward on the team they could have been able to use Bradley at the 1 as Hayward would run the offense.

I am not mad they traded him because I like watching Boston fail but I can not wait to face a backcourt of IT/Smart. One can not play offense to save his life. The other can not play defense to save his life. Lowry/Demar are going to kill that team.